Beakbryce

Tennis balls, like golf balls have different play abilities especially depending on the tennis surface. If you watch any of the tournaments, they sometimes discuss the different balls and how some balls would be faster or slower, bounce higher or lower off a particular surface. You are absolutely correct though that a tournament uses all the same brand balls for the length of the tournament. What they haven't done is roll back the ball. This despite the fact that players are generally scoring more Aces then 20 years ago. Sound familiar? If you want to see something funny, watch any tournament with Tracy Austin and Chris Evert , giants of their generation, the ball speeds, and then watch Wimbledon or the US Open tennis matches this year. Night and day. Despite huge gains in racquet technology and player physical fitness, they haven't yet limited either ball or racquet, raised or lowered the net, or changed the size of the playing field. Makes one think, yes?

Leave us not forget Squarz shoes and that new sock product guaranteed for more yards. Seems like buying a game though. Wait, what? Besides, I already use that tee. Bummer! Maybe they will find new tee technology by 2030.

I'm 71 so forgive me if I don't remember the exact circumstances, but I think a ball was invented some time ago exactly as you describe. I think it was in a Golf or Golf Digest magazine. You're right, it didn't take off. Still, this idea would bring walking the course back for a lot of people and wouldn't take 4 hours. Hopefully! It would be awesome for a lot of the par 62ish courses already out there.

I remember reading an article when I started playing golf in the early 80's. The article indicated that the ideal golf height was 5' 11". At the time, clubs were decidedly heavy. While being fit for clubs was way in the future, the gist of the article was that finding clubs for tall players that were actually playable was very very difficult. A lot of people don't realize the genius of Tom Weiskopf as a golfer using clubs that were not even close to fitting him. I think my wood drivers were 42-43 inches. I totally agree that shortening the shaft would decrease yardage. However, tall players are going to be the odd group out. Imagine Aberg with a 43" driver. Which is why the USGA only went down to 46". What do you think the comments will be from golfers if in January 2025, the USGA announces a period of inviting comments on shorter driver length, MOI restrictions, COR restrictions etc., with rulings possibly taking effect in Jan 2030 along with the ball rollback? They could then "give in" to comments on the length showing how reasonable they can be but hammering all the other stuff. Because believe me, the average golfer won't want a 46" driver if the sweet spot is significantly reduced anyway.

Club grooves, they caved when they were sued by Solheim, putting the change off long enough for every manufacturer to come out with new options that fit the rule they made that were just as good or better than square grooves. They did learn they needed a war chest for any big decisions so they could fight off a court decision in the future, which they now have. Then they started with little things, like training a puppy. Putter anchoring, hardly anyone was doing it so no one actually cared to put up a fight. Then driver length, again only affecting a few people. No fight. These latter 2 decisions didn't affect hardly anyone. Screwing with the ball does. The only good thing here is again putting it off for years. If this goes down without a whimper, we should expect more rulings. I'm with @CB Lobo 4 Life on this.

I hate to disagree, but here we are. I agree, they took in all the comments. I agree they listened to all the comments. Then they did exactly what they wanted to do, comments be damned. They proposed bifurcation because they knew they would get significant negative feedback from the only people that mattered, and that's the folks that make the balls. Win their concurrence and it doesn't matter what anyone else says. Then when they got the feedback regarding bifurcation as they knew they would, they ruled for the rollback, because what else could they do? Aw shucks guys, you didn't want option 1. You have forced us to stick it to everyone. Ha-ha. Ha. There is no Karsten Solheim willing to fight this decision. If Titleist, Callaway, Bridgestone and all other ball manufacturers were thinking to sue, and knowing where the decision was going, you would think they would have at least announced they were contemplating legal action. As a group. Most statements that I have read show a lot of figurative hand wringing and then total cave. It might happen, who knows? Want to bet? If anyone thinks they are going to stop with the ball rollback they are mistaken. Sure, maybe a ball roll back of 10 yards might just mean moving up a tee. Or by 2030 they have a ball that is proportionally shorter for high swing players but not slow swing players, making this much ado about nothing and we can "all play the same ball". Technology being what it is, who knows? I worry that it is going to be an aggregate of future rulings that will hamstring amateurs. A lot. This is just step 1. Step 2, next rule. Think about how a smaller clubhead would be killer. No high MOI hits off center going nearly as far. Who cares if the pro's have more in the tank? They want to bring golf back to a skill game for everyone with every club, make the hitting area on every club the size of a dime. Let's see Rory et al hit with a swing speed such that missing the sweet spot doesn't mean a little way in to the rough, but a hit that actually leaves the planet! Like it used to be when I started with persimmon woods and Tommy Armour irons. 43 years ago when a challenge was fun! At my age now, fun is still being reasonably good using every bit of technology I can find. This game is hard! Accept this decision, all the time getting older... and shorter. Invest now in some old Tommy Armour's! Now that's fun golf! Good luck with that!

Why do they need to go anywhere? If the long ball is so good, new course records should be of record every year or so. Not true at Pebble where the men's professional record has not been broken since Tom Kite's 62 in 1983. The course record for Pebble Beach is 61, set by Hurly Long during a college event in 2017. The men's course record for the AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am is 62, shared by Tom Kite (1983), David Duval (1997), Patrick Cantlay (2021), and Matthias Schwab (2022). The women's course record is 64, set by Brittany Lincicome in 2021 at the TaylorMade Pebble Beach Invitational. The problem with just using driving averages doesn't mean the courses are automatically defenseless. You can always make an argument using one set of stats. The rule makers would be a lot better off providing shots gained, record scores, lower average scores, etc. on the courses they think are in danger. Since they haven't, I am not saying the ball isn't longer, what I am saying is that the USGA/R&A haven't shown that a long ball has had a material effect on scoring. It's like the long putter. They didn't like it so they banned it. If the long putter was so good, everyone would have been using it. Since there were not a lot of users, I can only conclude that it wasn't that big a help on the greens. Since there were not a lot of users, no one stood up for the people using them. Explains the hullabaloo now, don't you think? Everyone has some sort of stake in the ball issue. The USGA people I have seen on TV continue to say it isn't really a rollback but an attempt to stop the ball getting any longer, which tells me that they figure they can still hold Opens on courses they want to play with the ball where it is at.

would be cool but who do you think is going to litigate this issue? Ball manufacturers? Nope. They are selling balls regardless. What they didn't want was bifurcation where they would have to produce a separate ball for the pros and wouldn't be able to market that ball using the "as used by your favorite pro" tag line. The Tours? There is so much more going on with the Tours than a ball rollback. PGA of America? Probably not. Wouldn't be very sporting to have club pros trying to get members to abide by the rules while they are suing the rule makers. It's not like the 99% of golfers that don't have balls soaring 300 yds+ have a unified voice and organization to challenge this issue.

I am all in on this. I'll give it a shot!

I will be the first to say after some reflection that we actually don't know the result of this ruling for the average golfer that drives it roughly 220. We have years before this issue becomes even halfway relevant. We can though be assured that more changes are inbound concerning the driver and whatever else the USGA thinks they can get away with now that the OEM's are rolling over on this issue. I will say the following though. We aren't talking the Rule Book, which let's face it has some illogical problems and still could be tweaked in some places and remains a convoluted crap shoot for some. Just ask Morikawa. We are talking about an esoteric equipment ruling that is a response to a situation the USGA created. They have ruined courses for the US Open over the 4 days of play. They insist on hard and fast, when that actually leads to longer drives. The PGA Tour, while not ruining courses, still adhere as much as possible to hard and fast which has provided the USGA the cannon fodder they are using to prove their point. The USGA whines about the old courses that can no longer be played because the pros hit the ball too far. Well, set those courses up as they would have played in 1930, i.e., don't manicure them, and then make your argument after playing that way. Yes, I know, THEY said this isn't about the old courses they want to remain relevant. Do you actually believe that? They pretty much have only used the distance averages from the Tours to decide the ball goes too far. They haven't used strokes gained, relative scoring average on Tour or elsewhere, average score value for holes on courses that have been repetitively played for decades to show that increased yardage makes a vast difference for scoring on those holes. Would someone please review all the relative stats, hole by hole, and winning scores for a place like Harbour Town? Has increased distance actually made an impact? Or has a smart routing with some hazards retained its ability to challenge the best golfers? And please stop whining that a more strategic layout takes the driver out of play for the longer hitters. So what? Isn't that why there are 14 clubs in the bag? If as they say distance is ruining golf, then new scoring records for every course should be being set on a continuing basis. Do we see that on Tour? We do not. They also set up the discussion among all the stakeholders to make sure they have someone else to blame for applying this solution to everyone. You don't think the comment period was actually this long for any other reason than that do you? Almost every entity involved in the discussion had staked their response at some point over the past 5-10 years so the length of this period was idiotically long. They leveraged enough stake holders that could have busted the rule in to saying no one wanted bifurcation other than you know, the 99% of golfers not appreciably hitting the ball further. Oh, and Rory, Tiger. Of course Rory has already indicated that amateur golfers should consider this much ado about nothing. We can always "play better" to use his ongoing mantra for every question. Or we can move up a tee. Until we can't. Until we run out of tees to move up to. At 71 now, by 2030 this may mean no golf tees to play. Which is when I will buy a simulator for the house and adjust my driver distance and all clubs to conform to Rory's and play his game! Elsewhere on the thread it was noted that new courses being built have averaged 6600-6700 yards or thereabouts. This shows that people building courses are NOT building to a perceived distance problem. We are seeing record drives in the long drive championship and by members of the Tours. This is self limiting at some point. The human body for most of us isn't a temple we can just work out 5 hours a day to build the necessary structure to swing at a golf ball as hard as possible multiple times a day. If you look at a lot of the recent ball phenoms, like Cameron Champ or Will Zalatoris, they hit the ball a long way and are now going through injury problems. Tiger same way. Sure there are the occasional Phil or Rory that haven't been affected. Do we want to legislate all golf for those few? I love reading the threads in this forum where players talk standard 300+ yard drives but are struggling to break 80 or even 90. The emphasis on training is in the wrong place. I recently did a test of the new Mizuno driver, 3 wood, and 4 hybrid. I kept track of yardages more than I ever had before because I have played the same 3-4 courses for the last 20 years and know where I hit the ball. I play in the desert which I believe leads most to think we can have above average drive lengths. But we play early in the morning, the course is soaked so the grass stays healthy all day. The grass is often long enough in the fairway to be called something closer to the Tours first cut of rough rather than fairway grass. Does this make a difference? You bet your booties it does. The difference in driver yardage between most days and the few days the course is scalped and dry for overseed purposes results in 30-40 yard difference in drive length. You know, even for us amateurs. Edit: the USGA talks about returning courses to the shot value when built. But to do that, you also have to return the course to the agronomy upon which those shot values were originally based. Merion, Winged Foot, Pebble Beach, the Old Course, Pinehurst #2, et al were not built to be set up hard and fast. Augusta has changed dramatically since it's inception, much of the change required because they got better and better at building the course hard and fast instead of leaving it shaggy as when originally built. Do you think the designers of Augusta really thought that sub air systems would be built under the greens so the green speeds could be kept ridiculously high when they designed the slopes of the greens. C'mon man! It's a philosophical change that is required by the USGA, not an equipment issue change. We only have their philosophy that a hard and fast course determines the best golfer. Actually, all that determines is the longest golfer having the best putting week. Whose to say that making it a little wet and sloppy with little burns and strategic trees which brings the whole field in to play isn't just as good a way to determine the best golfer. There is a reason Jack used to say there were only a handful of people he needed to beat. He attributed to mental, I attribute it to his length.

and we don't have to wait until 2028 to see how the pros like it! This is to funny. That's why we are going to hoard Pro V1x from now on!

That's right folks, the USGA\R&A have gone too far. Ball rollback indeed. Therefore, my new rules of golf. Please feel free to add your own rule/rules for those things for which you feel the USGA has screwed the pooch. Those stodgy idiots have programmed us to feel bad about ourselves if we incorrectly interpret one of their disgustingly illogical and ungovernable rules. Let's get back to an enjoyable game. Have fun. Feel good about yourself. I love Scottish people to death, but let's remember that they started this whole rules thing because they wanted to bet on the outcome. Oh wait, you thought golf was a game just begging for rules, Not! That isn't the game I want to play. Little sun, little exercise, feeling good, that's the ticket. 1. You can hit any ball club combo you can afford. If you feel compelled to play the "new" ball, instead of moving up a tee, tee up your second ball. 2. Since the current rules involving hazards and out of bounds, lost balls are incredibly stupid by any form of logic, do this. If you can figure out where a ball crossed a hazard line, you ought to be able to figure that out for out of bounds. Additionally, one should be able to figure out the last place on the course a lost ball was seen. Here is the one rule. All bad areas are hazards or lost ball. No need for a provisional or a knee high drop. Place your ball at the nearest CONVENIENT point of relief where the ball was last seen and charge yourself a stroke. By convenient, I mean on the correct side of the cart path etc no closer to the hole. And for the sake of pace of play, don't drop on the cart path twice and mark the ball, and then further drop at the nearest USGA point of relief wasting everyone's time. Just move it to the spot your conscience or the buddy you have a dollar, dollar, dollar bet with says is mutually agreeable. C'mon man, this isn't rocket science. Life is about negotiation. Don't be above pointing out that your buddy has a plaque next to that OB on 15 that they hit every time and they might want some leeway on that drop. 3. Your ball is in a divit, sand filled or not. Dude, roll that thing. In fact, take a club length anywhere you want. Tree roots, gone. Divits, gone. Bad lies in a bunker? You have to stay in the bunker, but you can move or rake your ball position so you have the same lie that dork ahead of you had that didn't rake for you. Well, you have to stay in the bunker unless it is filled with water. Then you get free relief outside the bunker. 4. No one ball rule. Hit your favorite ball when driving, subsequent shots, chipping, putting, whatever ball makes you happy for each endeavor. The ball manufacturers will thank you. 5. Sprinkler heads. Enough said. 6. Leaf covered fairways, don't get me started. 7. And remember, when you tell the spouse about your round, make yourself look good! 8. If playing a computer version of golf with a launch monitor, feel free to increase your drive/hit length by whatever percent allows YOU to play like RORY. Always keep this in mind, some day when Rory is 80 years old and can't hit his driver farther than his putter, he too will play by these much simpler rules! "The short ball WILL NOT affect the average golfer", indeed! "Play better" indeed! You talk a lot for a guy that doesn't even carry his own bag and figure out his own yardages and has a rules official there to make sure he does the right thing. JEEZ LOUISE. 9. Last, there is no handicap system for regular golfers. Members at Merion, Firestone, etc., continue on your merry way. Handicap caters to the lost child in all of us. We either under or over report our true play. So don't trust it. Play mano a mano or beg for strokes or don't bet. Haven't played with someone who wants a wager, take them up on it or politely decline until you have played with them a 100 times. Really? Yes, a 100 times. Many people believe if they ain't cheatin they ain't tryin. Please remember to only bet what you can afford to lose. I think there is a phone number to call if your habit grows beyond that point. Check out any commercial in the next MNF game. No one wants to see a grown golfer cry.

I have had mine since 2011. It doesn't get a lot of use because I live in AZ. We also have a heater but really don't use it. By the time we play the coldest it might be is 35 degrees. As long as we get into the sun it gets really warm quickly without a heater. This cover is a universal cover so when we play where we rent a cart, we take it with. This picture shows it on my jeep golf cart. It was on sale after Christmas on Golfsmith.com for $60. Take a look after Christmas maybe find a similar deal. The only thing I don't like is the zipper goes straight up and down. The better ones have a bit of a curve at the top so there is a little more room when entering and exiting the cart.

I was not a fan. Both clubs are not as long as my Epic gamers. I believe my swing speed prevented the best use of the driver and 3 wood. One of the problems from my point of view was a standard 45" shaft which lost a nominal amount of yardage I could not afford. I think Mizuno is all in on a certain market, high swing speed hitters, and built the clubs for that market. I felt the clubs produced very low spin balls that just would not stay in the air for me and didn't run when they landed. Both clubs were very straight. Straighter then my Epics, but I don't miss a lot of fairways anyway so no reason to switch. I was fit for the clubs with 125 ball speed and 2400 RPM with nominal distance of 225 but in real life I never hit them that far. I am with @russtopherb in that they do not have a memorable sound or feel. The 4 hybrid was a nice club, but not an improvement over my current 4 hybrid. The flight was marginally higher with a softer landing. Please let me know if you have any specific questions.

Always a good suggestion. I have a mat and have had it for years. I swing on it everyday that I am not golfing without hitting balls. Gotta keep loose. When there were no houses behind me I used to hit birdie balls into those lots. I also chip wiffle balls in to the back yard. I just don't remember where I bought it.

Thank you, this helps. I have 4 lights. If it doesn't work with what's there now, I guess I could start experimenting with lights over and/or behind the unit to see what works. If I do this, I will report the results. BTW, any suggestion on a hitting net that is as quiet as possible. I live in a retirement community that is really quiet, and I hesitate to make noise even in the middle of the day.

If I buy this unit, I would be using it on a covered porch with shades. It doesn't have the best lighting, but I can upgrade the can lights with led lights. My question then is did you think the loss of accuracy was due to lighting brightness indoors or some other factor? Thank you

I think you have nailed the problem with goals in golf. It is usually a score or a handicap level, when it is better to just have fun. A better goal is to improve the process, IE, everything that happens before the club goes back. I flat out stopped keeping score for awhile until I had fun again. Good luck.

Thank you. Went for a long bike ride. Golfed yesterday and had a blast. Tomorrow off to BJ's with others for a free meal for veterans and a free birthday pazookie. Good times. Loving life. I wish you all a great weekend and month. B

Already need a new goal. I needed to pitch better, especially now during over seed when the greens are like a shaggy carpet. Noted this goal earlier. I saw a really simple video that was trying to cure hanging back on the right side while pitching. It involved raising the right heel coming through the ball like a full swing. I don't have that specific problem but tried it anyway. My problem is more an inability to drag the handle left through the ball. Instant fix. I don't raise the heel much, just enough to finish the swing. Killing it.

fitting for Paradym X vs 6th gen PXG vs Titleist driver actually, I would probably wait for next iteration 2nd gen Paradym Folks are talking iron sets as "one thing" so if one thing could include a complete wood set would throw in tests of 3,5,7 woods too greedy?

This loss of capability is detrimental to the Corps. Any Marines needing to follow some up to date thought on USMC plans and operational capability might want to subscribe to Marine Corps Compass Points.

Two weeks no golf. Tomorrow on the course after overseed. I don't know how I got through the winter when I lived outside Chicago. Pretty much used to all year golf now. The only problem with this time of year is the courses make their money from all the snowbirds so prices are sky high. Courses that charge $15 in the afternoon in the summer are now $110 for a round of golf. Disgusting. Even the dog tracks! Thank God I am retired USMC and can play the military course at Luke AFB. Wonderful course.

Tee them all. It's all about a consistent lie. We have varying grass height where I play depending on time of year, overseed, etc. I have to put up with it in the fairway, why would I do it on the tee? At this time of year we get flyers out of the tee area! C'mon man.

My goals next year are the same as this year, mostly. 1. Get up in the morning (I'm 71, my dad is 94 so not really a worry there!) 2. Play golf 3. Have fun. 4. Add a pitch shot to my short game. This was a very good year. Shot 67, ok sure- moved up a tee but still... Became an MGS tester. Helped my wife whose handicap is coming down. Through hard work and a lot of repetition, fixed my putting yips. Anything more than that will have to wait until January 1. I am one of the few who can play all year around so have another couple of months for more cool things to happen on the course. Will have to pitch most of next month instead of chipping because the course will be shaggy while the rye grass is allowed to grow.