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Fiiting: indoor vs outdoor


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#1 stevenhw8

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 12:51 PM

So after a month eating like a pig and drinking like an alcoholic, it's time to prepare for the new golf season.

I'm getting a new set of Mizuno irons and have to schedule a fitting with 2 options:

1. I could do the fitting indoors right away with Flightscope and wouldn't have to wait for the weather to warm up to order my new clubs (2 weeks waiting time)
or
2. I could wait for spring to come (right now it's 0F outside) and do the fitting outdoors with Flightscope as well. The downside is I would waste 2 weeks of precious golfing time while I wait for my clubs to assemble and ship.

You have one extra piece of info outdoors by looking at the ball flight, but is it strictly necessary for a good fitting?
What is your take on the subject? Indoor/outdoor just as good? Indoor good enough? Always outdoors?

Thanks!

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#2 JBones

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 03:39 PM

You have one extra piece of info outdoors by looking at the ball flight, but is it strictly necessary for a good fitting?
What is your take on the subject? Indoor/outdoor just as good? Indoor good enough? Always outdoors?

Thanks!

I will ALWAYS get fit outside. You can show me the launch numbers all you want, but if I can't see that trajectory with my own eyes, then it's a deal breaker. I've hit tons of clubs that give great numbers inside, but don't perform how I want them to outside. I think a lot of it has to do with where/what you are hitting from. Getting fit inside, you are going to be hitting off of a mat, which they have got closer to being like grass, but there is still a huge difference. If it was me, I'd wait for the better weather or at least get fit inside, then take a club and hit it a few times outside, before making a final decision.
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#3 GolfSpy T

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 03:47 PM

I know far too many very good fitters who don't do any fittings outdoors to believe a proper fitting can't be done indoors. That said, I do think it depends on the launch monitor being used.

aboutGolf and HD golf both do an excellent job rendering ball flight. What you see on the screen is what you get outdoors. Based on what I saw at the show, I'd trust ForeSight both indoors and out.

The radar based systems (Trackman and Flightscope) , in my opinion, don't perform near as well indoors, they have to calculate far too many details, and we're seeing more indoor fitters move away from them.

Indoors you can control all the variables...outdoors, weather will always be a concern (for radar based systems anyway).

JBones point about the mat itself is legitimate. I've hit off HDGolf's product, aboutGolf's, and most recently ForeSight. Of the 3, only aboutGolf's product comes close to replicating the feel of turf interaction. The others just feel like fancy mats.
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#4 indacup

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 05:46 PM

We do both indoor and outdoor fittings…but if I had my way, we’d only do outdoor fittings. Not because you can see the ball flight, but because most customers fall into one of two categories.

Type l
Is the person who tends to hit harder than usual because since they cannot see the ball flight, they equate the loudness of the ball against the screen with distance. So these players tend to “Muscle Up” which in reality SLOWS their swing down.

Type ll
These are people who in the booth feel (intentionally or unintentionally) that they are “boxed in” and don’t loosen up properly. They don’t follow thru properly.

#5 GolfSpy T

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 05:49 PM

We do both indoor and outdoor fittings…but if I had my way, we’d only do outdoor fittings. Not because you can see the ball flight, but because most customers fall into one of two categories.

Type l
Is the person who tends to hit harder than usual because since they cannot see the ball flight, they equate the loudness of the ball against the screen with distance. So these players tend to “Muscle Up” which in reality SLOWS their swing down.

Type ll
These are people who in the booth feel (intentionally or unintentionally) that they are “boxed in” and don’t loosen up properly. They don’t follow thru properly.


Excellent points. We don't see Type I as much, but we've definitely had guys who whether coming in to play on the simulators or for testing, comment how they feel like they're going to hit the walls, and so yeah...we see some short-arming.

The guys who actually do hit the walls are generally the ones with very wide, ugly swings.
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#6 GolfSpy Tim

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 06:11 PM

I've done both indoor and outdoor fittings.

I prefer outdoor myself simply for the fact that hitting off of mats indoors really messes with me.

My miss is always a push and/or slice, suddenly I move to an indoor fitting and every miss for me was left - this did affect the fitting, and my confidence in the fit clubs.

Nothing wrong with an indoor fitting, especially if you're comfortable with that situation, but I really just prefer hitting balls outdoors.

That all said, using an AboutGolf simulator recently indoors, I felt that everything but my wedge shots were extremely accurate to my typical game.
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#7 indacup

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 06:13 PM

Excellent points. We don't see Type I as much, but we've definitely had guys who whether coming in to play on the simulators or for testing, comment how they feel like they're going to hit the walls, and so yeah...we see some short-arming.

The guys who actually do hit the walls are generally the ones with very wide, ugly swings.


Actually, the Type l person I attribute partially due to the screens.

About 2-3 seasons ago I replaced all our screens with a new style that had rubber filiment weaved into the screens to minimize sound...I think many people remember the older screens and now trying to duplicate the ols sound? Maybe?

#8 GolfSpy T

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 06:15 PM

My miss is always a push and/or slice, suddenly I move to an indoor fitting and every miss for me was left - this did affect the fitting, and my confidence in the fit clubs.


I'd love to track down the reason for this. I can't say it's with everyone, but we definitely find that people pull the ball more than they might normally do outdoors. It's not a case of the cameras misreading anything, there's something psychological that happens. Most guys, given enough swings, adjust, but certainly not everyone.
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#9 finalist

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 06:28 PM

I'd love to track down the reason for this. I can't say it's with everyone, but we definitely find that people pull the ball more than they might normally do outdoors. It's not a case of the cameras misreading anything, there's something psychological that happens. Most guys, given enough swings, adjust, but certainly not everyone.



I have a guess as to why. When you can't see the ball flight you go more on feel, so when indoors you swing harder, perhaps cast earlier, and pull. When outside you see the ball flight and rely on that more than feel. You then leave the face open a bit more and slice the ball. Hitting indoors is a numbers game and hitting outdoors is a target game.

For years the walls at indoor fitting places drove me nuts. I swung too hard and held off big slices. I think it has to do with parallax visual problems of the walls cramping me.
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#10 Super Tuna

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 09:56 PM

I like getting the numbers indoors so the "science of the swing" as it were is worked out. Then I want the clubs outside so I know they're still working for me. I'm guilty of having a weird since so special attention to how the sole is outdoors is quite important and I entirely fall into Type 2 of Indacup's post. Even with my normal swing there's no way I'd hit the wall but that doesn't mean I don't feel like I'm about to crack it at anytime which makes me really hesistant with a rather expensive club in my hands to do things properly.
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#11 GolfSpy Tim

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Posted 03 February 2012 - 11:33 PM

I have a guess as to why. When you can't see the ball flight you go more on feel, so when indoors you swing harder, perhaps cast earlier, and pull. When outside you see the ball flight and rely on that more than feel. You then leave the face open a bit more and slice the ball.


I like getting the numbers indoors so the "science of the swing" as it were is worked out.


Interesting, the fitting I did indoors didn't have a "screen" you were hitting into, just a net, so i couldn't "see" my ball flight.

But... on AboutGolf - I was able to see a visual of my ball flight, even if only projected, and I had my normal misses there.

And I agree with Super Tuna, the indoor numbers I was getting from AboutGolf were AWESOME!!! Immediate feedback, a beautiful thing.
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#12 Matt Saternus

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 01:36 AM

If the difference is only a couple weeks, I'd wait and do it outside. While I have a lot of faith in launch monitors (good ones, anyway), there's a lot to be said for having your eye validate what the launch monitor says. There's also the benefit, as others have mentioned, of hitting off real turf instead of mats. I've heard a number of people suggest that hitting off mats reduces the spin substantially, though I can't verify that.

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#13 stevenhw8

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 08:25 AM

I guess it's unanimous! Outside it is! :lol:
Just looked outside the window... car is covered in snow again... sigh...

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#14 JBones

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 02:42 PM

I guess it's unanimous! Outside it is! :lol:
Just looked outside the window... car is covered in snow again... sigh...

Patience, grasshopper, patience.
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#15 indacup

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Posted 04 February 2012 - 03:32 PM

Patience, grasshopper, patience.


I agree, this close to spring...just wait it out...




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