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LPGA Tour Lexi Thompson Ruling!


ole gray
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It was disgusting. Next someone will watch video of 86 Masters. Be a call for DQ, some silly rule violation.

And why wait til next day? Once round is in books it should be done. UNLESS, it can be shown someone intentionally cheating.

 

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I agree totally....I HATE that they listen to these people when the call/email in in the first place, BUT, if you are going to do it, I think once the first tee shot is hit in the next round, it's chiseled in stone and no changes can be made, no matter what someone sees.   Where DO you draw the line on time if not.

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2 separate issues here.

 

Lexi's mark and replacement of her ball. She did it, it was obvious and in the current rules should be a penalty.

 

Some asshat emailing in the rules infraction after the round and not being assessed until mid next round. That's just brutal.

 

I'm with the other guys. Once a rules official signs the card it's done. You catch something later than that and congrats you got away with one.

 

And please don't allow any call in or emails. The players and rules officials on the course are good enough we don't need outside assistance.

 

 

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So if they don't call her out late or not, then it's perfectly acceptable her obviously moving the ball?

It's cheating, intentional or not. But for me it needs to be seen by someone on the course that day. Getting an email from Joe public is just stupid.

 

 

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So if they don't call her out late or not, then it's perfectly acceptable her obviously moving the ball?

Yep.

How many pass interference or holding penalties do we see in NFL games that don't get called?

 

Officials are all over the place during a round. If they miss something and your playing partner missed it, you get away with it. Part of the game. That's why integrity is so important- we usually have to call the penalty in ourselves.

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Definitely cheating, whether it was a mental lapse or not.....I'd have called out an opponent for that. Actually had it happen in a tournament, I didn't see it, but another in the group called the guy out and the offender threw a fit and walked off the course.

 

The fact that call ins are allowed is the most ridiculous thing ever.

 

 

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I'm not willing to assume that she blatantly cheated on purpose and feel that's a slippery slope.  Her placement of the ball was questionable, but the accusation of cheating purposefully goes a little too far in my opinion.

 

We have placed our game on a pedestal.  We are a game of integrity where we call penalties on ourselves.  Integrity, honor and sportsmanship are defining characteristics of playing our game at any level.  Yet, we allow someone to phone in or email something they witness on television.  It simply doesn't make any sense to me.  

 

I think we could all learn a lot from watching this young lady handle this situation.  With grace and humility!

 

 

​​

 

I remember a few years back one of my close friends (Bubba Grimes), use to mark his ball with a small piece of red man chew tobacco. We didn't play for a million bucks however our dollar per hole bets were significant enough.  Now thinking back, I can remember Bubba moving his ball a couple inches to the left of his chewing tobacco mark more than a few times.  Now was Bubba cheating when he didn't spit in the perfect place his ball came to rest. Maybe. Did we give a rats arse? No. Hell if it was in a 12 inch circle it was all good with us.  I don't believe Bubba spit in the wrong place on purpose however the wind could have blown it off a  bit.   I believe I'll call him today and tell him he owes me a couple hundred bucks for not spitting in the right place.   Guess what Bubba Grimes would tell me to do with that couple hundred bucks. ;)​ 

 

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I remember a few years back one of my close friends (Bubba Grimes), use to mark his ball with a small piece of red man chew tobacco. We didn't play for a million bucks however our dollar per hole bets were significant enough. Now thinking back, I can remember Bubba moving his ball a couple inches to the left of his chewing tobacco mark more than a few times. Now was Bubba cheating when he didn't spit in the perfect place his ball came to rest. Maybe. Did we give a rats arse? No. Hell if it was in a 12 inch circle it was all good with us. I don't believe Bubba spit in the wrong place on purpose however the wind could have blown it off a bit. I believe I'll call him today and tell him he owes me a couple hundred bucks for not spitting in the right place. Guess what Bubba Grimes would tell me to do with that couple hundred bucks. ;)​

 

But this is fine because his gambling buddies were ok with it. I'd consider this your "local rule".

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But this is fine because his gambling buddies were ok with it. I'd consider this your "local rule".

 

When it all shakes out it's not about whether she intentionally moved the ball an inch either way. It's the fact some sob called in and made the call. I don't think this dip wad should have been allowed to call in ......  Frankly I could care less if Lexi intentionally moved the ball.  I don't think she placed the ball where she did with the intent of gaining a stroke over her opponents.  I hope the person who called in get's a year long case of jock itch with no relief.  :angry: 

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When it all shakes out it's not about whether she intentionally moved the ball an inch either way. It's the fact some sob called in and made the call. I don't think this dip wad should have been allowed to call in ...... Frankly I could care less if Lexi intentionally moved the ball. I don't think she placed the ball where she did with the intent of gaining a stroke over her opponents. I hope the person who called in get's a year long case of jock itch with no relief. :angry:

To me, it's on the officials. Any idiot can call or email in - have a ball. But for the officials to change a ruling made the previous day (via certifying the card), is where the real problem lies. They should have ignored it. Call it the rub of the green, missed calll, whatever.

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ShotLink or it didn't happen...

 

A - The rules of golf are clear and in the overwhelming majority of scenarios, rules infractions have nothing to do with intent. The governing bodies have refused any subsequent discussion of intent in their proceedings because that would be a de facto admission professional golfers are flawed human beings just like the rest of us.

B - The mere idea of intentionally marking/replacing my ball to avoid an imperfection on the putting surface makes me nauseous.

C - CDW sponsors Paula Creamer but won't license their "big data savior" to the LPGA, even for their majors?

 

Since it already runs on the backs of volunteers, ShotLink should be available to any pro tour event that can supply the requisite tournament staff. Set a reasonable tolerance for valid mark and replacement. If you violate, an automated data exception will initiate an immediate player communication via tour official. The data doesn't lie and would most certainly identify any questionable mark/replace trends.

 

I seem to recall a nearly identical scenario temporarily marring one of Mark O'meara's Major victories. Does anybody else remember that? I cannot find mention of it anywhere but feel like it was the '98 British Open and somebody's manager (Jesper? Constantino Rocca?) made a huge stink about a mark/replacement infraction coming down the stretch on Sunday. Mark's Monday reply was something to the effect "Even if I did incorrectly replace my ball, it was a short putt and I like to think I'm a pretty solid putter inside 3 feet". Major victory stands and he's now in the Hall of Fame.

 

 

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ShotLink or it didn't happen...

 

A) The rules of golf are clear and in the overwhelming majority of scenarios, rules infractions have nothing to do with intent. The governing bodies have refused any subsequent discussion of intent in their proceedings because that would be a de facto admission professional golfers are flawed human beings just like the rest of us.

B) The mere idea of intentionally marking/replacing my ball to avoid an imperfection on the putting surface makes me nauseous.

C) CDW sponsors Paula Creamer but won't license their "big data savior" to the LPGA, even for their majors?

 

Since it already runs on the backs of volunteers, ShotLink should be available to any pro tour event that can supply the requisite tournament staff. Set a reasonable tolerance for valid mark and replacement. If you violate, an automated data exception will initiate an immediate player communication via tour official. The data doesn't lie and would most certainly identify any questionable mark/replace trends.

 

I seem to recall a nearly identical scenario temporarily marring one of Mark O'meara's Major victories. Does anybody else remember that? I cannot find mention of it anywhere but feel like it was the '98 British Open and somebody's manager (Jesper? Constantino Rocca?) made a huge stink about a mark/replacement infraction coming down the stretch on Sunday. Mark's Monday reply was something to the effect "Even if I did incorrectly replace my ball, it was a short putt and I like to think I'm a pretty solid putter inside 3 feet". Major victory stands and he's now in the Hall of Fame.

 

 

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It was Jarmo Sandelin who accused O'Meara of an improper ball marking.

 

https://www.si.com/vault/1999/09/20/266683/in-your-face-confrontational-and-controversial-jarmo-sandelin-has-few-friends-on-either-side-of-the-atlantic-which-is-how-he-likes-it

 

O'Meara and many others feel like this accusation is why he was never selected to captain a Ryder Cup team.  O'Meara was never fully able to remove the stigma that followed.

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Not much publicity of the Lexi loss on the Golf Channel, and even less on the LPGA website.  So Yeon Ryu won.  I'm sure they just want to let it fade away as quickly as possible.  

 

I agree that a penalty occurred, but the penalty for signing an incorrect scorecard the next day, halfway through the final round, is the real issue, unless the infraction was deemed to be intentional.  If intentional, then the old ruling of DQ should be enforced.  I don't believe that Lexi did it intentionally, and if it is not obvious to playing partners and officials at the time and the scorecard signed by all, then it's in the books IMO.

 

I put blame for these situations on the television broadcasters.  Big events get a lot of cameras and producers want all kinds of camera shots because it gives the commentators something more to talk about.  Personally, I don't think super closeup shots should be televised.  Sure, they can zoom in on a ball that has an interesting lie for effect, but when a player gets ready to play the shot, the camera should view the shot like everyone around can see, no closer.  I saw no reason for that camera to be zoomed in when Lexi marked her ball.  It is not fair to the best players who are on camera all the time.  Players at the bottom of the leaderboard do not get closeup photos.  I think it's time that the professional organizations dictate the kind of coverage of their players that TV broadcasters can use.

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Is it me or are the other players going to let Lexi win? All were climbing the leader board but now dropping shots

They're probably worried they get a penalty... it's like a speed trap. Everyone slows down when they see the first person pulled over.

 

 

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It was Jarmo Sandelin who accused O'Meara of an improper ball marking.

 

https://www.si.com/vault/1999/09/20/266683/in-your-face-confrontational-and-controversial-jarmo-sandelin-has-few-friends-on-either-side-of-the-atlantic-which-is-how-he-likes-it

 

O'Meara and many others feel like this accusation is why he was never selected to captain a Ryder Cup team. O'Meara was never fully able to remove the stigma that followed.

Nice find. I did more research and it appears a television viewer in Sweden brought it to the attention of Sandelin. Jomar subsequently wrote O'meara a letter and supplied video evidence of the infraction on the 15th hole, quoted as "roughly half an inch closer", calling for Mark to disavow the victory and return the trophy. Mark's only refutation, "I didn't intend to gain advantage" and that seemed to be enough for the governing bodies or at least their malleable unpublished statute of limitations had already passed.

 

 

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In my opinion, the job of rules enforcement is exclusively the role of other players and the on site officials, not some loser watching on TV, whose joy in life is to create problems for others in order to promote their self esteem.  Moreover, I think that not only should the LPGA, but all professional tours should state that they will no longer utilize reports from viewers regarding rule enforcement.  

 

Other than the Masters, my wife shows no interest in televised golf.   However, yesterday, when she came out of her hobby room to get a drink, I told her what happened to Lexi.   She immediately sit down and started routing for Lexi.   When coming LPGA events are televised, I'm sure the wife is going to ask--how is Lexi doing.  While the LPGA may have harmed its general popularity, they did gave Lexi's popularity a major boost, so to speak.  

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So if they don't call her out late or not, then it's perfectly acceptable her obviously moving the ball?

not saying she didn't mark/replace incorrectly......it's the ruling on it a round later, because a fan called in........At some point, the score needs to become 'official'.......what if someone today went through some old '86 Masters home video a fan took, and found out Jack should have a had a penalty somewhere?    What would be the difference?   It should be up to the rules officials on the course and your opponents in your group, in my humble opinion

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Nice find. I did more research and it appears a television viewer in Sweden brought it to the attention of Sandelin. Jomar subsequently wrote O'meara a letter and supplied video evidence of the infraction on the 15th hole, quoted as "roughly half an inch closer", calling for Mark to disavow the victory and return the trophy. Mark's only refutation, "I didn't intend to gain advantage" and that seemed to be enough for the governing bodies or at least their malleable unpublished statute of limitations had already passed.

 

 

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I remember when it happened but like seemingly everyone else, especially in this country, I wrote it off as Sandelin being Sandelin.  For those who don't know who he is, the guy is certifiably crazy and that's being kind!  Sandelin also had a well publicized dust-up with Lee Westwood the following year that was ironically at the same event as the dust-up with O"Meara. 

 

He once played a 60 inch driver at St. Andrews and used a 52 inch driver for the majority of his career.  

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Everyone is correct on a lot of things:

 

The late penalty was BS

Calls in shouldn't be allowed

The handling by the USGA/LPGA was horrendous 

 

But the one thing that is beyond true and needs to be addressed:

 

You damn well know when you put a marker almost to the side of the ball and then move your ball an inch over to replace it on that spot. She knew 100% what she was doing, I have no doubt about that.

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