Playing a championship course (Tanglewood)

[Kor.A.Door]

I have an opportunity to play Tanglewood country club, Championship Course, in mid April, this should be a pretty good experience, there is a bit of history with this course, there has been a PGA championship there in the 70's, some high profile amateur events in the 80's and some senior tour events as recent as the early 2000's. The course is located in Winston-Salem, NC. About 90 min away. This should be a fun day.

[BIG STU]

You will love it I am telling you. I have played that course many times but it has been a while. When I was living in Charlotte we used to do the weekend thing play Tanglewood on like Saturday and then Bryan Park in Greensboro on Sunday. The first time I played that course I was 14 in a private school tournament and at the time those were the largest greens I had ever seen and at the time they were bent grass that I had never putted before so I was like a fish out of water. My friend has told me they have made some changes since I have played it but it is all good. It will be well worth the drive from "The Fort" for you. Keep me posted on how you like it

[JohnBarry]

Very Nice, think I am playing the River Course at Kingsmill this weekend! before the snow comes again!

[Kor.A.Door]

The cost is good too. 49 with cart. I a really looking forward to this, some of the guys that I play Saturdays with go up there on occasion, so the guy that runs the Saturday game, thought it would be fun to go on the road, and the wife said I could go, so I don't have to sneak around

[Kor.A.Door]

well, tomorrow was supposed to be our trip to Tanglewood, but Mother Nature has other plans, it started raining earlier this evening and its not supposed to stop until Sunday so it is being rescheduled for sometime in May.

[BIG STU]

I was up that way myself but managed to play Wed and Thursday. Ended up staying an extra day due to my wife and BIL handling family business and I was not needed for that particular endeavor (thankfully) So I snuck out and played Mooresville Muni which is a good layout Ross course for front 9 and I don't know who designed the 2nd nine but pretty good course for a muni and not great shape but considering the winter they had ok. Had to drive back to the beach Saturday in all the rain

[JMiller]

I have an opportunity to play Tanglewood country club, Championship Course, in mid April, this should be a pretty good experience, there is a bit of history with this course, there has been a PGA championship there in the 70's, some high profile amateur events in the 80's and some senior tour events as recent as the early 2000's. The course is located in Winston-Salem, NC. About 90 min away. This should be a fun day.

 

I just now saw your post. It is public now a days think the park owns the 2 courses and par 3 back in their now a days. Here is the history behind the course :: https://www.forsyth.cc/Parks/Tanglewood/Golf/championship.aspx

 

I have played it probably 2 or 3 times now being about 1.5 to 2 hours from my house, I used meet a friend from Charlotte over there once and awhile. It is a tough track from the back at a par 70. It is too bad you didn't get to play it good track.

[Kor.A.Door]

Played tanglewood on Saturday. Back in the day this course was probably a beautiful track. It's too bad the city doesn't take very good care of it anymore. The fairways were nice but everything else was crap. The teens were bent grass, and they were way too long, you could not make a putt from anywhere they were that bad, the sand bunkers were treacherous. There is about 90 bunkers everywhere on this course and If/when you found one, good luck, no sand in most if them, hard clay mostly, some were dried like cement, some were recently watered and mushy clay. Not one was like any other. I was playing very well until 7 where a pull right put me in the free side bunker right in someone's footprint in mushy clay and I had about 15 yards to get to the green. That double put me 4 over, and then on 9 I striped a drive and left my favorite yardage, about 120, an easy gap wedge, well I hurt my back on that swing and hit a 30 yard hook down the hill and then doubled for there, and after hurting my back I just couldn't swing very well after that. I finished 41, 43, all in all I played okay, I just wish I hadn't hurt my back, the course was fun, and with the history, just to think I played a course that Gary Player, and Jim Tolbert played it was a good experience and I look forward to playing some more courses with rich history even if they have become goat tracks

[BIG STU]

Glad you finally got to play but I am sad to hear the course has went to crap. It may be due to the rough winter. We have courses still recovering from the bad winter we had and then the courses got bombarded with the normal spring tourist golf season and some of the snowbirds extended their stay due to them not getting to play much due to the weather. It has been hard to get tee times here for the last 5 weeks or so. Now the bike weeks are going on and so there is not much play but I gotta work the next 11 days straight. Yeah I am semi retired but good help is impossible to find in the towing business down here. I am going to take the 1st week off in June though

[revkev]

Played tanglewood on Saturday. Back in the day this course was probably a beautiful track. It's too bad the city doesn't take very good care of it anymore. The fairways were nice but everything else was crap. The teens were bent grass, and they were way too long, you could not make a putt from anywhere they were that bad, the sand bunkers were treacherous. There is about 90 bunkers everywhere on this course and If/when you found one, good luck, no sand in most if them, hard clay mostly, some were dried like cement, some were recently watered and mushy clay. Not one was like any other. I was playing very well until 7 where a pull right put me in the free side bunker right in someone's footprint in mushy clay and I had about 15 yards to get to the green. That double put me 4 over, and then on 9 I striped a drive and left my favorite yardage, about 120, an easy gap wedge, well I hurt my back on that swing and hit a 30 yard hook down the hill and then doubled for there, and after hurting my back I just couldn't swing very well after that. I finished 41, 43, all in all I played okay, I just wish I hadn't hurt my back, the course was fun, and with the history, just to think I played a course that Gary Player, and Jim Tolbert played it was a good experience and I look forward to playing some more courses with rich history even if they have become goat tracks

 

 

We get a bit spoiled in Florida because every where you turn there's another course that used to host a PGA tour event and even one that still does, just in my county.  For example we have Bardmoor that used to host the JC Penny classic, I practice there and play there often.  We have Seminole lake that used to host an LPGA event, I'm playing there Saturday.  We have St. Pete Country Club that used to host a PGA tour event and still hosts the oldest AM event in the South.  Of course we have the Copperhead course that hosts the Valspar.  There's a reason the pros love that course, it's awesome.  I can also drive across the Bay and play TPC Tampa Bay that up until this past season hosted a Champion's tour event - that's a ridiculously under rated course - probably the most under rated, under mentioned course that I've ever played.  With the exception of the Copperhead course all of these tracks may be played for under $50 at the right time of the year.

 

There are two other courses that I haven't mentioned because they are particularly note worthy. 

 

The first is Pasedena Yacht and Country club because for a long time Walter Hagen made it his winter home and was the pro there.  I know what you mean by imagining yourself on the same fairways or greens as the greats.  This course is always pristine but it's pretty exclusive - I used to have a church member who was a member so I'd play there a couple of times a season as his guest.  It's not long but man is it a challenge. 

 

The second is the Dunedin Country Club.  This one is a Donald Ross course (that makes it special in and of itself) that used to be the winter home of the PGA tour.  Tour members would stay and play at housing provided to keep their games sharp during the winter months.  It's another one that hasn't been updated to be a brute in regards to length but it is such an enjoyable course to play.  Because its essential public (they call it semi-private but I haven't figured out what the private part is) it's not in great shape but it's always good and you better put your ball in the right spot or else.  It's a shot makers delight which means the pros of yesteryear probably loved it.  It stands up too, we recently took a group of 12 guys there, several were very low handicappers, one played on his college team, another played in the AHL and NHL (cup of coffee).  The young guys played the tips the rest of us were up a set and only 3 of us broke 80.  The best score was a 2 over 73 from the hockey guy who's a 1 at a Nicklaus Course that plays at 7,400.  So I'd say the course does okay in its old age.

[Kor.A.Door]

I was able to essentially over power this course, but the greens were so bad you could not putt on them, and once I hurt my back on the 9th fairway, I really couldn't do anything. The back nine was just make it through without butchering the score. Side note: I had plan going in since I looked the course up on line, most holes were not very long so the plan was 3 wood all day, except on the long par fours, and the par 5's,then I hurt my back, and I totally went away from plan, i was angry about the shot that hurt my back so I screwed up the next 2 holes before settling down. I should have stayed on plan, but without making mistakes how would we learn

[JMiller]

It sucks that the course was in bad condition, most places around here in the triangle have seen some rough conditions late into the season. We are probably about 1 to 1.5 months behind in the growing schedule. The long winter, heavy rains lately can turn a course to crap in a real hurry unless something is done about it.

 

Duke University GC, the fairways were almost dirt late March still laying dormant, It took until first week of May when the temps got up to 70+ and stayed there before the growing started (419 Bermuda fairways, rough & collars). The other place that I played earlier this year has been Mill Creek Golf Club and their fairways had thin spots but looked better then Duke actually. Both places got some winter kill around the collars, not something that was really avoidable do to the winter conditions. I was over at the Governors Club in Chapel Hill late last week when they got 5.4" of rain on Thursday the bunkers had huge wash out spots and were being played as ground under repair, drop in the bunker on sand for the US Open Local Qualifier on Friday.

 

Maybe next time you are up in the NC area you find yourself a golf course that is in full summer conditions.

[Kor.A.Door]

Yes, it seems that most of the courses are in full bloom now. The fairways were on great shape, the greens and bunkers just needed that little extra work that it doesn't seem they are getting.

Most if not all of the bunkers were in desperate need of sand, and the greens needed the touch of an experienced greens keeper. It wasn't far off from being really nice, but it needed some help.

[revkev]

It's been a rough year for courses. My league course looks as if someone was herding sheep on it all winter. Think of the trouble they were having with the greens at TPC. It was wet all winter and now that they've aerated it hasn't rained.

[JMiller]

Yes, it seems that most of the courses are in full bloom now. The fairways were on great shape, the greens and bunkers just needed that little extra work that it doesn't seem they are getting.

Most if not all of the bunkers were in desperate need of sand, and the greens needed the touch of an experienced greens keeper. It wasn't far off from being really nice, but it needed some help.

 

You never know exactly why courses are in poor shape in a given area. It could be a lot of things. Without really having a contact on staff at the course that is honest about why the conditions are in their current state then it's all guess work.

 

Having worked on a grounds crew for a golf course in college you start to understand a little more on where they have to cut some corners to keep in budget and long term hope to turn the golf course around to be in good shape. I wouldn't automatically assume that it is an inexperienced super attendant. Sometimes the person just has to work with what he has and unexpected equipment failures can ding the budget as well.

 

I have heard stories in the past where the Super Attendant did whatever the GM wanted him to at the end of the day it is his boss. This can result in really poor conditions, I know one course this happened to where they lost the greens twice and finally realized that the GM was to blame. Got a new GM new Super Attendant and are turning the course back around finally.

 

 

Let me give you a good example of something that you probably wouldn't expect at all:

Duke University Golf Club has awful fairway conditions and very little sand in their bunkers currently.  Duke University G.C. operates independently of the University and Hotel. They had to do private fundraising to change the greens from Bent in 2013 to Champions Bermuda. Trust me when i say it was more Poa annua then bent in 2012 and early 2013. The greens were so bad in the summer of 2012 they punched them every 2.5-3 weeks to keep them alive. I played Duke for the first time in Spring 2012 the greens were great, summer they were awful, fall they were great again. Spring 2013 good, closed summer 2013, fall 2013 w/ Champions they were great. With Duke they need a new irrigation system, so the sand in the bunkers is on the bottom of the list to replace in terms of budgets. They also have a lot of plans that they feels would make the golf course more healthy long term and more interesting to play. However, I don't know that these plans will even get implemented in the next 5 years.

 

Maybe it is the case that the super attendant is inexperienced maybe it is not for various other reasons. I'll probably end up playing Tanglewood again sometime, when that is I'm not sure.

[Kor.A.Door]

my guess is that they just dont have the money to maintain the entire course, i think the greens will be better as the year goes on, and if they cut them, the problem is the hot summer with bent grass, they have to keep it somewhat "froggy" to keep them from drying out. unless they want to spend countless hours watering, but that is probably not in the budget for them. we may go back there later in the year, so maybe it will be better.