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High Handicap Fitting Experience: Frustrating


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Hey all, 

 

In my introduction post I noted how 2018 was the year I was going to double down on my golf game and make huge improvements through investing in my game through lessons and club fitting. 

 

In my 4 years of golfing, I had never been fitted for clubs. I've taken a dozen lessons over the past 6 months and had gotten to a point where I just didn't feel comfortable with my equipment, especially with my long game clubs. 

 

My current long game clubs are as follows:

 

  • Taylormade R15 Driver Stiff Flex, 12* head de-lofted to 10.5 (miss = huge slice)
  • Taylormade R11S 3-wood Regular Flex (miss = fat shot, can't "feel" the club and properly deliver it back to impact)
  • Taylormade R11s 5-wood Regular Flex (relatively comfortable with the club)

 

Goals for fitting: 

  • Gain comfort in my long game clubs
  • Minimize misses (dispersion), especially the ballooning slice
  • Find the best driver/fairways for me, irrespective of company (I hold no loyalties!) 

Before we go any further here, I want to acknowledge that I am NOT expecting equipment to solve the fundamental issues with my swing. That said, I know that I'm at a place where the right equipment can make a difference (I'm shooting low 90s, broke 90 first time last week, and shot 41 on an twilight 9-hole round this weekend).

 

Between reading online (MGS, GolfDigest, etc) and watching YouTube (Mark Crossfield, Rick Shiels, TXG) it was clear to me how important fitting was.

 

This is where things really started to unravel for me and get frustrating. (Note: I intentionally left names of people and shops out of this...for now)

 

Attempt 1: Get fit with your coach

 

Mark especially says fitting should be done by your swing coach. So that's where I started. 

 

Unfortunately, my coach is a Callaway rep and the course doesn't have a ton of fitting carts (though they do have Trackman). I setup a 1 hour long game fitting with him even though he told me we'd only be hitting Callaway stuff since "it's the best fit for my swing" :blink:  and that they hadn't gotten a lot of the updated carts yet from other club makers. 

 

This was red flag one  :excl:  :mad:, but ultimately I was ok with it since I could get some real data on my swing via Trackman and also get a full hour with my swing coach for $85. My thinking was that I could at least get some instruction out of the hour if I didn't buy clubs (and thus get the fitting fee refunded as part of their deal).

 

When I arrived I found out that we'd only be hitting Driver, as the fairway woods hadn't come in yet. Red flag two.  :excl:  :mad:

 

Over the next hour we hit a bunch of different Rogue Driver head/shaft combos and I really learned a lot about my swing and preference for shaft weight and feel.  :D

 

Below are my notes I took from the fitting. 

 

  1. "Feel" to me means heavier shafts, SS not impacted by weight much at all
  2. Swing driver swing speed 100 MPH +/- 2-3MPH
  3. Good drives with R15 carry 230-250. Attack angle too far down on the ball. (Consistently -2 to -4)
  4. Old R15 Driver crazy spinny, slices losing 25-40 yards
  5. Rogue head felt good, misses more under control but left-right dispersion was inconsistent. Distances much more controlled
  6. Rogue Draw eliminated the left side of the fairway completely (note: I'm lefty)
  7. Rogue Draw shots just a touch longer than R15, more consistently above the 240 carry mark. Still too negative on attack angle, but better (closer to -2)

My coach landed on the final recommendation: 

  • Rogue Draw Head, 9*
  • Project X Hzrdus Yellow, 76G 6.0
  • Shaft 1/2 inch short

I didn't pull the trigger on the purchase. Why not? I didn't feel great that I hit one head. I'd heard a lot about PING G400 Max and wanted to hit that to compare, but couldn't under this setup. Also, I wanted to think about the Driver & Fairways as a set that matched my desired distances etc. I wasn't able to do that. 

 

Attempt 2: Go all out and invest in a premium fitter

 

Ok, so working with my swing coach and hitting only one company's offering didn't give me the comfort that I was looking for. What now? It was right around this time that I found TXG's YouTube page and spent hours watching their stuff. If I lived even remotely near Canada, I would've spent a day or two and go to them.

 

Instead I picked a premium club fitter nearby and booked their next available session a few weeks out. 

 

Since I had been doing so much research on my own and had already attempted a long-game fitting, I put my notes and interests into an e-mail and passed them along to the fitter I would be working with.

 

I knew that this company built the clubs in-house, such that you'd pay the price of the driver/fairway club THEN the shaft as well, but also that there was no requirement to buy from them. In my note I just let him know that I was on a budget, and that exotic shaft combos may be a bit out of touch for me at this time, and to the extent that we could be aware of costs as we progress through the fitting, that'd be really helpful. 

 

I didn't near back until the night before my morning fitting. 

 

The gentlemen called and proceeded to explain to me that they're a "premium" shop that is akin to taking your car to a tune up shop to get more performance out of the engine. Because of that, when he works with people they simply want to find the best club for the golfer and while it's good to know a budget, they don't fit to a budget.  :excl:  :mad:

 

.... ok? Sounds roughly like what I'm trying to do, just with an upper bound constraint to keep myself in reality.

 

I explained my predicament, that I wanted to hit a variety of clubs from various companies and try to find something that was within budget that was better than my 12* R15 driver. 

 

He agreed that made sense and we left the call keeping the fitting session on. In hindsight, I should've canceled right here. 

 

I arrived in the morning and got all set up. At that point the guy forgot I was a lefty and moved the trackman over, but said I had to aim at the screen off the to left to make sure that it was picking up the ball on the right line. This was definitely not ideal. 

 

I warmed up and he immediately called out my negative attack angle (again, that -2 on good shots, -4 on misses), which was very true, and that we'd work to try and lessen that and thus reduce the spin induced by that. Great!

 

Over the next 45 minutes we tested a bunch of different shafts on a Ping G400 head. Numbers looked best with an Aldilia NV Green 65G Stiff Shaft. We never tested a 75G despite acknowledging that was what I had been fit to prior. I mentioned that the heavier shaft helped me "feel" when I was coming over the top and how that really helped eliminate the slice previously. He disagreed.

 

We then moved on to heads. We hit Rogue, Rogue Sub Zero, G400, G400 Max, and M3. Through this entire time, he had to step away to answer the phone a couple times and just generally seemed a bit disinterested or distracting. 

 

Just after the halfway mark, he basically concluded that with my swing I needed to focus on hitting up on the ball more to drop my spin, this is true! But, I'm a work in progress. He said that if I wanted a new driver I should just get the M3 with the Aldilia NV shaft mentioned above, but it wasn't going to do anything for me until I fixed my swing.  :wacko: He kept harping on how with my power I should be seeing ~260-270 yard drives under ideal launch, but that was never going to happen hitting so down on the ball. Again, true.

 

He didn't seem to care so much that all I wanted was to not play a 12* driver and reduce my slice miss. 

 

I ended up paying the $150 and left pretty bummed at the whole experience. I wasn't even able to take notes since I was so exasperated by how it unfolded.

 

Attempt 3: Just go hit at a retailer

 

Last weekend was the royal wedding, so I needed to get out of the apartment while my wife had her friends over to watch.

 

I had heard good things about an independent retailer nearby so I drove out there. Met with a guy and explained what I was looking to hit (drivers and fairways from some the various companies they stock). He threw me into their Callaway Fitting Center (Trackman) and brought in Taylormade Stuff (M3 & M4), Callaway Stuff (Rogue & Rogue Draw), and Ping Stuff (G400, G400 SFT, G400 Max).

 

I warmed up and hey, he called out my negative attack angle! At the very least, my swing miss was consistent and easily identified. The gentlemen said we should be able to still get good results regardless.  :lol:

 

I hadn't mentioned anything about shaft weight, but he quickly identified that I was a good fit for a heavier shaft and quickly landed on the 75G offerings.

 

For the Ping and Callaway stuff, I actually really liked the feel of the Project X Hrzdus Yellow. So we hit each Ping & Callaway head with that shaft and logged the results. We also hit the Taylormade heads, but I was just spraying them all over (M3 weights were back for forgiveness). 

 

The results were actually surprising, I landed nearly exactly where I started with my swing coach.

 

  • Callaway Rogue Draw 10.5* (Coach originally fitted me for 9*)
  • Project X Hzrdus Yellow, 76G 6.0
  • Stock Length (Fitter thought was that it's easier to cut down a shaft later and redo the swing weight than to lengthen)

A close second was the G400 SFT. Both the Rogue Draw and SFT eliminated the left side of the course for me, but the Rogue was a bit longer on mishits, and in aggregate ~5% longer overall. 

 

Given the dual confirmation that Rogue was suiting me best (attempts #1 and #3 came damn close to the same conclusion), I went ahead and pulled the trigger on the purchase. 

 

The process cost me $100 ($150 with $50 back since I bought), but I actually got the exact experience I was hoping for. I got to hit all clubs on Trackman, stick to shafts that were stock or minor upcharges, and do so in a way that didn't feel biased to one company.

 

What do you think? 

  • Did I do this whole thing wrong? 
  • Am I good enough to get fit?
  • Should I be more upset about the outcome of attempt #2 than I am?
  • Did I leave a lot on the table by narrowing myself to the list of shafts available from Ping/Callaway/Taylormade fitting sheets? 

 

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First: interesting write up of the whole experience. Glad to have read it.

 

In some ways, despite the evident frustration of the experience, you did come away with this advantage: two different fitters giving you more or less the same advice. I've not been fitted before (so take anything I say with that grain of salt), but I always suspected that with a fitting, you might wonder that if you went on a different day or talked to a different fitter, you'd end up with a significantly different result. In your case, you have good reason to think that, at the very least, you've been recommended a club that's a good fit for you now.

:titleist-small: TS3 9.5°, Tensei Blue
:755178188_TourEdge: CBX T3 15°, Project X HZRDUS Black
:callaway-small: Epic Super Hybrid 18°, Aerotech Steel Fiber FC HYB S
:755178188_TourEdge: C722 21°, Ventus Blue 8S
:touredgeexotics: CBX Iron-Wood 25°, Project X HZRDUS Black 6.0
:Sub70: 639 CB, Aldila NV 95 Graphite, 6–PW
:cleveland-small: CBX 48°
:mizuno-small: T22 54° and 60°
:edel-golf-1: EAS 4.0, Garsen G-Pro grip
:taylormade-small: TP5x and Tour Response

Full WITB with pictures

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Good write up and I'm sorry to hear the whole experience didn't go quite as planned, but glad to hear you got fitted into a driver that works well for you.

I dont believe you went about it wrong at all. sucks about fitting number two, but i guess that is why they are a premium fitter?

I dont believe you limited or narrowed yourself. Sounded like you had a pretty decent idea of what you wanted to try and you did in the end.

I've only ever been fit for my irons never driver (probably went I have yet to find one I really love) so it was good to hear about your experience. Thanks for sharing!

 

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

⛳🛄 as of Nov 6, 2023 (Past WITB
Driver:  :callaway-small: Paradym TD w/ GD ADDI 6X Driver Shootout! 

Wood:    :cobra-small: F7 3 wood 14.5* w/ Motore F1 Shaft

Irons:   :titleist-small: T Series - T200 5 Iron
                                          T150 6-9 Iron
                                          T100 PW/GW

Wedge:  Toura Golf - A Spec 53,37,61 degree 

Putter:  Screenshot 2023-06-02 13.10.30.png Mezz Max!

Balls:     Vice Pro Plus Drip (Blue/Orange)

 

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thanks for sharing! that is really frustrating overall, but, as mpatrickriley noted above, at least you did get similar results from 2 different fitters. 

Sucks that you had to pay to go through 3 different fittings and that some were not set up well for you. I had the same spraying experience with the TM head when i hit it for fun a few weeks ago, i couldn't get it to go anywhere near the fairway. 

If you're happy with the overall result and the time/$$ expense doesn't affect you, try to let it go. Sounds like you know who to avoid for future fittings. 

I've always been a golfing on a budget person, and there are pros and cons on pre-narrowing your selection on heads and shafts in your price range. It'd be awesome to go to a truly agnostic fitter with everything you could imagine, but there is the time and $$$ expense. sounds likes you found a really good combo. 

What's in my  :cleveland-small: bag:

Driver :  :cobra-small: F9 10.5, Fujikura Speeder 757 TR 

Fairway  :cobra-small: F9 15.5° Aldila Rogue White 80X

Hybrid:  :cobra-small: King F7 18° KBS Tour PROTO Hybrid 95 S+

Irons:   :srixon-small: z585 4i - 6i,  z785 7i-PW, Nippon Modus 120X

Wedges:  :cleveland-small: CBX  50.11, 55.11, 60.10  TT DG S400 Black

Putter:  post-53756-150768041262.jpg Honey Badger 34" 

Ball:  :srixon-small: Q-Star Tour

 

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A fear of fitting for me is getting the wrong guy and not being satisfied with the end result.

DRIVER: Cobra F9 10.5  Tensei AV Blue 65g

3W- Callway XR PRO 16 stiff

5W- Alpha- Mitsubishi Diamana  Redboard w/band

Irons- Mizuno JPX 919 Tours with S KBS Tour shafts

Hyrbid- TM 4h mid-rescue

Vokey- Vokey SM5 51 degrees,  SM7 Wedges 54 and 58 1/2 half 3 degrees upright

Putter- Taylor Made Rossa Monza Mini Spider

Ball-ProV1 and AVX

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Great story about your fitting experience. Even though it was frustrating with the first two it sounds like you ended up getting what you needed. And for us lefty's it is frustrating when the retailers either aren't set up for us or don't have the entire range of available options.

 

So now that the Rogue's in your bag do you like it?

 

 

Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

Left Hand orientation

:taylormade-small:SIM 2 D Max with Fujikura Air Speeder Shaft 

Cobra  Radspeed 3W/RIptide Shaft
:ping-small:  410  Hybrids 22*, 26*

Cobra Speed Zone 6-GP/Recoil ESX 460 F3 Shafts 

:titelist-small: SM7 54* Wedge

:ping-small: Glide 3.0  60* Wedge

:odyssey-small: O Works putter

:ShotScope: V3
:918457628_PrecisionPro:NX9-HD

:CaddyTek: - 4 Wheel 

EZGO TXT 48v cart
:footjoy-small: - too many shoes to list and so many to buy

:1590477705_SunMountain: And  BAG Boy

Golf Balls: Vice Pro Plus 

2020 Official Teste:SuperSpeed: Beginning Driver Speed  - 78

2019 Official Tester :ping-small:  410 Driver

2018 Official Tester :wilson-small: C300

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I don't think you did it wrong. My personal preference is to not get fit by my coach but I get the reasoning behind that concept.

 

Everyone is good enough to get fit and I think txg did a great job in their video on that.

 

Attempt #2 is something you could come across at any fitting location so I would be a little ticked but would ring it up to a learning experience.

 

The stock shafts from all brands are designed to fit the majority of golfers and most don't need to go after market with shafts so imo you didn't leave anything on the table.

 

One thing I would do is focus your lessons on learning to hit up with driver. Most amateurs will gain significant distance and improve dispersion by hitting up on driver.

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Great write up and thanks for sharing your experiences.

 

I found a few important take always.

 

1. Your swing is your swing. It was the same all three fittings. Even though it's not where you would like it to be you have a clear pattern.

 

2. Change swing coaches. He should have at least been honest with you and said - all the OEMs are good but I work with Calloway and can find a good fit for you there.

 

3. The negative AoA isn't as bad as you think it is. The average touring pro has a negative AoA with driver. It's your swing - don't ruin it by chasing a positive AoA on driver - just maximize what you have.

 

4. Frustrating as it was you ended up with a driver that fits.

 

Hit it well!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Taylor Made Stealth 2 10.5 Diamana S plus 60  Aldila  R flex   - 42.25 inches 

SMT 4 wood bassara R flex, four wood head, 3 wood shaft

Ping G410 7, 9 wood  Alta 65 R flex

Srixon ZX5 MK II  5-GW - UST recoil Dart 65 R flex

India 52,56 (60 pending)  UST recoil 75's R flex  

Evon roll ER 5 32 inches

It's our offseason so auditioning candidates - looking for that right mix of low spin long, more spin around the greens - TBD   

 

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Great write up, very detailed and interesting. First off-you are never too good or too bad to get fit, but as you get better, there may be other combos that work better for you.

 

I think you got to he right conclusion but I would've looked at other people too after your swing coach, but unfortunately you were forced again to look at another guy bc the 2nd dude was lame.

Lastly, your budget and needs are yours. If you need a stock shaft price, that's what you need and a good fitter should be able to work within that. It sounds like you got a good option.

 

Ps. We've all had bad fittings lol it's nothing new. My last fitting the guy bent my irons all differently. I had to get them fixed and they were bent from everything from down 1 to up 4 and I should've been up 1 lol

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

<p>Knoxville, TN 8 Hdcp PXG 0811  10.59deg loft Ping G25 3 wood Titleist 2i rescue Ping I irons +1 upright Vokey Sm5 52, 56, OdysseyRed 2Ball Fang with 1.0 super stroke</p>

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First: interesting write up of the whole experience. Glad to have read it.

 

In some ways, despite the evident frustration of the experience, you did come away with this advantage: two different fitters giving you more or less the same advice. I've not been fitted before (so take anything I say with that grain of salt), but I always suspected that with a fitting, you might wonder that if you went on a different day or talked to a different fitter, you'd end up with a significantly different result. In your case, you have good reason to think that, at the very least, you've been recommended a club that's a good fit for you now.

 

 

thanks for sharing! that is really frustrating overall, but, as mpatrickriley noted above, at least you did get similar results from 2 different fitters. 

Sucks that you had to pay to go through 3 different fittings and that some were not set up well for you. I had the same spraying experience with the TM head when i hit it for fun a few weeks ago, i couldn't get it to go anywhere near the fairway. 

If you're happy with the overall result and the time/$$ expense doesn't affect you, try to let it go. Sounds like you know who to avoid for future fittings. 

I've always been a golfing on a budget person, and there are pros and cons on pre-narrowing your selection on heads and shafts in your price range. It'd be awesome to go to a truly agnostic fitter with everything you could imagine, but there is the time and $$$ expense. sounds likes you found a really good combo. 

 

Agreed. The fact that I landed in effectively the same place with two different folks has me feeling good. 

 

Time will tell if I'm pleased once the club comes in! 

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Great story about your fitting experience. Even though it was frustrating with the first two it sounds like you ended up getting what you needed. And for us lefty's it is frustrating when the retailers either aren't set up for us or don't have the entire range of available options.

 

So now that the Rogue's in your bag do you like it?

 

 

Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

 

Not yet! Ordered last weekend and was quoted 7-10 business days. Hoping it comes in later this week in time to go in the bag for the weekend! 

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Great write up and thanks for sharing your experiences.

 

I found a few important take always.

 

1. Your swing is your swing. It was the same all three fittings. Even though it's not where you would like it to be you have a clear pattern.

 

2. Change swing coaches. He should have at least been honest with you and said - all the OEMs are good but I work with Calloway and can find a good fit for you there.

 

3. The negative AoA isn't as bad as you think it is. The average touring pro has a negative AoA with driver. It's your swing - don't ruin it by chasing a positive AoA on driver - just maximize what you have.

 

4. Frustrating as it was you ended up with a driver that fits.

 

Hit it well!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

 

Thanks for digesting the post and putting your conclusions together. 

 

1: Agreed on my swing. It's not perfect, but my misses are consistent. (Coming over the top on the downswing, generating an out-in swing path & getting a touch steep). Was glad that ultimately my swing coach and retail fitter landed in the same spot. 

 

2: This is where I'm torn. I've done a dozen or so lessons with him over the past 6 months or so, and really done a good job getting me to transition my swing. Even during my fitting session with him, he was intelligent and looking for all the right things. But as you said, the way Callaway was pitched to me was a little off. Out of convenience (10 minutes from my home) and overall experience thus far, I'm planning to stay with him, but unlikely to try and get fit with him again.

 

3: Yeah. I'm torn on AoA. Lots of videos and general thoughts on a good way to increase distance is simply getting to a positive AoA. Generally I get steep with my swing regardless, so I think as I better manage my swing path it'll shallow out a touch naturally. I doubt I'm suddenly going to end up swinging +2, but if I could move that AoA closer to 0 to -2 instead of -2 to -4, that may be helpful beyond Driver.

 

4: Agreed! Thanks.

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I don't think you did it wrong. My personal preference is to not get fit by my coach but I get the reasoning behind that concept.

 

Everyone is good enough to get fit and I think txg did a great job in their video on that.

 

Attempt #2 is something you could come across at any fitting location so I would be a little ticked but would ring it up to a learning experience.

 

The stock shafts from all brands are designed to fit the majority of golfers and most don't need to go after market with shafts so imo you didn't leave anything on the table.

 

One thing I would do is focus your lessons on learning to hit up with driver. Most amateurs will gain significant distance and improve dispersion by hitting up on driver.

 

Curious your thought on why you prefer to not get fit by your coach? Love the TXG videos. Was half thinking about trying to get fit by them up in Toronto on a work trip.

 

Re: #2, definitely a learning experience. Primarily frustrating because I took a half day at work and drove up to the other side of DC into MD to get fit, only to pay $150 for the privilege to be told to go get a better swing!

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Thank you so much for this detailed review! I've only been through one set of lessons and a “fitting” for my irons. (I say “fitting” because everything was about swinging the stock options and not changing shafts, or bending any of the equipment, etc.)

 

I have never been through a full fitting because I am apprehensive that the only goal of the person doing the fitting is to have me buy the most expensive equipment. I also am a lefty and a budget conscious golfer and want to make sure my investment is going to be worthwhile. I like your strategy of three different fittings so as to compare the results like getting different quotes on a project for the house.

 

Based off of the information you have shared, it sounds like the frustration may have been worth it as your swing was proven to be consistent across three different days and times as well as having basically the same thing recommended two out of the three times. Using the information you have shared, I think that when I'm ready to spend the time and money, I would copy your approach of getting three separate fittings and be able to compare the data.

 

Thank you again for sharing, and I hope to hear soon about how your experience is with the new driver in play.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

In my :cobra-small: Ultralight Stand Bag:

Driver:    :callaway-small: Rogue 10.5° - LH -  Project X EvenFlow 60 Stiff
Woods:   :cobra-small: King F9 - LH - 3/4 Wood - Atmos Blue TS 7 Stiff
               :cobra-small: King F9 - LH - 5/6 Wood - Atmos Blue TS 7 Stiff
Irons:      :cobra-small: King F9 - LH - 5-GW - KBS C-Taper Lite Stiff
Wedges: :cobra-small: King Black - LH - 52° 56° 60° - KBS Hi-Rev 2.0 Stiff
Putter:     :1332069271_TommyArmour: - Impact No. 3
Ball:        Maxfli TourX

Rangefinder: :skycaddie: LX5 Watch

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Thank you so much for this detailed review! I've only been through one set of lessons and a “fitting” for my irons. (I say “fitting” because everything was about swinging the stock options and not changing shafts, or bending any of the equipment, etc.)

 

I have never been through a full fitting because I am apprehensive that the only goal of the person doing the fitting is to have me buy the most expensive equipment. I also am a lefty and a budget conscious golfer and want to make sure my investment is going to be worthwhile. I like your strategy of three different fittings so as to compare the results like getting different quotes on a project for the house.

 

Based off of the information you have shared, it sounds like the frustration may have been worth it as your swing was proven to be consistent across three different days and times as well as having basically the same thing recommended two out of the three times. Using the information you have shared, I think that when I'm ready to spend the time and money, I would copy your approach of getting three separate fittings and be able to compare the data.

 

Thank you again for sharing, and I hope to hear soon about how your experience is with the new driver in play.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

 

Regardless of the frustrations in getting fit, I highly encourage getting fit. I will say though, it was not my "Strategy" to get fit 3x (and pay three times!). I'd recommend doing some research on good, reputable fitters in your areas (check out forums here, reviews online, etc). Pick one you'd like to reach out to and send them a note/phone call to discuss before you go and pay. If you don't get a good vibe, move on. 

 

I'd only recommend going to another fitter and paying again if you don't feel comfortable with where you landed after the first session.

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Curious your thought on why you prefer to not get fit by your coach? Love the TXG videos. Was half thinking about trying to get fit by them up in Toronto on a work trip.

 

Re: #2, definitely a learning experience. Primarily frustrating because I took a half day at work and drove up to the other side of DC into MD to get fit, only to pay $150 for the privilege to be told to go get a better swing!

As for not getting fit by my coach or a coach, most don't have the in depth knowledge of shaft properties and/or heads especially in driver. Also like your coach they are usually on staff with a certain brand and may or may not have access to other brands gear and tend to push towards the brand they are on staff with.

 

Where in MD did you get fit?

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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As for not getting fit by my coach or a coach, most don't have the in depth knowledge of shaft properties and/or heads especially in driver. Also like your coach they are usually on staff with a certain brand and may or may not have access to other brands gear and tend to push towards the brand they are on staff with.

 

Where in MD did you get fit?

 

Very fair points re: fitting by a coach.

 

My experience at attempt #2 was Club Champion up in Rockville with Jim. 

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Regardless of the frustrations in getting fit, I highly encourage getting fit. I will say though, it was not my "Strategy" to get fit 3x (and pay three times!). I'd recommend doing some research on good, reputable fitters in your areas (check out forums here, reviews online, etc). Pick one you'd like to reach out to and send them a note/phone call to discuss before you go and pay. If you don't get a good vibe, move on.

 

I'd only recommend going to another fitter and paying again if you don't feel comfortable with where you landed after the first session.

Makes complete sense. My mistake in not thoroughly understanding that you were “forced” into three fittings due to lack of positive experiences. Thank you for the advice on how to go about it based on your experience.

 

 

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In my :cobra-small: Ultralight Stand Bag:

Driver:    :callaway-small: Rogue 10.5° - LH -  Project X EvenFlow 60 Stiff
Woods:   :cobra-small: King F9 - LH - 3/4 Wood - Atmos Blue TS 7 Stiff
               :cobra-small: King F9 - LH - 5/6 Wood - Atmos Blue TS 7 Stiff
Irons:      :cobra-small: King F9 - LH - 5-GW - KBS C-Taper Lite Stiff
Wedges: :cobra-small: King Black - LH - 52° 56° 60° - KBS Hi-Rev 2.0 Stiff
Putter:     :1332069271_TommyArmour: - Impact No. 3
Ball:        Maxfli TourX

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Very fair points re: fitting by a coach.

 

My experience at attempt #2 was Club Champion up in Rockville with Jim.

Not familiar with Jim. My recommendations for next time you want to get fit in the DC area is 1) find one of the demo days. The reps in this area are pretty good and they are free. 2) gonyo either goldom in Tyson's or if you come into MD go to nighthawk

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Not familiar with Jim. My recommendations for next time you want to get fit in the DC area is 1) find one of the demo days. The reps in this area are pretty good and they are free. 2) gonyo either goldom in Tyson's or if you come into MD go to nighthawk

Based on the variety of clubs and shafts he hit the third time, I bet Golfdom was the 3rd place. It actually would have been a good place to start.

 

They have full fitting carts from just about everyone and the staff there is pretty knowledgeable.

 

 

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Thanks for posting your experience SEL, very informative.

In the bag:
Driver: :titelist-small: TSR2 Project X HZRDUS Black 5.5
Fairway: :callaway-small: Apex UW 19° & 21° Project X HZRDUS Smoke RDX Black 5.5

Irons: :mizuno-small: JPX 923 HMP 5-PW UST Mamiya Recoil 95 F4
Wedges: :mizuno-small: T-22 Denim Copper 48°, 52° & 56° UST Mamiya Recoil 95 F4
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Based on the variety of clubs and shafts he hit the third time, I bet Golfdom was the 3rd place. It actually would have been a good place to start.

 

They have full fitting carts from just about everyone and the staff there is pretty knowledgeable.

 

 

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Could be. At first I was thinking maybe woody's

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Based on the variety of clubs and shafts he hit the third time, I bet Golfdom was the 3rd place. It actually would have been a good place to start.

 

They have full fitting carts from just about everyone and the staff there is pretty knowledgeable.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

 

 

Could be. At first I was thinking maybe woody's

 

 

Bingo. It was Golfdom working with Jim. I had originally tried to avoid them due to the general stigma around "big box" stores, but found the experience really solid. Highly recommend them.

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While I understand your frustration, your post leaves me thinking, hmmmmmm....

 

Because while I find some of the online pros like Crossfield entertaining, and more entertaining than actually informative, I also think they have their merits.

But I also tend to disagree with the/their premise that your fitter should be your coach/teacher.

Most coaches only become good at their jobs after years of experience, and most fitters only become good at their job after years of classes and seminars, and experience - and I've known of few coaches that have actually ever attended a single clubfitting/making class.

And the reason being is that most if not all pros are signed by/attached to a brand, and while they (might) show/offer you other brands to try, it's my opinion that they're going to guide you (even subconsciously) back to the brand they represent if for no other reason that it's what they're more familiar with.

They're different trades. ... Let coaches do their job, and let fitters do theirs.

And realistically, while I understand it can be frustrating, unless it's a fitter that you've worked with before, I'm of the belief that people should attend multiple fittings (with more than one fitter, like you did), before settling on what fits them best (like you did) - because oftentimes it's not a cut and dry, one session experience. ... And really shouldn't be.

 

But anyways, I also am concerned for a couple of other reasons:

1) It appears your results are based totally on trackman/simulator numbers, and from the sound of it no live (outside) hitting. While imho it's great to use sim numbers to support what you're seeing from a range session, I don't think relying on them alone is enough to justify a purchase - and too often I hear (here and other places) of people making a purchase based on trackman/sim numbers that "look" great, only to get the club on the course and it being a dud.

2) Your statement, "He didn't seem to care so much that all I wanted was to not play a 12* driver and reduce my slice miss."

Sometimes it's tough to accept, but if you go into a fitting (or teaching session) with preconceived notions and your mind set - you're not always going to get what you want to hear.

As the one fitter that you disagreed with suggested, without fixing your swing first it's not really a good idea to buy a new driver - and I tend to agree. Why? Because investing in a driver now, and fitting it to your swing that's producing a huge slice, is like putting a bandaid on a broken arm. ... Sure, we've all got swing faults to some extent or another that we live with, but if you're taking lessons to improve your swing, then it seems to me that your new driver is going to be less and less applicable for your new swing the more your improve. A driver alone is not going to fix a slice.

3) No offense, but if you're slicing a high-lofted driver, regardless what shaft's in it - just based on the universally-accepted premise that higher lofted clubs are easier to hit than lower lofted clubs (aka a 3 wood is easier to hit straight than a driver) - I'm wondering why you were so dead set on not playing a 12* driver, other than vanity? ... Because a lower lofted driver is going to accentuate your miss (slice) more over the long term than a higher lofted one.

4) While it seems a draw-biased driver was what was recommended for you, and might be the best thing based on your current swing - I also think they're a bit of a bandaid (see post 2 above) as well - in much the same manner that offset drivers were all the rage with slicers back in the 1990s and early 2000s, draw-biased drivers are in recent years. Because if you have a swing fault that allows you to slice the ball, it's a matter of time until your swing fault allows you to slice the new driver.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of the technology, in fact I play a draw-biased driver myself. But I'm a cutter, I hit a natural fade, and a draw-biased club just allows me to hit is straighter (I'm not trying to correct a slice). ... And that's why I like drivers with moveable weights for people that slicer or hook the ball that are taking lessons and working on their swings, as it allows them to make the temporary fix, while allowing them to tune it out as their swing improves.

.

 

Anyways, those are my thoughts - and I'm not saying I'm right or wrong - just throwing it out there. ... And end of the day I hope it all works out for you and your new sticks work out for you.

Best of luck, and good golfing to ya! :)

 

 

 

 

Yeah. Someone else also called out the coach being tied to a brand, which is exactly what I experienced. Lesson learned. 

 

Re: #1 Trackman vs. hitting outside: the first fitting with my swing coach was at the range hitting outdoors with the addition of Trackman. Kind of the best of both worlds, but a lack of clubs to swing. While I'd love to be able to get a proper hit-everything fitting outdoors, there just isn't that option within a close distance to me. If I lived in FL or CA where I suspect these are prevalent, certainly would have found one and made that work. I quick google search of nearby outdoor fitters found one ~25 miles from my place.

 

#2: I think my preconceived notion that my R15 12* driver wasn't doing anything for me was validated when all three fitters laughed when they grabbed it. As I mentioned, I had it cranked down 1.5* and didn't realize that the more you crank it down the more it also opens the club face. Given my neutral (good swing)/out to in (bad swing) swing path, any additional opening of the face only exasperated my miss. I'm not sure I agree that my preconceived notion hindered the fitters ability to recommend something that would work better.

 

#3: Yeah, again, I prefaced that I don't expect this to solve my game. But I got to the point where I simply couldn't "feel" the club and what my swing was doing.Through the first fitting with my coach, we realized pretty quickly that with a heavier shaft, I could actually feel my swing and diagnose a bad swing, rather than feeling like I'm swinging air. 

 

Frankly I may have been able to get similar results simply by picking up a 75G shaft and putting it into the R15, fair enough. The shaft didn't fix my swing, but it helped me feel where my swing came undone, and then avoid that motion.

 

As for why not play a 12* driver standard, my spin rates and launch angles were just too high. This is primarily a result of hitting down on the ball through driver (as all fitters called out, a bit too much so for driver at -2 on good swings, -4 on bad), but even on the good swings with a -2 AoA spin rates were up near 4000-4500 RPM. On misses, it'd balloon up over 5000 RPM spin and just shed distance and slice away off the left. 

 

With the lower lofts we had better control of spin. Still not great, closer to 3000 RPM instead of the desired 2000-2500. But the misses were staying more on line and the slice much less pronounced (read: likely in play instead of OB). 

 

4: Definitely hear you! And maybe that's why fitter #2 tried to recommend an M3 so we could toss the weights around. I should mention that the slice is my miss, I'm liable for 2-3 of them per round with the driver, where all other drivers land either in the left side of the fairway or just in the rough. A slice is my miss, not my usual hit. I'm still going to work with my swing coach to flatten the swing and bring it more neutral. If the net result of that is I'm now drawing the ball with this club instead of fading/slicing, that'll be a first! 

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If I understand the OP correctly , he spent $385 to "get fit" for a driver. I think the driver he bought is about $500, for which he received $50 off the previous fitting, so his total cash outlay for this fitting experience and driver is $835.

 

At the end of his post the OP asked "did I do the whole thing wrong"?

My answer to that question is that if the OP wanted to pay for fittings, learn about them, get the experience of having them, and can financially afford $385 worth of fitting service costs, then he did nothing wrong.

 

The OP also asked "am I good enough to get fit"?

I understand that it is common and popular on every internet forum for the majority to write posts recommending a person "get fit" before buying any new clubs. Certainly the equipment brands and retail stores give the same message.

But I think if the OP asked a Tour pro if it is worth it to spend $835 on fitting services and a new driver, the Tour pro would likely say "for that $835 you could get 8-10 lessons from a competent PGA teaching pro. And if you combine the lessons with plenty of practice doing what the instructor taught you, your handicap can drop from 20 to less than 10"

 

Yeah. This is fair, and absolutely not hindering me from continuing lessons. Frankly that first $85 session with my swing coach I almost am willing to consider a pseudo lesson. 

 

So I'm $150 in on the poor experience at Club Champion, and another $100 in at Golfdom ($150 less the $50 back for buying clubs). The Golfdom fit is technically for a full bag, so I have to go back at another time to get fit for fairways, hybrids, irons etc. 

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Yeah. This is fair, and absolutely not hindering me from continuing lessons. Frankly that first $85 session with my swing coach I almost am willing to consider a pseudo lesson. 

 

So I'm $150 in on the poor experience at Club Champion, and another $100 in at Golfdom ($150 less the $50 back for buying clubs). The Golfdom fit is technically for a full bag, so I have to go back at another time to get fit for fairways, hybrids, irons etc. 

Its both interesting and a shame to read of your experiences at Club Champion.  I had been fit there twice previously (both under their original main fitter who is sadly no longer there)  It was a great experience both times.  But you experience is now the 2nd or 3rd similar experience I have heard there.   I know forum member CNosil was there earlier this year and for the most part had a good experience if I recall.

 

I also stopped in GolfDom back during the winter wanting to demo the XXIO Prime Driver.  While I didn't schedule or pay for a fitting, the sales person spent a lot of time with me, putting me on the LM, trying different shafts with it and even a swing tip or two.    I was very appreciative of the time they spent. 

 

Also I will echo what RevKev said earlier about not chasing the angle of attack numbers.  Sure a positive number will yield a bit more distance with everything else being equal.  But a number of -2 isn't going to kill you.    I sat through several demo days with reps this spring, watching them fit people and with all but one exception they told people, that sure if it was lower it would help, but there were so many other factors that were more important in dialing them in than just AOA.     

 

Because let's not forget, a fitter's number one job is to fit a club to your CURRENT swing.  Not try to change you swing to optimize numbers.  That can come later through lessons and what not, if you desire.  But focusing too much on trying improve your AOA during a fitting, shouldn't be the prime objective. 

:ping-small: G430 Max 10K 

:titelist-small: TSiR1 15.0 Aldlia Ascent 60g

:titelist-small: TSR2 18.0 PX Aldila Ascent 6og

:titelist-small: TSi1 20 Aldila Ascent Shafts R

:titelist-small: T350 5-GW SteelFiber I80 

:titelist-small: SM10 48F/54M and58K

:ping-small: S159 48S/52S/56W/60B

:scotty-cameron-1: Select 5.5 Flowback 35" 

:titelist-small: ProV1  Play number 12

 

 

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As far as I'm concerned - yeah you did it right. To elaborate on that answer, let me break it down into the key areas which would be of benefit to any level of golfer.

 

1. You actually got off your butt and went to get fit! It still amazes me how many folks these days still do not even get to this first basic step, but you did - and this is great.

 

2. You didn't take one piece of advice - you sort out multiple opinions. OK, this may not have been intentional on your part, but at least you got more than one perspective on what you should (or could) be looking at in terms of equipment and cost.

 

3. You trusted your own feel. Nobody else, not even the worlds top swing gurus can tell you how something feels - only you can. This is key in finding something that is comfortable to swing and helps in the fitting process.

 

4. It's all a learning process. Sure, lessons are good and I recommend them as the best investment you will ever make to yourself, but when it comes down to fitting equipment a certain amount of reality check needs to be applied. A premium fitter is just that - they're probably not interested in connecting anyone with an option that wastes their time and money. Therefore they tend to list options that are appropriate rather that options you think you might like. Retail fitters are just that too - they tend to want to sell stock  so their options normally follow this trend too. 

 

5. Never give up. Sooner or later something will click in your game that will make the best sense in terms of what you are trying to achieve and what you can realistically deliver. The point is, the harder you try and the harder you practice, the easier this becomes and the rest will follow. I always say that the level of fitting you deserve is directly related to the level of effort that you're prepared to make. On the face of what you said, then I'd say you made a pretty decent effort - which scores highly in my eyes (see point 1).

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I was going to hit on the area where you said you only wanted a driver without 12* of loft. But RP already responded to that twice in his reply. I suppose I'm a decent player. 5 hcp. And guess what? I play a 14* SLDR dialed back to a 12*. The exact thing you don't want. I know a lot of guys that could probably hit my driver over a skyscraper. But not me.... I actually hit a mid-to high draw with it and love it. It's been my longest and most accurate driver ever. I have never had anyone examine my driver and snicker at the loft. And besides... who cares if they do? Golf is a results game. And my 12* driver puts me long in the mow.

 

Fitting is a strange animal. Now days every Joe that has a backyard shop and can glue in a shaft is a fitter. Hardly. Golf Pros think they are fitters too. Laughable. Some Pros cant even provide good instruction. Most resorts and high-end clubs have now gotten into fitting. These are for suckers mostly. Personally I prefer the types that have been fitting and building clubs for 20-30 years. Made a career of it. Look for these guys. Many of these Professional Club fitters-builders might not even deal with brands you're familiar with and that's good too. Just because a club isn't called Callaway or Ping or Titleist doesn't mean they are no good. There's a whole other world out there to be discovered if you're interested. 

My Sun Mountain bag currently includes:   TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 771CSI 5i - PW and TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png PFC Micro Tour-c 52°, 56°, 60 wedges

                                                                               :755178188_TourEdge: EXS 10.5*, TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 929-HS FW4 16.5* 

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Its both interesting and a shame to read of your experiences at Club Champion.  I had been fit there twice previously (both under their original main fitter who is sadly no longer there)  It was a great experience both times.  But you experience is now the 2nd or 3rd similar experience I have heard there.   I know forum member CNosil was there earlier this year and for the most part had a good experience if I recall.

 

I also stopped in GolfDom back during the winter wanting to demo the XXIO Prime Driver.  While I didn't schedule or pay for a fitting, the sales person spent a lot of time with me, putting me on the LM, trying different shafts with it and even a swing tip or two.    I was very appreciative of the time they spent. 

 

Also I will echo what RevKev said earlier about not chasing the angle of attack numbers.  Sure a positive number will yield a bit more distance with everything else being equal.  But a number of -2 isn't going to kill you.    I sat through several demo days with reps this spring, watching them fit people and with all but one exception they told people, that sure if it was lower it would help, but there were so many other factors that were more important in dialing them in than just AOA.     

 

Because let's not forget, a fitter's number one job is to fit a club to your CURRENT swing.  Not try to change you swing to optimize numbers.  That can come later through lessons and what not, if you desire.  But focusing too much on trying improve your AOA during a fitting, shouldn't be the prime objective. 

 

Thanks Golfspy Rob! Definitely a bummer about Club Champion and agreed. Fitting should be about your swing today. Unfortunately CC's experience turned into "here's why we can't optimally fit you". Golfdom definitely doesn't fit in the typical "retailer" category. Super informative, no pressure of putting me in a particular brand, and took the time to find what worked AND offered for me to come back another time to complete the rest of my fitting I paid for.

 

 

As far as I'm concerned - yeah you did it right. To elaborate on that answer, let me break it down into the key areas which would be of benefit to any level of golfer.

 

1. You actually got off your butt and went to get fit! It still amazes me how many folks these days still do not even get to this first basic step, but you did - and this is great.

 

2. You didn't take one piece of advice - you sort out multiple opinions. OK, this may not have been intentional on your part, but at least you got more than one perspective on what you should (or could) be looking at in terms of equipment and cost.

 

3. You trusted your own feel. Nobody else, not even the worlds top swing gurus can tell you how something feels - only you can. This is key in finding something that is comfortable to swing and helps in the fitting process.

 

4. It's all a learning process. Sure, lessons are good and I recommend them as the best investment you will ever make to yourself, but when it comes down to fitting equipment a certain amount of reality check needs to be applied. A premium fitter is just that - they're probably not interested in connecting anyone with an option that wastes their time and money. Therefore they tend to list options that are appropriate rather that options you think you might like. Retail fitters are just that too - they tend to want to sell stock  so their options normally follow this trend too. 

 

5. Never give up. Sooner or later something will click in your game that will make the best sense in terms of what you are trying to achieve and what you can realistically deliver. The point is, the harder you try and the harder you practice, the easier this becomes and the rest will follow. I always say that the level of fitting you deserve is directly related to the level of effort that you're prepared to make. On the face of what you said, then I'd say you made a pretty decent effort - which scores highly in my eyes (see point 1).

 

Thanks for the encouraging words jaskanski! Lots of lessons learned through this process. I'm excited to continue working to a better golf game. 

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As rob mentioned I did go to CC and had Jim as my fitter. No, he wasn't the most engaging fitter but I got what I was seeking from the experience. I think I am fairly knowledgeable about equipment so I could perhaps explain what I was feeling and what I wanted. We had some discussions but they were not like talking to your best friend about equipment.

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
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