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And a good rule of thumb is if you find yourself on the same side of an argument as Chamblee, then you should reevaluate your stance

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... I will add a Millennial story. I was shooting Mind Games and an extra and I started talking during a break. He is an Accountant and his firm placed him in charge of the incoming Millennials that graduated from college and were ready to join the work force in Chicago, a very competitive market. They found they were losing too many employees after 6 months to a year working there. About 30% quit or were fired. So they started a one month training program and he was placed in charge. Basically covering what it is like to work for a big company and what is expected of the employee and what they can expect from their employer. Here are the highlights:

 

Work starts at 9am. If you come in at 9:02 you are late. Get to work early everyday and then relax until 9am. One Millennial asked "What if the line at Starbucks is slow?" She was told to get out of line and get to work on time. She walked out. 

 

You don't get a pat on the back for doing your job. You are expected to do your job. Anything less is grounds for dismissal. 

 

​You don't get a raise for doing your job. You get a raise for going above and beyond what is expected. 

 

Work is not a place to make friends. If you happen to make a friend that is OK. You can take your break together, go to lunch together or meet after work. Work is for working, it is not a social adventure.

 

Your cell phone is not to be used at work period. You have an office phone for work related calls. All other calls should be made on your own time. 

 

Facebook and social media are not allowed at work. 

 

If you follow these rules and work hard you can go far and fast. Raises, bonus's and perks are your reward. If you don't, you will not last very long.

 

​... He said about 20% drop out before the class is over. That is less than before classes started and they didn't go thru training or leave work half finished. The important thing he said was that means about 75% are in the workforce and doing a good job. He thought it was unfair to lump all Millennials into one group when 75% were hard working and still with the company. The 25% were giving the rest a bad name. Food for thought if you are suffering from curmudgeonitis.   ;) 

That is exactly the work ethic my old man taught me. That is like where I work now they have trouble finding people to work period. It is like that all around here mainly for causes you stated

 

My wife works for a major grocery chain. Now she has been with the company 13 years. Recently 2 other major chains have came into the area. An associate friend of hers tried to get her to go with their company. She did the interview and talked head to head with the Regional Manager who told her he told corporate that he thought it was a mistake to open up in this area because they did not have a dependable workforce pool to draw on. She ended up turning the job down because she would lose all her accumulated vacation and benefits. Besides since then she has set up to retire with a full pension in 1 1/2 years

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We are all the same. If I came into this thread and complained about baby boomers/or older and showed total disprespect to that group of people, all hell would break loose.

 

I would never disrespect those people who are in a different stage of life than I, and I'm sorry, but I don't take kindly when someone does that towards me.

 

 

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plaid, both you and numberonncoog make Excellent points, showing it's a multi-generational cause and problem. The millennial generation didn't raise themselves and many parents are waaaaay too overprotective of theirs kids' feelings, leading to some of them having no backbone or ability to handle failure and/or thinking they are special.

There seems to be an attitude issue on both sides, usually some form of entitlement, whether it's (some) older/experienced players feeling like golf is "theirs" and newer/weaker golfers shouldn't be on golf courses, while (some) younger /newer players thinking golf should change to match the way more fast paced consumption they're used to.

When we golf and my 9 year old nephew plays, we tee him up from our 2nd or 3rd shot, depending on hole length, and it doesn't really slow us down, so maybe have a very forward set of tees ( yes executive courses fit this bill as well) Courses could also do 3- or 6-hole mini-rounds, the challenge would be where to start them.

As GolfSpyDave noted, Sacramento has a good junior 1st Tee program that makes the cost of entry very low and many courses welcome it.

 

 

 

 

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There is an exclusive private course down the road from me I am lucky to play at. One of my old running buddies is the assistant pro there. They have permanant markers in the ground for the kids to play from. They are color coded according to age group. It is a PGA program and my buddy explained it to me. Pretty good idea. They do run some junior tournaments there. I have officiated when they were short of help. But I think it is a real good program wish more public courses here would go with it

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We are all the same. If I came into this thread and complained about baby boomers/or older and showed total disprespect to that group of people, all hell would break loose.

 

I would never disrespect those people who are in a different stage of life than I, and I'm sorry, but I don't take kindly when someone does that towards me.

 

 

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Dont take it so hard. Remember I have read your posts over the years and worked with you on equipment tests and on the guideline comittee. You contribute a lot to MGS. You are one exception. There is good and bad in everything. Hell there are some old fart crumudgens around here I have no use for. I think this post was started in good faith for kicks and giggles and maybe has went too far for some. If I offended you or anyone else I am sorry as they say at work "LOL That is just Stu being Stu"

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[emoji1375] that's the problem! I took my kids out golfing last year, and some gentlemen decided to cuss and throw their gear and tell me to hurry up. I thanked them for introducing my children to a what not to be.

 

As a kid I played horse shoes, and by "regulations" I could play from 30' instead of 40'. You can till you turn 18 I think if I remember. Anyways, I got heckled everywhere I went. The number of horseshoe players has been cut by about 60% because of jerks like those.

 

Golf is golfs problem, not which age group or generation your from.

 

 

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Dont take it so hard. Remember I have read your posts over the years and worked with you on equipment tests and on the guideline comittee. You contribute a lot to MGS. You are one exception. There is good and bad in everything. Hell there are some old fart crumudgens around here I have no use for. I think this post was started in good faith for kicks and giggles and maybe has went too far for some. If I offended you or anyone else I am sorry as they say at work "LOL That is just Stu being Stu"

Stu i took no offense to what you said. Like I said and tried to make clear, I completely respect you and everyone else in this forum.

 

What I take offense to is the idea that it's "all or nothing" and I don't necissarily think that's the point you were making. Do I agree that there are plenty of people in my generation who don't have the drive, have a sense of entitlement and general lack of respect? Absolutely!

 

But guess what man? I can think of people that are examples of that attitude who are 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 and so on. Negative attitude is just that. It has no prejudice and will infect anyone it can get it's hands on.

 

I just don't think it's fair to anyone in any stage of their life to classify them into a large bucket. We all matter, and hell Stu, you matter to me man. You're an extremely valuable member of this community. But honestly man, age plays no role in that for me. That's my only point.

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I have neither the brains nor the ego to "tell it like it is," and I hate to generalize about things, especially groups of people. I know 4 millennials very well - my 4 kids. Are they exactly like me? No. Do they like the same things? Some, and they like things I don't like. For instance, my oldest son loves watching the Red Sox - so do I. He loves watching Trailer Park Boys - I think it's the dumbest thing I've ever seen. I can't make general statements inclusive of the only 4 millennials I know well, how the hell can anyone generalize about an entire age group and expect to be taken seriously??

 

Golf is going to evolve. Hell, our world is going to evolve. If you want an idea of what golf is going to look like in 25-30 years, pay attention to what 20-25 year olds are doing. It'll be their game soon enough. We older folk can say "move along" all we want, or say play the game the way I see that it's meant to be or go find something else, but that's ridiculous. We're all passengers on this flight, and it's gonna go where the next generation takes it.

 

I have a buddy who started a golf lifestyle brand, and started selling flip flops for golf. I posted some pics here and the self-proclaimed guardians of the game lost their collective minds. How dare he do that??? Not proper golf attire!!! Lighten the hell up. It's a game.

 

This young kid is a millennial - one of the hardest working kids I know, and one of the best golfers I've ever played with. He likes to play barefoot or in his flip flops, and some people here treated him like he was Kim Jong Un. He was raised by a single mother, worked his way through college and won a business plan competition to help start his company.

 

We love to generalize about a generation, but that's silly, childish and often based on preconceived notions we claim come from our "experience." We're talking about individuals - and there are lazy, entitled, self-righteous and self-centered baby boomers, just as there are lazy, entitled, self-righteous and self-centered millennials.

 

At least the millennials have youth and inexperience as an excuse.

 

 

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Driver:  Sub 70 639D - 9.5; :cleveland-small: Launcher HB Turbo; :mizuno-small: ST 190 
FW Wood: :tour-edge: Tour Edge EXS 220 - 15*; :mizuno-small: ST 180 14*
Hybrids:  PXG 0311 22
Utility Irons: :wilson_staff_small: Staff Model Utilities 18, 21, 24*;  Lynx VT Stinger - 16*
Irons::wilson_staff_small: D7 Forged; :benhogan-small:PTx Pro, :macgregor-small: VIP 1025 V-Foil MB/CB; :wilson_staff_small: Progressives (circa 1993)

Wedges:  :cleveland-small: CBX -2, :benhogan-small:Riviera 52-56-60; :wilson_staff_small: Staff Model
Putter:   :edel-golf-1:  Willamette,  :bettinardi-small: BB8,  :benhogan-small:Baby Ben

Ball: :bridgestone-small: Tour B X (2020); :srixon-small: Z-STAR XV

Stat Tracker/GPS Watch: :ShotScope:


 
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News flash for Millennials, Gen Xers, Baby Boomers, The Silent Generation and anyone else on MGS worried about the game of golf....it was here before you were born and it will be here after you're gone. There is nothing to worry about. There is a lot of hand-wringing "oh how is the game going to survive" talk, but don't worry, it's gonna be alright.

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I have neither the brains nor the ego to "tell it like it is," and I hate to generalize about things, especially groups of people. I know 4 millennials very well - my 4 kids. Are they exactly like me? No. Do hey like the same things? Some, and they like things I don't like. For instance, my oldest son loves watching the Red Sox - so do I. He loves watching Trailer Park Boys - I think it's the dumbest thing I've ever seen.

 

Golf is going to evolve. Hell, our world is going to evolve. If you want an idea of what golf is going to look like in 25-30 years, pay attention to what 20-25 year olds are doing. It'll be their game soon enough. We older folk can say "move along" all we want, or say play the game the way I see that it's meant to be or go find something else, but that's ridiculous. We're all passengers on this flight, and it's gonna go where the next generation takes it.

 

I have a buddy who started a golf lifestyle brand, and started selling flip flops for golf. I posted some pics here and the self-proclaimed guardians of the game lost their collective minds. How dare he do that??? Not proper golf attire!!! Lighten the hell up. It's a game.

 

This young kid is a millennial - one of the hardest working kids I know, and one of the best golfer I've ever played with. He likes to play barefoot or in his flip flops, and people treated him like he was Kim Jong Un. He worked his way through college and won a business plan competition to help start his company.

 

We love to generalize about a generation, but that's silly and often based on preconceived notions we claim come from our "experience." We're talking about individuals - and there are lazy, entitled and self-centered baby boomers, just as there are lazy, entitled and self-centered millennials.

 

 

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I played a round barefoot once, it was fantastic!

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I played a round barefoot once, it was fantastic!

I've always wanted to play a round bare-chested, but a buddy said it would be way too much hair to look at.

 

 

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What's in the bag:
 
Driver:  Sub 70 639D - 9.5; :cleveland-small: Launcher HB Turbo; :mizuno-small: ST 190 
FW Wood: :tour-edge: Tour Edge EXS 220 - 15*; :mizuno-small: ST 180 14*
Hybrids:  PXG 0311 22
Utility Irons: :wilson_staff_small: Staff Model Utilities 18, 21, 24*;  Lynx VT Stinger - 16*
Irons::wilson_staff_small: D7 Forged; :benhogan-small:PTx Pro, :macgregor-small: VIP 1025 V-Foil MB/CB; :wilson_staff_small: Progressives (circa 1993)

Wedges:  :cleveland-small: CBX -2, :benhogan-small:Riviera 52-56-60; :wilson_staff_small: Staff Model
Putter:   :edel-golf-1:  Willamette,  :bettinardi-small: BB8,  :benhogan-small:Baby Ben

Ball: :bridgestone-small: Tour B X (2020); :srixon-small: Z-STAR XV

Stat Tracker/GPS Watch: :ShotScope:


 
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I've always wanted to play a round bare-chested, but a buddy said it would be way too much hair to look at.

 

 

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The December edition of Links Magazine has a list of courses that would "allow" such an event. I think it was December anyways. [emoji6]

 

 

- Alan

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I have neither the brains nor the ego to "tell it like it is," and I hate to generalize about things, especially groups of people. I know 4 millennials very well - my 4 kids. Are they exactly like me? No. Do hey like the same things? Some, and they like things I don't like. For instance, my oldest son loves watching the Red Sox - so do I. He loves watching Trailer Park Boys - I think it's the dumbest thing I've ever seen.

 

Golf is going to evolve. Hell, our world is going to evolve. If you want an idea of what golf is going to look like in 25-30 years, pay attention to what 20-25 year olds are doing. It'll be their game soon enough. We older folk can say "move along" all we want, or say play the game the way I see that it's meant to be or go find something else, but that's ridiculous. We're all passengers on this flight, and it's gonna go where the next generation takes it.

 

I have a buddy who started a golf lifestyle brand, and started selling flip flops for golf. I posted some pics here and the self-proclaimed guardians of the game lost their collective minds. How dare he do that??? Not proper golf attire!!! Lighten the hell up. It's a game.

 

This young kid is a millennial - one of the hardest working kids I know, and one of the best golfer I've ever played with. He likes to play barefoot or in his flip flops, and people treated him like he was Kim Jong Un. He was raised by a single mother, worked his way through college and won a business plan competition to help start his company.

 

We love to generalize about a generation, but that's silly and often based on preconceived notions we claim come from our "experience." We're talking about individuals - and there are lazy, entitled, self-righteous and self-centered baby boomers, just as there are lazy, entitled, self-righteous and self-centered millennials.

 

At least the millennials have youth and inexperience as an excuse.

 

 

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Well said.

 

There's nothing else to elaborate on here. Pretty much life in a nutshell.

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:titelist-small: AP3 5-PW with Accra Tour 110i shafts and Black MicroPerf Best Grips.

:titelist-small: SM7 50F, 54S and 60M grinds with Dynamic Gold 120 Tour Issue S400 and Black MicroPerf Best Grips.

:bettinardi-1: Queen B #6 with 34" Stability Shaft and P2 Aware Tour Grip.

:titelist-small: Pro-V1 Golf Ball.

Jones Utility Golf Bag.

Dormie Custom Headcovers.
Bushnell Pro X2 Laser Rangefinder.

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I have neither the brains nor the ego to "tell it like it is," and I hate to generalize about things, especially groups of people. I know 4 millennials very well - my 4 kids. Are they exactly like me? No. Do hey like the same things? Some, and they like things I don't like. For instance, my oldest son loves watching the Red Sox - so do I. He loves watching Trailer Park Boys - I think it's the dumbest thing I've ever seen.

 

Golf is going to evolve. Hell, our world is going to evolve. If you want an idea of what golf is going to look like in 25-30 years, pay attention to what 20-25 year olds are doing. It'll be their game soon enough. We older folk can say "move along" all we want, or say play the game the way I see that it's meant to be or go find something else, but that's ridiculous. We're all passengers on this flight, and it's gonna go where the next generation takes it.

 

I have a buddy who started a golf lifestyle brand, and started selling flip flops for golf. I posted some pics here and the self-proclaimed guardians of the game lost their collective minds. How dare he do that??? Not proper golf attire!!! Lighten the hell up. It's a game.

 

This young kid is a millennial - one of the hardest working kids I know, and one of the best golfer I've ever played with. He likes to play barefoot or in his flip flops, and people treated him like he was Kim Jong Un. He was raised by a single mother, worked his way through college and won a business plan competition to help start his company.

 

We love to generalize about a generation, but that's silly and often based on preconceived notions we claim come from our "experience." We're talking about individuals - and there are lazy, entitled, self-righteous and self-centered baby boomers, just as there are lazy, entitled, self-righteous and self-centered millennials.

 

At least the millennials have youth and inexperience as an excuse.

 

 

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Anyone else hear the Star Spangled Banner playing in their head when reading this post?
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:ping-small: G425 LST 14.5* Tour AD DI 7X

:titelist-small: 818 H2 20* Tour AD DI 85X

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:mizuno-small: JPX 919 Tour 5-PW OBAN CT 115X(-)

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:EVNROLL: ER1v #CustomER

:titelist-small: ProV1

 

 

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What I take offense to is the idea that it's "all or nothing" and I don't necissarily think that's the point you were making. Do I agree that there are plenty of people in my generation who don't have the drive, have a sense of entitlement and general lack of respect? Absolutely!

 

I just don't think it's fair to anyone in any stage of their life to classify them into a large bucket. We all matter, and hell Stu, you matter to me man. You're an extremely valuable member of this community. But honestly man, age plays no role in that for me. That's my only point.

 

 

... Shawn, those of us that have been around awhile longer have seen this come and go for every generation. Millennials are the golden generation compared to us Hippies of the late 60's. Were called "girls" (unbelievably an insult back then) because of our long hair. "Creeps" because of our clothing. Lazy bums because we lived a free style life and made our own rules. And of course Communists because we didn't believe every member of Government was a sacred official. We were everything the suit and tie wearing, buzz cut, military loving older generation hated. And we were all lumped in together. Just like millennials today, we did fall into a range of people that were pretty similar in looks and attitude when compared to the generations before them. 

 

... But we were all individuals. I am still a Hippie liberal at heart and proud of it. We wanted to make the world a better place and didn't care about economic wealth. Millennials are the same as any generation that came before it. There is a general look and attitude, I have seen more beards in this generation than all others combined. If you don't wanna be a millennial, don't look like one. :)  Again, I had no problem being labeled a Hippie because I was one. Long hair, dirty cut off and frayed jeans, tee shirts and gym shoes. But I was an individual too, always was a hard worker, I just chose what I wanted to work hard at doing. As I illustrated in my story about the accounting firm, there was a small group that had a huge impact on the way their generation is perceived. But there was a much, much larger group that were just like everyone else in the workforce and every generation before it. People are people, always changing and always the same.  Labels don't matter unless you let them. 

 

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Utility:      :taylormade-small: UDi 18* ... Even Flow Black 85R
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                  :taylormade-small: Sim Hybrid 22* ... Diamana Ltd 75R
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                  :taylormade-small: MG3 58* LB ... Steelfiber 95R
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... Shawn, those of us that have been around awhile longer have seen this come and go for every generation. Millennials are the golden generation compared to us Hippies of the late 60's. Were called "girls" (unbelievably an insult back then) because of our long hair. "Creeps" because of our clothing. Lazy bums because we lived a free style life and made our own rules. And of course Communists because we didn't believe every member of Government was a sacred official. We were everything the suit and tie wearing, buzz cut, military loving older generation hated. And we were all lumped in together. Just like millennials today, we did fall into a range of people that were pretty similar in looks and attitude when compared to the generations before them.

 

... But we were all individuals. I am still a Hippie liberal at heart and proud of it. We wanted to make the world a better place and didn't care about economic wealth. Millennials are the same as any generation that came before it. There is a general look and attitude, I have seen more beards in this generation than all others combined. If you don't wanna be a millennial, don't look like one. :) Again, I had no problem being labeled a Hippie because I was one. Long hair, dirty cut off and frayed jeans, tee shirts and gym shoes. But I was an individual too, always was a hard worker, I just chose what I wanted to work hard at doing. As I illustrated in my story about the accounting firm, there was a small group that had a huge impact on the way their generation is perceived. But there was a much, much larger group that were just like everyone else in the workforce and every generation before it. People are people, always changing and always the same. Labels don't matter unless you let them.

 

Great post. Couldn't agree more.
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:titelist-small: TS3 8.75 with HZRDOUS Yellow and Black MicroPerf Best Grips.

:callaway-small: XR 16 3W & 5W with HZRDOUS Red shafts and Black MicroPerf Best Grips.

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:titelist-small: AP3 5-PW with Accra Tour 110i shafts and Black MicroPerf Best Grips.

:titelist-small: SM7 50F, 54S and 60M grinds with Dynamic Gold 120 Tour Issue S400 and Black MicroPerf Best Grips.

:bettinardi-1: Queen B #6 with 34" Stability Shaft and P2 Aware Tour Grip.

:titelist-small: Pro-V1 Golf Ball.

Jones Utility Golf Bag.

Dormie Custom Headcovers.
Bushnell Pro X2 Laser Rangefinder.

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As a millennial, I can definitely see merit in what you are saying about changing to accommodate the millennial generation's "consuming habits" for lack of a better term. Probably not the best idea.

 

However, golf does need to change. Specifically, we need to do a much better job of catering to children, and teens. We need to make the game so incredibly accessible to them. The industry is in decline. We need a new generation of golfers to come up behind us to rebuild the game if we want a bright future. No golfers leads to fewer courses/ranges, which leads to the eventual demise of golf.

 

It's too late to capture millennials. That ship has sailed. Let's get after the 7-17 year olds right now. Grow the game from the bottom up.

 

 

 

 

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Cost, the main reason is cost. Some areas have really good deals for Jr. Golf other areas have nothing, first tee is a nice program, but here is cost and the times they are offered often don't work for that age group, especially if they are in school programs and activities. I personally think that you should be able to take a child lets say 16 and under to the course and play with each paid adult round of golf, that's how you get them out there, my problem is that when taking the kids cost about 25 bucks, and then they only want to actually play about 4 out of 9 holes. Those are my thoughts. As for millinials, well, there are a different species, but you all are right, changing things to suit them is bad. Maybe they dont keep score and everyone wins the club championship and they all get a trophy.

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Lefties are always in their Right Mind

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Cost, the main reason is cost. Some areas have really good deals for Jr. Golf other areas have nothing, first tee is a nice program, but here is cost and the times they are offered often don't work for that age group, especially if they are in school programs and activities. I personally think that you should be able to take a child lets say 16 and under to the course and play with each paid adult round of golf, that's how you get them out there, my problem is that when taking the kids cost about 25 bucks, and then they only want to actually play about 4 out of 9 holes. Those are my thoughts. As for millinials, well, there are a different species, but you all are right, changing things to suit them is bad. Maybe they dont keep score and everyone wins the club championship and they all get a trophy.

Hahah, **** millennials, am I right?!?! We're all a bunch or whiny little assholes who can't stand adversity, thank god we have the previous generations around to tell us how entitled and shitty we are!

 

 

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WITB:

 

Driver: Taylormade M2 (2016) 10.5° | Fujikura Pro Stiff 60g

Fairway: Taylormade Aeroburner 2.0 TP 16.5° | Diamana Whiteboard Stiff 80g

Hybrid: Titleist 915h 21° | Diamana Blueboard Stiff 80g

Driving Iron: Titleist 712U 3 Iron | Kuro Kage Stiff 70g

Irons: Titleist AP2 714 4-PW | KBS Tour 90 Stiff Shafts

Wedges: Titleist Vokey SM5 50°/54°/58°

Putter: Scotty Cameron 2016 Newport 2 | SuperStroke Mid Slim 2.0 

Ball: Taylormade TP5x

 

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