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Ball moved on the green and my competitors were not happy.


RoverRick

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Yesterday, on the 16th hole, I hit a wedge to the back of the green.  There is a slope there and I thought that the ball, it usually does in that pin location, would check up and roll back down the slope and stop near the hole.  For some reason, it checked up like it should and I thought I hit the perfect shot, but it stopped on a seemingly impossible slope about 20 feet fro the hole.

 

We all looked at the ball and were astonished that it stopped on that slope.  We discussed it for a while, and I said I was not touching it even to mark it, since it was not where near their lines.  After two guys chipped on and one other putted it was my turn.  I was on the bank behind my ball trying to imagine the exact line to the hole, when it started moving.  At first, I thought it was my imagination, but it started towards the hole, wobbling left and right and picking up speed and hit the top edge of the hole and falls in.

 

They went nuts.  Saying I had to replace the ball and putt it.  I said that since I had never marked it, and I had not addressed the ball and I had not grounded my putter it was in the hole.  They said that if it would have rolled away from the hole I would be replacing it.  I pointed out that if there was a chance it would roll away from the hole I would have marked it.  But I did not touch it so I had an eagle.

 

They were not happy about that, but I did not want to have a fist fight right there.  So I said we could look it up on the phone, and to save time, and not have the people behind us wait, I would replace the ball as near as I could and putt it out and look it up on the next tee.  In their defense it had been 8-10 minutes and that ball had just sat there.  I have no idea if it was the wind or what caused it to roll, but I was standing there plumb bobbing 5-6 feet away and 3 feet higher because the hill.

 

It turns out that Rule 18 covers the ball on the green.  Even if I would have marked my ball and it rolled after I had replaced it but before I addressed the ball than that was an act of God and I got to play the ball from the new spot.  Since I never got within 3 feet of it, intentionally, I obviously did not cause it to move.  But they were saying me walking by created enough vibration to cause it to roll.  Even so, if that is all it took it should not have been stopped there in the first place.

 

I got to count the eagle and was very glad because I tapped the ball as lightly as I could and it rolled 10 feet past the hole.  I also missed the next putt for par and blew it by the hole 4 feet.  Then the bogie putt went 4 feet past but I did make double bogie.  Since we were playing $1 per stroke, that turned into a $5 swing.

 

However, it counted as an eagle because if decision 20-3d/1.  A ball at rest begins to roll on its own or because of the wind or for any reason that is not considered an outside agency and falls into the hole it is considered to be holed out on the previous stroke.  Even if you mark the ball and replace it.  But it must be at rest.

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Pretty cool.  I've jumped up and down near a ball hanging on the lip with no luck whatsoever.

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I am pretty sure it was the 5-10 minutes between when it stopped and started again and the fact that it turned and rolled in the hole.  I am darned lucky they did not burn me at the stake.  The hole before that I sank a par putt for about 15 feet that I pulled left, I started cussing when a leaf landed on the green and deflected the ball into the hole.

 

Pretty sure they were thinking about it but nothing else like that happened.  Pretty much EVER.  Most of the time something happens to keep the ball out of the hole.

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Wow! That's some interference going your way!

 

Last time I played with my bro-in-law I had a short chip from right off the green. He had a pitch from down a hill out of sight. I hit the chip and he happened to hit his shot at the same time since we couldn't see each other. I missed seeing what happened exactly. The guy paired with us got excited. I tho't the two balls hit each other on the green. He said they hit mid air! My ball bounced back on the line I just hit it. His went across the green into a bunker. I was about to hit my ball again when he says Hey! That's my ball! I look closer and sure enough, when they hit, it didn't knock mine back to me. His ball was the one that came back to me and it sent mine into the bunker. It was so strange how my ball took off in the same trajectory and speed as what his came in with and his gently bounced back on my line. Never guessed they switched places.

 

That's what we get for not paying attention to order of play. But we all agreed to just play ready golf to keep things moving when we started.

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Last summer, I was teeing off on 5 and hit a beautiful hit drive but it was going down the edge of the 15th fairway which comes the other way.  My ball just dropped out of the sky and we were all talking about it.  I drove to my ball as another guy was arriving from 15 and he said "Did you see that?  Our balls hit in mid air."  Unbelieveable!

 

It turned out that it was his ball that dropped out of the air.  Mine caromed off farther into the 15th fairway.  Both of us were pretty happy with the results.  It could have been a lot worse.

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It turned out that it was his ball that dropped out of the air.  Mine caromed off farther into the 15th fairway.  Both of us were pretty happy with the results.  It could have been a lot worse.

"Did you see that?  Our balls hit in mid air."  Unbelieveable!

My Mom hit a sparrow in mid-air once.  It was her first birdie.  True story.

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Had you never declared that you intentionally acted the way you did I'd say congratulations awesome eagle! With that being said I'd ding ya two shots for violating rule 1-2. See note 2. If you still disagreed and I was on the committee I'd just dq you. There is a lot to be said about a players "intent" when looking at the rule book. Obviously it was your "intent" to never go near the ball even though it obviously came to rest at that spot (you even said it yourself that it was almost ten minutes and you still didn't go near it.) Therefore your intent was to cheat. That my friend is a no no.

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That's really cool. One thing that is weird is how nutted up those guys get over a few dollars. This is like your previous post about Hacker but I won't get into that. If I were them, I would have no objection to paying because that would be quite the sight to see.

Different guys than Hacker.  We were playing $1 per stroke, and I was already up $13 on one guy and $4 on the other, and this was the sixth hole we played.  They also made 5 and 7 on this hole.

 

But this was the 34th hole I played that day.  I ran out of gas on the next 9 (actually the front nine but we started on 10.) and ended up loosing all but $4 of the lead.  Played 45 holes and the last 9 I should have gone home and napped.

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Had you never declared that you intentionally acted the way you did I'd say congratulations awesome eagle! With that being said I'd ding ya two shots for violating rule 1-2. See note 2. If you still disagreed and I was on the committee I'd just dq you. There is a lot to be said about a players "intent" when looking at the rule book. Obviously it was your "intent" to never go near the ball even though it obviously came to rest at that spot (you even said it yourself that it was almost ten minutes and you still didn't go near it.) Therefore your intent was to cheat. That my friend is a no no.

He was trying to make sure he didn't do anything that would make it start rolling and incur a penalty. How is that conceivably intent to cheat? Sounds like being extra careful not to cause it to move.

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Had you never declared that you intentionally acted the way you did I'd say congratulations awesome eagle! With that being said I'd ding ya two shots for violating rule 1-2. See note 2. If you still disagreed and I was on the committee I'd just dq you. There is a lot to be said about a players "intent" when looking at the rule book. Obviously it was your "intent" to never go near the ball even though it obviously came to rest at that spot (you even said it yourself that it was almost ten minutes and you still didn't go near it.) Therefore your intent was to cheat. That my friend is a no no.

 

I did not act the way I did because I expected the ball to move or that I was even hoping it would move.  I acted the way I did because I did not want to cause the ball to move and I feared (which was later proved accurate) that I would have trouble getting the ball to stay on that slope if I marked it.  I know now that I had to press it down on the green to get it to stay there.  Also, when I did it caused the ball to hop when I did putt it. 

 

How can you say it was my intent to cheat? 

 

What exactly did I do that was cheating? 

 

And how do you know my intent?

 

The rules do not say that I must mark and lift my ball on the putting green unless I am asked to do so.  The rules do not say that I must go stand near my ball when it is not my turn to hit.  I was not causeing an undo delay.  It was not my fault that one guy chipped over the green and had to go get a different club and walk over to his ball.

 

You can not declare me or anyone in breech for not not taking an action that is not manditory.  I did not have to mark the ball.  I did nothing to cause the ball to move.  It was just that it was so precariously perched on the slope I knew it would not take much to cause it to move.

 

I did declare that I intentionally did not go near it during that time because I did not want to cause it to start moving.

 

Had I have marked it, and then replaced it.  As long as it was at rest first, and it would have started to roll, then it would have been the same result.

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I've now hit a power line on two separate courses....local rules allowed me to replay the shot. Still it was damn weird....

 

As for legality of rovers actions - I'd have been comfortable enough as long as he wasn't within a step or two of the ball. When I say happy, what I mean is quietly cursing him, well not that quietly at all.....

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I've now hit a power line on two separate courses....local rules allowed me to replay the shot. Still it was damn weird....

 

As for legality of rovers actions - I'd have been comfortable enough as long as he wasn't within a step or two of the ball. When I say happy, what I mean is quietly cursing him, well not that quietly at all.....

 

There's a country club that I've played at a couple of times and  there are power lines that go across the "window" where you would want to hit it. You can replay the shot if you hit them but I still think it's annoying. Although I've never hit the power lines thankfully.

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There's a country club that I've played at a couple of times and  there are power lines that go across the "window" where you would want to hit it. You can replay the shot if you hit them but I still think it's annoying. Although I've never hit the power lines thankfully.

Decision 33-8/13 says that there can be a local rule requiring you to replay the shot.  There can not be a rule that allows you to replay the shot.  We had this at my course, I guess we still have the rule, it is just that the hole is now an island and the new clubhouse is being built on the site of the old hole.  But I hit a tee shot that bounced off the pole (considered part of the line) and stopped about a foot from the hole on the green, almost a hole in one, but it would not have counted because if there is a rule it must be applied no matter the outcome of the shot.

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Decision 33-8/13 says that there can be a local rule requiring you to replay the shot.  There can not be a rule that allows you to replay the shot.  We had this at my course, I guess we still have the rule, it is just that the hole is now an island and the new clubhouse is being built on the site of the old hole.  But I hit a tee shot that bounced off the pole (considered part of the line) and stopped about a foot from the hole on the green, almost a hole in one, but it would not have counted because if there is a rule it must be applied no matter the outcome of the shot.

 

Sorry that's what I meant and thanks for the correction. You do replay the shot and there is a local rule.

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Had you never declared that you intentionally acted the way you did I'd say congratulations awesome eagle! With that being said I'd ding ya two shots for violating rule 1-2. See note 2. If you still disagreed and I was on the committee I'd just dq you. There is a lot to be said about a players "intent" when looking at the rule book. Obviously it was your "intent" to never go near the ball even though it obviously came to rest at that spot (you even said it yourself that it was almost ten minutes and you still didn't go near it.) Therefore your intent was to cheat. That my friend is a no no.

Sounds like his "intent" was not too incur a penalty. People do this all the time when they hover the club rather than grounding it during periods of high wind. Same "intent".

 

Not sure you can be DQ'd for trying to follow the rules.

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  • 1 month later...

Rick,
Don't fret.  If your buddies don't believe a bunch of forum members, you can now show him in print that your eagle counts and stands.  It's covered in "Ask the Rules Guy" in Golf Magazine in this month's current issue on page 26.

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Funny thing was last weekend someone else's ball stopped in a similar position.  I told him to just leave it and be careful it might roll on its own.  And the guy who was the loudest about having to respot it is said, "Yeah, Rick made an eagle like that a few weeks ago."  He said he knew I did not have to mark it, he just did not like it.  By the way, this weekend the guys ball did not move, and the flag was in a different place anyway.

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