Are older game improvement irons ruining my game/consistency?

[MWGolf23]

Questions:

• Can game improvement irons make it harder to close the face if you have a lot of clubhead speed? (strike and distance are not a problem for me)
• Is it harder to hold greens with game improvement irons?

My long game, wedge, and putting game are pretty strong. Hit my driver pretty consistent 270-290 etc. and is pretty accurate. It's my iron game that gives me fits and doesn't really provide me too many opportunities for birdies, driving my handicap higher. ( I could probably cut my handicap down by at least 3-5 points if I could figure my irons out)

 

My iron set is unfitted. I choke up for correct length for my wrist-to-ground measurement. This helped me with consistent striking. My problem is dispersion (most often pushing straight right). This could just be a swing fault, I have to get out soon to test some theories like moving the ball up in my stance to help the club face close, and adjust my swing path slightly (I draw my driver, probably too much even with the ball far up in my stance).

 

Ultimately I would like to get fitted for irons in the next couple of years, but just wondering if anyone has seen vast improvements in consistency/dispersion and holding greens with the move to players or players-distance irons when your clubhead speed and strength are above average.

 

[null]

Hard to answer your questions without knowing you spin and angle of descent numbers with your irons.

[Shankster]

How old, and how game improvementy? I know some of the older irons had V grooves, and from what I understand didn't impart as much spin as U grooves. That was from a magazine article, so take that for what it's worth.

 

But, like jlukes said a launch monitor sesh would prove beneficial.

[MWGolf23]

How old, and how game improvementy? I know some of the older irons had V grooves, and from what I understand didn't impart as much spin as U grooves. That was from a magazine article, so take that for what it's worth.

 

But, like jlukes said a launch monitor sesh would prove beneficial.

 

Taylormade RAC HT. They are a typical cavity back. I would say they have a low-to-mid trajectory for each club which I know will affect holding greens. I was just at a simulator on Sunday to dial in my new driver and woods, didn't pay attention to my iron spin/launch dang it.

 

Any thoughts on the face angle typically staying open for me?

 

[cnosil]

The type of iron probably won't have a lot of impact on green holding ability unless you are making poor contact. Ball could have some impact as well

 

As for closing the face, the type of iron should have huge impact unless your shaft is way stiffer than it needs to be. My guess would be a swing issue.

 

You say straight right so you my guess is you are coming too far inside on the backswing and trying to swing to right field to make the ball draw and never close the face. Ball straight right means swinging in to out and the face is square to the clubs path.

[MWGolf23]

The type of iron probably won't have a lot of impact on green holding ability unless you are making poor contact. Ball could have some impact as well

 

As for closing the face, the type of iron should have huge impact unless your shaft is way stiffer than it needs to be. My guess would be a swing issue.

 

Does the balk go start right of intended line and go straight, does it start right and curve right, does it start straight and curve right, or start left and curve right?

Currently, it typically goes straight right with no draw back to the left. That's the reason I want to tinker with my ball position, moving it up further and also work on my swing path/bending my wrist a little more to entice the face to close more.

 

I agree, thanks. So my swing path should be the biggest component to work on then right? Ball position may help a little, but it sounds like I need less in to out. I would rather have a slight draw or straight iron shot. The goal is to get it straight to where I aim.

[cnosil]

Currently, it typically goes straight right with no draw back to the left. That's the reason I want to tinker with my ball position, moving it up further and also work on my swing path/bending my wrist a little more to entice the face to close more.

 

I agree, thanks. So my swing path should be the biggest component to work on then right? Ball position may help a little, but it sounds like I need less in to out.

I am not an instructor and have never seen your swing bug a common flaw is starting the club inside on the takeaway. When the club is parallel to the ground where does it point?

 

There are lots of reasons that the ball can start right. And we all want to have the ball go where we aim

[Shankster]

That's above my pay grade. But I'd think if they were hugely offset they'd be going right. But I'm no pro.

 

Edit: going left not right.

[RickyBobby_PR]

Currently, it typically goes straight right with no draw back to the left. That's the reason I want to tinker with my ball position, moving it up further and also work on my swing path/bending my wrist a little more to entice the face to close more.

 

I agree, thanks. So my swing path should be the biggest component to work on then right? Ball position may help a little, but it sounds like I need less in to out. I would rather have a slight draw or straight iron shot. The goal is to get it straight to where I aim.

Ball position could affect path. But it could also be s face issue st impact. What's your current ball position setup throughout your bag. Is you miss always the same with every club or do you have different misses

[MDGolfHacker]

Easy way to figure out if it's the clubs or you -grab a buddy's iron and hit his (hopefully similar spec but different brand or model). If the ball is doing the same thing then it's more likely a swing issue. If your hitting it better it's a club issue. Didn't that club has a bit of offset? That sometimes messes people up.

 

MDGolfHacker

[chemclub]

I actually played a round with those rac irons last summer while visiting a buddy and used his old set. Hit some great iron shots into a few greens with plenty of spin. Even when I play with SGI irons I don't notice too much drop off in spin. 

 

I would look at shaft and your swing, all informed by a launch monitor, before thinking about the head. Based the description of your misses and working on swing path, I think those inconsistencies are the likely culprit.

 

Good luck

[MWGolf23]

Ball position could affect path. But it could also be s face issue st impact. What's your current ball position setup throughout your bag. Is you miss always the same with every club or do you have different misses

Driver through 5 iron I typically don't have that problem (driver I occasionally push right). I start to push more often starting around 7 through 9 or PW. So my typical second shot into the green.

[MWGolf23]

Ball position could affect path. But it could also be s face issue st impact. What's your current ball position setup throughout your bag. Is you miss always the same with every club or do you have different misses

Driver I have the ball way up in my stance, but maybe every 5th or 6th driver I push it right.

[MWGolf23]

The type of iron probably won't have a lot of impact on green holding ability unless you are making poor contact. Ball could have some impact as well

 

As for closing the face, the type of iron should have huge impact unless your shaft is way stiffer than it needs to be. My guess would be a swing issue.

 

You say straight right so you my guess is you are coming too far inside on the backswing and trying to swing to right field to make the ball draw and never close the face. Ball straight right means swinging in to out and the face is square to the clubs path.

 

For me I believe the trajectories are too low for each degree of iron compared to others. I've seen fitting videos where a better fit for higher launch and steeper descent angle play a huge factor in holding greens better, because of less roll out and more spin. I think I might have too piercing of a trajectory.

[cnosil]

For me I believe the trajectories are too low for each degree of iron compared to others. I've seen fitting videos where a better fit for higher launch and steeper descent angle play a huge factor in holding greens better, because of less roll out and more spin. I think I might have too piercing of a trajectory.

Possibly, but you can flight wedges down and put lots of spin on the ball. You would have to check on a launch monitor for your current launch and spin numbers.

[HardcoreLooper]

A good friend of mine used to play the RAC HTs. The HT stands for High Trajectory. These clubs want to hit the ball in the air. These were his first decent set of clubs. Once he learned to make a better swing, he started hitting moon balls with these and got rid of them. If you're hitting them too low, I'm wondering if you're de-lofting the club too much.

[MWGolf23]

A good friend of mine used to play the RAC HTs. The HT stands for High Trajectory. These clubs want to hit the ball in the air. These were his first decent set of clubs. Once he learned to make a better swing, he started hitting moon balls with these and got rid of them. If you're hitting them too low, I'm wondering if you're de-lofting the club too much.

De-lofting is a good point. I feel like at address I don't but maybe through the swing. Maybe too focused on downward angle of attack.

 

Your comment also made me think I may not be choking down on the club enough. The clubs are standard and I'm supposed to be about an inch shorter. I'll have to re-measure. Maybe make some lines or tape on my clubs to be consistent. Not worth it to me to get them cut if I plan on actually getting fit for new ones in the next few years.

[MWGolf23]

De-lofting is a good point. I feel like at address I don't but maybe through the swing. Maybe too focused on downward angle of attack.

 

Your comment also made me think I may not be choking down on the club enough. The clubs are standard and I'm supposed to be about an inch shorter. I'll have to re-measure. Maybe make some lines or tape on my clubs to be consistent. Not worth it to me to get them cut if I plan on actually getting fit for new ones in the next few years.

 

I did just re-measure, and I probably need to choke down another half inch. I will say last year when I measured and choked down on my 5-iron, I had a brand new favorite club. Most often straight, was able to get it up in the air, decent height and 200 yards. I'll test choking down a little more on it and the rest of the irons. Might lose some distance, but I'll be happy with straight more often. My grips happen to have marks on them that will make it easy to place my hands in the right spot. Thanks for all of the insight guys.

 

Does anyone have a list of ideal launch and spin rates for each iron?

 

That would be extremely helpful to have a benchmark. Plan of action will be:

• Choke down more and see if that helps things. Sounds like it will help with higher trajectory at least. And I'm thinking my club face will close a little bit better.
• Get back to a launch monitor and compare to benchmarks.
• Definitely, lessen my in-to-out swing path.
• Tinker with closing the face and ball position. Depends on how much I lessen my in-to-out path.

Any additional ideas? I'm sure getting fit in a few years will help a lot with consistency too.

[cnosil]

I did just re-measure, and I probably need to choke down another half inch. I will say last year when I measured and choked down on my 5-iron, I had a brand new favorite club. Most often straight, was able to get it up in the air, decent height and 200 yards. I'll test choking down a little more on it and the rest of the irons. Might lose some distance, but I'll be happy with straight more often. My grips happen to have marks on them that will make it easy to place my hands in the right spot. Thanks for all of the insight guys.

 

Does anyone have a list of ideal launch and spin rates for each iron?

 

That would be extremely helpful to have a benchmark. Plan of action will be:

• Choke down more and see if that helps things. Sounds like it will help with higher trajectory at least. And I'm thinking my club face will close a little bit better.
• Get back to a launch monitor and compare to benchmarks.
• Definitely, lessen my in-to-out swing path.
• Tinker with closing the face and ball position. Depends on how much I lessen my in-to-out path.

Any additional ideas? I'm sure getting fit in a few years will help a lot with consistency too.

Ideal launch and spin numbers are based on swing speed and ball spin. There isn't a single chart. Use one of the trajectory optimizers to figure out you optimal

 

In to out swing path is something that should be verified prior to trying to change. Do you use alignment sticks to ensure you are setup correctly?