Jump to content

Stability putter shafts - hot or not?


Recommended Posts

Hoping to be part of the official MGS testing of this shaft.  I keep picking up these putters and trying them when I am at headquarters and I have to say the more I try the stability shaft the more I like it.  It is really hard to describe the feeling or how the shaft impacts your stroke, but it does seem to provide some benefit. 

  • Like 1

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :cleveland-small: 588 54-14, 58-12
Putter:  Bellum Winmore 787

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 160
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Have gotten a few more rounds in with the stability shaft and some comparison practice against some of my other putters. Feel: This is obviously very subjective. I don’t feel much when it comes

Alright, I got mine back today and if anything, it looks freaking amazing! I’m going to practice tomorrow and will be playing Ko’Olina Sunday so I’ll have more real world feedback soon. Also,

Putter arrived a couple of hours ago and since I am working from home I quickly opened the package and rolled some putts on the carpet. I like the looks and feel of the putter, just not sure about t

Posted Images

Hoping to be part of the official MGS testing of this shaft.  I keep picking up these putters and trying them when I am at headquarters and I have to say the more I try the stability shaft the more I like it.  It is really hard to describe the feeling or how the shaft impacts your stroke, but it does seem to provide some benefit. 
I wonder if if the benefits/performance of it is more apparent depending on the head weight of the putter
  • Like 1

In my :mizuno-small: BR-D4 Stand Bag

:ping-small: G410 LST 9* VA Nemesys 65X
:ping-small: G410 LST 14.5* Tour AD DI 7X
:titelist-small: 818 H2 20* Tour AD DI 85X
:mizuno-small: MP20 HMB 4 Tour AD 95X
:mizuno-small: JPX 919 Tour 5-PW Oban CT 115 X(-)
:titelist-small: Vokey SM7 50F - 54S - 59D
:EVNROLL: ER1v
:titelist-small: ProV1
Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, jlukes said:
5 minutes ago, cnosil said:
Hoping to be part of the official MGS testing of this shaft.  I keep picking up these putters and trying them when I am at headquarters and I have to say the more I try the stability shaft the more I like it.  It is really hard to describe the feeling or how the shaft impacts your stroke, but it does seem to provide some benefit. 

I wonder if if the benefits/performance of it is more apparent depending on the head weight of the putter

One of the things talked about in the description is that it was designed because of the heavier putter head weights.   I think the other aspect that should be considered is the players tempo.  I would think that with a slower tempo there wouldn't be as much benefit.   

  • Like 2

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :cleveland-small: 588 54-14, 58-12
Putter:  Bellum Winmore 787

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

I played with a guy yesterday that had a Stability Shaft in his SC putter head. (I think a Concept X) This same guy I've played with a few times over the past year. I can't recall or say whether he's a good putter or not. But he is a decent player generally. However, yesterday his putting sucked and I'm sure he'd admit the same. Do I accuse the putter/shaft combo or the player for his poor performance? I'd say the player. IMO it doesn't matter how much tech or fitting, etc is involved. If you can't square up the face of any club your results will be poor. I will also say there is probably something to the Stability Shaft. Barney Adams didn't dream this up as a con. Hardly. But it's not something I believe will noticeably benefit that many golfers. Putting is a strange animal and a very distinct part of the game. Apart from all other aspects of the game - driving, ironing, chipping, etc - putting is an enigma. For instance, how many very good players (0-5 hcp) have you known/played with who are really sharp/solid tee to green but once on the putting surface they struggle day after day year after year?  Or...how many weekend 6-pack players have you played with; always carding high scores but somehow putt good once they find the green? I've played with plenty of both. Putting is strange... you either have it mentally and or mechnicanically or you don't IMO. 

  • Like 1

My Sun Mountain bag currently includes:   TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 771CSI 5i - PW and TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png PFC Micro Tour-c 52°, 56°, 60 wedges

                                                                               :755178188_TourEdge: EXS 10.5*, TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 929-HS FW4 16.5* 

                                                                                :edel-golf-1: Willimette w/GolfPride Contour

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/6/2019 at 2:03 PM, PlaidJacket said:

I played with a guy yesterday that had a Stability Shaft in his SC putter head. (I think a Concept X) This same guy I've played with a few times over the past year. I can't recall or say whether he's a good putter or not. But he is a decent player generally. However, yesterday his putting sucked and I'm sure he'd admit the same. Do I accuse the putter/shaft combo or the player for his poor performance? I'd say the player. IMO it doesn't matter how much tech or fitting, etc is involved. If you can't square up the face of any club your results will be poor. I will also say there is probably something to the Stability Shaft. Barney Adams didn't dream this up as a con. Hardly. But it's not something I believe will noticeably benefit that many golfers. 

Putting is a strange animal and a very distinct part of the game.

Apart from all other aspects of the game - driving, ironing, chipping, etc - putting is an enigma. For instance, how many very good players (0-5 hcp) have you known/played with who are really sharp/solid tee to green but once on the putting surface they struggle day after day year after year?  Or...how many weekend 6-pack players have you played with; always carding high scores but somehow putt good once they find the green? I've played with plenty of both. Putting is strange... you either have it mentally and or mechnicanically or you don't IMO. 

Oh yeah, it is ... "the game within the game" some old guy once said 😉

Good comments, though - it will be interesting to see if this will garner any traction with the "weekend" crowd?

WITB of an "aspiring"  😉 play-ah ...
..Callaway Epic Speed 4W (Project X Cypher)
..Tour Edge Exotics EXS 7W (Tensei CK Blue)
..Callaway Super Hybrid 23 (PX Catalyst) and Big Bertha 19 5H (Recoil ZTR)
..PXG 0211 6i-GW (Mitsubishi MMT) 
..Cleveland CBX2 54 and CBX 60 (both Rotex graphite)
..Evnroll ER5 (33", 385g, P2 Reflex Tour)
..all in a Datrek bag on a Bag Boy Quad XL push an MGI Zip Navigator electric cart.

Forum Member tester for the ExPutt Putting Simulator

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, cksurfdude said:

Oh yeah, it is ... "the game within the game" some old guy once said 😉

Good comments, though - it will be interesting to see if this will garner any traction with the "weekend" crowd?

I doubt it. I think this is a equipment junkie thing. I just don't see your weekend joe buying a $200 shaft for his putter. He'd buy a new putter over a new shaft. Heck, weekend golfers mostly have stock regular shafts in their drivers, which they care about a lot more than putters. To them, Distance is king!

  • Like 4

Wilson Staff C300 9.0* Fujikura Pro 58 stiff

Callaway Rogue 3W Mitsubishi Diamana D+ LTD 80 stiff

Mizuno MP-18 MMC FLI-HI 2 iron UST Mamiya Recoil 95 stiff

Ping I200's 4-W Aerotech Steelfiber I110 CW stiff

Ping Glide 52* and 58* stiff

Bettinardi Studio Stock #38 Armlock

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, GB13 said:

I doubt it. I think this is a equipment junkie thing. I just don't see your weekend joe buying a $200 shaft for his putter. He'd buy a new putter over a new shaft. Heck, weekend golfers mostly have stock regular shafts in their drivers, which they care about a lot more than putters. To them, Distance is king!

 

Yeah, that's definitely going to be a big part of it. 

Even though - as we know - you only hit your driver a max of 14 times per round .. vs 36+ times for your putter .. yet many players very eagerly pony up $500+ for a new driver every year.....................................

  • Like 1

WITB of an "aspiring"  😉 play-ah ...
..Callaway Epic Speed 4W (Project X Cypher)
..Tour Edge Exotics EXS 7W (Tensei CK Blue)
..Callaway Super Hybrid 23 (PX Catalyst) and Big Bertha 19 5H (Recoil ZTR)
..PXG 0211 6i-GW (Mitsubishi MMT) 
..Cleveland CBX2 54 and CBX 60 (both Rotex graphite)
..Evnroll ER5 (33", 385g, P2 Reflex Tour)
..all in a Datrek bag on a Bag Boy Quad XL push an MGI Zip Navigator electric cart.

Forum Member tester for the ExPutt Putting Simulator

Link to post
Share on other sites

Going back and forth on this.  I'm an average putter and recently had a Club Champion fitting including getting on the SAM lab.  It was determined that my putting stroke was actually fairly good.  On the course, my main issue tends to be a misread or speed.  Most of the time, I'm getting the ball on my line that I've chosen.  

I've read some replies that this can help some with distance control, but what I find happens is that I will just lose my feel for distance after about 7-8 holes and then my confidence sort of goes with it. 

I've read some others are putting stiff iron shafts to help with stability.  Can anyone comment or even compare?  That would be a much cheaper way to go.

Driver:  image.png.3c6db1120d888f669e07d4a8f890b3f1.pngMavrik Sub Zero 9* (Set to 10) Ventus Blue 6X

2 Hybrid: :titelist-small: 818 H2 Hybrid Tensei Blue 80 X

3 Hybrid: :titelist-small: 818H2 Fujikura Atmos TS Blue 8X

4 Iron - Srixon ZX 23* Recoil F5

Irons 5-PW: :mizuno-small: MP 18 SC Dynamic Gold AMT X

Gap/Sand Wedge:  :titelist-small: Vokey SM6 49*  SM8 54* 

Lob Wedge:  image.png.3c6db1120d888f669e07d4a8f890b3f1.pngJaws 5 Wedge 58* DG Tour Issue Stiff

Putter:  image.png.cca2328f4144a299c795aa9b8f3bf677.png Inovai 6.0              :scotty-small: Pro Platinum Newport 2 35"  

Link to post
Share on other sites
Going back and forth on this.  I'm an average putter and recently had a Club Champion fitting including getting on the SAM lab.  It was determined that my putting stroke was actually fairly good.  On the course, my main issue tends to be a misread or speed.  Most of the time, I'm getting the ball on my line that I've chosen.  
I've read some replies that this can help some with distance control, but what I find happens is that I will just lose my feel for distance after about 7-8 holes and then my confidence sort of goes with it. 
I've read some others are putting stiff iron shafts to help with stability.  Can anyone comment or even compare?  That would be a much cheaper way to go.


What do you mean you lose your feel for distance? What is your current approach to distance control and how off do you get? The shaft wouldn’t fix being off by feet, the theory would be that the face angle is more consistent so you are making better contact.

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :cleveland-small: 588 54-14, 58-12
Putter:  Bellum Winmore 787

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, cnosil said:

 


What do you mean you lose your feel for distance? What is your current approach to distance control and how off do you get? The shaft wouldn’t fix being off by feet, the theory would be that the face angle is more consistent so you are making better contact.

 

Hard to explain it - i'll practice all sorts of drills for distance control and feel that I have them down pat, then out on the course I'll just lose it.  

I agree that contact and face angle do help and I had some adjustments done to my putter at club champion that I believe will help get the ball rolling more quickly.  Just psych myself out I guess.

Driver:  image.png.3c6db1120d888f669e07d4a8f890b3f1.pngMavrik Sub Zero 9* (Set to 10) Ventus Blue 6X

2 Hybrid: :titelist-small: 818 H2 Hybrid Tensei Blue 80 X

3 Hybrid: :titelist-small: 818H2 Fujikura Atmos TS Blue 8X

4 Iron - Srixon ZX 23* Recoil F5

Irons 5-PW: :mizuno-small: MP 18 SC Dynamic Gold AMT X

Gap/Sand Wedge:  :titelist-small: Vokey SM6 49*  SM8 54* 

Lob Wedge:  image.png.3c6db1120d888f669e07d4a8f890b3f1.pngJaws 5 Wedge 58* DG Tour Issue Stiff

Putter:  image.png.cca2328f4144a299c795aa9b8f3bf677.png Inovai 6.0              :scotty-small: Pro Platinum Newport 2 35"  

Link to post
Share on other sites

If you haven't noticed the price is already starting to come down.  Several sources selling for $177.  Not that big a prices reduction, but maybe be an indicator of how well initial sales are going.

Woods: Callaway Rogue Sub Zero 9*, Fujikura Ventus Blue 6S / TM M5, 15*, Diamana Thump 75S / TM M5, 19*, Diamana Thump 75S
Hybrid: TEE C721 22*, KBS TGI 80S

Irons: TM M6, 5-GW, Accra 80i S
Wedges: Cleveland CBX 2, 55*, 60*, Accra 80i S
Putter: Evnroll ER1.2, 355g, KBS Tour One Step, 33", SS Mid-Slim 2.0
Ball: Maxfli Tour
Bag/Cart: '20 Nike Air Hybrid 2 / BagBoy Quad XL
Accessories: Arccos 360 / Sky Caddie SX 400 / Nikon Coolshot Pro Stabilized

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, juspoole said:

Going back and forth on this.  I'm an average putter and recently had a Club Champion fitting including getting on the SAM lab.  It was determined that my putting stroke was actually fairly good.  On the course, my main issue tends to be a misread or speed.  Most of the time, I'm getting the ball on my line that I've chosen.  

I've read some replies that this can help some with distance control, but what I find happens is that I will just lose my feel for distance after about 7-8 holes and then my confidence sort of goes with it. 

I've read some others are putting stiff iron shafts to help with stability.  Can anyone comment or even compare?  That would be a much cheaper way to go.

I really don't think this is what your looking for. I think you just need to keep in mind that, everyone goes through hot and cold spells with putting. If this is the route you decide to go, I'd go with a graphite hybrid shaft before an iron shaft though. 

Wilson Staff C300 9.0* Fujikura Pro 58 stiff

Callaway Rogue 3W Mitsubishi Diamana D+ LTD 80 stiff

Mizuno MP-18 MMC FLI-HI 2 iron UST Mamiya Recoil 95 stiff

Ping I200's 4-W Aerotech Steelfiber I110 CW stiff

Ping Glide 52* and 58* stiff

Bettinardi Studio Stock #38 Armlock

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • SPY VIP

Just wait until you get a chance to roll the Odyssey Stroke Lab shafted putters.

The Atlanta S is so badass. I have never, ever, had the speed control like I have with this putter.

 

 

Volvo Intorqueo

 

All the cool kids follow me on twitter: @golfspy_dave

 

If you are not a cool kid, following me on twitter will make you cool...

Link to post
Share on other sites

I just don’t see a lot of promise in this, and believe me I hope I’m wrong like plenty of times before. I can miss as many putts with a hickory shafted putter as I do steel shafted one and it’s entirely the Indian over the arrow but maybe I’m that fella this new tech works for... when the price falls a tad...


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

  • Like 1

Right Handed

4.5 handicap

Driver: Nike Vapor Flex with Mitsubishi Rayon Fubuki ZT60x5ct S-flex shaft and stock grip.

3-Metal: Nike VRS 15 degree with Mitsubishi Rayon tour issue Diamana S73x5ct X-flex shaft and GolfPride MCC midsize Black/White grip.

Irons: Ben Hogan PTx 22, 26, 30, 34, 38, 42, 46 degrees standard length and lie with KBS Tour-V stiff shafts and GolfPride MCC midsize Black/White grips.

Wedges: Ben Hogan TK15 54, 58 degrees with KBS Tour-V X-flex shafts and GolfPride MCC midsize Black/White grips.

Putter: Nike Method Converge B1|01 with Superstroke Flatso 2.0 grip.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...
On 1/14/2019 at 12:02 PM, juspoole said:

Going back and forth on this.  I'm an average putter and recently had a Club Champion fitting including getting on the SAM lab.  It was determined that my putting stroke was actually fairly good.  On the course, my main issue tends to be a misread or speed.  Most of the time, I'm getting the ball on my line that I've chosen.  

I've read some replies that this can help some with distance control, but what I find happens is that I will just lose my feel for distance after about 7-8 holes and then my confidence sort of goes with it. 

I've read some others are putting stiff iron shafts to help with stability.  Can anyone comment or even compare?  That would be a much cheaper way to go.

I just bought a new O Works 7S and wanted to lengthen it, but instead of just adding an extension I bought a KBS C-Taper X flex iron shaft.  Figured it could possibly be a similar solution as probably heavier and more "stable" than standard putter shaft.  I put an 8" section of foam backer rod in to help dampen vibration. 

I've never been able to demo one of the Stability shafts yet, so can't compare, but so far I'm liking the feel on my little experiment.  Unfortunately going to be a while before I get a chance to roll it on a real green, but loving it while carpet putting in the basement.

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, halliedog said:

I put an 8" section of foam backer rod in to help dampen vibration.

Great idea! I was trying with the idea of pulling the grip on my putter and trying to get some foam down in there. Hmmmm 🤔

WITB of an "aspiring"  😉 play-ah ...
..Callaway Epic Speed 4W (Project X Cypher)
..Tour Edge Exotics EXS 7W (Tensei CK Blue)
..Callaway Super Hybrid 23 (PX Catalyst) and Big Bertha 19 5H (Recoil ZTR)
..PXG 0211 6i-GW (Mitsubishi MMT) 
..Cleveland CBX2 54 and CBX 60 (both Rotex graphite)
..Evnroll ER5 (33", 385g, P2 Reflex Tour)
..all in a Datrek bag on a Bag Boy Quad XL push an MGI Zip Navigator electric cart.

Forum Member tester for the ExPutt Putting Simulator

Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know. I saw someone asked ScottGolf, the independent club maker on tour, his thoughts and he said he hasn't seen anyone using them yet, so he couldn't comment. I also saw Club Champion boasting a 54% improvement in putting with the shaft on Twitter. I asked them what metric was used for that claim and they said "owner feedback". Not exactly hard science! 

  • Like 1

Driver: :cobra-small: Speed Zone 9* HZRDUS Smoke Yellow Shaft

3 Wood: :cobra-small: King Speedzone 13.5* HZRDUS Smoke Black Shaft

2 & 3 Hybrids: :cobra-small: Speedzone Recoil 480 ESX Shaft

Irons: :cobra-small: Speedzone 5-GW Recoil 460 ESX Shafts

Wedges: :cobra-small: MIM 54* Versatile/60* Widelow

Putter: :odyssey-small: Dual Force Rossi II

Ball: Whatever I find in the woods

:Arccos:

HCP:18

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm a little late to commenting on this conversation - mostly because I always thought the stability shaft was a marketing ploy, and I thought the way they presented their data was dishonest (Showing data that looks good but actually doesn't speak to performance).

Did anything come form the MGS test that was promoted on twitter?

Now, I will totally buy into the fact that the stability shaft will give a different feel and that can have a huge impact on your feel/confidence with the putter. Dampening of any kind of vibration, even for on-center hits, can communicate stability to your brain and that is a good thing! But I don't see anything compelling about dampening vibrations leading to off-target effects with the ball when the ball is no longer on the face to be affected by those vibrations.

  • Like 1

Bag: Bennington Quiet Organizer 9-Lite (link)

Cart: :Clicgear: 3.5+

Driver:  :cobra-small:  F9 speedback, Accra iWood

Woods:  Sonartec GS Tour 14*, Fujikura Six S
DI:  :titelist-small:  T-MB 2 iron, KBS Tour-V 120 X,
Irons: :Miura: PP-9003SN 4-GW, Nippon 1150GH Stiff
Wedges: :Miura: 1957 K-grind SW, LW, Nippon 1150GH Stiff
Putter: :odyssey-small: EXO Indianapolis (link)
Ball: :Snell: MTB
Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, chemclub said:

Did anything come form the MGS test that was promoted on twitter?

The test was done,  I took part.   It was one of the first times they used the GC Quad to measure putting performance so it may be taking a little while to analyze the results.  I don't when they will publish results. 

  • Like 2

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :cleveland-small: 588 54-14, 58-12
Putter:  Bellum Winmore 787

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, cnosil said:

The test was done,  I took part.   It was one of the first times they used the GC Quad to measure putting performance so it may be taking a little while to analyze the results.  I don't when they will publish results. 

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see what comes from that test.

I'm thinking it's possible any purported benefit - eg. less vibration - may only be measurable on a workbench...?

Also like chemclub and others have said, putting is such an individual and personal "feel" thing, so I'd have to agree it all comes down to if a player thinks something will help their game.......

WITB of an "aspiring"  😉 play-ah ...
..Callaway Epic Speed 4W (Project X Cypher)
..Tour Edge Exotics EXS 7W (Tensei CK Blue)
..Callaway Super Hybrid 23 (PX Catalyst) and Big Bertha 19 5H (Recoil ZTR)
..PXG 0211 6i-GW (Mitsubishi MMT) 
..Cleveland CBX2 54 and CBX 60 (both Rotex graphite)
..Evnroll ER5 (33", 385g, P2 Reflex Tour)
..all in a Datrek bag on a Bag Boy Quad XL push an MGI Zip Navigator electric cart.

Forum Member tester for the ExPutt Putting Simulator

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...