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General Musings on why I hate Golf Companies


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I bought my first real set of irons back in March, a set of Callaway X2 hots, 5 iron-A Gap and got them custom fit. I picked up 10-20 yards on each iron, making my old 4 hybrid redundant. Which brings me to yesterday, and the last few days really. I am currently looking to fill out the set and add the 4 iron from the X2 hot product line. I checked online on just about every major golf retailers website. Either they wanted me to buy the whole set (didn't bother to see if I can custom fit them), or I could only buy the club without custom fitting and had no options other than grips. These are clubs I bought less than a year ago and already they're basically telling me the company doesn't care about the line.

 

I figured PGA Superstore in Phx could help me out. Nope, even they can't get them custom fit. So now I have a hole in my bag which I figured potentially could be replaced by a hybrid. Took a few swings and felt sort of comfortable with the 4 hybrid in the x2 hot product line. My problem: All my other clubs are bent 1 degree upright and 1/2 inch short, this one is stock. So not sure how I would feel going back and forth with the club.

 

Oh did I mention they want 170 for the club?

 

Here's the general list of my gripes right now:

 

I paid top dollar for my irons at the time because they were brand new and 8 months later I can't even get a custom fit club to fill out the set from the companies website. Yet the same company wants me to pay top dollar for a hybrid that in a few weeks the price will drop down.

 

As for the hybrid, the store had no fitting options for hybrids at all. I couldn't test out different shaft lengths or lie angles even on the new(er) clubs. Not sure if that's on the store or whom, but how can they not have one or two shaft length options besides stock?

 

I get the sense that golf companies want to play both ends of the podium here: We'll charge you top dollar for stuff that's 8 months old, but won't provide any services on it. To me it sends a message of don't buy clubs ever, because in six months we're going to have a new product line and won't care about you or your purchase. At the time they need all the customers they can get, boy do they sure know how to push me away from buying. I know this is nothing new, but it sucks

 

Last and your advice is appreciated:

 

Is going stock length with a hybrid going to frustrating when my irons are cut shorter? Does anyone have any experience with this?

 

 Driver:   :callaway-small:  Epic Flash 12 Degree

Wood: :callaway-small:  GBB 3 Wood
Hybrid: :callaway-small: Razr 4 hybriid stiff stock shaft.
Irons: :callaway-small: X2 Hot 4 iron (pro version) 5 iron - Gap Wedge (non pro version).  KBS 120g Shaft stiff cut 1/2  inch bent 1°upright
Wedges: :vokey-small: 52° 56° and 60°.
All grips are Golf pride grips midsized
Putter (lefty):  Odyssey Metal-X #8 34", stock shaft bent 2° Superstroke grip
Golf Balls:   :titelist-small: 2018-9 Pro-V1x and Prov1s
Shoes:  :footjoy-small:  Dryjoy tours

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86 it's not at all uncommon to have a combo set in your bag. I personally used to carry a Ping 4i along with my TM RAC LT set. I had Cleveland wedges too. These days I don't carry a 4i anymore. I use a 4hb instead. A 4i is too hard to hit accurately for me now days. I'd guess it's probably not the ideal club for you either. The stronger lofts big mfgs. put on clubs there days is a joke. A stardard loft 4i these days is probably more like a 3i. I'd suggest you take a hard look at a hybrid. Especially one that is fully bendable. (Wishon. Yes... I love his clubs for a 100 reasons)

My Sun Mountain bag currently includes:   TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 771CSI 5i - PW and TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png PFC Micro Tour-c 52°, 56°, 60 wedges

                                                                               :755178188_TourEdge: EXS 10.5*, TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 929-HS FW4 16.5* 

                                                                                :edel-golf-1: Willimette w/GolfPride Contour

 

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Its going to depend on how long the "stock" length of the hybrid is. Some of them, they are a good 1.5 to 2 inches longer than the iron they supposedly replace. I'm not real well-versed in the Cally clubs, so not sure what their tendencies are there. Bigger head with a more rounded forgiving sole on most hybrids allow more room for error to offset the additional length to some extent versus an iron.

"Glute Activator"

 

*Please accept my contributions of participation and intellectual property sharing as substitute for monetary renumeration.

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Have you looked on eBay or the used section for the club you want? It would probably be cheaper and you could always swap the shaft out for a shorter one later.

Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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Driver -  :taylormade-small: M1 9.5* w/ Aldila Rogue Silver 70X

Fairway -   :taylormade-small: M1 5W 19* w/ Aldila Rogue Silver 70X

Hybrids -   :ping-small: G25 4H 23*

Irons -  :mizuno-small: JPX 850 Forged 4-PW w/ Nippon N.S. Pro 1150S

Wedges - :mizuno-small: S5 50*07, 54*12, 58*12 w/ Nippon N.S. Pro 1150S

Putter - Oddyssey Metal-X #7 w/ SuperStroke Pistol GT 2.0

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If you live in Phoenix and didn't just hit PGA tour store on vacation, you might check with Hot Stix up in Scottsdale. I've built all my sets with them and have been able to buy the single iron heads I wanted and then they built them how I wanted(.25") long to get swing weight right. Did the same thing when I needed to replace my 56* sm4 wedge cause it was too worn. Bought the new sm5 head only and they built it to specs of my previous wedge.

TIBA Putt - Discover your best stroke.

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My advice would be to get one off of Callaway pre-owned and have it bent, even in a cast iron 1* is not really that much.  As for the length any club fitter can take half an inch off and throw the grip back on.  The site actually has a 4 iron that is 1 up and standard length for under $70, but not sure what shaft flex you are looking for.

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In the Bag for 2020

PXG 0811XF Gen 2 10.5* (set at 9*) AD VR 6x

PXG 0341X Gen 2 15* AD TP 7x

PXG 0317X Gen 2 19* KBS Proto 95x

PXG 0311T Gen 3 4-6 KBS $ Taper 130

PXG 0311 ST 7 - PW KBS $ Taper 130

PXG 0311 Sugar Daddy 50/10 KBS $ Taper 130

PXG 0311 Sugar Daddy 54/10 & 58/07 TTDG TI S400

:rife-putters-1: Two Bar Blade Long 47"

 

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If it was me I would check out www.2ndswing.com . You should be able to find just about anything you are looking for. They will customize it for you as well. Talk to Thomas, he is their master club fitter. They are local to MN but ship all over the place and are a legit company.

Good luck.

Titleist AP1 irons

Titleist 913D 7.5 Degree, Stiff Speeder Tour Spec 6.2 Shaft

Wedges: Taylormade 60 d Titleist Vokey 54,56,58

Seemore Mallet Putter

Right Handed

Apple Valley, MN

8 Handicap

10885218_10205856139265562_6140026354236

 

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My first bit of advice -- get over your umbrage.   All the companies do this.   It's like railing against the onset of winter every November.   You'll be happier if you just roll with the punches and "learn how to ski".

 

By "learning how to ski" I mean learn to BUY OFF EBAY.   It has 156 current listings for X2hot 4 hybrids right now.   You should be able to find a good one, maybe new, for under $75.

 

20+ of the listings are from 2ndSwing for $100 to $130 depending on condition.

 

UPDATE:   I just read Sportsfans' post on the "best Ebay purchases" thread so I know he already knows all this.  He must be carping just to carp.

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bag - SunMountain Synch with Ogio Synergy X4 cart
driver - :callaway-small: Optiforce 440, Paderson Kevlar Green stiff 46.5"
fwoods - :taylormade-small: Jetspeed, 3HL regular
irons - :taylormade-small:  Speedblades 3-8, 85g stiff steel, 2 up
wedges - :edilon-small: Scor 40, 45, 50, 54, 58
putter - :ping-small: Ketsch 35" slight arc, SuperStroke 2.0 mid-slim
ball - :titelist-small: ProV1x

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You can keep searching for a matching 4i, sometimes they show up. Adjusting the lie 1* and shortening 0.5 in is no problem.

 

I agree that you can get nice X2hot hybrids off eBay for cheap. Getting a standard lie hybrid, I don't think you will notice a 1* difference. More important for an iron. Club can be easily shortened 0.5 in and regripped.

 

My concern would be whether the 4H is the right club to fill your gap. The hybrid is longer than the 4i and will fly higher and further. How big of a gap do you have between your 5i and you club above this one (is that your 3W)? I would think you need whatever hybrid covers that range. Could be 4H, maybe 3H. I say this because when I got fitted, my irons went to the 5i, but my first hybrid was a 5H because the 4H produced too big of a gap.

 

I like the hybrid option because it's quick and relatively cheap, and works better for me going into greens. But I'm old. :)

We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.”

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Club Finders. Shoot them an email with what you're looking for if they don't have one in stock

In The Bag
Driver: TaylorMade M2 (2017) w/ Project X T1100 HZRDUS Handcrafted 65x 
Strong 3 wood: Taylormade M1 15* w/ ProjectX T1100 HZRDUS handcrafted 75x
3 Hybrid: Adams PRO 18* w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"
4 Hybrid: Adams PRO 20* (bent to 21*) w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"
4-AW: TaylorMade P770 w/ Dynamic Gold Tour Issue Black Onyx S400

SW: 56* Scratch Tour Dept(CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold Spinner
LW: 60* Scratch Tour Department (CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold Spinner
XW: 64* Cally XForged Vintage w/ DG X100 8 iron tiger stepped
Putter: Nike Method Prototype 006 at 34"

Have a ton of back-ups in all categories, but there are always 14 clubs in the bag that differ depending on the course and set-up. Bomb and gouge. Yes, I'm a club gigolo.

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I've purchased individual replacement clubs from this site with no problems, reliable reseller: - http://www.ironfinder.com/Individual-Irons/callaway/x2_hot-14.htm

 

2 X2 Hot 4 irons listed right now.

What's In The Bag

Driver :titelist-small:

Titleist 913 D2 10.5* (set to 9.75* / Neutral) 46" Paderson KINETIXX Kevlar Green - R

Fairway Wood

Tom Wishon 949 MC 16.5* Fujikura Speeder 569-A

Hybrid  :cleveland-small: Hibore 22* Aldila VS Proto Blue

Irons  :ping-small: G series 5-P

Wedges :ping-small:Glide 54* SS / 60* TS - SCOR 53*

Putter     :nike-small: Nike Method 001 / P2 Reflex grip 35"

Ball

Master Grip Tour C4

Bag

Datrek DG Lite  

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Thanks all..

 

Currently scouring Ebay and all the sites listed.

 

Here's my new dilemma.. just checked Callaway Specs the 5 iron is actually 23 degrees as well as the 4 hybrid. It's a dead match.

 

As much as I'm thinking hybrid I'm not sure whether to go 3 hybrid, 4 hybrid or go 4 iron. I don't want to buy the hybrids without testing them distance wise especially if I dump money into it to get it up to my specs

 

My thought is go 4 iron and have that fixed to me, but hoping I don't screw up and end up with a 4 iron that I can't hit. Haven't bagged a 4 iron in probably 5 years.

 Driver:   :callaway-small:  Epic Flash 12 Degree

Wood: :callaway-small:  GBB 3 Wood
Hybrid: :callaway-small: Razr 4 hybriid stiff stock shaft.
Irons: :callaway-small: X2 Hot 4 iron (pro version) 5 iron - Gap Wedge (non pro version).  KBS 120g Shaft stiff cut 1/2  inch bent 1°upright
Wedges: :vokey-small: 52° 56° and 60°.
All grips are Golf pride grips midsized
Putter (lefty):  Odyssey Metal-X #8 34", stock shaft bent 2° Superstroke grip
Golf Balls:   :titelist-small: 2018-9 Pro-V1x and Prov1s
Shoes:  :footjoy-small:  Dryjoy tours

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A 23* 5 iron is very strong. It's actually a 4 iron with most other manufacturers. A 20* 4 iron is essentially a 3 iron. Just something to think about. Whether or not a 4 iron would be practical comes down to how well you hit your 5 iron. The 4 hybrid is 23* which is the same loft as your 5 iron but would likely give you more distance. The only way to know is to hit them and check the distance gaps. Here's a good video I saw the other day with some food for thought.

 

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Driver -  :taylormade-small: M1 9.5* w/ Aldila Rogue Silver 70X

Fairway -   :taylormade-small: M1 5W 19* w/ Aldila Rogue Silver 70X

Hybrids -   :ping-small: G25 4H 23*

Irons -  :mizuno-small: JPX 850 Forged 4-PW w/ Nippon N.S. Pro 1150S

Wedges - :mizuno-small: S5 50*07, 54*12, 58*12 w/ Nippon N.S. Pro 1150S

Putter - Oddyssey Metal-X #7 w/ SuperStroke Pistol GT 2.0

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A 23* 5 iron is very strong. It's actually a 4 iron with most other manufacturers. A 20* 4 iron is essentially a 3 iron. Just something to think about. Whether or not a 4 iron would be practical comes down to how well you hit your 5 iron. The 4 hybrid is 23* which is the same loft as your 5 iron but would likely give you more distance. The only way to know is to hit them and check the distance gaps. Here's a good video I saw the other day with some food for thought.

 

Thanks. Big problem is like you said distance gaps. Plus I don't want to have to change my swing for one club. Think I'll go 4 iron in this case. It's going to be used primarily off the tee, with the occasional use when I'm that far out.

 Driver:   :callaway-small:  Epic Flash 12 Degree

Wood: :callaway-small:  GBB 3 Wood
Hybrid: :callaway-small: Razr 4 hybriid stiff stock shaft.
Irons: :callaway-small: X2 Hot 4 iron (pro version) 5 iron - Gap Wedge (non pro version).  KBS 120g Shaft stiff cut 1/2  inch bent 1°upright
Wedges: :vokey-small: 52° 56° and 60°.
All grips are Golf pride grips midsized
Putter (lefty):  Odyssey Metal-X #8 34", stock shaft bent 2° Superstroke grip
Golf Balls:   :titelist-small: 2018-9 Pro-V1x and Prov1s
Shoes:  :footjoy-small:  Dryjoy tours

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  • 5 months later...

86, you have probably solved this issue by now, but my two pennyworth.

 

Go and see a proper 'independent' fitter, not someone based out of one of the superstores. Generally speaking, they are as much a fitter as I am a rocket scientist.

 

I spent a not inconsiderable time with a Maryland based fitter who was fantastic. We started by properly gapping my irons from PW back up the line. My longest iron is a six which is set at 32°. I now have three hybrids in my bag set at 28°, 24° and 20°. Carry distances are 185, 200 and 215. These are Wishon 775HS. A proper fitter will sort you out with the correct shaft for you swing speed and release and you will be as happy as a pig in poo.

 

The other great thing about being fit is that once the job is done you no longer need to get concerned about the latest greatest newest fastest longest club that the major companies release with great fanfare every twelve months. Does that sound just a touch cynical?

 

Good luck

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86, you have probably solved this issue by now, but my two pennyworth.

 

Go and see a proper 'independent' fitter, not someone based out of one of the superstores. Generally speaking, they are as much a fitter as I am a rocket scientist.

 

I spent a not inconsiderable time with a Maryland based fitter who was fantastic. We started by properly gapping my irons from PW back up the line. My longest iron is a six which is set at 32°. I now have three hybrids in my bag set at 28°, 24° and 20°. Carry distances are 185, 200 and 215. These are Wishon 775HS. A proper fitter will sort you out with the correct shaft for you swing speed and release and you will be as happy as a pig in poo.

 

The other great thing about being fit is that once the job is done you no longer need to get concerned about the latest greatest newest fastest longest club that the major companies release with great fanfare every twelve months. Does that sound just a touch cynical?

 

Good luck

Welcome! Nice first post.

Ping G410 - turned down to11.25 degrees, neutral setting - Fujikura Motore X R flex

Ping G410 5-9 wood

Wilson D7 forged 6-GW -  Mamiya recoil 460 R flex

SCOR 52,60

EVNRoll ER 5

Titleist Pro VIx optic yellow with revkev stamped on them

Currently testing Edison wedges to replace SCORS that are wearing out. Also auditions for the 14th spot in the bag.  Current possibilities are a Ping 26 degree hybrid - duplicates the 9 wood or 5 iron but would be used almost exclusively for chipping or Tour Exotics 3 wood simply because you can carry 14 clubs and I might occasionally hit it in certain unusual wind conditions once every four or five rounds. 

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I have a 4 iron, 4 hybrid and 2-3 hybrid that I alternate, depending on the course I am playing.

 

The 4i is 170 yards and more accurate

The 4h is 170 yards and lands softly

The 2-3h is 185-200 is very low and great under trees

 

Each has its own benefits

Driver: Tour Edge Exotics EXS w/Mitsubishi ck Blue regular shaft BACKUP DRIVER: Cobra F8 w/Mitsubishi ck Blue regular shaft  Fairways:  Cobra King F8 3W(14.5*) & 5W(18.5*) w/Mitsubishi ck Blue regular shaft Hybrids: Tour Edge CBX 119 4H(22*)  with Project X Evenflo regular shaft Irons: Wilson Staff D7 5 - PW w/Recoil 460 regular shafts Wedges: Wilson D7 GW(50*) & SW(54*) w/Recoil 460 regular shafts; Cleveland RTX Zipcore(58*) w/True Temper Spinner Wedge steel shaft  Putter: 33" Slotline SSi 693 mid mallet Bag: Cobra Ultralite Cart Bag(Peacoat Blue).

 

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If it was me I would check out www.2ndswing.com . You should be able to find just about anything you are looking for. They will customize it for you as well. Talk to Thomas, he is their master club fitter. They are local to MN but ship all over the place and are a legit company.

Good luck.

The only problem with 2nd Swing is they are a ripoff.  They want way too much money for everything they have.

Whats in my Sun Mountain 2.5+ stand bag?

Woods: Tommy Armour Atomic 10.5* 

Irons: Mizuno MP Fli-Hi 21* and Mizuno T-Zoid True 5, 7 and 9-irons

Wedge: Mizuno S18 Blue Ion 54*

Putter: Mizuno Bettinardi A-02

Ball: Maxfli Tour X

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