Golf Problems - Current Players Chasing Off New Players?

[dru_]

Last weekend I had a very enlightening discussion with one of the pro's at the club.  I was out walking a practice round and bumped into him on 14, and we walked the last 4 holes in.  The conversation was about how few new members the club has added in the last 2 years that have actively engaged and integrated into the community with the longer term members. 

 

He had some very choice thoughts on the culture of the longer tenured members.  People that have been there 5, 10, even 20 years. These members, in many cases chase off these younger, newer members unknowingly because they have this sense of entitlement from the long membership. 

 

In many ways, it is the little things that they do not even realize they do.  

 

On the course it is the 'local rules', where they play by a set of local rules that have evolved over the years among the core players but are never real documented or shared outside that core.  

 

Playing "regular" groups/games that aren't advertised to the general membership, but often played during prime tee times (making tee times tougher to get for the newer members). Often these games are open to anyone, but few of these guys ever play outside their groups and fail to meet the other members. 

 

Off the course, they have their social networks in the clubs, and these groups feel unapproachable to new members, particularly younger members.

 

I was wondering, for those that are members are private clubs, do you wee similar things at your clubs?  Do you try and address any of this?

 

I ask this, because I am one of the younger members that has crossed the bridge into a couple of these groups, and I am trying to decide how/if I should go about helping others do the same to further grow the games, but also improve the overall health of the club membership as this is as much the responsibility of the members as it is the clubs (IMO).

 

 

[RookieBlue7]

The number one reason there are less new members year to year? The economy still sucks and people still can't find work. Golf is expensive whether we like it or not

[gdiddy]

Thats an interesting take on that. I have thought about join a CC but am very concerned about cost per round.

A local CC here in Columbus,Oh. is about $2400 per yr

The course is 40 yrs old and in no better shape than a public course.

I think I would need to play 5 time a mo. to get value.

With that said I think low membership its related to too many distractions available today that pull us away from golf.

That coupled with the out modes business model of the older you are the more you pay. Jr. members get a better price which with the state for golf today is just silly

my 2cents

[whiskey golf]

The problems that you listed don't sound like entitlement, more of just an intimidation factor, with the exception of one problem. If a new member really wants to meet this formed groups then there is nothing stopping him from introducing himself or herself and getting to know them. And if they don't want to meet you then you are better off without them. The "local rules" are knowledge from being at the club for a while and as your membership gets longer, you will most likely learn about all of the "local rules." The one thing that sucks is the tee time situation but it somewhat makes sense, the longer you have been at the club the better perks you get. Think of it this way, if you were a member that has been paying thousands of dollars in a membership at the club for twenty years, would you want your prime time spot taken by a newbie who has been there for a month? I'm not saying it's right or anything but that's how people are.

 

And I also agree with Rookie, golf is expensive which is the main reason.

[jaxbeachpackerfan]

In my former life in the frozen tundra of Wisconsin, I was a member of a CC and had exactly the same regular group, priority tee time situation.  There was absolutely no intent or plan of excluding anybody, but there was also no incentive or motivation for inclusion.  We all are lazy, we are comfortable with our situation, we forget the uncomfortabilities (I think I just made that word up) that a new member faces in getting integrated into the regular club activities, and just go on with our golfing lives.  We always welcomed new participants, but we also didn't seek them out.  Really, it becomes a function of the club pro to help out the new members, introduce him or her to the organizer or whatever, and find out what the member is seeking.  Down here in Fla at TPC Sawgrass, its pretty much the same with a pseudo CC, we have a weekend group and two weekday groups, but a new member really has to ask the pros and staff to even know the opportunities exist.  We invite anybody we run into to get on the email list, but there is no formal group listing or functionality to our existence.   I guess what I'm saying, unfortunately, is that it is on the new member to find out what's going on and seek to be included, because the regs don't spend much energy on thinking about "marketing" to the new guys or gals.

[BIG STU]

The number one reason there are less new members year to year? The economy still sucks and people still can't find work. Golf is expensive whether we like it or not

I think you are quite correct on that even though I live in a resort area and have a different golf environment from most of you. this time of the year we have the "snowbird" season as some of you know especially the ones living in Florida. It has really picked up this year even with the rough weather it has been from my observations the best in years. Last summer it did pick up some and the Strand Tourism Comission has predicted a good summer. I do know we have been having more visitors on the south strand in recent years since The City of Myrtle Beach itself with their high taxes and crime have drove off a lot of visitors and people are staying and playing golf on the south end now. But in the mainstream I can see why golf memberships would be down due to the economy

[BIG STU]

Oh good lord(to quote a resident philosopher), I go in to correct a typo and all hell breaks loose

 

So sorry

 

Take care

 

Fairways & Greens My Friend,

Richard

Don't feel bad old buddy I went to edit a post myself the other night and don't know what I hit but I got a blue screen and then the old lady's screen saver fish swimming came up. I went ballistic and said (oops cant say it this is a G rated forum) I went to watch TV she came in a minute later and said ok it is fixed you can go back to your golf buddies now. I did hear her mutter under her breath I don't know how he does those things. So don't feel bad you aint alone

[dru_]

I think you are quite correct on that even though I live in a resort area and have a different golf environment from most of you. this time of the year we have the "snowbird" season as some of you know especially the ones living in Florida. It has really picked up this year even with the rough weather it has been from my observations the best in years. Last summer it did pick up some and the Strand Tourism Comission has predicted a good summer. I do know we have been having more visitors on the south strand in recent years since The City of Myrtle Beach itself with their high taxes and crime have drove off a lot of visitors and people are staying and playing golf on the south end now. But in the mainstream I can see why golf memberships would be down due to the economy

 

For much of the country, I would completely agree. Atlanta really hasn't seen quite as hard a hit (huge technology base) as most of the country statistically, and the new members are still coming at a pretty good pace, but the retention isn't there.  According to the pro I was talking to, only about 20% of new members are staying members beyond their first year. Of the new members about 20% fail to use the facilities, but the other 60% seem to consistently struggle to establish ties to the other members.

 

I personally think that is part of a cultural problem, particularly among a younger crowd that never learned how to walk up to people, stick a hand out and introduce themselves, but that just makes me sound like an old guy talking about 'kids these days'.  

 

It sounds like it is a pretty common thread though, were established groups within the clubs  aren't exclusionary, but at the same time aren't reaching out to actively recruit among new members.

[Undershooter]

I have to say it seems very much this way at the club I recently joined. I used to be a member of CC's in my early teens but baseball took priority after that and all throughout college so there was no reason to be a member. I had been putting off joining somewhere because I liked having options on where to play but I finally sucked it up and joined one that gives 3 different courses as options. The nicest course of the three is ALWAYS backed up and you almost always have a 5 hour round unless you are one of the first to tee off. This kills me because for me to play well I have to have some type of pace to my game (I know I'm one of "those" guys). There are standing tee times from 8 until 11 on basically every saturday and sunday which gets really really old. I can appreciate them being there for much longer than me but blocking off 3 hours seems almost ridiculous. Maybe that's just my newbie way of looking at it. I will say that course isn't hurting for money though. I was talking an employee the other day and he said they pushed almost 200 rounds through there that saturday.

[PlaidJacket]

We have standing tee times (blocked off) every Saturday at my club too. They are basically three different groups of between 12 to 20 players in each block. The group I usually play with is the most competitive of the three. And we go first. Ha! Meaning... we are more serious about our game and we have numerous bets going. The feature bet is the skin game and we usually have a medalist game/winner and other side bets if you want partake. Lots of fun. No music playing and very little booze until after round. The second group is a little easier going. They are fun and I've enjoyed playing with them on occasion. They play from the middle tees mostly and a few play from the senior tee. Usually just a dollar skin with no carries. The final group is what I call the golf party group. Anything goes here. Plenty of music, booze, and yelling. No one putts out and mulligans are plentiful. Defiantly not my thing. Every now and then the pro will introduce a new guy looking for a game. If we have room that day he's welcome aboard. Anyone that wants to join us is welcome. Just call ahead in the week and get your name down. It's first come first served.

 

By the way Undershooter30.... how did you afford a CC membership as a teen?

[jpcgolf]

I feel the same way.  My parents joined a golf club so I could have a place to practice, (I am a junior).  Carts cost 25 dollars on this course, and I just see some of the long term members go right out in the afternoon without paying for a cart.  Sometimes, they play with as much as 8 people per group.  I can definitely tell the new members from the old members. 

[bma725]

I've been a member at multiple clubs in different parts of the country for most of my life, and even worked at another club during my high school and college years.  In my experience this is not a new phenomonon by any stretch of the imagination.   

 

In fact, I'd go so far as to say I've never heard of a private course where this doesn't occur nor have I heard of one that has found a way to solve it because this is something that is in inherent in private club culture.

 

Ultimately private clubs are exclusionary in nature.   Even at the places that have a very friendly membership, you're still talking about a group of people who are only willing to grant access to those that meet certain criteria.  That attitude of exclusion eventually filters down to all aspects of the club, including how open people are to playing with others.   

 

It isn't that they are necessarily against newer members, it is that they don't want to take the risk that a new member might not fit their little group's ideal of what the club should be about.  So it is easier to band together and exclude those people from the group rather than risk it, and the club can't do anything to change that because the members run the place.

 

In the old days this wasn't even seen as a problem at many places, because they had newer members coming in all the time and those new members would get together and form their own clique that excluded the older members.  Eventually the older members would die out, and those previously new people would become the established group that replaced them. 

 

Now with the changing of priorities around golf, and the continued problems in the economy most places just aren't getting the same influx of new blood.  In the end the established members will have to change or the courses will die out...but you can't undo decades of tradition overnight.

 

 

[OHGolfer79]

Interesting topic. My belief is that the golf staff should be more proactive in helping new members integrate into a club. I play in a large weekly group. We have a website (www.tccbushwood.com) and all kinds of events for spouses and significant others. And our numbers have grown every year because we asked our pro to have all new members contact us if they are looking for a regular game.

 

It's easy for that pro to blame long tenured members. But what has he done to help his new members integrate into the club. My guess is very little.

[Undershooter]

Plaidjacket Obviously my parents membership lol I definitely couldn't have paid for one back then. I think the last year my parents had it was when I was in 8th grade. Baseball took over my life from then throughout college. I still played golf in high school but I played very sparingly. For example, my senior year I probably played 8 rounds of golf and 6 were in tournaments for the team. 

[Salmon]

I've seen many sides to this through my life so far.

 

First example is we had a select bunch of older more wealthy members of a private club I was once a member at. They didnt really appreciate all the kids starting to play the game so they had a habbit of sitting by the front window of the club house and watched them practise putt on the green just out side waiting for one of them to putt there ball back up off the fairway onto the green when one ran down the slope on the side of the green. They would promptly head out and have them disqaulified for practising on the course.

 

Also had a member from that same club who was a much older gentleman but spent a lot of his own money with the help of the club to set up the entire junior golf program and support the junior pennant teams to help build golf for the younger generations.

 

My current club had a young member join who appeared to be a decent player, but turned out something very dodgy. He would only play with a select group of people that he knew, and even though he had started off with a handicap in the realm of 12-13 he began shooting scores under par that just didnt seem to add up, just around where some of the major trophies were being played for. Lets just say it wasnt appreciated and I don't think he has been back since a couple of his scores were discounted after he had done it a few times.

 

But unfortunately there are always going to be people like this in the world regardless of what we do, because I myself have even been excluded from the junior groups back when I was a member of the private club mentioned above. I was the lower marker when a lot of the others had joined, and I did what I could to reach out and help them, once they surpassed my due to school they basically shunned me.

 

If the majority of people make an effort to include new and potential members and try and give people the benefit of the doubt I think we can overcome the damage being caused by the groups that don't