You're Right...

[Shankster]

So, I watched a bit of golf over the weekend. And -21 is just stupid. The Senior Open was won with a -4, and the Euro Open was -13.

 

I retract all of my posts about low scoring events. It is kind of a mockery of the game...

 

All of the Par 5's at the Canadian Open were sub 560. In fact there was only one longer than 530...

 

Where is the cut off for it being a Par 4? Just doesn't make sense to me. Why are there 550 yard Par 4's one week and 516 yard Par 5's the next?

 

Instead of changing equipment rules, make a set number for the dang hole length. Pro's are gonna get on in 2 on a 516 yard Par 5... heck, I could... maybe.

 

The winner played the Par 5's at -12 for the week... come on...

 

 

 

- Alan

[STUDque]

THANK YOU!

 

That being said, that's the difference between majors and all the other tournaments. There's only so many difficult championship courses in the world that I'm sure they'd run out of variety if they tried to make it difficult enough that the winner is finishing at -5 week in and week out.

 

Also, wow 516 is super short for pros. There better be some crazy undulation on the green and hazards all around. All 4 Par 5's at my home course are at least that long from the tips.

 

 

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[Reesedw]

I agree there should be a Min and max on length.. agreed upon by both the USGA and the R & A.. that way if your playing from the Whites ( generally normal men's tees) you will not see a 250 yd par 3, or a 520 yard par 4.. And the Pro's should have guidelines that anything between say 315-520-ish should be a par 4 that way you'll see them have to play strategically, and not just bomb's away.. 

[Eseay32]

I don't have a problem with the scoring in any of the events. I'm ok with the events where guys shoot a bunch of 65s because I know how hard it is, no matter how good you are, to put a 62-65 together. I also don't have a problem with majors that are even par. I like drivable par 4s, I like par 3s that if you make birdie that you pick up 2 shots in the field. I'm ok with the variety each week that not making a birdie will cost you a tournament and saving bogeys will win one

 

 

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[Shankster]

THANK YOU!

 

That being said, that's the difference between majors and all the other tournaments. There's only so many difficult championship courses in the world that I'm sure they'd run out of variety if they tried to make it difficult enough that the winner is finishing at -5 week in and week out.

 

Also, wow 516 is super short for pros. There better be some crazy undulation on the green and hazards all around. All 4 Par 5's at my home course are at least that long from the tips.

 

 

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You're welcome. Still. Golf is a game of strategy that has became (driver - wedge - 2 putt)...

 

550 or below = Par 4 for those guys on TV.

 

 

- Alan

[Shankster]

I agree there should be a Min and max on length.. agreed upon by both the USGA and the R & A.. that way if your playing from the Whites ( generally normal men's tees) you will not see a 250 yd par 3, or a 520 yard par 4.. And the Pro's should have guidelines that anything between say 315-520-ish should be a par 4 that way you'll see them have to play strategically, and not just bomb's away..

Yes sir. Was it Oakmont that had a 280 yard Par 3? Even for the Pro's a Par is good.

 

 

- Alan

[Shankster]

THANK YOU!

 

That being said, that's the difference between majors and all the other tournaments. There's only so many difficult championship courses in the world that I'm sure they'd run out of variety if they tried to make it difficult enough that the winner is finishing at -5 week in and week out.

 

Also, wow 516 is super short for pros. There better be some crazy undulation on the green and hazards all around. All 4 Par 5's at my home course are at least that long from the tips.

 

 

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And make them a Par 67 or 68.

 

 

- Alan

[TBT]

I hate seeing par 5's where Pros are hitting driver, wedge... where's the risk/reward factor in that???

 

I want to see them hit driver, FW or at the very least hybrid or long iron!

 

When's the last time any of us hit into a par 5 in two with less than 4 or 5 iron??

 

I know the difference is some of them are hitting 350 yard drives and 160 PW...but I think all tour par 5's should be 570+ with tight landing areas about 310-340

[Shankster]

Well said TBT.

 

 

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[GolfJunkie302]

I believe the USGA does have restrictions on the length of holes. But the margins are wide. I think a par 5 has to be between 480 and, I think, 700 yards. Not sure about the 700 yards. Might actually be closer to 650.

 

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[null]

Does is really matter what the par is? They're all playing the same holes

[Shankster]

It does matter. They are making birdies or eagles on the same length hole that that played at birdie or par maybe even bogey on a different course.

 

Yeah, I get that courses are different. But a 550 yard "Par 4" and a 558 yard "par 5" what is the real difference there?

 

 

 

 

 

 

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[Shankster]

Like this week. There is a 526 yard Par 5 and a 667 yard Par 5. That's 150 yard difference. And it still plays at 70.

 

 

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[newballcoach]

I know Glen Abbey pretty well having attended that tourney in the past. It's not long, and it's also not very hard. Although it's days are numbered, I do agree the par 5's, while good for regular golfers, are not setup to challenge tour pros. I think the date on the calender and the average course setup discourage a lot of pros from playing.

 

If they were keeping that course, new tee blocks on 6-7 holes would dramatically change the way the course played and create more risk/reward options. Right now, the course is usually all reward. I do like some of the par 4's and most of the 3's are pretty good.

 

I would turn 18 into a par 4 (maybe move the blocks up) and have some real challenge on the final hole

[downlowkey]

When you begin to factor in design characteristics such as elevation change and predominant wind direction along with typical tour tournament conditions like firm fairways that stimp at 10+; 500 yard holes can easily play 100 yards less. Establishing a set of universal stipulations regarding par designation as it relates to hole length subsequently makes zero sense.

[tommc23]

I hate seeing par 5's where Pros are hitting driver, wedge... where's the risk/reward factor in that???

 

I want to see them hit driver, FW or at the very least hybrid or long iron!

 

When's the last time any of us hit into a par 5 in two with less than 4 or 5 iron??

 

I know the difference is some of them are hitting 350 yard drives and 160 PW...but I think all tour par 5's should be 570+ with tight landing areas about 310-340

I once had a 7i into a par 5 and missed the eagle putt. I agree there needs to be some kind of length requirements. I've heard them announce many times this hole plays as a par 5 for the membership. They need to do that more on the shorter holes.

 

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[Shankster]

Well... generally speaking shorter holes play lower scores. Regardless of any outside influences.

 

And I think it makes perfect sense. They want to "protect" or "preserve" the game. Stop having almost guaranteed on in 2 Par 5's.

 

 

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[Shankster]

Just call them Par 4's when the Pro's are there.

 

 

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[null]

But for the sake of tournament they could call everything a Par 10 and it wouldn't make a difference

[Jmikecpa]

Conditions have a lot to do with it.  -12 won the same event last year and Tiger Woods won it at -22 in 2000.  Heck I played Sunday and in the morning I hit driver, seven iron into the par 5 4th in the morning playing at 535 yards.  In the afternoon the wind direction changed and I hit driver and hybrid 30 yards short of the green.

[cnosil]

The men's pro game is at a completely different level than anything we could ever dream of. That being said score is irrelevant to me since they are all playing the same course and I don't care If the winner is even or -25. The PGA could make the courses tougher by adjusting green speeds, growing up the rough, changing the bunker takes like was done at the memorial years ago, and narrowing fairways. Length is not a way to protect a course; it just separates the field more.

 

This is also the reason I watch the LPGA. They don't bomb the ball and they play a game similar to ours with regards to distances hit. I also don't care that the Americans don't always win; for me it is good golf.

[Kenny B]

The men's pro game is at a completely different level than anything we could ever dream of. That being said score is irrelevant to me since they are all playing the same course and I don't care If the winner is even or -25. The PGA could make the courses tougher by adjusting green speeds, growing up the rough, changing the bunker takes like was done at the memorial years ago, and narrowing fairways. Length is not a way to protect a course; it just separates the field more.

 

This is also the reason I watch the LPGA. They don't bomb the ball and they play a game similar to ours with regards to distances hit. I also don't care that the Americans don't always win; for me it is good golf.

I agree... except I would still like to see Americans step it up a little on the LPGA.

[cnosil]

I agree... except I would still like to see Americans step it up a little on the LPGA.

Don't disagree, but that isn't a reason for me to not watch. I do know people who refuse to watch because of the Korean dominance

[Shankster]

I like the Champions Tour.

 

 

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[newballcoach]

They have said for years the way to limit the advantages for big hitters is to shorten and tighten courses, not lengthen them.

[Shankster]

10 yard wide fairways that are only 275 yards long. That would be interesting.

 

 

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[STUDque]

10 yard wide fairways that are only 275 yards long. That would be interesting.

 

 

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Starting to sound like we're going to take some of the courses from "The Golf Club" and make them real.

 

 

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[revkev]

There used to be suggested hole lengths in the rule book.

 

I think there's a place for 20 under winning just not in a major and particularly not in the US Open.

 

The US Open tries to push guys out of their comfort zone. It wants a player to have it in his head that it may take an entire round to offset a double. Can he remain patient when pars are good?

 

Those are legitimate things to ask.

 

 

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[TheWahoo]

Don't disagree, but that isn't a reason for me to not watch. I do know people who refuse to watch because of the Korean dominance

I agree that it is not a reason not to watch the ladies play some darn good golf.   But I do think more Americans must show up on the leaderboards for the tour to grow and for purses to materially increase.   The one thing I've noticed about the Korean players, most if not all speak English.  I must admit that it pleases me and I respect them for it.

[lou mcconaughey]

It's progress. You now have real athletes playing golf and equipment that is cutting edge. My feeling is for the pro's use a limited flight golf ball just like they did with the softball. Make the landing area much tougher for the long hitter. Have bunkers that are really hard to get out of. Or force the pro's to drink whiskey and smoke cigars and stay out all night like the old days. Lol

 

 

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