#13 at The Open

[TR1PTIK]

So I was reading a bunch of the comments about Spieth's drop on #13 over at GolfWRX and was curious what the consensus was here on two things:

 

1 - What do you think about the decision to declare an unplayable lie and take the drop on the driving range - some think it should've been OB and that the R&A were playing favorites?

 

2 - How do you feel about the time it took for Spieth to take the drop and make his shot? They were already warned about slow play, do you think he should have received a penalty? Do you think it was fair/not fair to Matt Kucher?

 

Just curious is all. My opinion on the matter is that the rules officials were there to make the calls. If they didn't call anything on him then that's that. I do hate that it took so long for Kucher's sake - that kinda wait can really screw up your momentum. However, I also think he could have said something about it if it were really an issue.

 

Kuch is a good guy though and a true class act to give Spieth the time he needed. I think it shows how much he wanted to win on his own merit rather than pushing Jordan to make a hasty decision that could have cost him more than bogey.

[Shankster]

Even if he got a 9 there he would have tied if nothing else changed. Birdie, eagle, birdie, par...

 

As much as I don't like how long it took. There was no denying him the Jug after the near Ace. That wayward drive flipped some switch I haven't seen on tour for a while. He played lights out after taking 30 minutes to figure out where to drop.

 

I think if they were playing favorites they would have started an Englishman at -8 instead of E...

 

 

Sent from the driving range @ Royal Birkdale

[null]

1: it wasn't marked OB, so it's not OB

 

2: it wasn't Spieth taking long to take his shot, it was Spieth waiting for the R&A officials to make a correct ruling on his initial drop area and line of site issues

 

Jodran wasn't the one dragging his feet, it was the R&A making sure they made correct rulings in the moment so that they weren't criticized after the event for making an incorrect ruling

[GolfJunkie302]

Definitely not fair for Kuch. Having to sit in the fairway for 40 min... not cool. We all know what it's like to play behind a slow group. It just kills your momentum...

 

For those of you who weren't watching, here was Jordan's lie on 13 after his tee shot:

 

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[StrokerAce]

...my guess is that Greller was reading the Open Championship thread on MyGolfSpy and he caught that part where Shankster said watching Spieth play was like watching paint dry so he decided to make it a bit more exciting...

 

I'd say he succeeded!

 

And all the credit in the world to the kid for knowing the rules and how to use them to his advantage.

[Golfspy_CG2]

Kinda echo Jlukes points.

 

On Live From after the Open they were out on the range (where Speith hit from) with a Tournament Rules guys, he said the members at Royal Birkdale, play the range as inbounds so there was no need to change it.  Plus he said it never really came into their thoughts they would even need to think about it one way or the other,that it is so far off line for a pro. 

 

Agreed on time of the delay, a lot of that was discussion with the R&A Rules official, it wasn't him taking his time or delaying anything unintentionally.   Was it fair to Kuchar, I'll just say it's something that can happen in golf.  I guess it couldn't have happened to a better guy (as far as Speith is concerned) I'm not so sure his apology on the green would have been so warmly accepted if it was Bubba Watson or Pat Perez.  Don't know that for sure, but just a guess. 

 

It was just one of those things that happen in golf where there is really no blueprint for how to handle it.  But I give the R&A and Speith credit for taking their time to make sure all options were explored and were within the rules. 

 

On another note, how great and appropriate was it that they determined inside the Titleist Truck would be the nearest line of sit relief...ha

[Shankster]

...my guess is that Greller was reading the Open Championship thread on MyGolfSpy and he caught that part where Shankster said watching Spieth play was like watching paint dry so he decided to make it a bit more exciting...

 

I'd say he succeeded!

 

And all the credit in the world to the kid for knowing the rules and how to use them to his advantage.

Sorry everyone! My bad Kuch!

 

 

- Alan

[Shankster]

Definitely not fair for Kuch. Having to sit in the fairway for 40 min... not cool. We all know what it's like to play behind a slow group. It just kills your momentum...

 

For those of you who weren't watching, here was Jordan's lie on 13 after his tee shot:Screenshot_20170723-092226

 

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Then he damn near put it on the green. Was a spectacle for sure.

 

 

- Alan

[Shankster]

My daughter is a major Spieth fan. She always tells me that he is good. I should listen...

 

 

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[Undershooter]

Me and Theo actually discussed this on twitter yesterday. Do I think it was fair to Kuchar? No not really but those are the breaks. Spieth knew what he wanted to do and it was the officials that took forever making sure that it was a legal drop. 

Theo's take was that he believes this fiasco cost Kuchar the tournament. 

Personally I just can't see it. Spieth went -5 over his next 5 holes. Kuch played the next 4 in -2 before making bogey on 18. -1 actually tied the lowest he'd gone all week on holes 14-18 so its not like he plays that stretch incredibly well anyway. It's just hard to keep up with someone going that low in that few of a stretch of holes. I don't see any way that Kuch does it whether he keeps the momentum or not. 

 

 

Here is pic of Greller's caddy notes from Sunday.r"Practice range shot: No number. We guessed 240 yards."

 

[StrokerAce]

Me and Theo actually discussed this on twitter yesterday. Do I think it was fair to Kuchar? No not really but those are the breaks. Spieth knew what he wanted to do and it was the officials that took forever making sure that it was a legal drop. 

Theo's take was that he believes this fiasco cost Kuchar the tournament. 

Personally I just can't see it. Spieth went -5 over his next 5 holes. Kuch played the next 4 in -2 before making bogey on 18. -1 actually tied the lowest he'd gone all week on holes 14-18 so its not like he plays that stretch incredibly well anyway. It's just hard to keep up with someone going that low in that few of a stretch of holes. I don't see any way that Kuch does it whether he keeps the momentum or not. 

 

 

Here is pic of Greller's caddy notes from Sunday.r"Practice range shot: No number. We guessed 240 yards."

 

 

To be fair - if the tables were turned I think Kuch would have done something similar.  Or he would have just gone back to the tee box and hit another shot (which would have taken time as well).  

I think part of the time delay was getting everyone to move out of the way.  They kept yelling at the spectators to move to one side or the other and they would shuffle their feet about 3 inches.  It really was maddening.

[Undershooter]

To be fair - if the tables were turned I think Kuch would have done something similar.  Or he would have just gone back to the tee box and hit another shot (which would have taken time as well).  

I think part of the time delay was getting everyone to move out of the way.  They kept yelling at the spectators to move to one side or the other and they would shuffle their feet about 3 inches.  It really was maddening.

I just rewatched it again a minute ago and I think Spieth actually rushed to hit his 3rd because he knew it was taking an eternity to get all of that stuff figured out and the crowd moved. 

[TR1PTIK]

I was not fortunate enough to get to watch it . I was in the middle of a 3 hour drive back home from a cousin's wedding so I have no idea how it all unfolded, but I thought the perspectives over at GolfWRX were interesting (perhaps bizarre).

 

I definitely agree that Spieth was right to seek out a rules official and consider all the options (it was a major after all). Sad that it did take the rules officials a while, but who can blame them after all the hot water the USGA and PGA have been in over recent years.

 

Can't argue Undershooter30's logic regarding Matt Kucher -  and he did still par that hole despite the long wait.

 

At the end of the day golf is golf and rules are rules. Sometimes you can use the rules to your advantage (as is the case in any sport) and sometimes you can't. The decision by Spieth and Greller to take the unplayable and drop on the driving range easily rivals the decision Tiger made to call a rules official about his "loose impediment" at Phoenix in 1999.

[downlowkey]

Most golfers don't recognize the Rules of Golf were intentionally designed to aid the player in trouble. If you don't understand the rules, it is hard to take advantage of the myriad options they provide. The time is takes to proceed in accordance with the rules and consider all options is inconsequential. Throughout the tournament these situations occur regularly. The sole reason we are discussing this one is because it happened to occur on Sunday in the final pairing of a major championship. Jordan's sincere contrition was warranted and Kuchar graciously accepted, that's the end of it. However, it is my opinion Jordan decided an apology wasn't entirely sufficient and as recompense to Kuchar and fans everywhere alike, willed himself to play the next 5 holes (-5) to not only win, but to remove any doubt that the delay affected the final outcome. And for that, we should all be eternally grateful, because it was quite literally as good as championship golf and humanity in general ever gets.

 

 

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[Undershooter]

I was not fortunate enough to get to watch it . I was in the middle of a 3 hour drive back home from a cousin's wedding so I have no idea how it all unfolded, but I thought the perspectives over at GolfWRX were interesting (perhaps bizarre).

 

I definitely agree that Spieth was right to seek out a rules official and consider all the options (it was a major after all). Sad that it did take the rules officials a while, but who can blame them after all the hot water the USGA and PGA have been in over recent years.

 

Can't argue Undershooter30's logic regarding Matt Kucher -  and he did still par that hole despite the long wait.

 

At the end of the day golf is golf and rules are rules. Sometimes you can use the rules to your advantage (as is the case in any sport) and sometimes you can't. The decision by Spieth and Greller to take the unplayable and drop on the driving range easily rivals the decision Tiger made to call a rules official about his "loose impediment" at Phoenix in 1999.

Here you go if you haven't seen it. https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2017/7/23/16016796/jordan-spieth-british-open-shot-driving-range-birkdale

[TBT]

Spieth used the rules to his full advantage, which was his right. I'm not sure most pros would have proceeded to option 3 under the rules, but Jordan did.

 

It was the rules officials that took so long to determine exactly where his relief would be, not Spieth....it's not like he was intentionally going slow to "ice the kicker" or something like that, once the R&A determined his relief from the unplayable and then line of sight, he actually played quickly.

 

Did it suck for Kuchar?? Sure, but it's not like that wait unnerved him and he blew up and played poorly over those last 5 holes...he went 1 under down the stretch which was not only respectable, it was the best he played those last 5 holes all week!!

 

So did the 20+ minute delay suck? Damn skippy....did it cost him the tournament? NO WAY IN HELL! What cost him the tournament was Jordan Spieth turning into a stone cold assassin and dropping bombs with that magic wand he calls a putter!! He drained 100 feet of putts to close it out, 8 feet on 13 for the most incredible bogey in history, 4 feet for birdie after the near ace on 14, a 55 foot downhill double breaking snake for the eagle on 15, 25 feet for birdie on 16, and 8 feet for birdie on 17.....I don't think anybody could have survived that kind of onslaught.

 

Kuchar didn't lose because of a lengthy delay, he lost because Jordan Spieth is an effin' magician!

[STUDque]

I personally love the drama that goes along with a drop decision like this. All the possibilities are explored and they get great camera and sound work nice and close to hear what they're talking about. It's great theater watching the process and then the shot is always something extra interesting to watch.

 

Especially when the tournament is on the line

 

 

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[Golfspy_CG2]

I have the round on DVR. I think I'll go back and watch that whole 23 minutes again. It was pretty interesting especially how it turned out.

[Golfspy_CG2]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned in all this, at least I don't think. Is how Johhny Miller kept insisting the smart play was to go back and hit from the tee again. I disagreed with him vehemently at the time (I'm sure he heard me..ha) and he was proven wrong ...AGAIN!

 

Speith HAD to get out of that hole with a bogey in my mind to keep from utterly collapsing. Going back to tee would have been crazy. He hadn't hit a fairway in a month and he would be expected to do it now....what if he goes In the junk again and has to pitch out for 4. Then he's staring a triple and a blown Championship.

 

Making bogey from the drop was no piece of Cake, but he sure had a better chance hitting 3 from the range than hitting 4 from the junk 230 yards out.

 

I know Miller was a great golfer. But more times than not, he's completely out of the loop in strategy and the game as it's currently played.

[STUDque]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned in all this, at least I don't think. Is how Johhny Miller kept insisting the smart play was to go back and hit from the tee again. I disagreed with him vehemently at the time (I'm sure he heard me..ha) and he was proven wrong ...AGAIN!

 

Speith HAD to get out of that hole with a bogey in my mind to keep from utterly collapsing. Going back to tee would have been crazy. He hadn't hit a fairway in a month and he would be expected to do it now....what if he goes In the junk again and has to pitch out for 4. Then he's staring a triple and a blown Championship.

 

Making bogey from the drop was no piece of Cake, but he sure had a better chance hitting 3 from the range than hitting 4 from the junk 230 yards out.

 

I know Miller was a great golfer. But more times than not, he's completely out of the loop in strategy and the game as it's currently played.

 

 

I love when the announcers are hammering how bad a decision is and how the player "would be fortunate to get it to stay on the green" then they go out and put it to 3 inches. If you ain't first you're last buddy.

 

 

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[Golfspy_CG2]

I love when the announcers are hammering how bad a decision is and how the player "would be fortunate to get it to stay on the green" then they go out and put it to 3 inches. If you ain't first you're last buddy.

 

 

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Lol. That happens all the time, and drives me crazy. Ha

[djahubes]

Kuchar was playing steady golf up to that point, that's what he does. The only momentum that he had going was Spieth's apparent implosion up to that point. He had multiple opportunities to take control but didn't, including missing that putt on 13 to go up 2 regardless of Jordan's miracle bogey. Spieth did absolutely nothing wrong, he waited for the correct ruling, played his shot, made a 5, then proceeded to go on the best 5 hole run in any major period. He was humble, apologetic, and confident all at once. He can be a little chatty with his ball at times, but he his a stone cold killer who wants to win

 

 

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[tommc23]

I feel bad for kuchar but he didn't play much different afterwards like others have said. Jordan putting it into another gear was cool to see. I've never seen him play like that and if he can do that more he would win more than he does and he is winning two plus tournaments a year for the past few years.

 

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[Golfspy_CG2]

Since my current avatar of the new JumpMan Jordan is outdated, I have been searching for a a good pic of Jordan standing atop the dunes.   Not sure if they one will do, but it would be a good "Caption This" thing.

 

So what say you, I'll start.   

 

"Micheal, Go get it"

 

or "So the fairway is way down there, you say??"

 

I know not very original but it's the first that came to mind..ha

[STUDque]

 

 

"Look down there, everything the light touches is my kingdom"

 

 

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[EthanSterlingPrice]

I like Jordan's choice in that it meant he didn't have to hit driver and mess with the same tee shot again, he could've been in the fairway or just as easily been in the junk again. From what I'm reading we're pretty much in a consensus that the time issue wasn't entirely Jordan's fault at that point, I told my brother as we were watching that the R&A definitely didn't wanna repeat the USGA issue. Gotta give Kuchar credit for playing as well as he did down the stretch and I think he would've won any other time with that level of play but the ending stretch by Jordan was amazing. Overall it was an open worth watching.

 

 

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[STUDque]

 

 

"Him! That's the meanie that stole my hot dog"

 

 

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[STUDque]

 

 

 

"Ugh, this guy missed a belt loop. So tacky. How'd they even let him past the gate?"

 

 

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[STUDque]

 

 

 

"Just wait till my father hears about this. That Potter will be expelled for sure"

 

 

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[STUDque]

 

 

Jordan: I think I'll just drop up there with Matt's ball so we don't slow down the place of play

Rules Official 1: Can't argue with that logic, proceed Mr Spieth

Rules Official 2 *furiously flipping through the rulebook*: Whoa! He can do that?

 

 

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