Courses being shut down

[tony@CIC]

Interesting - if not depressing article on the state of our game. I'm aware of two courses near me that have shut down - one is just abandoned the other will become a housing tract. .Is this more of a consolidation after being overbuilt or a major down trend. 

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/inside-two-abandoned-golf-courses-2017-6

[MaxEntropy]

We've lost a 27 hole course, a 9 hole course,an 18 hole course, and a 36 hole course was shrunk to 18. None of them were the highest quality, but it is still a depressing trend.

[bens197]

Golf isn't cheap and this trend doesn't surprise me. When you consider all the costs involved, the opportunity to spare 4-5 hours and spend anywhere from $50-$120 to play most average courses in the NE where I'm from, it becomes a process of natural selection.

 

Middle and lower income families just don't have the time and or money to play when you factor family, personal time and the need to pay down debt while working two jobs to make it. This is a product of our economy and how we are getting further away from what made this country great in the post WW2 era. Strong middle class families with living wages made our Country great. Men in suits are ruining it for us.

 

 

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[russtopherb]

It's tough to see unfortunately. My old home course closed almost 3 years ago now. It was a short but challenging 9 hole course that had a huge wedding reception and event business. The owner ran it into the ground and it hasn't been sold so it's overgrown and in terrible shape.

 

3 driving ranges near me have also closed, including the one 3 mins from my office.

 

On the good side, the semi-private that's also near my house has almost 100 more members this year over last, and the muni the next town over that was running ragged has new management with a history of turning around courses. So there are good signs in the industry, too.

 

 

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[palvord]

Courses being shut down makes sense to me as the need for houses, and places to build them, increases. The money that can be made by selling land to a developer is greater than what you can make running an every day golf course.

 

There is a 54 hole course near me that sold 36 of the holes to a land developer for a huge chunk of change. Instant profit.

 

As to the interest in the game being down for the “younger generation” it makes complete sense to me. The entry level cost is high, which can intimidate potential players. Also, the image of golf is of an elite, private thing. That can prevent people from even checking out the game.

 

 

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[sixcat]

From a professional standpoint, this is the trend I have witnessed.  My firm has converted several former golf course properties into various other things over the past decade.

 

First, golf courses were overbuilt following the "Tiger boom" of the late 90's and early 2000's.  Which was never sustainable over time, especially now with the game reverting back to a more normal and sustainable level.  Some are going to fail as a result, and maybe they should.  It isn't particularly popular to say but taking my area as an example, a 50 miles radius search of my address yields no fewer than 27 golf courses serving an area with a population of less than 150,000 residents.  More than half of which were built after the year 2000.  It's simply not sustainable. 

 

Second, environmental regulation, water conservation and a shortage of residential housing in many areas of the country have resulted in land being more valuable as subdivided real estate than as a mixed-use facility such as a golf course.  Given that most golf courses already have some form of public utilities dissecting the property, it lends itself to a quick, easy, and a relatively cheap transition into subdivided real estate.  Given the often-false public narrative that golf courses are gluttonous with water consumption and usage, community leaders can sell the concept of subdivided real estate to the general public by politically charged "grandstanding" that gets their names in the paper and aides in reelection bids.  A lot of Country Clubs tend to have sweetheart deals with the community going back several decades and generations for the supply of public water.  That lends itself to making the Clubs easy targets of an ever growing population who's utility bills go up every 24 months.  Most of us cringe a bit when we get our water bill from the city.  It doesn't sit well when we learn the local golf course uses 10 times the amount of water as the average family and pays significantly less and often nothing for it.  Again, not sustainable.

 

Third, the golf course housing development concept that exploded in the late 90's isn't particularly appealing to a large percentage of the population.  Even the majority of the golfing population aren't big fans of the idea.  I know I'm not.  I'm a member of a highly successful country club that does one thing and does it very well.....golf.  If the club were to be surrounded by homes, residential streets and hustle and bustle of everyday life, I wouldn't be a member!  In my opinion, golf needs to get back to the ideal that the average amateur golfer doesn't want or need restaurants, playgrounds, bike trails, aquatic centers, fitness centers and tennis facilities.  Just give me a quality golf course in reasonably good condition, I don't want or need the fluff and filler and certainly don't want to feel as though I'm paying for those things in which I will never use.  If I want to take my family to a nice restaurant, the golf course is the last place I would consider.  My family wouldn't be very enthusiastic about the idea either. 

 

Evidently, most people in this area feel the same.  Of the recent course closures I have been associated with, all but one were private, equity clubs built withing the last 15 years who overpaid for aquatic centers, fitness centers, restaurants, bike/hiking trails, etc and forgot to cater to the golfers.  The one that didn't fall into this category was a 9-hole muni where the land was used to build a new school for that ever growing population. 

[palvord]

From a professional standpoint, this is the trend I have witnessed. My firm has converted several former golf course properties into various other things over the past decade.

 

First, golf courses were overbuilt following the "Tiger boom" of the late 90's and early 2000's. Which was never sustainable over time, especially now with the game reverting back to a more normal and sustainable level. Some are going to fail as a result, and maybe they should. It isn't particularly popular to say but taking my area as an example, a 50 miles radius search of my address yields no fewer than 27 golf courses serving an area with a population of less than 150,000 residents. More than half of which were built after the year 2000. It's simply not sustainable.

 

Second, environmental regulation, water conservation and a shortage of residential housing in many areas of the country have resulted in land being more valuable as subdivided real estate than as a mixed-use facility such as a golf course. Given that most golf courses already have some form of public utilities dissecting the property, it lends itself to a quick, easy, and a relatively cheap transition into subdivided real estate. Given the often-false public narrative that golf courses are gluttonous with water consumption and usage, community leaders can sell the concept of subdivided real estate to the general public by politically charged "grandstanding" that gets their names in the paper and aides in reelection bids. A lot of Country Clubs tend to have sweetheart deals with the community going back several decades and generations for the supply of public water. That lends itself to making the Clubs easy targets of an ever growing population who's utility bills go up every 24 months. Most of us cringe a bit when we get our water bill from the city. It doesn't sit well when we learn the local golf course uses 10 times the amount of water as the average family and pays significantly less and often nothing for it. Again, not sustainable.

 

Third, the golf course housing development concept that exploded in the late 90's isn't particularly appealing to a large percentage of the population. Even the majority of the golfing population aren't big fans of the idea. I know I'm not. I'm a member of a highly successful country club that does one thing and does it very well.....golf. If the club were to be surrounded by homes, residential streets and hustle and bustle of everyday life, I wouldn't be a member! In my opinion, golf needs to get back to the ideal that the average amateur golfer doesn't want or need restaurants, playgrounds, bike trails, aquatic centers, fitness centers and tennis facilities. Just give me a quality golf course in reasonably good condition, I don't want or need the fluff and filler and certainly don't want to feel as though I'm paying for those things in which I will never use. If I want to take my family to a nice restaurant, the golf course is the last place I would consider. My family wouldn't be very enthusiastic about the idea either.

 

Evidently, most people in this area feel the same. Of the recent course closures I have been associated with, all but one were private, equity clubs built withing the last 15 years who overpaid for aquatic centers, fitness centers, restaurants, bike/hiking trails, etc and forgot to cater to the golfers. The one that didn't fall into this category was a 9-hole muni where the land was used to build a new school for that ever growing population.

I really like the point you make about the “Tiger boom” and how that influenced bad decision making. 27 courses serving less than 150,000 people is a crazy stat and can explain why some courses are now closing their doors.

 

 

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[sixcat]

I really like the point you make about the “Tiger boom” and how that influenced bad decision making. 27 courses serving less than 150,000 people is a crazy stat and can explain why some courses are now closing their doors.

 

 

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That's a rough estimation on both parts but isn't going to be far from accurate.  I highlighted all golf courses in a 50 mile radius of my house on Google Earth and have a working knowledge of the population of that area given my profession. 

[JAGolfore]

We are loosing the top public course (price) wise in our area next year. And we have had one other move to a 12 hole course. That being said we still have at least nine 18 hole courses for just over 208,000 people in our county. 3 of those are private though.

 

 

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[MattF]

We've lost a 27 hole course, a 9 hole course,an 18 hole course, and a 36 hole course was shrunk to 18. None of them were the highest quality, but it is still a depressing trend.

 

Which ones? Maplecrest, Green Hills, Oak Knolls and Wests Mogadore are all gone. Rain Tree is apparently in it's last year as is Tannenhof and Roses Run.

[txgolfjunkie]

It's a shame there aren't more city-owned golf courses opening up around the country. The public golf scene in Houston and my hometown of Waco is pretty bleak, but the courses owned by the city are some of the best in the area. Houston is a different story with their crown jewel (Memorial Park) getting most of the benefit, but Cottonwood in Waco is the only public course worth a darn in the county. There's a great course east of Houston, Eagle Pointe, that is city owned. Mainly funded by property taxes from the natural gas storage facility in the area. Some of the best courses I played in Denver...city owned.

 

What seems to be the trend in Houston is semi-private courses selling out to Club Corp and then going private. I've grown to really dislike Club Corp. Oh you want to play? That's $325/month. Oh you want cart? That's another $20/round. Oh you'd like to go play another CLub Corp course? ....

[poprocksncoke]

We have had 3 golf courses where I live close down in the past 5 years.  One of which was the first course I worked at back in the 90's.  Two of them were build in the early 90's and back then they were always busy.  The other had been around for over 50 years.  

 

I can only speak for the one I used to work at but at the time it was one of the nicest courses around.  From what I gather the City had a hard time making the bond payments on the course and sold it to a developer.  The developer promised to keep the course open for at least 5 years after the sell.  The course did stay open beyond the 5 year mark but unfortunately the upkeep on the course suffered greatly.  Not sure what happened to the developer who planned shopping, housing and golf but all that is left is the clubhouse and the course is now an orchard. 

 

Couple of years ago I was in the City I went to high school in and went to go find one of the courses I used to play at.  Again, all I was able to find was an orchard where the course used to be.

 

Sad........ 

[PlaidJacket]

We have only two public courses here. One is a muni and the other a daily-fee. The daily fee is for sale and could close at anytime. I hate to see it go even though it's a boring; poor design. That leaves our city with it's 36-hole muni track. It's pretty much goat. The three other courses in town are private.

I've tried and tried for 5 years to get our city officials to do something about the muni but so far they've refused. Their model is failed. I've presented them with many options to consider but so far they will not listen. They apparently are sticking to a 1950's model of what a municipal golf course is and how it's operated. Everything about municipal golf in my city is wrong. The course is run-down, it's unprofessional, people are treated poorly, the food and beverage is bad, it loses money year over year, and well,.... the whole place stinks to high heaven. There's even a stench of corruption IMO.

[Kenny B]

No golf courses closing in my area.  Last new golf course was built in 1994.  Since then our population has just about doubled, probably 350K people.  Granted, most of the new residents are probably not taking up golf, but some are and some came from other locations where they played golf (mostly California).  Courses are all very busy, which is good for them and bad for us trying to get tee times.  We could use another course.

[bens197]

No golf courses closing in my area. Last new golf course was built in 1994. Since then our population has just about doubled, probably 350K people. Granted, most of the new residents are probably not taking up golf, but some are and some came from other locations where they played golf (mostly California). Courses are all very busy, which is good for them and bad for us trying to get tee times. We could use another course.

Where are you located Kenny?

 

 

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[Kenny B]

Where are you located Kenny?

 

 

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SE Washington State 200 miles up the Columbia River from Portland, OR.

 

Washington wine country!!

[bens197]

SE Washington State 200 miles up the Columbia River from Portland, OR.

 

Washington wine country!!

That's not a bad place to be Mister!

 

I am a big fan of Russian River Pinot Noirs (MacMurray is my current favorite)

 

Always looking for a good wine recommendation

 

 

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[tommc23]

There's a course in my area that is on a decline and another that is going from 18 to 9 due to putting apartments on the back 9

 

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[MaxEntropy]

Which ones? Maplecrest, Green Hills, Oak Knolls and Wests Mogadore are all gone. Rain Tree is apparently in it's last year as is Tannenhof and Roses Run.

The ones I was thinking of were Valley View (27), Kent State (9), Maplecrest (18), and Oak Knolls contracted to 18. Didn't know about Rain Tree and Roses Run. Haven't played Rain Tree much but have spent a fair amount of time at Roses Run.

 

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[palvord]

The ones I was thinking of were Valley View (27), Kent State (9), Maplecrest (18), and Oak Knolls contracted to 18. Didn't know about Rain Tree and Roses Run. Haven't played Rain Tree much but have spent a fair amount of time at Roses Run.

 

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I'm originally from Akron and played most of these courses at one time. It makes complete sense to me that this entire list would close. Every time I played, it seemed like the passion to actually try and take care of the course was not there from management. It was sad, and painful to play while experiencing the inevitable slow death.

 

 

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[MattF]

The ones I was thinking of were Valley View (27), Kent State (9), Maplecrest (18), and Oak Knolls contracted to 18. Didn't know about Rain Tree and Roses Run. Haven't played Rain Tree much but have spent a fair amount of time at Roses Run.

 

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Oak Knolls contracted from 36 holes years ago and they actually closed completely last year.

[MGoBlue100]

This is the course that really got me started in the golf “business”, such as it was. Nice that it's being used as a nature preserve instead of housing. What stinks is that this was a Donald Ross design... SIGH

http://www.woodtv.com/news/grand-rapids/nature-preserve-at-former-highlands-golf-club-open_2018030208094815/1003442757

 

 

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[00sportsman]

Just played a nine hole course a couple of weeks ago that used to be 18. It's located in a housing non-development. The guy in the pro shop said they just couldn't afford to maintain all 18. Tons of empty lots in the "development."

 

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[tony@CIC]

The ones I was thinking of were Valley View (27), Kent State (9), Maplecrest (18), and Oak Knolls contracted to 18. Didn't know about Rain Tree and Roses Run. Haven't played Rain Tree much but have spent a fair amount of time at Roses Run.

 

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There's also one around the corner from my son's house in Hinckley.

 

 

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[palvord]

There's also one around the corner from my son's house in Hinckley.

 

 

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It's incredible how many courses are listed here that are closed down or reduced all in the Akron area. And yet still, there are a number of courses thriving there. I firmly believe that if you build and maintain a course with passion, the golfers will keep coming back.

 

I get that courses are expensive to run, but so are many other businesses. The ones run with passion and care last.

 

 

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[dhartmann34]

It doesn't surprise me in the least. We've had 3 courses close by me in the past 6 months. 2 are in talks of being closed down and 2 more were sold as they were on the brink of closing down...and I don't know how long they'll actually last even with new ownership. 

 

The golf industry is shrinking. It's time consuming and expensive and young people today don't have the attention span or urge to golf. They've got so much technology coming at them that golf is the last thing on their radar. TopGolf is probably the new golf..... incorporates all the technology and entertainment they are looking for....with MUCH less commitment in time and money. 

[palvord]

It doesn't surprise me in the least. We've had 3 courses close by me in the past 6 months. 2 are in talks of being closed down and 2 more were sold as they were on the brink of closing down...and I don't know how long they'll actually last even with new ownership.

 

The golf industry is shrinking. It's time consuming and expensive and young people today don't have the attention span or urge to golf. They've got so much technology coming at them that golf is the last thing on their radar. TopGolf is probably the new golf..... incorporates all the technology and entertainment they are looking for....with MUCH less commitment in time and money.

I'm not sure how much I buy that the younger generations don't have the attention span for something. I agree that time, being the most valuable commodity lately, is a major factor to growing the game.

 

There are more options today for everyone to go enjoy. It's not just technology that has changed the landscape of “fun” ways to spend money.

 

I think that the more we can do to introduce the game to young people, the more it sticks with them and they continue on. There probably are not many people that picked up the game without having someone, more than likely a family member, introduce them to it.

 

Also, the perception of accessibility matters. From people outside the game, golf can look like a game for only the privileged few. The more work that can be done to break down the barriers (perceived and real) that will help the game grow.

 

 

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[Golfinvegas]

Here in Vegas, my old club Silverstone (27 holes) shut down after being run into the ground by inept management and 6-figure monthly water bills. Then another 27 hole club Badlands got shut down for same reasons. Both are in expensive litigation with developers.

 

Another course Black Mountain has gone from 27 down to 9. Drove by there a month ago and no one was playing it, with the exception of Paiute, Vegas courses are hurting big time.

[Golfspy_CG2]

Here in Vegas, my old club Silverstone (27 holes) shut down after being run into the ground by inept management and 6-figure monthly water bills. Then another 27 hole club Badlands got shut down for same reasons. Both are in expensive litigation with developers.

 

Another course Black Mountain has gone from 27 down to 9. Drove by there a month ago and no one was playing it, with the exception of Paiute, Vegas courses are hurting big time.

Wow. The only two courses in Vegas that I've played, shut down. I guess I was bad for the Vegas golf economy. But not to worry I made substantial contributions to a couple of those big shiny casinos.

 

 

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[Rickp]

I ran into a guy from CT yesterday. He stopped me because I had a shirt with a course from CT logo. After brief conversation we had some acquaintances in common. Anyway he told me a course in Southington was sold and one of the 9's was turned into homes and the other 9 may have same fate. A private course in Bristol was in serious financial problems and was sold. The fate of that course is unknown.

 

 

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