Ditching the Hybrid

[tehuti]

I am still having trouble with my 3 hybrid, even though I finally started hitting well with it on the range. So I picked up a brand new closeout Srixon Z355 7 wood to see if that is easier to hit off the deck.

 

 

 

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IMG_0157.HEIC

[BIG STU]

On 9/14/2018 at 9:45 AM, deejaid said:

Settled on an 18.5* Macgregor persimmon 4-wood and it's been great. Probably really similar to a hybrid with a similar head size and shaft length.

 

 

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I was on the range the other week hitting one of my Mac Custom 5 woods. THis kid beside me got curious and real politely asked me "Sir when did they start making hybrids out of wood?" He was sincere. I had to explain that it was not a hybrid but a real fairway wood back when woods were actually woods. As you know all of those Mac fairways are tiny even in it's day. Actually his new Callaway hybrid was a tad larger than my 5 wood. I told him if he was interested he could hit one. He really did not want to. I told him if he ever wanted to go to persimmon please see me. We talked and I know his Dad. I bet $20 I will know what his Dad will tell him. "Ole Stuey is ok but he is tied too much to the past with those outdated antiques" Funny thing is I am some 25 years older than his Dad and can beat him straight up from any tee using my antique equipment and him moderns. A lot of the regulars around my club will tell you tongue in cheek that I am "touched in the head" because I am always hitting those antique blades and wooden woods

[deejaid]

I was on the range the other week hitting one of my Mac Custom 5 woods. THis kid beside me got curious and real politely asked me "Sir when did they start making hybrids out of wood?" He was sincere. I had to explain that it was not a hybrid but a real fairway wood back when woods were actually woods. As you know all of those Mac fairways are tiny even in it's day. Actually his new Callaway hybrid was a tad larger than my 5 wood. I told him if he was interested he could hit one. He really did not want to. I told him if he ever wanted to go to persimmon please see me. We talked and I know his Dad. I bet $20 I will know what his Dad will tell him. "Ole Stuey is ok but he is tied too much to the past with those outdated antiques" Funny thing is I am some 25 years older than his Dad and can beat him straight up from any tee using my antique equipment and him moderns. A lot of the regulars around my club will tell you tongue in cheek that I am "touched in the head" because I am always hitting those antique blades and wooden woods

Now that I put the Stan Thompson’s in my bag I’m having even better results. I’m not sure the loft but the 4-wood is backweighted with lead and the ball gets way up in the air. 215 yards with a nice steep landing that holds the green. Better than any hybrid I’ve ever tried.


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[BIG STU]

3 hours ago, deejaid said:

 

 

Now that I put the Stan Thompson’s in my bag I’m having even better results. I’m not sure the loft but the 4-wood is backweighted with lead and the ball gets way up in the air. 215 yards with a nice steep landing that holds the green. Better than any hybrid I’ve ever tried.


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Yup you know those Gintys are a classic design--- I have a 29* Ginty 7 wood I need to try

[tehuti]

I just received a 7 wood yesterday, and if it works out the 3h is getting benched again. Stubbornly I want to keep working with the hybrid until I figure it out. But solidifying that spot in the bag takes priority.

 

 

 

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[catchmeoutside]

It does trip me out when I see someone hit a hybrid from 190 yards out but it really helps them get the ball in the air since they don't have a very high swing speed. I only have 1 hybrid, 19 degree titleist that I use instead of a fairway wood. I rarely use it from the fairway, I mostly use it off the tee and I do like to tee it up off the ground. I don't like hitting it off the ground.

[deejaid]

Yup you know those Gintys are a classic design--- I have a 29* Ginty 7 wood I need to try

Mine is probably late 1950’s, pre-Ginty. Part of a 1,2,3,4 set. I don’t have the 2 wood in the bag though.

Those Ginty’s look like they would be great out of the rough but might be a bit tough from tight lies.




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[deejaid]

I just received a 7 wood yesterday, and if it works out the 3h is getting benched again. Stubbornly I want to keep working with the hybrid until I figure it out. But solidifying that spot in the bag takes priority.


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This might really be a space in the bag where real wood woods can excel. A heavy wood head can help you stay down whether through the rough or fairway. Modern fairway woods and hybrids are just stainless steel. Pretty much no different than the early small head metalwoods of the 1980’s.


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[BIG STU]

2 hours ago, deejaid said:

 

This might really be a space in the bag where real wood woods can excel. A heavy wood head can help you stay down whether through the rough or fairway. Modern fairway woods and hybrids are just stainless steel. Pretty much no different than the early small head metalwoods of the 1980’s.


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That IMHO is why the old V-Steels are such an awesome metal wood-- Heavy with lots of weight in the bottom and those TM Tour Cleeks were good too with the rails on the sole like an old Baffler

[fixyurdivot]

I still have yet to own/play a hybrid.  I've hit a few now and then, but they don't seem to offer me much - at least from what I observe at the range.  I look at these much like "switch rods" in fly fishing.  They attempt to get the best of both ends of the performance/application scale, but IMO, seem only to find something not far from the middle.  I do play with a couple of guys who really like them, but they are pretty high handicap players who really struggle with long irons.

[tehuti]

I still have yet to own/play a hybrid.  I've hit a few now and then, but they don't seem to offer me much - at least from what I observe at the range.  I look at these much like "switch rods" in fly fishing.  They attempt to get the best of both ends of the performance/application scale, but IMO, seem only to find something not far from the middle.  I do play a couple of guys who really like them, but they are pretty high handicap players who really struggle with long irons.

You make a good point. I am a high handicapper, and I’ve spent this year struggling with my various hybrids more than I ever did with a 3 iron. At some point it may be necessary to just get another 3 iron and bench the hybrids for good.

That may be my project for 2019.


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[tony@CIC]

I'm a high handicapper as well. I use my long irons and hybrids interchangeably depending on the situation or the day. For instance if the ball in in the first cut or sitting high in the rough - I'll always take out my hybrid. With my 26 I generally get about 155, with the 22 about 165-170.

What's interesting is that some days I hit my long irons better than the hybrids and vice versa. Next year's project is working on hybrid consistency


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[chisag]

On 9/18/2018 at 6:27 AM, NiftyNiblick said:

I'm a driving iron fan, but I don't see it as being a hybrid substitute.

 

The hybrid is a fairway club that you can use on the tee,

 

The driving iron is a tee club, and you'd better be a hell of a long iron player to use it on the fairway.

 

For me, the driving iron was a one-trick-pony, but I always believed in one-trick-ponies being a legitimate segment of the bag..

 

... I know you are not fond of modern equipment but this is one area where current DI's are so much better than past DI's. I have no problem hitting my UDi even with a HZRDUS Black hy shaft from the fairway and I prefer it to a hybrid. Even my P790 3 iron that I put a hybrid shaft in at 19* of loft is basically an old 1 iron but with the low and deep weighting and a hollow head, it is very easy to hit from the fairway, although it does produce a lower trajectory. For me the big difference between a hybrid and modern DI is from the rough because the DI is useless from even light rough if there is grass between the club face and the ball. This summer after all the rai we had and thick rough conditions, I put a F6 Baffler in my bag with a shorter, heavier shaft that is a combo of a fairway wood and hybrid and I use from the rough or if I need a high flying, soft landing shot into a green. 

... At around 100 mph with a driver I am not exactly a high swing speed player, but have enough speed and make good contact, both required to hit DI's from the fairway. And off the tee I can move it a little forward or backward in my stance to give me a higher or lower trajectory. 

[BIG STU]

14 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... I know you are not fond of modern equipment but this is one area where current DI's are so much better than past DI's. I have no problem hitting my UDi even with a HZRDUS Black hy shaft from the fairway and I prefer it to a hybrid. Even my P790 3 iron that I put a hybrid shaft in at 19* of loft is basically an old 1 iron but and with the low and deep weighting and a hollow head, it is very easy to hit from the fairway, although it does produce a lower trajectory. For me the big difference between a hybrid and modern DI is from the rough because the DI is useless from even light rough if there is grass between the club face and the ball. This summer after all the rai we had and thick rough conditions, I put a F6 Baffler in my bag with a shorter, heavier shaft that is a combo of a fairway wood and hybrid and I use from the rough or if I need a high flying, soft landing shot into a green. 

... At around 100 mph with a driver I am not exactly a high swing speed player, but have enough speed and make good contact, both required to hit DI's from the fairway. And off the tee I can move it a little forward or backward in my stance to give me a higher or lower trajectory. 

IMHO speed is not all it is cracked up to be but the other thing you mentioned good contact is imperative. My friend Bear is a good example. He is about the size of Gary Player and has I would say a little less than 100 mph swing speed but is one hell of a ball striker. He hits it further than I do not by much and usually is one club longer on the irons whether it is moderns or vintage. I have a little more club speed and I am bigger and stronger than he is but not nearly the ball striker he is. I never considered myself a ball striker but more of a shotmaker/ scrambler get out of jail artist

[chisag]

... I hear ya on speed Big Stu but once you get below 90mph it becomes more difficult to get the ball in the air and carry with a low lofted DI. Especially considering the modern ball spins less off woods and long irons so slower swing speeds will most likely have some difficulty with DI's from the fairway. Hybrids create more spin as well as launching higher so they are usually a better alternative for slower swing speed players. That said, every golfer is different and a combination of great technique with excellent ball striking can make just about any club playable. 

[tehuti]

I'm a high handicapper as well. I use my long irons and hybrids interchangeably depending on the situation or the day. For instance if the ball in in the first cut or sitting high in the rough - I'll always take out my hybrid. With my 26 I generally get about 155, with the 22 about 165-170.

What's interesting is that some days I hit my long irons better than the hybrids and vice versa. Next year's project is working on hybrid consistency


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For the reason you stated above I am keeping the 4 iron and 4 hybrid in my bag. The 3 hybrid is still really problematic though.


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[BIG STU]

17 hours ago, chisag said:

... I hear ya on speed Big Stu but once you get below 90mph it becomes more difficult to get the ball in the air and carry with a low lofted DI. Especially considering the modern ball spins less off woods and long irons so slower swing speeds will most likely have some difficulty with DI's from the fairway. Hybrids create more spin as well as launching higher so they are usually a better alternative for slower swing speed players. That said, every golfer is different and a combination of great technique with excellent ball striking can make just about any club playable. 

I guess I still have somewhat good speed because I can still hit blade long irons off the fairway with the correct shaft and weight placement for me. But on my regular set I do carry that V-Steel 7 wood because I can hit a high floater with cut spin with it. Further thinking about swing speed I guess I may swing faster than I think I do because I can still hit a persimmon driver off the deck and can still hit my modern 915 D-2 at 10.5* off the deck. Honestly I have not tried the Homna G1-X off the deck

[GolfSeeker]

I tried hybrids for a couple of years when I was having problems getting long irons in the air. However as I got better hitting my 5i and 4i s, I started to struggle with the hybrid. This was my dilemma. I was working really hard on getting more consistent with my 3w but it always seemed like I had to have 3 different feels: 3w, 3h and 4i. This lead to a lot of complexity in my process. I eventually ditched the 3h and picked up a 3i. This move has done wonders for my ball striking. I can have the same feel 5i to 3i. Practicing hitting the 3i has made the 5i and 4i swings almost routine. Having a clean separation of feels between 3i and 3w has also lead to more consistency with the 3w. I think I may eventually go back to the hybrid as I get older but for now I am performing better without it.

[Alf. S]

Good debate. For me I've always been an irons man until recently that is. 

My 2nd last set of new irons (c. 2013) were Adams CB3s (KBS Tour Regular Shafts) which as standard come 4i to PW with option for 3i and GW. I tried to get the "optional" 3i but in the UK could never get it. That left me with 4i 180yds to 3w 210 yds gap.  I tried a set of Titliest 910 hybrids to fill the gap but never really felt happy with them and fell back to using an old set of AP1s with a 3i.  

My latest irons (c.2018) Srixon z565s (Nippon NS Pro 850gh Stiff Shafts) again come as standard 4i to PW and I bought the optional 3i and AW. I'm now hitting these irons 10yds longer but after 6 months was finding the 3i was dropping out the air i.e.I hit my 4i 190yds and my 3i was about 185. to try and fix this I bought the Callaway Epic 3h (Recoil ES Shaft) and hit it great about 200 so I then bought the 4h and again more consistent and higher ball flight. I also have a 2h but that stays in the garage my thoughts were that the hybrids spin less than my 3w so in high winds I would take out the 2h.

I'm now really comfortable using the hybrids and don't think I will be going back 3h, 4h are in my bag with no 3i or 4i.

[ZenGolfer]

I recently ditched my 3-hybrid for a 5-wood and couldnt be happier with it.  The 5-wood is both more forgiving and longer for me.  IMO, for high handicappers or people with a slower swing speed, a fairway wood is the way to go.  The head of a FW is designed to be more forgiving and to help you launch the ball and the longer shaft is going to give you more power.

For me, my 5-wood is a consistent 200-yard club and as long as its not sitting down in the rough, its a club that I can hit out of any lie.

[BMart519]

Long game gapping is all about trial and error. I have a 15 degree Adams super xtd 1 hybrid that fires low bullets which has replaced my 3 wood because it is easier to hit off the ground even though it is mostly a tee club. I hit it 230-250 depending on ground conditions. I’ve phased out the 4&5 hybrid over the past 2 seasons (still use a 2H) for my set 4/5i due to better iron striking and the fact that bad misses with irons are usually more playable than a pull hook hybrid on a rope 190 yards in the wrong direction. 

[tehuti]

Much has changed since my last post on this thread. I have benched both my 4i and 4h in favor of an iron-wood, which I hit a bit better.


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[jddaigneault]

On 2/7/2018 at 7:58 PM, deejaid said:

One problem for me is cost for how little I would use it. I probably pull my hybrid out of the bag twice a round so spending $200+ for a seldom used club isn't very appealing.

 

 

I started a thread a little while back about chipping with a hybrid. I'm trying to convince myself to keep it in the bag by getting more use out of it.

 

I'm playing on Saturday and won't have the new shaft for my 3-Iron head so the hybrid will stay for at least one more round.

 

 

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Doesn’t that always seem to be the case with golf?! I’d love to finally get my set dialed in so I never feel like anything needs to be replaced, other than when they’re just run down. Clubs are way too expensive these days!

[Grand Stranded]

I haven't read past the first page of this thread, but I think it's a "personal swing" issue. From what I see with the guys I play with, those who love hybrids hate FWs, and vice versa. Of course there are the exceptional players who can hit a 130 gram x flex 2 iron or anything else they want, but I'm talking your typical 10-20 hcp player.

My hybrids are my most dependable clubs in my bag, but I can't hit a 3 or 5 wood to save my life. For every good FW shot I hit, I have two bad ones. I'm almost at the point where I'm just thinking of taking my lone FW out of the bag, and putting in a LW. I've tried so many 3 woods you wouldn't believe it if I told you. I'm getting tired of trying, especially since I'm getting "4 wood" distance with my 3H.

 

[jddaigneault]

1 hour ago, Grand Stranded said:

I haven't read past the first page of this thread, but I think it's a "personal swing" issue. From what I see with the guys I play with, those who love hybrids hate FWs, and vice versa. Of course there are the exceptional players who can hit a 130 gram x flex 2 iron or anything else they want, but I'm talking your typical 10-20 hcp player.

My hybrids are my most dependable clubs in my bag, but I can't hit a 3 or 5 wood to save my life. For every good FW shot I hit, I have two bad ones. I'm almost at the point where I'm just thinking of taking my lone FW out of the bag, and putting in a LW. I've tried so many 3 woods you wouldn't believe it if I told you. I'm getting tired of trying, especially since I'm getting "4 wood" distance with my 3H.

 

I’m in the same boat with you. I can mash the fairways off the tee, but don’t trust them outside of a perfect lie on the course. Since those happen a lot...not to mention, it’s just not a club that gets used enough to keep a spot in my bag. I’m debating trying a UDI for tee shots, and rolling with just a 3 hybrid out of the rough on par fives and tee shots for long par 3s. I hit plenty far with my irons as it is, especially with ever stronger lofts. Pitching wedges are down to 42.5 (and probably stronger) in some lines! It makes me consider putting four wedges in my bag, as that loft is more of a nine iron anyways. Seems crazy to carry 5* wedges, but the 3 hybrid goes 245-255 so I’m not sure what use I have for a wood anyways. 

[Kegger]

Way back on the first page of this thread I said that I have a love/hate relationship with hybrids... Well, I'm currently in the love phase! I have dropped my 4i and replaced it with a 22* hybrid! Going to a heavier shaft (85g) in the hybrid seems to have helped with my consistency. As for the woods, I'm still rocking the 5w (have a new one on the way!) but am dropping the 3w. When I went through my long game fitting, I hit my 3w and 5w the same distance and couldn't find a 3w that I could hit further than a 5w! So I now have an extra spot in the bag for something... I just don't know what yet!

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[Alf. S]

4 hours ago, Kegger said:

Way back on the first page of this thread I said that I have a love/hate relationship with hybrids... Well, I'm currently in the love phase! I have dropped my 4i and replaced it with a 22* hybrid! Going to a heavier shaft (85g) in the hybrid seems to have helped with my consistency. As for the woods, I'm still rocking the 5w (have a new one on the way!) but am dropping the 3w. When I went through my long game fitting, I hit my 3w and 5w the same distance and couldn't find a 3w that I could hit further than a 5w! So I now have an extra spot in the bag for something... I just don't know what yet!

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get a 64' wedge that's something that can do damage to anyone's game.

[GolfSpy AFG]

For me it's a situational things; course and weather conditions.  All things being equal, I game an 18 degree CBX 119 that I get 230 out of.  Love the club...small profile without draw/hook bias.  But, I have a hard time flighting it low, so if I see a gusty 2-club day on the forecast I'll play a 2i TMB.  Usually I play either club fine, but if the swing is off a bit I find the 2i to be less forgiving.

[LittleWalter]

I have been through several hybrids myself.  All the gurus say that us mid-handicap golfers should be playing a hybrid.  I hate them.  Last year, I went to a 7 wood and love it.  I used to think of the 7 as an "old man" club.  I used to play with a guy who used his 7 wood for everything from 150 yards to 200.  He was in his late 60's and could hit that thing as accurate as I hit my 9 iron.  When I got fed up with trying hybrids, I put the 7 in my bag.  Haven't looked back.

[Wondergiulio]

On 2/7/2018 at 12:08 PM, cnosil said:

People either live or hate hybrids and I think it is based on how they swing. I personally love them and they have replaced my 5w, 3i, and 4i. I think the driving irons are designed to be easier to hit irons for people that have a swing that doesn't fit a hybrid.

 

You have tried hybrids, give the driving iron a try. Worst thing that happens is they don't work for you.

I agree.

seems to me that whoever has not the longest driver game but is a good iron striker with smooth tempo loves hybrid (look at Kuchar).

i am one of those. But lately I tried the Sub70 699 utility and I saw a similar result on the skytrak. Need to try it on the course tho.