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Aotearoa_Brad

Advice please: What effect does low hands have?

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I took some video at the range during the weekend and noticed that my hands seem quite low. My back is pretty straight so I'm not overly worried about causing damage, and I don't really hook the ball so not overly concerned about the swing being too flat of a plane etc but wondered whether any of our resident experts out there can give me a heads-up...

 

Lil but if Sunday arvo practice - @biionfootwear @birdiebogeypar

A video posted by Brad Clarke (@golfspybrad) on

Would a more upright posture be more efficient (i.e. am I potentially missing out on transferring momentum by being too low)?

Is there anything else this could impact on?

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I've got no advice on the swing, but nice hat!

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I've got no advice on the swing, but nice hat!

 

haha - thanks Hcky ... matching (Limited Edition) BirdieBogeyPar polo as well... 

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haha - thanks Hcky ... matching (Limited Edition) BirdieBogeyPar polo as well... 

I didn't even notice the polo, now I'm really jealous!!

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I am not a swing guru by any streach of the imagination. I will ask you one question Do you feel confortable with your swing and posture etc? I would not let the hands thing worry me one bit because if you think about it too much you will get tense in those hands and that is no good. Remember this is my philosophy There is no one correct way chiseled in stone to swing a golf club and that includes hand position and grip. When the weather gets good and you can practice again take you a breather and watch other people. I have seen people with terrible swings that hit the ball good and I have seen people with textbook swings that could not play dead in a cowboy movie. I have seen a lot of range pros that look good on the range and cant play a lick when it comes to playing. I know this is going to sound like a PGA commercial but if you are really worried you can find a pro you trust and can work with and go from there.

Edit I did look at your video again and I do like your takeaway and club position at the top

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Thanks Stu - I'm not necessarily struggling with anything in particular and this is a comfortable posture for me, I was more wondering (from a biomechanical standpoint) whether being more upright lends itself to greater accuracy / better transfer of energy to the ball etc... not sure which is why I ask.

 

Fortunately Stu I'm in Hawaii so don't really have to wait for weather to get much better... we get the odd torrential downpour, but other than that this is the nicer time of year to play (fairways are a bit greener, greens a bit softer)

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I will offer you my experience from my own range sessions over the past few weeks. I've been in a bit of a slump my last 4-5 rounds. I understand I'm playing fall/winter golf here in PA but I expect a great deal out of myself and refuse to use it as an excuse. My past few range sessions I've been focusing on standing much closer to the ball. Obviously, this makes the posture much more upright. It took a few hundred balls for me to get comfortable with it. I haven't changed any other parts of my swing or had any different swing thoughts. Since then, my striking has improved dramatically thereby improving my distance and accuracy. I've been able to hit much more consistent draws and fades without worrying about overdoing it. I do also feel like I'm swinging with more power. I figured I would try it since it was an easy setup change and I could revert back just as easily if I needed to. Might be worth messing around with since it's not a drastic swing change.

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I'm no teacher, I can only tell you what I like and don't like.

 

I like that good straight back and I'm a fan of your low, close hands.  I like to keep my hands low and close while standing fairly upright.   My demon is the hunched back and spine angles go kerflooey if I do this.

 

So I liked your whole address and set up -- until I saw you reach out to a ball that was about 3 inches farther away from your body than I expected it would be.   Here's what I mean about angles.

 

angles.jpg

 

Gray is what you've got, orange is what I think would be better.

 

I think you're still able to pivot and turn so well because you've got that good straight back, even if your bend at the waist is deep and you reach out to the ball.  I just think it should be a little more upright and that would be more efficient and more powerful.  I don't think my orange lines are too steep or close at,  all do you?   Yet they would bring that ball about 3 inches closer and cause you to need clubs a couple of degrees more upright.

 

How tall are you?   I'm guessing you play with clubs bent a couple degrees flat, correct?

 

I had to do a similar thing with my coach.  I went from way flat and a reach out, to what felt like very tall and upright.  But on the video it just looked normal.  In my head it felt too tall and too close.

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Thanks Mark, I'm 5'9" and 77/78ths ;) - irons are bent 1 degree flat. I think I'll have a play and see what it feels like to set up a little closer and stand a little taller. Watch this space I guess - I'll revisit after a few range sessions and let you guys know how I'm getting on.

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Thanks Mark, I'm 5'9" and 77/78ths ;) - irons are bent 1 degree flat. I think I'll have a play and see what it feels like to set up a little closer and stand a little taller. Watch this space I guess - I'll revisit after a few range sessions and let you guys know how I'm getting on.

 

Well then FORGET EVERYTHING I JUST SAID.

 

Your clubs are not too flat, you may not be bending over too much and my impression may just be an effect of the camera angle!

 

Try my advice a little bit, don't firmly commit to it if it doesn't work, I'm probably wrong in your case.

 

I"m 6'3" and if you could see my before video of when I was hunched and reaching out, you'd gag.   It was a 2 month long struggle for me to shift to straight and upright.

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Brad, markb was on the correct track here in my opinion. I just might word this a little differently.

 

Posture

~ You only need around 30-35* of hip bend, you have what appears to be 45-50*. Where the back is flat you still are just too bent over.

--> When the shoulders get out past the toes your weight gets forced onto the balls of your feet or into the toes, this can cause rotational problems later in the swing.

 

Try This

Without a club stand straight up with your arms to your side, palms facing your hips.

~ Slightly bend forward from the hips allowing the arms to swing in front of you and then add a little knee flex for balance.

--> The weight distribution in your feet should be centered, not out on the balls of your feet / toes, or back in the heels.

Visual Reference ::

 

You will need to learn correct posture without the club first as a club is just a distraction.

~ Once you are conferrable with proper posture without a club, add in a club with the grip pointing down at the ground.

--> Your posture shouldn't change with the club in hand then it was without it.

 

~ After you are conferrable with proper posture with the grip towards the ground, then and only then add the club into the sequence with the club in a normal playing position.

--> You shouldn't be changing posture from the first two steps in this step they should all match.

 

 

 

 

As for anything in the swing it looks reactionary to the poor posture at address. This is just my opinion take it or leave it.

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I like that jmiller video, which emphasizes posture at address FIRST, letting the arms drop, then the club is gripped and if the club is sized correctly, it determines where the ball position goes, NOT the other way around.   That's what my instructor had to do with me, also adjust shoulder position and width of stance (I was all out of whack)

 

You can see in your video how you skootch away from the ball, so you are letting ball position determine your posture, not the other way around.

 

It will look weird to you if you try the address posture first method, your clubhead will seem to fall too close to your body.  My ball position with my driver probably came in 6-8 inches before and after, no joke.   It felt weird for over a long time.   Now when my drives go bad, the first thing I look for is too far away from body and shoulders not tilted.   It's the culprit every time.

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Brad after all is said and done I like one of the things you said in that you feel confortable in your current position. Being confortable relaxes your hands and body and I feel this is the most important thing period!

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I noticed that your left arm/elbow is moving away from your body and twisting very early. Seems to be the way you take the club away, and then the club head ends up a little bit behind. Look at the clouds for reference point.

 

Not sure if this is related to your posture and balance. Not even sure if it matters for your swing :) 

 

I'm not going to say anything about the shoes. Not today.

 

 

skjermbilde-2014-12-11-kl-00-44-36.pngskjermbilde-2014-12-11-kl-00-45-12.png

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Let me toss in some extra information here.

 

Brad's takeaway is that way because of his weight distribution being too far forward. The weight is too far forward due to the fact the posture is incorrect at address.

--> So Brad moves his arms / hands independent of the body in the takeaway as a reaction to improper balance.

 

If Brad rotates his shoulders from that start position two things will happen:

1) He will fall forward on his face being way out of balance

2) His body will correct and his weight will shift backwards more towards the center of his feet or heels.

--> Brad later in the swing when his shoulders do turn his weight shifts backwards naturally finding a balance not to fall over. Just look act the lower half and you see the rock backwards in weight distribution.

 

 

Part of giving recommendations is finding the root cause of a problem, also understanding the why part of what you are going to recommend. We can slap on a bandage for Brad's takeaway, but it might only be temporary fix and 3 months he finds new problems because we never looked any deeper then the surface.

 

 

Like I said before it is my opinion that the Posture is the root of the issues and the swing is reactionary due to the posture at address.

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See a pro -

 

There's plenty of sound enough advice here but just find a trusted teacher in the area and see him/her, it will be your best golf investment of '15.

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