Cheaters on Tour

[Kanoito]

Was just reading this article, but don't know who the author is referring to.

 

http://www.golfdigest.com/story/undercover-tour-pro-cheaters-are-hard-to-catch-but-we-know-who-they-are

 

Can anybody shed some light?

[PlaidJacket]

I don't care much for this type of stuff. I suppose GD thinks it cool but to me it's just gossip and the Nat'l Enquirer.

[poprocksncoke]

first guess would be Montgomerie?

[The Dansome]

Billy Mayfair?

 

If this was the women's tour it would be pretty obvious who.

[downlowkey]

From the scant information we received via Jack Nicklaus' Masters presser on the Lexi situation, I feel like Danny Lee could be singled out as the serial ball mark violator that was given a "talking to" during the prior Presidents Cup. But I did my homework before making any assumptions.

[ole gray]

Sooooo who hasn't cheated in golf at one time or another? I roll the ball in the rough on occasions, I may not mark the ball perfectly, and I have putted with a titty putter recently. My wife loves me, my dog loves me, and all my golfing buddies would be pissed if I didn't show up at the blitz.

They know I cheat because they do too. It's a cheating kind of thang with our group however it's all good....

You may not cheat in golf however did you ever tell a lie? Did you ever steal something (piece of candy or your brothers/sisters stuff? Don't judge unless you judge your self first...


Gawd I hope the person who phones in rule violations gets a case of the hundred year jock itch!


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[Undershooter]

Its either Vijay or Billy Mayfair. I'm going with Billy.

[Kanoito]

Nah, not judging anybody. Just mere curiosity.

 

And I don't even know who Billy Mayfair is

[scooducks]

Sooooo who hasn't cheated in golf at one time or another? I roll the ball in the rough on occasions, I may not mark the ball perfectly, and I have putted with a titty putter recently. My wife loves me, my dog loves me, and all my golfing buddies would be pissed if I didn't show up at the blitz.

 

They know I cheat because they do too. It's a cheating kind of thang with our group however it's all good....

 

You may not cheat in golf however did you ever tell a lie? Did you ever steal something (piece of candy or your brothers/sisters stuff? Don't judge unless you judge your self first...

 

 

Gawd I hope the person who phones in rule violations gets a case of the hundred year jock itch!

 

 

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If you're not cheating, you're not trying!

 

 

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[Philly Golf Guy]

My Dad and I were talking about this yesterday. There's a difference between gaining advantages and straight out cheating so hopefully there's proof of this player doing the latter.

[Shankster]

I am not good enough at golf to follow all of the rules. I would hate golf if there were refs on the course telling you what penalty you just committed. On TOUR if you knowingly cheat you should be suspended for a few tournaments.

 

If I cheat it's because I'm not hitting my ball off a cart path, out of a crater, up against a giant pine tree, in rocks... I try to avoid this stuff, but I'm not going to take a chance of ruining my clubs. If I am keeping score for handicap I play by the rules, but if I'm out with my dad just having fun. Who cares.

 

 

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[ole gray]

I am not good enough at golf to follow all of the rules. I would hate golf if there were refs on the course telling you what penalty you just committed. On TOUR if you knowingly cheat you should be suspended for a few tournaments.

 

If I cheat it's because I'm not hitting my ball off a cart path, out of a crater, up against a giant pine tree, in rocks... I try to avoid this stuff, but I'm not going to take a chance of ruining my clubs. If I am keeping score for handicap I play by the rules, but if I'm out with my dad just having fun. Who cares.

 

 

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This ^^^^^^^^^^

 

 

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[silver & black]

If I cheat it's because I'm not hitting my ball off a cart path, out of a crater, up against a giant pine tree, in rocks... I try to avoid this stuff, but I'm not going to take a chance of ruining my clubs. If I am keeping score for handicap I play by the rules, but if I'm out with my dad just having fun. Who cares.

 

This.... exactly.

[ole gray]

This.... exactly.

And the thing is all my Tuesday group cheats. You can move it a club length and inside the leather is good. We're just good ole boys betting a little money and having fun. Hell the most you can win is $40.00 and everybody is good with our local rules.

 

I played with some of my old buddies in middle Georgia a few weeks back. You play it down everywhere. Pure golf rules to the extreme. I hit the ball better than the boys I bet with all day however they took my money. I ended up with huge dings in two of my irons hitting the ball off rocks and roots. There's no where to drop the ball without rocks snd roots. DawgDaddy said I should have brought an old beat up 7 iron to punch out of trouble. If I had to do it again, I'd do that.

 

I prefer not to play that way . I haven't been back since then.

 

 

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[silver & black]

My league has a 6" fluff rule. we're just a bunch of working guys that have fun on Wednesday evenings. Most of the time my partner and I tell whoever we're playing with to put the ball where they have a shot, because we just don't care that much...lol. 

 

Golf is supposed to be fun. If you are playing for fun, why not have fun?

 

That said.... I never play like that in a more serious setting.

[PlaidJacket]

Sooooo who hasn't cheated in golf at one time or another? I roll the ball in the rough on occasions, I may not mark the ball perfectly, and I have putted with a titty putter recently. My wife loves me, my dog loves me, and all my golfing buddies would be pissed if I didn't show up at the blitz.

 

They know I cheat because they do too. It's a cheating kind of thang with our group however it's all good....

 

You may not cheat in golf however did you ever tell a lie? Did you ever steal something (piece of candy or your brothers/sisters stuff? Don't judge unless you judge your self first...

 

 

Gawd I hope the person who phones in rule violations gets a case of the hundred year jock itch!

 

 

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I'm willing to bet you're not a cheater Old Gray. If your ball rolled in the water and no one was looking would you fish it out or drop one and then tell me it was dry? If your ball was in an unplayable position would you move it and not tell me? If you lost a ball would you not tell me? If you were OB and I didn't know it would you not tell me? That's cheating and I don't think you'd do any of those things to anyone.

 

Now, and since we're not playing a tournament and just playing a weekend game; I don't mind or expect you to play strict rules. I don't. If we discover your ball went OB I say just take a drop add your penalty strokes and keep moving. If you're in an unplayable position... take a reasonable drop with penalty and keep moving.

 

So I call BS on you saying you cheat. 

[ole gray]

I'm willing to bet you're not a cheater Old Gray. If your ball rolled in the water and no one was looking would you fish it out or drop one and then tell me it was dry? If your ball was in an unplayable position would you move it and not tell me? If you lost a ball would you not tell me? If you were OB and I didn't know it would you not tell me? That's cheating and I don't think you'd do any of those things to anyone.

 

Now, and since we're not playing a tournament and just playing a weekend game; I don't mind or expect you to play strict rules. I don't. If we discover your ball went OB I say just take a drop add your penalty strokes and keep moving. If you're in an unplayable position... take a reasonable drop with penalty and keep moving.

 

So I call BS on you saying you cheat. 

 

 

You're absolutely right PJ.  I would not do those things you mentioned above.  That kind of stuff would never cross my mind. I was thinking the lax rules my buddies and I use were considered cheating however since we all cheat it would not be an issue. At least for us. I was telling a potential new guy I asked into our group today about us moving the ball off rocks, roots, etc. and he looked at me like, hell I do that anyways.   I told him it might not be real golf however you're gonna have one heck of a good time with us.   

[bullldog]

Here is where I disagree. For us, fine but PGA boys no!

Ya ain't doing this as a job/career and ain't playing for millions.

[Rickp]

Here is where I disagree. For us, fine but PGA boys no!

Ya ain't doing this as a job/career and ain't playing for millions.

Yup!!

 

 

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[tommc23]

From the scant information we received via Jack Nicklaus' Masters presser on the Lexi situation, I feel like Danny Lee could be singled out as the serial ball mark violator that was given a "talking to" during the prior Presidents Cup. But I did my homework before making any assumptions.

Danny Lee is who I was thinking too but Danny doesn't use a long putter and that's one of the things that was mentioned in the article. The long putter really narrows the group down. Heck if I'm in a bad divot in the fairway I roll it out a little to get a better shot. I play a lot with random people because I work a different schedule than my weekend golf buddies so I tend to play it where it lies more because of it being with people I'm not familiar with and don't want to have them say something. I've played some shots that honestly I never should have tried to do and that most pros wouldn't try but I get a kick out of those shots sometimes.

 

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[PLLand55]

It's Billy Mayfair.

 

 

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[downlowkey]

Danny Lee is who I was thinking too but Danny doesn't use a long putter and that's one of the things that was mentioned in the article. The long putter really narrows the group down. Heck if I'm in a bad divot in the fairway I roll it out a little to get a better shot. I play a lot with random people because I work a different schedule than my weekend golf buddies so I tend to play it where it lies more because of it being with people I'm not familiar with and don't want to have them say something. I've played some shots that honestly I never should have tried to do and that most pros wouldn't try but I get a kick out of those shots sometimes.

I wasn't venturing a guess as to who Phil was covertly referencing in OP's linked article. Only that Nicklaus gave just enough information during his Masters press conference following the Lexi debacle that with very little digging I was able to zero in on Danny Lee as the player who was the recipient of a stern ball mark lecture during the last Presidents Cup.

[Undershooter]

Guys one more time with a little oomph.. Its Billy Mayfair and its been going on for decades. Here's a nice little tweet that is very telling if you read the responses.
Has a long history of this stuff.

 

 

 

edit: spoiler alert, a lot of fellow pros comment.

[revkev]

Regardless of who it is I'm surprised at some of the things I'm reading.

 

Fully agree on the casual round stuff - I could care less what anyone does when we are out playing for fun even with a few bucks on the line so long as we agree to it up front or at some point during the round.

 

But in a tournament or place where we've agreed to play strictly by the rules? Really? This isn't baseball or football where the umps or refs legislate it as we go along - it's golf - it's up to the player to know the rules and abide by them. I'm sure that I've broken a rule in that type of round but generally speaking it's been unwittingly - taking a drop under the lateral water Hazzard rule at a white stake type thing -

 

Instead of skirting the rules we should be trying to play by them to the best of our ability to do so in a tournament setting.

 

 

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[Brian A]

Following the sentiments of everyone else, PGA Tour level, not ok, weekend hacker, to some extent alright. 

 

My buddy and I talk about it all the time, the courses we play arent PGA tour kept, so the grass is missing in spots or burned out, just general things these guys would have to deal with. Most of the time we just tell the other person move the ball and dont break a club or wrist

[Undershooter]

Regardless of who it is I'm surprised at some of the things I'm reading.

 

Fully agree on the casual round stuff - I could care less what anyone does when we are out playing for fun even with a few bucks on the line so long as we agree to it up front or at some point during the round.

 

But in a tournament or place where we've agreed to play strictly by the rules? Really? This isn't baseball or football where the umps or refs legislate it as we go along - it's golf - it's up to the player to know the rules and abide by them. I'm sure that I've broken a rule in that type of round but generally speaking it's been unwittingly - taking a drop under the lateral water Hazzard rule at a white stake type thing -

 

Instead of skirting the rules we should be trying to play by them to the best of our ability to do so in a tournament setting.

 

 

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I generally don't give a crap about my playing partners fallowing the rules during a casual round but I 100% agree in regards to any type of tournament or competitive setting. At that point, you are protecting the integrity of the field. 

Sadly I had to call out a hacker in the club championship a few years ago. He really shouldn't have been playing anyway but he did with his 2 buddies and myself in the 1st round. He had trouble making ANY putts and picked up a couple of times. I warned him about it and even told his buddies that he needed to try and finish out if he was going to play in these type of events. The response I got from them was "dude its just a club event, chill out." I told them to take that junk to the scrambles and that if they wanted to play for real in a club championship then they needed to play by the rules. I ended up having to call a couple of penalties on him on the back 9 because he didn't change much. His friends were upset but I told them they were lucky I wasn't a stickler because he should've been DQ'd. Alot of the other people they could've played with at that club would've DQ'd him after the 1st few holes. 

[jayjay0808]

I generally don't give a crap about my playing partners fallowing the rules during a casual round but I 100% agree in regards to any type of tournament or competitive setting. At that point, you are protecting the integrity of the field. 

Sadly I had to call out a hacker in the club championship a few years ago. He really shouldn't have been playing anyway but he did with his 2 buddies and myself in the 1st round. He had trouble making ANY putts and picked up a couple of times. I warned him about it and even told his buddies that he needed to try and finish out if he was going to play in these type of events. The response I got from them was "dude its just a club event, chill out." I told them to take that junk to the scrambles and that if they wanted to play for real in a club championship then they needed to play by the rules. I ended up having to call a couple of penalties on him on the back 9 because he didn't change much. His friends were upset but I told them they were lucky I wasn't a stickler because he should've been DQ'd. Alot of the other people they could've played with at that club would've DQ'd him after the 1st few holes. 

 

Totally agree with you. I have no care in the world if it is a casual round on the weekend and that is how the players I am paired with would like to play. i do have an issue if it is in a tournament setting for sure

[The Dansome]

Casual rounds drop it where it went out, bump it if your lie is redonk, that's how our group plays. Tournament though, you better abide by the rules.

[TheWahoo]

My buds with whom I regularly play and I understand that local rules can be established.  Heck, even the pros will play lift, clean and place on a wet course.   So we have established our own set of local rules so to speak.   If one's ball lies is a divot, we consider it ground under repair.  All stakes are either red or yellow, there are no white stakes.  We understand that at the venues we play, bunkers are not always properly raked.   If one's ball is in a footprint for example, one can rake the bunker and replace the ball.   We have what we label the endangerment rule, if your ball lies in an area where your club can be damaged or the player can be physically hurt, the endangerment rule applies ( drop without penalty at the nearest point of relief).   

[downlowkey]

To each their own but if you actually care about making them in tournaments, I'd advise you to _always_ putt 'em. I've had gambling buddies try to give me 8 footers because in their words "they've never seen me miss one", their perspective is obviously hyperbole (and a thinly veiled effort to expand my own give radius) but I _always_ putt _everything_ regardless. I don't see any reason to keep score otherwise.

But we _are_ a genteel group that does stuff like stand ready to rake bunkers for your playing partner and cleaning up spike mark scuffs in our competitors' lines because they can't officially do it themselves. There are ways to play within the rules and still keep the gambling completely friendly. If I'm giving someone a whooping; just because I start conceding putts on the gambling sheet, doesn't mean they can't turn in a legit handicap round on the official scorecard.

 

However, if we really want to get philosophical about the morality of not always holing out, I believe the only person getting cheated is yourself. Specifically of the opportunity to practice your grit.

 

 

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