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Why iron shafts are not getting as much love as driver ones?


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I'll just throw this out as a possible answer to the question, not as a absolute answer but as a theory to be debated: there are clear and obvious differences among iron heads. At the extremes, a set

I’m thinking iron shafts will all be graphite within 10 years or so. The cats been let out of the bag, and pricing will come down. in my case, my last two sets have graphite. From Steelfiber 110’

I think that once many people find an iron shaft that works well, they stick with it. But if I’m a low launch/low spin shaft guy, I’ve got so many companies and options that if I don’t like the feel o

I think it’s because it’s easier to move an iron shaft from one set to another than it is for the woods/hybrids

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Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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2 hours ago, Mr_Theoo said:

I think it’s because it’s easier to move an iron shaft from one set to another than it is for the woods/hybrids

Speaking from personal experience only, I can play well with most wood shafts, just because the launch characteristics stay fairly similar throughout a lot of shafts. And, woods are more distance clubs that require less precision. Usually, I'm not trying to hit a wood a specific distance.

With irons I feel very strongly about what shafts I use. I need to know that I'm going to get the launch/spin I need to hold greens, and get my carry number right. Irons are precision clubs, I need to be able to rely on my equipment to do what I want it to, as long as I put a good swing on it. 

Just my $0.02. 

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Wilson Staff C300 9.0* Fujikura Pro 58 stiff

Callaway Rogue 3W Mitsubishi Diamana D+ LTD 80 stiff

Mizuno MP-18 MMC FLI-HI 2 iron UST Mamiya Recoil 95 stiff

Ping I200's 4-W Aerotech Steelfiber I110 CW stiff

Ping Glide 52* and 58* stiff

Bettinardi Studio Stock #38 Armlock

 

 

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59 minutes ago, puttingpirate said:

You mean the other way around?

No, I meant it as you could put the same iron shafts in a new set of irons and get similar performance but if you try the same for woods it rarely seems to work as well

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Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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I think that once many people find an iron shaft that works well, they stick with it. But if I’m a low launch/low spin shaft guy, I’ve got so many companies and options that if I don’t like the feel or look of something, I can try something new.
With that being said, if money is no object, try out the Oban steel shafts. It’s been the most consistent iron shaft I’ve ever tried, but even with a PUD discount, I couldn’t justify the cost of doing a whole set.


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:wilson_staff_small:  Cortex w/MGS Motore X F1 7X tipped 1"

:wilson_staff_small: F5 17 degree hybrid w/Rogue Black 85X

:wilson_staff_small:C300 Forged 3-5 w/C-Taper 130X

:wilson_staff_small: FG Tour V6 5-6 w/C-Taper 130X

:wilson_staff_small: Staff Model Blade 7-PW w/C-Taper 130X

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25 minutes ago, GB13 said:

Speaking from personal experience only, I can play well with most wood shafts, just because the launch characteristics stay fairly similar throughout a lot of shafts. And, woods are more distance clubs that require less precision. Usually, I'm not trying to hit a wood a specific distance.

With irons I feel very strongly about what shafts I use. I need to know that I'm going to get the launch/spin I need to hold greens, and get my carry number right. Irons are precision clubs, I need to be able to rely on my equipment to do what I want it to, as long as I put a good swing on it. 

Just my $0.02. 

To each their own for sure. I can pretty much hit my ideal numbers with the same shaft regardless of iron model but woods it seems I need a more precise fit and different shafts that match the head

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Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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28 minutes ago, GB13 said:

Speaking from personal experience only, I can play well with most wood shafts, just because the launch characteristics stay fairly similar throughout a lot of shafts. And, woods are more distance clubs that require less precision. Usually, I'm not trying to hit a wood a specific distance.

With irons I feel very strongly about what shafts I use. I need to know that I'm going to get the launch/spin I need to hold greens, and get my carry number right. Irons are precision clubs, I need to be able to rely on my equipment to do what I want it to, as long as I put a good swing on it. 

Just my $0.02. 

That's fair enough. I'm a tinkerer and there isn't much more I can tinker with when it comes to putters, hybrids or woods so it's time for irons. I've spent a hell of a long time researching iron shafts, and well... doesn't seem to me people get excited about it as much as wood/driver shafts 🙂

5 minutes ago, Rtracymog said:

I think that once many people find an iron shaft that works well, they stick with it. But if I’m a low launch/low spin shaft guy, I’ve got so many companies and options that if I don’t like the feel or look of something, I can try something new.
With that being said, if money is no object, try out the Oban steel shafts. It’s been the most consistent iron shaft I’ve ever tried, but even with a PUD discount, I couldn’t justify the cost of doing a whole set.


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I'm leaving the steel world for a bit. After a few glasses of whiskey I have now the Mitsubishi OT 100, Diamana Thump 95 and Accra ICWT 95 coming this week. And a new set of heads not to screw with my gamers ;-D Planning on playing ~30 rounds with each and a few trackman sessions to see if I can see changes that would justify the move in a 'normal persons' head.

 

8 minutes ago, Mr_Theoo said:

No, I meant it as you could put the same iron shafts in a new set of irons and get similar performance but if you try the same for woods it rarely seems to work as well

Hmmmm, I disagree here. I think swing develops quite a bit over time, plus the technology advances at an astonishing speed. I think that everyone could see a benefit from a new fitting every 2/3 years. I'm on my 4th set of shafts in just over 3 years and every time I change, my game improves enough that I can notice it.

 

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49 minutes ago, puttingpirate said:

Hmmmm, I disagree here. I think swing develops quite a bit over time, plus the technology advances at an astonishing speed. I think that everyone could see a benefit from a new fitting every 2/3 years. I'm on my 4th set of shafts in just over 3 years and every time I change, my game improves enough that I can notice it.

 

 I definitely agree with the fitting because you do always want to have the best fit possible but I do think most people just seem to end up or go with what has always worked. Whether that’s out of habit or fear of change. 

Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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46 minutes ago, Mr_Theoo said:

 I definitely agree with the fitting because you do always want to have the best fit possible but I do think most people just seem to end up or go with what has always worked. Whether that’s out of habit or fear of change. 

Time to change that don't you think?! 🙂

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1 minute ago, puttingpirate said:

Time to change that don't you think?! 🙂

I have changed. They don’t make the project X flighted shafts anymore. The past 3 sets of irons I’ve had have all been different shafts

Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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I think it's just far easier to swap driver shafts in and out with the sleeves currently available, so they tend to get more attention when it comes to trying something new. Also, the driver to many is THE distance club, while irons are more for consistency, so getting more yardage with a quick driver shaft swap is far more attractive an option. 

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In my  :wilson_staff_small:  carry bag:
:callaway-small: Big Bertha Mini (the :wilson_staff_small:  D7 is in time out)
:callaway-small:  GBB 3W (lofted to 4W)
:callaway-small: V-Series Heavenwood
:cobra-small: Baffler XL 5i-PW
:cleveland-small: CBX 54*
:ping-small: iWedge 58*
:cleveland-small: #10

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12 hours ago, puttingpirate said:

Out of curiosity - tried composite yet? I guess you did, so what didn’t work?

Haven’t tried graphite iron shafts because no store near me has any to demo and I tend to like my shafts on the heavier side so those are even harder to find in graphite 

Driver:   :callaway-small: Epic 10.5 set to 9.5 w/ Tour AD-DI 44.5

FW:   :cobra-small: F6 baffler set at 16º

Hybrid:  NONE
Irons:   :taylormade-small:  3i 2014 TP CB  4-PW 2011 TP MC w/ TT S400

Wedges:   :nike-small: 52º :nike-small: 56º  :edel-golf-1: 60 º w/ KBS C-Taper XS Soft-stepped

Putter:   :ping-small: Sigma G Tyne 34 inches Gold dot

 

 

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18 hours ago, Mr_Theoo said:

No, I meant it as you could put the same iron shafts in a new set of irons and get similar performance but if you try the same for woods it rarely seems to work as well

To an extent yes but I’ve have success with one iron shaft in several heads and it gave me not so optimal results in two other heads.

ive used the multiple driver shafts in several heads and kept optimal results.  Like anything in golf a lot of it is player specific.

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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I'll just throw this out as a possible answer to the question, not as a absolute answer but as a theory to be debated: there are clear and obvious differences among iron heads. At the extremes, a set of Titleist MB and a set of Cleveland Launcher HB irons have enormously different playing characteristics and flight (launch, spin) properties.

At the top of the market, by contrast, the differences among driver heads have diminished. Take last year's Most Wanted drivers, for instance. The difference in ball speed between number 1 (the Cobra F8) and number 10 (PING G400 SFT) is less than a mile per hour. The lowest spinning driver (the Wilson D300) is less than 300rpm different than number 10 (Titleist D2). Less than 3 yards(!) separates number 1 from number 10 in total distance.

I'm not at all saying that driver heads don't matter, and I tend to be on the non-shaftoid side of the argument. But I propose the the reason that people are more interested in driver shafts than iron shafts is related to this idea: that iron heads produce pretty radically different numbers, and so most of the difference between irons can be attributed to the head, whereas driver heads produce very similar numbers, and a way to squeeze out a difference is by using a different shaft.

 

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:callaway-small: Epic Flash Sub Zero, 9°, Aldila Rogue White 130 MSI 70 X
:callaway-small: Mavrik Sub Zero 15°, Aldila Rogue White 130 MSI 70 S
:cobra-small: F6 5-6W, 18.5°, Fujikura Motore 6.3
:adams-small: XTD Proto dHy 21°, Aldila Green NV Hybrid 105 S
:Sub70: 699 Pro, Modus3 105, 5–PW
:Sub70: Forged Black 50°, 54°, and 58°
:odyssey-small: Stroke Lab EXO Seven Mini, 34"
:srixon-small: Z-Star XV

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If any of you guys follow Golfholics on YouTube, you'll know that Mike recently went to Fujikura for an iron shaft fitting. In that video they talk about some of the stigma and misinformation that surrounds graphite iron shafts and I'd have to say that stigma and misinformation pretty much sums up the discrepancies between all iron shafts and driver shaft fittings. Look at Tiger as an example. How long has he played X100's? There's so much more out there to try and he's only just even adapted to adjustable drivers since switching to Taylormade.

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Driver: Mizuno ST190 9.5* Aldila RIP Alpha 60 S
Fairway Wood: Mizuno ST190 15* Fujikura Atmos Blue 6S
Hyrbrid: Mizuno CLK 19* Fujikura Speeder EVO HB
Irons: Bridgestone J40 CB (4-PW) Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100
Wedges: Bridgestone Tour B XW-1 50*, 54*, & 58* Nippon Modus 3 105
Putter: Cleveland Huntington Beach SOFT Premier 4 34"
Ball: Snell MTB-X
Bag: 2017 Titleist Players 5 Stand Bag

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I recently went to club champion and got the full bag fitting. In regards to iron shafts the differences I felt were not nearly as apparent than those felt with driver. Certainly there were some differences in launch, spin, and dispersion so I definitely believe it’s just as important to get the right iron shafts. But for me the feel was so much different among the driver shafts I tried and relatively similar with the iron shafts.


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Driver:  image.png.3c6db1120d888f669e07d4a8f890b3f1.pngMavrik Sub Zero 9* (Set to 10) Ventus Blue 6X

2 Hybrid: :titelist-small: 818 H2 Hybrid Tensei Blue 80 X

3 Hybrid: :titelist-small: 818H2 Fujikura Atmos TS Blue 8X

4 Iron - Srixon ZX 23* Recoil F5

Irons 5-PW: :mizuno-small: MP 18 SC Dynamic Gold AMT X

Gap/Sand Wedge:  :titelist-small: Vokey SM6 49*  SM8 54* 

Lob Wedge:  image.png.3c6db1120d888f669e07d4a8f890b3f1.pngJaws 5 Wedge 58* DG Tour Issue Stiff

Putter:  image.png.cca2328f4144a299c795aa9b8f3bf677.png Inovai 6.0              :scotty-small: Pro Platinum Newport 2 35"  

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Wait a minute - before I offer my response I need to ask PuttingPirate if that ratio of 5/6 drivers to 30 irons is true?  Clearly if that's the case he's the anomaly or else perhaps he's counting wedges as irons?  If I rate the clubs by category as follows driver, fairways/hybrids, irons, wedges, putter their importance to my score (and I would argue the score of many people) based on relevant usage plus potential strokes gained would be

Driver, putter, wedges, irons, fairway/hybrids

(I could see wedges and irons flip flopping based upon the course and set of tees that I'm playing - I suppose if I played a set of tees that was too short for me Driver might drop below putter but then fairway/hybrids would move above irons and wedges also)

At any rate I read a lot about iron shafts on MGS at least.  I know that the shaft/head combo of irons is hugely important for me - more important than my driver even though my driver is more important to my overall score - I got fit last spring, changed the head (to a wider platform) and shaft (to a lighter graphite) and improved significantly in all areas of my irons - dispersion, distance, consistency.  I'm guessing that if it was this important for me it would be for most others also. 

Perhaps the OP has been checking in at times when we haven't been making a big deal out of iron shafts.  I do agree that there is more interest about driver shafts in general but I don't think that's necessarily true here -

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Ping G410 - turned down to11.25 degrees, neutral setting - Fujikura Motore X R flex

Ping G410 5-9 wood

Wilson D7 forged 6-GW -  Mamiya recoil 460 R flex

SCOR 52,60

EVNRoll ER 5

Titleist Pro VIx optic yellow with revkev stamped on them

Currently testing Edison wedges to replace SCORS that are wearing out. Also auditions for the 14th spot in the bag.  Current possibilities are a Ping 26 degree hybrid - duplicates the 9 wood or 5 iron but would be used almost exclusively for chipping or Tour Exotics 3 wood simply because you can carry 14 clubs and I might occasionally hit it in certain unusual wind conditions once every four or five rounds. 

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On ‎1‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 10:12 AM, GolfSpy MPR said:

I'll just throw this out as a possible answer to the question, not as a absolute answer but as a theory to be debated: there are clear and obvious differences among iron heads. At the extremes, a set of Titleist MB and a set of Cleveland Launcher HB irons have enormously different playing characteristics and flight (launch, spin) properties.

At the top of the market, by contrast, the differences among driver heads have diminished. Take last year's Most Wanted drivers, for instance. The difference in ball speed between number 1 (the Cobra F8) and number 10 (PING G400 SFT) is less than a mile per hour. The lowest spinning driver (the Wilson D300) is less than 300rpm different than number 10 (Titleist D2). Less than 3 yards(!) separates number 1 from number 10 in total distance.

I'm not at all saying that driver heads don't matter, and I tend to be on the non-shaftoid side of the argument. But I propose the the reason that people are more interested in driver shafts than iron shafts is related to this idea: that iron heads produce pretty radically different numbers, and so most of the difference between irons can be attributed to the head, whereas driver heads produce very similar numbers, and a way to squeeze out a difference is by using a different shaft.

 

I found this post extremely insightful!  Great points!

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Ping G410 - turned down to11.25 degrees, neutral setting - Fujikura Motore X R flex

Ping G410 5-9 wood

Wilson D7 forged 6-GW -  Mamiya recoil 460 R flex

SCOR 52,60

EVNRoll ER 5

Titleist Pro VIx optic yellow with revkev stamped on them

Currently testing Edison wedges to replace SCORS that are wearing out. Also auditions for the 14th spot in the bag.  Current possibilities are a Ping 26 degree hybrid - duplicates the 9 wood or 5 iron but would be used almost exclusively for chipping or Tour Exotics 3 wood simply because you can carry 14 clubs and I might occasionally hit it in certain unusual wind conditions once every four or five rounds. 

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