[SPY ZINGER]

Interesting interview with Taylor Made CEO, Mark King today from Orlando. King wants the golf industry to declare Jihad on the USGA and develop a new set of rules to grow the game. Sounds like they'll still manufacture long putters and he's not going to give up his own gamer either. From this interview, I left with the impression they may even start offering an entire non-conforming line. Started to sound a little bafoonish when he suggested players would snub USGA events in protest of the governing rules for these tournaments. Come on Mark-O you lost me there. The US Open? Have a read:

http://scoregolf.com.../taking-a-stand

[whiskey golf]

Some of his ideas are a little extreme, but I think the USGA likes to screw with people a little bit. I didn't get the groove rule and I don't get the anchoring ban. If it's available to everyone, pros and amateurs alike, then what's the big deal. Their rules are affecting the industry now which sucks for amateurs because we aren't gonna play in PGA tournaments so why can't we have non-conforming grooves and lately, why can't we anchor putters? Why make the game less enjoyable for us. If they want to do this to the pros, fine, but companies should be allowed to manufacture non-conforming equipment for the average golfer.

[RoverRick]

It sound like Mark King has been reading the Time for a Coup d etat? thread.

This is a vey "American" attitude. Europeans are much more likely to follow the rules they do not necessarily like. Americans are more like herding cats. We come to a rule we do not like. We change it and if the governing body does not like it, we change that. This sounds bad but it is one of the things that has made America what it is.

In terms of war, Rommel said the trouble with studying American war plans is that the Americans do not follow them.

Our club makes far more money on Wednesday and Thursday nights than on the weekend. Those nights each have 25-40 men show up for a scramble have dinner and drink. Drink a lot. Because of this the collared shirt rule was not abolished but changed to preferred instead of required.

USGA is either for progress or in the way of progress. They either need to adapt to changing times in this case accept anchored putters or go away like the collared shirt rule.

[RoverRick]

whiskey golf, on 26 January 2013 - 12:53 AM, said:

Some of his ideas are a little extreme, but I think the USGA likes to screw with people a little bit. I didn't get the groove rule and I don't get the anchoring ban. If it's available to everyone, pros and amateurs alike, then what's the big deal. Their rules are affecting the industry now which sucks for amateurs because we aren't gonna play in PGA tournaments so why can't we have non-conforming grooves and lately, why can't we anchor putters? Why make the game less enjoyable for us. If they want to do this to the pros, fine, but companies should be allowed to manufacture non-conforming equipment for the average golfer.

Why should they be allowed to do it to the pros? Shouldn't that be the Tour's job. USGA does not make them wear long pants that is the Tour. The USGA should be making less rules.

[Firstkart]

The USGA also has to understand that the there are substantially more people playing golf outside of the USA both amateur and professional. The Asian tour is growing exponentially both in participants and prize money.

Maybe in the very near future, the OEM's that currently cater to the US market might not do so anymore.

AJ

[furu]

I don't think they/King is alone. Nike is likely to have some of the same ideas. And I'll throw Cobra Puma into the mix too. Didn't MGS have an article about Nike and how they saw the game in the future? Swoosh-holes, augmented reality gps devices on buggies. And we've seen the golf-backpack.

I think there will be a golf game with less rules. But it's a new game, the "old" game will still be the same.

We can't just abandon USGA and R&A. What about competitions? Professional golf? There's no reason we can't have both. If there's 100 million golfers today, the goal has to be that they're joined by 100 million in the "new game". Not move the current players over to the new game.

King is right about some things but he has to accept that this is not a decision for corporate America. It's a lot bigger than that.

[RoverRick]

Forgive my middle of the night rant, I was not advocating the overthrow of all governing bodies. We have elections to do that in most cases.

However, we do not elect USGA "Leaders". Most if not all are old Country Club types from clubs like RP who see themselves as the last vanguard at the gate protecting this sacrite game from the savages. I played with a group of that type all week, they are all over 70, that griped about everything and everybody and praised how good it was in the old days before us kids (I am 47 and a kid to them) started playing and messing everything up. I have seen the pictures and it really was not that good.

But in the case of the USGA however, they made the groove rule that really did nothing but generate wedge sales. Their was not statictical evidence that it changed a darned thing, and when that was pointed out they claim it will take 3 years for the statistics to prove them right. B.S. Now, three years later, and three generations of wedges there is still not statistics but the OEM's are happy.

No evidence that the putters offer an advantage but they outlaw them to preserve the game.

They talk limiting the ball because the Tour players are making the great courses obsolete. Excuse me, but who does not like to see low scores. This week Tiger (T44 last year) and Kyle Stanley, who lost last year in a play off, and 154 other guys played the same courses. Tiger is -11 in first place and Stanley is +7 was cut and ended up like 150 and this year they use the same ball. It ain't the ball, and we do not need more useless rules.

[revkev]

It's so nice to have someone carrying my water jar for me - plus 10 to everything that RR says.

It's not that we don't want rules - we want fewer, understanstable rules that actually make sense. If the purpose of the rules are to make sure that everyone plays under the same conditions than why in the world can you repair a ball mark but not a spike mark?

That's a very small example that doesn't come into play much anymore but it's always respresented the ridiculousness of the USGA too me. They won't change a rule that is decidedly unfair but allow a generation of players to play a certain one, put a certain type of grooves on their conforming list for a goodly period of time and then make the claim that these two things which may be used by anyone and everyone don't feel right.

I'm sorry - I want rules - I just want ones that bring order not create more questions.

[SPY ZINGER]

I was able to engage Hank Haney in some Twitter conversation this morning. After being directed to this thread, Haney responded: "People think it, he [King] has the guts to say it."

He then tweeted: "Momentum is building for two sets of rules in golf, I think it is coming" "Ted Bishop is in my opinion doing a great job so far as President of the PGA, not scared to think outside the box and take a stand"


...This while wearing an Adidas shirt, and making adjustments to his R1 V2 since it's better than retail, but I digress.

I agree the Rules of Golf are confusing to many, to include myself at times. Some should be modified to grow the game, but there needs to be a universal set in my opinion, that everyone follows.

[whiskey golf]

RoverRick, on 26 January 2013 - 01:12 AM, said:

Why should they be allowed to do it to the pros? Shouldn't that be the Tour's job. USGA does not make them wear long pants that is the Tour. The USGA should be making less rules.

You have a point there, my mistake, it should be the Tour's job.

[R.P. Jacobs II]

RoverRick, on 26 January 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

It sound like Mark King has been reading the Time for a Coup d etat? thread.

This is a vey "American" attitude. Europeans are much more likely to follow the rules they do not necessarily like. Americans are more like herding cats. We come to a rule we do not like. We change it and if the governing body does not like it, we change that. This sounds bad but it is one of the things that has made America what it is.

In terms of war, Rommel said the trouble with studying American war plans is that the Americans do not follow them.

Our club makes far more money on Wednesday and Thursday nights than on the weekend. Those nights each have 25-40 men show up for a scramble have dinner and drink. Drink a lot. Because of this the collared shirt rule was not abolished but changed to preferred instead of required.

USGA is either for progress or in the way of progress. They either need to adapt to changing times in this case accept anchored putters or go away like the collared shirt rule.

THIS!!

Dude, you save me much time, thought & typing so the less that I type, the less people that I piss off :-)

So this is a good thing for everybody ;-)

And if they get pissed at you for the post, I'm just along for the ride, HaHa, so not only do you carry me on the golf course, you can now carry me in the forum.

HaHa, Bro, I don't care how big ya are, you gotta be gettin tired ;-)


Fairways & Greens 4ever

[BK in Wisconsin]

RoverRick, on 26 January 2013 - 03:12 AM, said:

Why should they be allowed to do it to the pros? Shouldn't that be the Tour's job. USGA does not make them wear long pants that is the Tour. The USGA should be making less rules.

whiskey golf, on 26 January 2013 - 01:39 PM, said:

You have a point there, my mistake, it should be the Tour's job.

Exactly!!!!

The "Tour" is an animal in and of itself. The USGA should govern for the 99.9% and the PGA Tour should worry about itself and other higher level competition.

[TWshoot67]

Here are some simple rules for the other 99%. Rule #1 Play the ball as it lies. If you can't hit the ball for whatever reason that is belonging to course like tree, boulder,lake, etc.... take a drop 1 stroke penalty. One and only amendment to Rule #1 , if there's a twig, pebble (small rock), or anything loose that's not alive and growing move it out of your way and hit your ball. You can Ground your club anywhere., (who cares about testing the soil, sand or hazard, if you can hit it go for it, if you can't take a drop ; penalty 1 stroke). Count all your strokes and have a great day. The end. Oh forgot the Equipment rules: #1 use whatever you want that was made for golf, no hockey sticks or jet propelled laser guided ball slingers.


Oh yes if the ball is embedded anywhere , tough crap. Hit it or take a penalty stroke... oh yes that's rule 1.

[RoverRick]

As forum bard this calls for a song. The tune is Do you hear the people sing? From Les Miserables.




1^st Verse

Do you hear the golfers sing, Singing the song of angry men?

It is the music of a people who will not have yips again,

When the flipping of your wrist causes the ball to go awry,

There is an anchored putter choice for you to try.



We will live again in freedom of how we play the game,

But we understand the reason that the rules should be the same.

So why in the world did they wait 30 years ? what a shame.



Chorus

Will you join in our crusade? Will you be strong and stand with me?

Somewhere beyond USGA, is there a world that you long to see?

Do you hear the people sing? Say do you hear the distant drums?

Is there a rule we understand when tomorrow comes.



2^nd Verse

We will live again in freedom, if our back is stiff as aboard,

We will walk behind our push carts, we will put away the sword,

The chains will be broken and all men will have their reward.

Chorus

Will you join in our crusade? Will you be strong and stand with me?

Somewhere beyond USGA, is there a world that you long to see?

Do you hear the people sing? Say do you hear the distant drums?

Is there a rule we understand when tomorrow comes.

[R.P. Jacobs II]

This is a serious question, and I don't know enough about the legal structure or standing of either body, however what do you think would happen if the PGA Tour decided that they would make all of the rules pertaining to THEIR players, not just behavior, dress and the such but also equipment rules.

I mean, the only tournaments that would outright be effected would be the US & British Opens, and they could start their own US Open(Cuz I doubt the Brits would go against The Royal R&A), cuz I mean which would have more prestige, if that came to pass, the USGA's or the PGA's? That's a no-brainer, HaHa.

And, they would allow all pros currently "anchoring," in any fashion, to continue to do so.

I'm tellin ya, that would put some serious screws to the USGA. They would basically lose any influence over the American Tour game, and this is the proving ground for a pro.

If you ain't done it here, you ain't done it

I know that it's unrealistic, though it's a move that I'd love to see, HaHa


Fairways & Greens 4ever