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Pace of Play Survey


GolfSpy Barbajo

Does Pace of Play REALLY Matter?  

659 members have voted

  1. 1. Does slow play.....

    • Keep you from playing golf at certain courses?
      185
    • Keep you from play golf at certain courses on certain days?
      320
    • Keep you from playing golf at all?
      12
    • Not affect how often or where you play?
      141
  2. 2. Does slow play negatively affect....

    • Enjoyment of your round?
      534
    • The business health of a specific golf course?
      17
    • Overall participation in the sport?
      73
    • Nothing, it's not a big deal.
      34
  3. 3. What are the biggest causes of slow play?

    • Course setup (high rough/narrow fairways/silly-fast greens)?
      43
    • Playing from the wrong tees?
      120
    • A long/difficult Par 3 within the first few holes?
      8
    • Idiots who don't know golf etiquette and think they are JB Holmes?
      346
    • Poor use of 2-person carts?
      52
    • Not enough space between tee times?
      89
  4. 4. How much extra would you be willing to pay for a course with a guaranteed 4 hour or less round of golf?

    • 10% over "normal" greens fees?
      74
    • 15%?
      43
    • 20%?
      46
    • 25%?
      23
    • More? This is what they're SUPPOSED to be doing!
      408
    • It's not a problem.
      64
  5. 5. Do you think golf courses REALLY see slow play as a problem that needs to be solved?

    • Yes
      218
    • No
      440


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Hi guys -- 

I'm working on a blog on the issue of slow play and I have a few poll questions. If  you could spare a few moments and give some answers to the questions provided, it'd be a huge help.  

Also, please feel free to provide any additional thoughts for discussion. I know the world is going all JB Holmes over slow play at the moment, so I figure this is a good time to ask...

 

Thanks!

 

NOTE: You need to be in the desktop version to complete the poll. Thanks!

 

What's in the bag:
 
Driver:  :titelist-small:TSR3; :wilson_staff_small: DynaPWR Carbon
FW Wood: :wilson_staff_small: DynaPWR 3-wood; :titleist-small: TSR 2+
Hybrids:  PXG Gen4 18-degree
Utility Irons: :srixon-small: ZX MkII 20* 
Irons:;  :Sub70:699/699 Pro V2 Combo; :wilson_staff_small: D9 Forged;  :macgregor-small:MT86 (coming soon!); :macgregor-small: VIP 1025 V-Foil MB/CB; 

Wedges:  :cleveland-small: RTX6 Zipcore
Putter: :cleveland-small: HB Soft Milled 10.5;  :scotty-small: Newport Special Select;  :edel-golf-1:  Willamette,  :bettinardi-small: BB8; :wilson-small: 8802; MATI Monto

Ball: :bridgestone-small: Tour B RXS; :srixon-small: Z-STAR Diamond; :wilson_staff_small: Triad

Stat Tracker/GPS Watch: :ShotScope:


 
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.FWIW  I didn't complete the survey, as there are a couple fields where I don't see an answer I agree with, and it is required to be filled out.   Perhaps one additional option for each, I think things are fine or I don't see a problem here option.

I am one who isn't jumping on the mob mentality of slow play is killing the game.  Is it an issue, sure at certain times on certain courses.  But I have yet to have one person decline an invitation for a round of golf by saying, "No it takes too long"   Even on some of our slowest rounds, I have heard minor griping during it, but have only heard on very rare occasions, someone say they will never go to XYZ course again because it took too long. 

edit:  Saw the additonal fields added, and now was able to complete!! 

Looking forward to seeing the results. 

:ping-small: G430 Max 10K 

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:titelist-small: TSR2 18.0 PX Aldila Ascent 6og

:titelist-small: TSi1 20 Aldila Ascent Shafts R

:titelist-small: T350 5-GW SteelFiber I80 

:titelist-small: SM10 48F/54M and58K

:ping-small: S159 48S/52S/56W/60B

:scotty-cameron-1: Select 5.5 Flowback 35" 

:titelist-small: ProV1  Play number 12

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

John..FWIW  I didn't complete the survey, as there are a couple fields where I don't see an answer I agree with, and it is required to be filled out.   Perhaps one additional option for each, I think things are fine or I don't see a problem here option.

I am one who isn't jumping on the mob mentality of slow play is killing the game.  Is it an issue, sure at certain times on certain courses.  But I have yet to have one person decline an invitation for a round of golf by saying, "No it takes too long"   Even on some of our slowest rounds, I have heard minor griping during it, but have only heard on very rare occasions, someone say they will never go to XYZ course again because it took too long. 

I tend to agree that no one openly complains or wont play because of it, that being said, I also believe that is because its the norm now and its expected. Which is not necessarily the same as acknowledging that slow play is an issue.

In my area for example, if you play on the weekends at a public course when its nice out, you are guaranteed a 5 hour round. As far as I can tell from people I play with its been that way for years. No one complains because its the standard and they are used to it, But I can guarantee if a 4some finished in 4 hours it would absolutely be talked about as some kind of an achievement. 

RH:

Driver: :cobra-small: F9 9.0º - 14g Low - Evenflow White T1100 75G X

Woods: :cobra-small: F9 3W - Evenflow White T1100 75G X

Hybrids: :cobra-small:  F9 3H - Aldila Green X

Irons: :cobra-small: F9 One Length 4-PW - Modus3 Tour 105 S

Wedges: :cobra-small: King Wedges 50º/54º/58º Versatile

Putter: :ping-small:  Sigma G Tyne 35"

Ball: Srixon Z Star XV

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As someone who plays a lot of rounds alone and can rip through 18 nice and quick slow rounds can be a killer. There are certain courses where it's simply not worth going to despite the courses being great, when things get jammed up it's really tough to enjoy. 

I'm more then fine with playing a round that takes the full 4 hours or so when it's simply a steady day and the course is making sure everyone is playing at a adequate pace. It's when there is the one or two groups that hold everyone up and aren't allowing groups to pass through or they take ages on the green to line up a putt that they leave 12 feet short haha. 

I also understand when tournament rounds take longer because there is more on the line. It's the day to day rounds that are long and drawn out which are killer. Not only for the enjoyment, but typically the score as well. 

⛳🛄 as of Nov 6, 2023 (Past WITB
Driver:  :callaway-small: Paradym TD w/ GD ADDI 6X Driver Shootout! 

Wood:    :cobra-small: F7 3 wood 14.5* w/ Motore F1 Shaft

Irons:   :titleist-small: T Series - T200 5 Iron
                                          T150 6-9 Iron
                                          T100 PW/GW

Wedge:  Toura Golf - A Spec 53,37,61 degree 

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7 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

John..FWIW  I didn't complete the survey, as there are a couple fields where I don't see an answer I agree with, and it is required to be filled out.   Perhaps one additional option for each, I think things are fine or I don't see a problem here option.

I am one who isn't jumping on the mob mentality of slow play is killing the game.  Is it an issue, sure at certain times on certain courses.  But I have yet to have one person decline an invitation for a round of golf by saying, "No it takes too long"   Even on some of our slowest rounds, I have heard minor griping during it, but have only heard on very rare occasions, someone say they will never go to XYZ course again because it took too long. 

I would agree with this to a point. It is not killing the game because the ones playing are the ones that truly love golf. But it is killing the game because I think that it hurts from a growth standpoint. Golf is a big commitment IMO from financial to practice. I can tell you from a personal standpoint that there have been different times in my life that the time commitment has stopped me from playing. And I’m pretty much a die hard. 

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

:ping-small:          G425 19 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:ping-small:          G425 22 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:srixon-small:            ZX7 5-9 (KBS C Taper S)

:titleist-small:            Vokey SM9 45 10 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 49 08 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 55 08 M (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 59 04 T (KBS 610)

:taylormade-small:     Spider GT Splitback 34"

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Twitter             @THEZIPR23

 

"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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2 minutes ago, THEZIPR23 said:

I would agree with this to a point. It is not killing the game because the ones playing are the ones that truly love golf. But it is killing the game because I think that it hurts from a growth standpoint. Golf is a big commitment IMO from financial to practice. I can tell you from a personal standpoint that there have been different times in my life that the time commitment has stopped me from playing. And I’m pretty much a die hard. 

I'd agree with that - and it wasn't so much slow play as it was time to play period. From 1991 to 2007 I maybe played 4 or 5 rounds total due to work, kids, life...couldn't even find a way to get 9 in, never mind 18. That's just life. 

It's a game where money, time and desire all have to intersect. 

Any additional thoughts on the causes of slow play and the impact of slow play - gang, I'm all ears!

 

What's in the bag:
 
Driver:  :titelist-small:TSR3; :wilson_staff_small: DynaPWR Carbon
FW Wood: :wilson_staff_small: DynaPWR 3-wood; :titleist-small: TSR 2+
Hybrids:  PXG Gen4 18-degree
Utility Irons: :srixon-small: ZX MkII 20* 
Irons:;  :Sub70:699/699 Pro V2 Combo; :wilson_staff_small: D9 Forged;  :macgregor-small:MT86 (coming soon!); :macgregor-small: VIP 1025 V-Foil MB/CB; 

Wedges:  :cleveland-small: RTX6 Zipcore
Putter: :cleveland-small: HB Soft Milled 10.5;  :scotty-small: Newport Special Select;  :edel-golf-1:  Willamette,  :bettinardi-small: BB8; :wilson-small: 8802; MATI Monto

Ball: :bridgestone-small: Tour B RXS; :srixon-small: Z-STAR Diamond; :wilson_staff_small: Triad

Stat Tracker/GPS Watch: :ShotScope:


 
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2 minutes ago, GolfSpy Barbajo said:

I'd agree with that - and it wasn't so much slow play as it was time to play period. From 1991 to 2007 I maybe played 4 or 5 rounds total due to work, kids, life...couldn't even find a way to get 9 in, never mind 18. That's just life. 

It's a game where money, time and desire all have to intersect. 

Any additional thoughts on the causes of slow play and the impact of slow play - gang, I'm all ears!

Agreed but would you have played more if you could play 18 in under 3 hours? I play more golf now than I have at almost any other time in my life. And I was an assistant pro for 7 years. The biggest reason, I am at a club that I can play 18 holes in 2 hours 3-4 afternoons a week. 

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

:ping-small:          G425 19 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:ping-small:          G425 22 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:srixon-small:            ZX7 5-9 (KBS C Taper S)

:titleist-small:            Vokey SM9 45 10 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 49 08 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 55 08 M (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 59 04 T (KBS 610)

:taylormade-small:     Spider GT Splitback 34"

 :titleist-small:           ProV1 #23

Twitter             @THEZIPR23

 

"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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I can do 18 holes in 1:50 with putting out every hole.

Put a 4 some in front of me that helps each other with the range finder only to Duff it 3 yards and add 3 to that.

I forget where I read it, but one of the pros... ah Sam Snead said sometimes you might just want to find a new hobby...

Or at least find a par 3 course you can hack your way around.

I think it’s skill level and trying to out do your buddy. Growing up working at a course was funny, guys literally spent 3-5 minutes with a range finder and hit it so far out of bounds... it’s frustrating waiting around for these guys.

I think everyone should be able to enjoy this wonderful game... get a few poor playing 4 somes out on the course and it really sucks the fun out it.

Maybe only let 2 go at a time. There isn’t a cure I don’t think.

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1 hour ago, THEZIPR23 said:

I would agree with this to a point. It is not killing the game because the ones playing are the ones that truly love golf. But it is killing the game because I think that it hurts from a growth standpoint. Golf is a big commitment IMO from financial to practice. I can tell you from a personal standpoint that there have been different times in my life that the time commitment has stopped me from playing. And I’m pretty much a die hard. 

I get what your saying.   But a sincere question I would ask you is,  that time commitment that kept you from playing.   Was it the difference between 4.5 to 5.0 hours vs 4.0.   Or was it even the 4 hours would have been too much?

It's funny whenever I go play on a weekend, SWMBO is fine with it, the only thing she cares about is what time will I be home. She honestly doesn't care how long, she just wants to be able to plan around it.  So if I have say a 10:00 AM tee time, I calculate in my head the following...4.5 hours for play, 1 hour to hang out, 20 to 45 minute drive home depending on where I'm playing.  So lets round up to 6.5 hours.   So I'll say, I'll be home around 3:30 or so.    

She will without fail, respond by saying....OK I'll see you at 4:30.   I haven't asked here whether she's counting on a longer round or three more beers 😁

Oh for the record, it's about 50/50 between her being correct and me being correct. 

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:titelist-small: TSR2 18.0 PX Aldila Ascent 6og

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:titelist-small: SM10 48F/54M and58K

:ping-small: S159 48S/52S/56W/60B

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:titelist-small: ProV1  Play number 12

 

 

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adjusted some of the possible replies to give you more options. 

 

Thanks for all the comments and participation - keep it coming!

 

What's in the bag:
 
Driver:  :titelist-small:TSR3; :wilson_staff_small: DynaPWR Carbon
FW Wood: :wilson_staff_small: DynaPWR 3-wood; :titleist-small: TSR 2+
Hybrids:  PXG Gen4 18-degree
Utility Irons: :srixon-small: ZX MkII 20* 
Irons:;  :Sub70:699/699 Pro V2 Combo; :wilson_staff_small: D9 Forged;  :macgregor-small:MT86 (coming soon!); :macgregor-small: VIP 1025 V-Foil MB/CB; 

Wedges:  :cleveland-small: RTX6 Zipcore
Putter: :cleveland-small: HB Soft Milled 10.5;  :scotty-small: Newport Special Select;  :edel-golf-1:  Willamette,  :bettinardi-small: BB8; :wilson-small: 8802; MATI Monto

Ball: :bridgestone-small: Tour B RXS; :srixon-small: Z-STAR Diamond; :wilson_staff_small: Triad

Stat Tracker/GPS Watch: :ShotScope:


 
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I took the poll and my answers fell in line with everyone else except for question #2. I answered that it effects overall participation. However, it does also greatly impact my personal enjoyment of the game. I wish I could have selected both answers. When I find a rhythm on the golf course I prefer to stay there as that is where I'm likely to play my best golf. When my rhythm slows because of players in front, it tends to throw my game out of whack - not always, but frequent enough to be an issue.

Also, while I wouldn't (always) call them idiots, my experiences demonstrate a clear lack of etiquette on the golf course. I've played as a single and I've played in groups that will get stuck behind someone who is 2 to 3 holes behind the group in front of them and still not permit me/us to play through. I've literally walked up to a tee box with players still on it and they would not let me play through. 

I'd like to address the notion that people don't turn down a round of golf due to time either because I've done that plenty (perhaps I'm just in the minority). I have a couple different groups I play with and have had to turn them down because I knew the round would take 5 hours or more based on the course they were playing and the tee time available. Instead, I went to a different course and played as a single or simply didn't play at all.

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This topic is one that I could go on for days about. But I’ll spare you all.

Slow play and waiting for terrible golfers is the worst thing about golf.

Imagine 4 JB’s in a group with an average drive of 150 yards playing from the tips. I know you’ve all fallen victim to this at some point. I’m not talking kids or Champions Tour guys. Guys my age that just can’t play golf.

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Trackman tweeted its congratulations to JB on his win yesterday, which immediately inspired the thought of a Trackman measuring JB's speed:

speed.jpg

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Like a lot of surveys it's difficult many times to complete. This one is no exception. But thanks John for starting a discussion and I hope my answers and short essay are useful to your task.

1. Slow play really isn't and issue with me or at my home course (private club) as most normal rounds are 4 hours. However, Fast Play is a problem for me. Or I should say playing with someone like yesterday that was in a mad dash to finish every hole as fast as possible. I felt like I had to rush around (like him) without any thought and hit a golf ball. To me that's worse than slow play. It's wasn't enjoyable.

2. Sure. Playing too slow is nagging when encountered. But I don't consider any given courses business health. I certainly have never given thought to quitting the game over a slow or a backed up round.

3. The causes of slow play are probably too numerous to list. While I can agree with the 5 choices presented; there are more. I'll suggest just one.... add just 2-3 additional minutes between tee times.

4. I've been a member at a club where there was never an issue with slow play. Many times there were 3 holes open in front. You could play very slow and leisurely or fast and never wait a shot. But to directly answer the question; I wouldn't pay more for a "guarantee" of 4 hour rounds. But I don't quite understand the premise. Does the entire club/course charge more (meaning to everyone) or am I given the option to pay more for my guarantee? What times are available for me to get my guarantee? What if I'm playing in the day game and it runs 4.15 minutes? Do I get a refund some some kind?

5. I don't know what golf courses think of slow play or how they define it. One man's slow play is another man's fast play. One extreme or another is nagging. 

I know this went too long and I apologize but...

Yesterday I played at a local daily fee course with a couple and one other guy. Yes, I know 5-somes are slow by nature. Took us almost 4.75 hours. It was a nice afternoon and everyone that discovered a set of clubs in their garage came out it seemed. I play a reasonably controlled game; meaning I keep the ball in play and on my hole 90% of the time. Yesterday like most days I played the same ball from #1 through #18. The two other men in my game sprayed their drivers all over the place. In fact the guy I'll call Mr. Hurry lost a sleeve in the first 4 holes!! The lady played decent and down the middle all day. Mr. Hurry was aggravated all day at how slow "everyone" played. But it was partially due to him, and overcrowded course, and rank hackers. Honestly, It was kind of crazy out there as many people had no clue where there their balls were going and carts were criss-crossing into our fairways all day. I had to laugh actually. I pretty much witnessed everything that is wrong about golf in a single afternoon. From slow play to poor etiquette and everything in between. It was all there on display. But that's what I see and hear mostly at muni or daily fee courses. That IMO is what gives golf a bad slow play reputation. Oh, did I tell you about the guy that held us up while he played two shots from our fairway! (while we waited disgustingly) and then eventually came wheeling up and parked next to our the green with his Waylon Jennings blaring from a bluetooth speaker? 

Such an enjoyable afternoon. 🤣

My Sun Mountain bag currently includes:   TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 771CSI 5i - PW and TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png PFC Micro Tour-c 52°, 56°, 60 wedges

                                                                               :755178188_TourEdge: EXS 10.5*, TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 929-HS FW4 16.5* 

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The only question I didn't align with the majority was #1.  Slow play doesn't affect where or when I play.  As a member of a muni, I play there because I have already paid for the year.  I will play other courses when asked and that is usually on weekends when play is about the same pace as my course, so it doesn't really matter.

There are always slow groups to contend with, but playing on weekends, that is to be expected.  It's the time when people that don't play much get out with friends.  I don't enjoy it, but it is what it is, if I want to play golf at a muni.  As long as the pace is steady, I can deal with it.  If it's always a waiting game, I will quit mid-round; maybe come back later in the day.

There is another reason for slow play that is not mentioned in Question #3, and it's related to my answer of No in Question #5.  Being a muni, my course does not set up the course to be difficult unless it's a tournament weekend.  The problem is course design and 8-minute tee times.  Because it's muni, the operator is trying to put as many people out on the course as possible; $$$.  A combination of less skilled players and close tee times makes groups wait starting on the first tee.  Combine that with our first 4 holes... #1 short par 4; #2 short par 4; #3 #1hcp hole; #4 short par 3.  Groups are automatically bunch on the #3 tee with water all the way down the left side and in front of the green.  Bailing out right puts you in big mounds of grass that then require a forced carry over water from bad lies, or a layup.  It's not until the 596y par 5 #5 that groups start spreading out.  Yes, the course knows that slow play is a problem, but they have no incentive to solve it, nor ability to mitigate the problem due to course design.

We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.”

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Anyone think they put too many groups on the course at the same time? I've played through a couple times and there is no relief.

I think that when you check in they should remind you to let faster groups play through...and have a ranger help move folks along and remind them to play the proper tees...

DriverCobra  Aerojet LS
Woods-
Cobra  LTD 3w 15*, 5W 19*,  F9 24* 
Irons- XXIO X (6-A)

Wedges- Callaway Jaws Raw (54/58)

Putter- Bettinardi BB56
Ball- Maxfli Tour X/Wilson Triad
Buggy- Clicgear 4.0
Bag- Callaway Org 14/Fairway C

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35 minutes ago, Shankster said:

This topic is one that I could go on for days about. But I’ll spare you all.

Slow play and waiting for terrible golfers is the worst thing about golf.

Imagine 4 JB’s in a group with an average drive of 150 yards playing from the tips. I know you’ve all fallen victim to this at some point. I’m not talking kids or Champions Tour guys. Guys my age that just can’t play golf.

Waiting for terrible golfers in front of you is bad, but playing alongside terrible golfers IS the worst thing about golf.  When my wife and I play on the weekend and we don't have a foursome, we sometimes get paired with... well... not very good golfers.  It's a struggle for us.  When a hole is open in front of us, we have politely asked if would be OK for us to go on ahead.  I hate to be rude, but I have thought that they actually felt better to not be playing with us.  Of course, that doesn't help the groups behind them!

Actually, in the 3+ years I have been at this muni, I have never seen anyone play from "the tips" that couldn't reasonably play from there.  The tips are not that long, only 6700y, but on weekends almost no one plays from there.  Maybe it's a resort course thing to do that.

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Added space between tee times as a choice. Thanks for the input gents!

 

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I can do 18 holes in 1:50 with putting out every hole.

Put a 4 some in front of me that helps each other with the range finder only to Duff it 3 yards and add 3 to that.

I forget where I read it, but one of the pros... ah Sam Snead said sometimes you might just want to find a new hobby...

Or at least find a par 3 course you can hack your way around.

I think it’s skill level and trying to out do your buddy. Growing up working at a course was funny, guys literally spent 3-5 minutes with a range finder and hit it so far out of bounds... it’s frustrating waiting around for these guys.

I think everyone should be able to enjoy this wonderful game... get a few poor playing 4 somes out on the course and it really sucks the fun out it.

Maybe only let 2 go at a time. There isn’t a cure I don’t think.
There's turtles on both ends of the handicap spectrum. A couple of the slowest players I know are legitimate +4/+5s. They qualify for USGA events and are some of the better golfers in the state but they simply refuse to play faster, or to even acknowledge the pace of other players. They go through their full routine for every shot and if a butterfly sneezes in an adjoining meadow they back up and do it all over again. They have it in their heads that it is part of being good but the reality is they're really good because they play really well, not because they take forever.

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3 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

I get what your saying.   But a sincere question I would ask you is,  that time commitment that kept you from playing.   Was it the difference between 4.5 to 5.0 hours vs 4.0.   Or was it even the 4 hours would have been too much?

It's funny whenever I go play on a weekend, SWMBO is fine with it, the only thing she cares about is what time will I be home. She honestly doesn't care how long, she just wants to be able to plan around it.  So if I have say a 10:00 AM tee time, I calculate in my head the following...4.5 hours for play, 1 hour to hang out, 20 to 45 minute drive home depending on where I'm playing.  So lets round up to 6.5 hours.   So I'll say, I'll be home around 3:30 or so.    

She will without fail, respond by saying....OK I'll see you at 4:30.   I haven't asked here whether she's counting on a longer round or three more beers 😁

Oh for the record, it's about 50/50 between her being correct and me being correct. 

Same here. When I play or how long is not an issue and almost welcomed if it’s an extended period...not sure if that’s good or bad 🤪

also I know that slow rounds happen and at certain courses it’s to be expected and I plan mentally for it.  While some rounds take forever I’ve never walked away from a round where there wasn’t some level of enjoyment. Surexive had bad rounds or played a course that wasn’t in good shape but it never affected if I enjoyed myself on the course

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3 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

But I have yet to have one person decline an invitation for a round of golf by saying, "No it takes too long"   Even on some of our slowest rounds, I have heard minor griping during it, but have only heard on very rare occasions, someone say they will never go to XYZ course again because it took too long. 

You haven't met me then.  I got into a MAJOR fight with a (now former) co-worker who always wanted to play FSU's Seminole course with me from time to time, and after the last time I was out there and it was pushing a 5 hour round, I told him, and anyone else I ever played golf with, that I will NEVER play Seminole ever again.  Seminole is affiliated with FSU, and because of that, it attracts a bunch of college students who don't know the rules or etiquette of the game, and think that their time at Seminole is best served with 3 other buddies who have no clue how to play golf, nor what any sort of pace of play is supposed to be, and they use their time to drink as much beer as possible, and take as long as they want on the course.

Granted, any issue with Seminole is gone now, as they are in the process of redesigning it and it won't be open until late this year.  But rumor has it that once it reopens it will go from being $30 or less per round to $75 per round, which means that there will be no one out there, as there is a definite price point that dictates if people will actually play golf in this town.  But I think FSU doesn't really care about the general public wanting to play their new course whenever it opens, because I think the goal is to have sparse play on it, so that the FSU golf teams can go out there any time they want and play practice rounds without having to fight the mob to do it.

Now, factor in one closed course in a town that only has 2 1/2 other public courses, and the fact that Seminole had the highest round count per day/week/month/year, and all that traffic has to go somewhere.  The other public courses went from having available tee times to me walking out there on a Saturday afternoon as a single and the guy in the pro shop bluntly telling me I couldn't play because there were no available tee times and the course was full.

So where does this leave me, golf wise?  I simply don't play anymore, mostly because I know that tee sheets are full, and even if I could squeeze on somewhere and play with another group, it would be a 5 hour round.  In short,  I give up.

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3 hours ago, THEZIPR23 said:

Agreed but would you have played more if you could play 18 in under 3 hours? I play more golf now than I have at almost any other time in my life. And I was an assistant pro for 7 years. The biggest reason, I am at a club that I can play 18 holes in 2 hours 3-4 afternoons a week. 

You didn't ask me, but if the round was affordable ($30 or less), and you could guarantee me that I would be finished in 3 hours or less, then I'd be there every time.  But as it is, there is no local course around here that can do it, or will even try to make it happen, so I stay home and say screw it and find other things to do.

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58 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Same here. When I play or how long is not an issue and almost welcomed if it’s an extended period...not sure if that’s good or bad 🤪

also I know that slow rounds happen and at certain courses it’s to be expected and I plan mentally for it.  While some rounds take forever I’ve never walked away from a round where there wasn’t some level of enjoyment. Surexive had bad rounds or played a course that wasn’t in good shape but it never affected if I enjoyed myself on the course

So much this!   it's meant to be our enjoyment, and if we let things out of our control such as weather, pace of play,  even our own play dictate getting upset, then to me that defeats the purpose of playing.

Do i wish I could shoot 75 each time out instead of 95 or 100....you bet.  And while those high scores might not make me jump for joy, I haven't quit yet after shooting one.   And I don't necessarily want to play a round in 2.5 hours.   To me that's too fast and there's no way you can be enjoying the day, the weather and the company if you're racing around the course.    If @MDGolfHacker is still around and see's this post, he can tell you about a round we played at Maryland National about 10 years ago with a Brit who walked on and joined us on the 10th tee.  We had just finished a very nice front 9, with pretty good scores and enjoyed the pace.    Well he was bound and determined to finish the back nine in about an hour, and while he was walking and we were in carts, it was all we could do to keep up with him, we were sprinting from the cart to our shots, and finally after about 3 holes, we told him to go ahead without us.  

So a round would have to be extremely long, like well over 5 hours for it to really bother me.   If it's slow during the round, I use that time to chat with my playing partner, or just relax and enjoy the weather.   

 

 

 

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I took the poll and my answers fell in line with everyone else except for question #2. I answered that it effects overall participation. However, it does also greatly impact my personal enjoyment of the game. I wish I could have selected both answers. When I find a rhythm on the golf course I prefer to stay there as that is where I'm likely to play my best golf. When my rhythm slows because of players in front, it tends to throw my game out of whack - not always, but frequent enough to be an issue.
Also, while I wouldn't (always) call them idiots, my experiences demonstrate a clear lack of etiquette on the golf course. I've played as a single and I've played in groups that will get stuck behind someone who is 2 to 3 holes behind the group in front of them and still not permit me/us to play through. I've literally walked up to a tee box with players still on it and they would not let me play through. 
I'd like to address the notion that people don't turn down a round of golf due to time either because I've done that plenty (perhaps I'm just in the minority). I have a couple different groups I play with and have had to turn them down because I knew the round would take 5 hours or more based on the course they were playing and the tee time available. Instead, I went to a different course and played as a single or simply didn't play at all.

Shoot! I just drive right by them as they are walking to the green, and hit off the next tee before they’re done putting! “Just smile and wave, boys!”


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The only question I didn't align with the majority was #1.  Slow play doesn't affect where or when I play.  As a member of a muni, I play there because I have already paid for the year.  I will play other courses when asked and that is usually on weekends when play is about the same pace as my course, so it doesn't really matter.

There are always slow groups to contend with, but playing on weekends, that is to be expected.  It's the time when people that don't play much get out with friends.  I don't enjoy it, but it is what it is, if I want to play golf at a muni.  As long as the pace is steady, I can deal with it.  If it's always a waiting game, I will quit mid-round; maybe come back later in the day.

There is another reason for slow play that is not mentioned in Question #3, and it's related to my answer of No in Question #5.  Being a muni, my course does not set up the course to be difficult unless it's a tournament weekend.  The problem is course design and 8-minute tee times.  Because it's muni, the operator is trying to put as many people out on the course as possible; $$$.  A combination of less skilled players and close tee times makes groups wait starting on the first tee.  Combine that with our first 4 holes... #1 short par 4; #2 short par 4; #3 #1hcp hole; #4 short par 3.  Groups are automatically bunch on the #3 tee with water all the way down the left side and in front of the green.  Bailing out right puts you in big mounds of grass that then require a forced carry over water from bad lies, or a layup.  It's not until the 596y par 5 #5 that groups start spreading out.  Yes, the course knows that slow play is a problem, but they have no incentive to solve it, nor ability to mitigate the problem due to course design.

Ahhh! You hit my issue on the head: COURSE SET-UP!!!

My muni has its fairways cut at TWENTY-ONE yards wide! Yep! All day, every day, and they don’t have enough workers to mow all-the-time, so our BERMUDA rough can be 2-3 inches high, JUST off the fairway!

 

We were about to play our City Championship, and I asked the Pro if he was widening the fairways. “No! I want it to play HARD!” I said, “Great. Then make sure everyone knows they have to go BACK to the tee and re-hit if they haven’t played a provisional. Our rounds are going to be over 6 hours, you watch!” What happened? People lost a TON of balls JUST off the fairway, started dropping everywhere, and never turned-in real scores. How did that affect this past year’s tournament??? 30 players TOTAL. No one wanted to be beat-up all day for three days.

 

I told the Pro this last year, after he came back from a tournament in California, “Dang! Must be nice to play courses that have fairways that are two to THREE times wider than ours, with a primary cut at an inch!” He got pissed!

 

We’re all amateurs! Set-up the stinking course to AID faster play! Fairway width, rough height, pin placements, and grass height on greens! It’s not that hard to HELP speed it up from a set-up standpoint!

 

 

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Anyone think they put too many groups on the course at the same time? I've played through a couple times and there is no relief.
I think that when you check in they should remind you to let faster groups play through...and have a ranger help move folks along and remind them to play the proper tees...

But like the Pros, someone has to enforce things... If it’s not a “high-style” place, rangers say stuff, but no one kicks slow players off the course.


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There's turtles on both ends of the handicap spectrum. A couple of the slowest players I know are legitimate +4/+5s. They qualify for USGA events and are some of the better golfers in the state but they simply refuse to play faster, or to even acknowledge the pace of other players. They go through their full routine for every shot and if a butterfly sneezes in an adjoining meadow they back up and do it all over again. They have it in their heads that it is part of being good but the reality is they're really good because they play really well, not because they take forever.

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If a butterfly sneezes!!!!


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Ahhh! You hit my issue on the head: COURSE SET-UP!!!
My muni has its fairways cut at TWENTY-ONE yards wide! Yep! All day, every day, and they don’t have enough workers to mow all-the-time, so our BERMUDA rough can be 2-3 inches high, JUST off the fairway!
 
We were about to play our City Championship, and I asked the Pro if he was widening the fairways. “No! I want it to play HARD!” I said, “Great. Then make sure everyone knows they have to go BACK to the tee and re-hit if they haven’t played a provisional. Our rounds are going to be over 6 hours, you watch!” What happened? People lost a TON of balls JUST off the fairway, started dropping everywhere, and never turned-in real scores. How did that affect this past year’s tournament??? 30 players TOTAL. No one wanted to be beat-up all day for three days.
 
I told the Pro this last year, after he came back from a tournament in California, “Dang! Must be nice to play courses that have fairways that are two to THREE times wider than ours, with a primary cut at an inch!” He got pissed!
 
We’re all amateurs! Set-up the stinking course to AID faster play! Fairway width, rough height, pin placements, and grass height on greens! It’s not that hard to HELP speed it up from a set-up standpoint!
 
 
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I used to play a course with tight fairways but luckily the rough wasn’t bad. When I questioned it the pro said it was to save money by not having to mow as much. He didn’t give me a number but how much could it be to make a couple more runs up the sides with the mower?


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I used to play a course with tight fairways but luckily the rough wasn’t bad. When I questioned it the pro said it was to save money by not having to mow as much. He didn’t give me a number but how much could it be to make a couple more runs up the sides with the mower?


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Our pro said they did it because, “They keep clipping the sprinkler heads with the mower, so we have to mow inside the sprinkler heads.”
Really?! The Super can’t teach them to mow?! Our pros are known for lying to make any excuse possible.


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Hybrid: Ping G425 22*, Ping Tour 80X

Irons:  Ping i230 4-GW, TT DG X100

Wedges: :edel-golf-1: SMS 50D/54V/58D:Nippon:Modus 130 stiff, +1”

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Ahhh! You hit my issue on the head: COURSE SET-UP!!!
My muni has its fairways cut at TWENTY-ONE yards wide! Yep! All day, every day, and they don’t have enough workers to mow all-the-time, so our BERMUDA rough can be 2-3 inches high, JUST off the fairway!
 
We were about to play our City Championship, and I asked the Pro if he was widening the fairways. “No! I want it to play HARD!” I said, “Great. Then make sure everyone knows they have to go BACK to the tee and re-hit if they haven’t played a provisional. Our rounds are going to be over 6 hours, you watch!” What happened? People lost a TON of balls JUST off the fairway, started dropping everywhere, and never turned-in real scores. How did that affect this past year’s tournament??? 30 players TOTAL. No one wanted to be beat-up all day for three days.
 
I told the Pro this last year, after he came back from a tournament in California, “Dang! Must be nice to play courses that have fairways that are two to THREE times wider than ours, with a primary cut at an inch!” He got pissed!
 
We’re all amateurs! Set-up the stinking course to AID faster play! Fairway width, rough height, pin placements, and grass height on greens! It’s not that hard to HELP speed it up from a set-up standpoint!
 
 
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Set em up like BlueJack National. The rough is slightly longer than the fairway if I read correctly.

I could handle this all day long and so could everyone else.

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