Do you manipulate the club with your hands ?

[Gg Owen]

First, I’m a huge believer in focusing more on the body than what my hands are doing.It appears that the new En Vogue teaching is manipulating the club head with the hands.Manufacturing a backswing - transition - impact or even a release.In my trials manufacturing a position has been a complete disaster.The result was loss of club head speed and accuracy.Personally, I play my best letting the club head free swing.But I do maniupulate my body movement while free swinging the club head .And this has yielded me some excellent results.Who here manipulates the club head with your hands.What positives or negatives has it given you so far 

[perseveringgolfer]

I've always been a 'handsy' player- still pictures show little body movement and that's what I've worked on but it's difficult.

Maybe thats just in my swing makeup having spent decades playing racket sports.

If it ain't broke don't fix it, is my new mantra as I played better as a handsy player than a body first player.

Man, this game gets under your skin and plays havoc with your psyche sometimes 

[cnosil]

I try to focus on the hands to not manipulate the club. I have a tendency to engage my right hand and hit the ball fat or over rotate. Maybe I am wrong in my approach, but I have been practicing hand position at impact. So while not defining it as being handsy I think I you need to know how to engage the hands. The goal is to get to the point of making it automatic.

[Big money]

Back in the day. Controlling or manipulating impact on my iron shots was golden. Could never do it with the driver though 

I do agree with the OP.This manipulation craze is a little over the top in teaching now a days.The instructors and clients are way too concerned about looking good versus actually performing for a score.Good luck playing any resemblance of a decent score doing that in the swing.Whenever you manipulate it’s a compensation for something bad that causes one to do this.A proper golf swing will get the ball from A to C in the lowest number of shots.A proper and pretty manipulated swing aren’t the same thing.I would run not walk away from an instructor that told me do this or that with my hands the entire swing.

[GB13]

My tendency is too get a little handsy with the right hand. I either hits pulls or pull hooks. My main focus has been taking the right hand out of my swing more and using the left hand and body rotation to get the club more in the slot. 

[cnosil]

My tendency is too get a little handsy with the right hand. I either hits pulls or pull hooks. My main focus has been taking the right hand out of my swing more and using the left hand and body rotation to get the club more in the slot. 

Me too! My problem isn’t getting into the slot, it is the flip to catch up because I get stuck.

[Kenny B]

I have never been a handsy player.  In fact, I have been working hard this year to get a better release but not flipping the hands.  Keeping the right side out of the downswings much as possible has helped because with the right hand on the club, my tendency is to hold off the followthrough.  Once I get the feeling of the release with the left hand, then I will add the right side back in, hopefully at the correct time, to add more power.

[GregB135]

My coach is constantly reminding me I use a little too much of my hands and arms in the swing. 

[PMookie]

I've always been a 'handsy' player- still pictures show little body movement and that's what I've worked on but it's difficult. Maybe thats just in my swing makeup having spent decades playing racket sports.

If it ain't broke don't fix it, is my new mantra as I played better as a handsy player than a body first player.

Man, this game gets under your skin and plays havoc with your psyche sometimes 

 

Same here. 14 years of year-round tennis still plays a role in my swing, and all the years of baseball have made it very difficult for me to not let the arms fly away from the body in the downswing. My hands and arms are way too overactive for golf.

 

 

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[Big money]

I’m in the camp where less you do In the swing is better.More of a basic fundamentals (posture/grip/alignment) fixes.Ive been with both type of teachers.The basic ball flight only guys and the ones who want you manipulating the entire swing.Going too keep this short and sweet.For anyone that has played the golf avidly for over 10 years or so.How can we expect changing what is already ingrained?Personally we aren’t tour pros who can practice 8 plus hours a day.So for me and many others.Just going with a teacher that focuses on basic fundamentals and ball flight only makes this game easier and more enjoyable.But do what works for you 

[THEZIPR23]

I don't think the en vogue thing is to be handsy, from what I have been able to decipher is it is wrist positions and controlling the club face with your wrists and then moving the body to accomplish that. I have always been a strong dominant hand player. If you look at my swing on video the shaft is almost parallel directly after contact. It leads to my inconsistency. I have been working hard to try to get rid of it but it is so ingrained it is very difficult. But when the timing is right it is very good. I heard someone say recently, I think it was Faldo but not positive, when he was playing the goal was to have the ball on the club face as long as possible and now with the changes in technology the tour guys are trying to have the ball on the club face as short as possible. A complete 180 in regards to execution that has come about with the change in technology. 

[ridgewalker]

I find I chip much better when I use the fine motor control in my hands to get the right contact/loft/distance.

If the numbers are right 80% of Tour players use a drive hold release meaning that the right wrist is staying bent through impact, the left wrist remains neutral or bowed, and the club head doesn’t pass the left arm until the follow through. Trevino, Hogan, DJ, Koepka, and Spieth are all examples.

I’ve worked on trying to do that this year and it’s very difficult. It’s a major shift mentally in how I think of hitting the ball. But hopefully I’ll keep getting better at it and my ball striking will improve.


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[perseveringgolfer]

chipping eureka moment for me was not letting the clubhead overtake the handle. TPI level 2 coach told me this alongside the thought of always having the leading edge moving to your target line until well after the strike, both swing thoughts mean I can be as wristy as I naturally feel and just keep the blade facing target and not overtaking the handle- result, happiness and confidence in chipping now from any lie

[russtopherb]

I try not to think about my hands in the swing, at all. Unless I'm working on my backswing and making sure I complete it so my wrists set. That's the extent of thinking about my hands or using them in the swing.

[Big money]

5 hours ago, ridgewalker said:

I find I chip much better when I use the fine motor control in my hands to get the right contact/loft/distance.

If the numbers are right 80% of Tour players use a drive hold release meaning that the right wrist is staying bent through impact, the left wrist remains neutral or bowed, and the club head doesn’t pass the left arm until the follow through. Trevino, Hogan, DJ, Koepka, and Spieth are all examples.

I’ve worked on trying to do that this year and it’s very difficult. It’s a major shift mentally in how I think of hitting the ball. But hopefully I’ll keep getting better at it and my ball striking will improve.


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The old Drive Hold.That is exactly what I did well with my short and mid irons.Massive shaft lean really let me hit some nice low running shots into the greens.Now my long irons and driver were a disaster doing this.Almost like the excessive forward shaft lean isn’t needed for those clubs.This move is the biggest compensation maniupulation in all golf teachings.But it sure gave me some great wedge shots thru the years 

[EthanSterlingPrice]

Big muscles for me, too much timing needed for the hands.


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[GB13]

On 10/3/2018 at 8:40 AM, GB13 said:

My tendency is too get a little handsy with the right hand. I either hits pulls or pull hooks. My main focus has been taking the right hand out of my swing more and using the left hand and body rotation to get the club more in the slot. 

I just had a Eureka moment. It is going to sound stupid to most of you but sometimes it takes me forever to figure out the simplest of things.

I have to take the back using the left hand and body. I have a bad habit of taking the club back with the right hand and then transferring to left hand to come through the ball. The problem with that is that it is in the position for the right hand to power through the ball.  I then have to reroute the club over the top to be able to able to come through with the left hand. 

 

I just need to swing BACK with the left hand so no rerouting is needed. 

[perseveringgolfer]

sounds like feel over real....whatever works- love these eureka moments, you feel you can do anything with the ball. Dont say it out loud or the golf Gods will hear you and reek revenge

[Wildthing]

Focusing on body parts means that you are consciously doing something and will short circuit your kinetic sequence. Scientific research over 2 decades have proved that  'motor learning skills'  (including learning the golf swing)  should be subconscious using 'external focus' cues based on an intended outcome. That basically means you focus on an intent outside of your body like the trajectory of the ball , or clubface cutting grass , or swinging the clubface over an intermediate target , or throwing the clubface to a target .  Instead of thinking about moving your weight to the front foot , you focus on 'pushing or getting the ground' , instead of keeping your butt on the tush line think about pushing a wall behind you . Try and avoid any conscious thought on the movement of a part of your body (which is an 'internal focus'  cue). Another example is focusing on the hands being forward for a punch shot vs picturing an image of overhanging trees where your intent is to keep the ball under and through to an 'achievable' target. Your intent must be something that your subconscious thinks is achievable from past experience or you will trigger a 'fear response'  where your actions will tighten up (like a rabbit caught in a headlight).

Your subconscious will automatically engage a much greater range of muscles to fire in the right sequence in the most efficient manner to try and meet your intended outcome  (if you let it). It has been found , that internal focus on a body part will not engage all the correct muscles and your movement will be inefficient  (ie. kinetic chain will be impaired).

Check out this podcast by Dr Gabriele Wulf as it will change your perception on the best way to learn how to swing a golf club and also how to retain those learning skills .