2019 Official Forum Member Review-Ping G410 Driver

[Golfspy_CG2 33,895]

Follow our five  testers of the G410 line as they put the first adjustable driver from PING through the paces.

 

 

 

@jlukes                Stage 1                        Stage 2

@tony@CIC          Stage 1                        Stage 2

@fixyurdivot         Stage 1                        Stage 2                

@PING Apologist #9     Stage 1               Stage 2

@GolfSpy STUDque     Combined Stage

[jlukes 16,688]

Ping G410 Plus Driver - Stage 1 Review - jlukes

Well it has been almost 2 whole years since I participated in official MGS forum testing and I have to admit, it feels great to be back in the fold!  I have previously tested the Sun Mountain 3.5LS Stand Bag (which I still use), Evnroll ER2 putter (which I am taking to my grave with me), and Mizuno JPX 900 Tour irons (the only reason I am not still gaming these is that through fitness and lessons I increased my swing speed to the point where I needed to change shafts).  What you should notice is that I do not apply to test everything and anything, and when I do apply to test something, it is a product that I am sincerely interested in doing a thorough long-term review for.

I am going to use some of the background from previous forum reviews because a lot of that information hasn’t changed! My name is Joe and I am from Central NJ.  I have been playing golf for about 23 years (since I was 12) and I am about a 4.1 handicap at the moment.  I started hitting balls when I was much younger - my grandfather cut down an old 9 iron and 5 wood and gave them to me so I could hit balls in my backyard.  I remember my first 9 holes being when I was about 11 years old - I shot 63 with my dad.  I started playing in County tournaments when I was about 13 years old and played varsity golf in High School.  My first job when I was at the local driving range/mini golf, and all through High School I worked at golf course taking care of the carts, running bags, and eventually became the starter.  I have always enjoyed being around the game of golf in any capacity and I have found that it is truly a game for life.  My son is just over 2 and he is already addicted to the game.  I hope that he continues to see what a fun game this is and it becomes something we can bond over for years to come.

 

When it comes to my golf game, I would say I have quite a few strengths.  I am a long hitter (Carry my driver > 270 yards), I have an okay wedge game, and I am a good putter.  Time is my enemy when it comes to golf; not being able to practice and play as much as I’d like (more than once a week or so) prevents me from being consistent.  I have rounds where I am pounding it off the tee, but I can’t hit a GIR, and then I have rounds where I am a little wonky off the tee, but my short game saves me.  Everything finally came together for me in November 2016 when I shot a personal best of -1 71, beating my previous best of +2 74.  I am the type of golfer that can be extremely competitive, but I also love fun, no-pressure rounds with my buddies.  A lot of the guys I golf with are not as good as me, but I do not care in the least.  I enjoy playing with all skill levels and I have no problem giving advice and helping someone with their game if asked (and only if asked).  I enjoy walking the course as much as possible and nothing frustrates me more than long rounds.  I see no reason why an average round should take over 4 hours, no matter what the golfers’ skill levels are.  

If you want to know a bit more about my swing, I have a swing overhaul thread I have been chronicling here:  

 

It has been an interesting spring as I work to keep the momentum up from my winter lesson programs and I will update that thread with updates on my swing changes as the season goes on.  But for the sake of this review, you should know that my driver swing speed is around 113-116 MPH and I play a bit of a draw.  I have an upwards angle of attack and my miss is primarily a hook.  Here is a video of my driver swing from the end of February 

 

 

For me, driver is my weapon.  I play aggressive off the tee because if there is anything that modern analytics and “strokes gained” has taught us, it is that distance is king and that taking advantage of my ability to hit it long is key to me scoring low.  I pull driver every opportunity I have.  I am no more accurate with my fairway wood or hybrid, so there is no reason for me to sacrifice distance by laying up off the tee unless a hole absolutely calls for a lay up.  I try to get on or close to all Par 5s in two, and I try to get myself as close as possible on all Par 4s so that I can be hitting a wedge into the green if the yardage dictates.

I wasn’t always a great driver of the ball.  I used to have quite a negative attack angle which resulted in low launch and high spin.  No amount of head and shaft changes (much to my dismay) could correct a bad attack angle, so in 2014 I went through a swing change and learned to hit up on my driver.  Once I got a positive angle of attack locked in, I noticed I gained 15+ yards of carry on my drives!  

I have been through quite a few drivers since high school - some were great, others were mistakes (due to lack of knowledge about fitting and purchasing on a whim)

TaylorMade 320
TaylorMade r5
TaylorMade r11
TaylorMade RBZ Tour
Cobra Amp Cell
Callaway Big Bertha Alpha (fitted)
Cobra Bio Cell+
Srixon 545
TaylorMade M1 (fitted) 
TaylorMade M2 (2017) (fitted)
Cobra F8+ (fitted)
Titleist TS2 (fitted)

When the Ping 410 Plus testing was unveiled, I knew it was a testing that I wanted to put my name in the hat for.  Ping received such outstanding reviews on their G400 line and I knew that that the G410 had to be something special in order to follow the G400.  With that being said, I have never gamed a Ping club before.  I do have a few old Ping putters, but I never really even given an extensive look to Ping Metalwoods and Irons.  Thankfully, I was selected for this great testing opportunity and I get to see what Ping is all about!

There are a number of selling points/claims that I will be keeping an eye on throughout testing:

Turbulators - do they really increase swing speed?

Adjustability - Well the G410 Plus is the most adjustable driver Ping has ever made.  Does the weight track (3 fixed positions) actually work?

Hosel Adjustment -  The G410 Plus features a brand new adjustable hosel from Ping, one that now includes “flat” settings.  Do they make a difference?

I will put these three elements, as well as the general performance of the G410 Plus to the test over the coming months with the hope of providing the best information for the MGS forum.

At the time of being selected for this review, I was gaming a Titleist TS2 driver that I was fit for at Club Champion.  I truly believe that fitting is necessary to maximize what a golf club can do for a player.  I chose the TS2 during my fitting because it provided me with the best combination of distance and accuracy.  The Cobra F9 and Epic Flash SZ were longer, but I had trouble with both distance and lateral dispersions.  

When I was selected for G410+ testing, I immediately went to my local range, who happens to be a Top 100 Ping fitter, and got a basic fitting for the G410+.  Unlike other OEMs, Ping does not offer a wide selection of no-upcharge shaft options.  The only two shaft options that were really even under consideration for me were the Evenflow Black and the Ping Tour.  However, I know from past fittings that I do not get along with the Evenflow series, so it came down to the Ping Tour.  We set up the G410+ in a 9-degree head a Ping Tour 65X shaft and it was clear right away that it was the combination I would submit to Ping for testing. I asked Ping that it play 45" at a D3 swing weight.  After I received my club I tested the swing weight and length at a shop and wasn't surprised to see Ping delivered on the nose.  

 

During the testing period I will be testing the G410 on the range, on the course, and on launch monitors.  While I will be touching on how the club fits me, I will try to remain focused on validating the performance claims from Ping to see if the G410 stacks up with the rest of the drivers on the market.  I want my review to be as interactive as possible, so please ask me as many questions on this testing thread and I will attempt to address them all.  You won’t have to wait for my Stage 2 to head how things are going.  All testers will be actively participating in the thread to provide updates as we go - so we can continue the conversation from day to day.

So I mentioned that the TS2 was my gamer going into this testing, but if you are a regular on the forum, you would have noticed that as of this Stage 1 (April 3rd), I have sold my TS2.  Without divulging too much right now, my 3 range sessions and 2 rounds were enough for me to know that the G410 Plus was going to be better for me going forward.  Furthermore, I believe a good testing write-up should be about the individual club in the test and not about a club going head to head with another club.

So does the Ping G410 Plus carry the torch that was lit by the G400 series?  Early results are positive and I look forward to sharing the rest of my thoughts with the MGS community as the testing progresses.

[jlukes 16,688]

Ping G410 Plus Driver - Stage 2 Review - jlukes

It has been a great 6 weeks testing the G410 Plus driver.  Over the testing period, I have played about 12 rounds of golf and had about 14 range sessions.  I tested the G410 in every weight setting and every hosel setting. I tried to hit draws, fades, cuts, hooks, high bombs, low bullets and everything in between.  I was able to get G410 on trackman and purchased the Arccos system that I had in play for the last few rounds. I made it a point to make this the most thorough club testing I have ever done.  I hope that my fellow forum members enjoyed following along as I posted regular updates and answered questions throughout the testing process. I always enjoy forum testing for MGS, but this one was my favorite by far simply because of how much work I put into.  

Now onto the scoring...

 

Looks

Beauty is always in the eye of the beholder and everyone has their own preferences when it comes to how their golf clubs look.  For me, the G410 Plus is a knockout. I always thought Ping turbulators were gimmicky, but I never spent any time with a Ping driver to really form a real opinion.  Now that I have spent a ton of time with them, I love them. Yes, they provide some sort of aerodynamic properties, but where they really shine for me is how well they work as an alignment aid.  The shape and size of the turbulators do such a great job of framing the ball. I have never had a easier driver to line up.

I also have to say that I am glad that Ping decided to invert the Dragonfly Crown and “hide” it under the hood this go around.  The combination of the turbulators and dragonfly crown on the G400 was a bit much for me, but G410 has a much cleaner look. The paint job is a beautiful matte dark grey and it is such a great finish to look at (and there are no glare issues).  The red, black and silver color scheme is simple and clean on the underside of the club, and the implementation of the weight ports/track does not take away from the aesthetics of the club at all.

Another thing that is often overlooked, but plays a huge role in how the club looks at address, is the size of the adjustable hosel.  Ping has the cleanest implementation of an adjustable hosel in the industry. When looking down at the club, it is barely noticeable. The shaft seems as if it transitions seamlessly into the head.  Just a small detail, but it really completes the look of the G410.

Score: 10 (out of 10 points)

 

Sound & Feel

Having played composite-crowned drivers over the last 6+ years, it was definitely adjustment when I first started hitting the Ping G410.  Heck, I wasn’t even sure I liked it. It  isn't a bad sound like the Nike SQ, it was just very different. There is definitely a tingy-ness to the sound rather than the “thwack” you get with a composite driver.  The more I hit it, the more my hearing adjusted to the sound and it became more and more pleasing. It is definitely a distinctly “Ping” sound, but it is a good sound.

Feel is often linked to sound, but for me, the G410 felt softer than it sounded.  That might not make sense to some people, but I feel that sometimes people associate loud with harsh, but that is not the case here.  The G410 feels explosive. Stability is also a strength of the G410 as I found the feel of the sweet spot to be rather large. If you followed along with my regular updates, you would know that I don’t always find the center of the face.  The feel and sound does differ a bit off low-face and heel-side hits, resulting in a more “thwacky” sound when compared to center and even toe strikes.

For me, the Callaway Big Bertha Alpha was my favorite feeling/sounding driver ever.  It felt explosive and had an intoxicating smooth sound at impact. How does the G410 compare?  All I can say it is different. At first I was slightly turned off, but like one of those deep album tracks from your favorite band, it grows on you over time.  The sound never once impacted how I would swing or my confidence in the club. Is it my favorite sounding driver of all time now? Honestly, it likely isn’t in my Top 3, but it still sounds good and feels even better.  If I could separate the sound and feel scores, it would be 3 out of 5 for sound and 5 out of 5 for feel.

Score: 8 (out of 10 points)

Basic Characteristics

Now that we have the vanity stuff out of the way, it is time to get into the nuts and bolts of the review.  Performance.

From the moment I had my initial fitting, I knew that the G410 was going to be something special.  I have struggled with over-draws for much of the last 36 months and with the Flat hosel setting and weight in the fade position, I was actually able to hit baby fades.  That is just not something I felt I could pull off with my current (and soon after getting the G410 on the course, previous) gamer.

After I got the G410, I went to Club Champion to get some Trackman numbers as well as test shafts.  I posted full details of that experience right here.  What I saw on Trackman were ball speeds in the low to mid 160s and carry distances that were in the 270s and occasionally touching 280+.  Those are lifetime best numbers for me all around. I was really really happy with everything I saw on trackman and couldn’t wait to hit some balls outside to see real ball fights.

I spent a lot of time at the range for this review (twist my arm) and the more I hit the G410, the more I am impressed with it.  I find the G410 to be low/mid spin and very easy to launch. The ball gets up fast and then flattens out for a very appealing flight.  

As I mentioned above, I tested just about every combination of adjustments the G410 had to offer and I found them all to make a noticeable difference.  Loft down to open the face, flatten the lie, and put the weight in the toe and you’ll notice a drastic difference in flight than when you loft up to close the face, neutral lie, and weight in the heel.  I played around with the settings to find an ideal setting for me and I have just about settled on the weight in the neutral position with the hosel set to the big minus sign to open up the face. This setting gives me a desirable baby draw with my standard swing and gives me the ability to hit a power fade if the situation calls for it.

In terms of accuracy, the G410 puts out what you put in.  I didn’t find any issues where a ball didn’t react in a way that wasn’t dictated by the strike.  The ball flew where the face to bath relationship says it should have flown and that is really all you can ask for in any golf club.

When it comes to forgiveness, I found the G410 Plus as stable and forgiving as any driver I have ever tried.  Where the the G410 really impressed me was on ball speed retention on low face hits. Yes, I saw lower launch and higher spin on low face shots, but the ball speed retention was so good that the distance losses were more than acceptable.  Heel and toe hits also produced above average results and I can’t think of one instance where I lost more distance or was more offline than I expected.

Where I think the G410 really shined for me was the distance category, and more specifically, the consistent distances I was seeing.  The G400 Max was an extremely forgiving driver, but it didn’t produce the best ball speed numbers. I feel as if the G410 Plus kept the stability of the G400 Max and added in ball speeds that allows it to compete with every driver on the market.  Is it the longest driver on the market? No. It isn’t. However, that isn’t because of a lack of ball speed, it is because the G410 isn’t a super low spin head. I demoed drivers like the M5, Epic Flash SZ, and TS3 and while all 3 drivers would give me slightly longer drives on well-struck shots, they penalized me more on off-center hits more.  As someone whose miss is a hook, super low spin can spell disaster on a mishit because it leads to ugly quacking duck hooks. While the G410 will never save me from a truly awful swing, I know that there is a greater margin for error.

That greater margin of error allows me to swing more freely, resulting in faster swings and better drives.  When on the range, I felt like I was in cruise control with the G410 in my hand. But we all know what really matters is how it performs on the course.

Score: 19 (out of 20 points)

On-Course Performance

So as many of you know, I undertook a big swing change this offseason, which is still in progress.  However this review isn’t a review of my swing or my struggles - it is a review of the performance of a driver.  On the course, the Ping G410 Plus was everything I could want in a driver. Stable, forgiving, and long. I played about a dozen rounds over the last 6 weeks, most of them at my home courses, and I had drives that left me yardages into greens that I’ve never had before.  Irons into Par 5’s where I am normally hitting at least a hybrid. Sand wedges instead of PW. Mid Irons instead of long irons. No matter the hole, the G410 gave me great results. I have only begun using the Arccos tracking system, but it has already showed me some great data.  Even on poor shots, my drives are still going 250 yards, which is a true testament to how good the G410 is.

I had two rounds where a really struggled with my swing, but even then the G410 produced relatively great results.  I mentioned above that I seemed to get good results off strikes low on the face while at the range. That proved true on the course as shots where I felt like a nearly missed the face entirely still traveled 250 yards, or about 88% of my average distance.  My fairways hit have been around 40%, but that number is more indicative of my swing struggles than the club itself. For me to be carrying drives in the 270s consistently is really something else. Unfortunately I don’t have any hard data to show what my tee game was before the G410, but I know my max carry was in the low to mid 260s and I needed some good roll out to 300.  Now I am seeing my really good drives carry almost 280 and even with the wet conditions we’ve had in the North East I have seen several drives crack 290. On dry days (but before I had Arccos), I had several drives go over 320 yards (measured with GPS watch). That is just absurd for me. I cannot wait to get out of this wet spring and hit some summer fairways with this bomber to see what new parts of the course I can explore.  

While my scores may not have improved yet, mainly due to the swing changes and iron play being worked on, I have no doubt that the added distance and consistency will eventually lead to lower scores.  All of the strokes gained data that MGS publishes shows that distance is king. Hitting longer drives, leading to shorter approach shots, which in turn lead to closer proximity to the hole, is the single most efficient way to improving scoring.  Seeing what the G410 has done over such a short period of time, even while I go through the growing pains of implementing my swing changes on the course, makes me believe that the G410 will absolutely be leading me to lower scores.  I will continue to update this thread as my time with the G410 continues to show just that.

I mentioned in my Stage 1 that I had never gamed a Ping club before.  I always had a perception of Ping that wasn’t quite favorable: I thought they were weird and gimmicky.  Testing the G410 shattered that perception for me and made me really gain a appreciation for the Ping engineering team and what they look to accomplish when they create a club.  I gained so much respect for Ping that I even tried out the G410 fairway wood at a local multi-vendor demo day and to my surprise the G410 LST 14.5* beat out every fairway wood on the market for me and earned a spot in my bag.  So I went from no Ping clubs in my bag ever, to two Ping Clubs in the top of my bag. I won’t lie - Ping firmly has my attention and I will be giving their clubs a shot at earning any spot in my bag going forward.

The G410 Plus is a great step forward from the G400 series.  At the time of this review, the LST head has just been announced and I can definitely say that while I want to try it, I am not sure how good of a fit it will be for me.  I really enjoy the stability and predictability of the G410 Plus and wouldn’t want to sacrifice any of that for a few extra yards. I really don’t see anything I would change in future iterations.  If they Ping engineers could fine tune the sound a bit more, it would appeal a bit more to the masses, but that is really the only major improvement I could see them making.

From the adjustable hosel and the movable weight, to the way the turbulators frame the ball, the G410’s feature set all serves a purpose.  I love that Ping fine tuned their hosel to add flat lie setting for better players, and the weight ports absolutely influence the closure rate of the head.  I hope Ping sticks with the adjustable weights and I wonder if they are already looking at what else they could possible do with them. We know they will never add adjustability if it means sacrificing weight placement and performance, so I am not sure how much more they can tweak this design.  It would be cool if they could offer a front/back weight tuning similar to the Cobra F9, but I am not sure they’d be able to do so while maintaining the weight distribution they desire.

Score: 29 (out of 30 points)
 

Miscellaneous

I have always heard how customer-service oriented Ping was, and this testing proved it.  We received our drivers extremely fast and mine came to the exact spec that I ordered. The packaging was more than acceptable from a protection standpoint.  Another thing I wanted to call out is the cost of additional weights. I wanted to experiment with a slightly different swing weight in both the G410 driver and the LST 3W I purchased.  The price of the weights are noticeably cheaper than competitors’ weights. The Ping driver and FW weights retail for $18 and $13 respectively. In comparison, Cobra F9 Weights are $25. Titleist TS2 weights are $25.  Just a great price point from Ping.

In MGS’s write-up of the Ping G410, they mentioned that Ping redesigned the headcover to be a bit heavier so it would would not blow away in the wind.  While I normally use my own personal headcover for my drive, I did bring the Ping headcover to several range sessions and rounds and can confirm that it definitely doesn’t blow around as easily as other headcovers.  Not something that would make or break the driver, but just a pretty cool detail from Ping.

Score: 10 (out of 10 points)

 

Play it or Trade it?

Considering the G410 Plus knocked my Titleist TS3 driver out of the bag in less than two weeks, it should be no surprise that is is now my full-time gamer.  I truly believe that the Ping G410 maximizes my overall tee game and my game is better for it. The LST version of this head does intrigue me. Did Ping simply create a lower spin version of the G410 plus, maintaining the stability and consistency of the G410, but in a lower spin? If so, that head could potentially change my tune.  I did win a full bag fitting from True Spec Golf, so it is only a matter of time until I find out just how good of a fit the G410 is for me. Until then, it isn’t going anywhere.

I believe the G410, due to all of its adjustability, will fit an extremely wide range of golfers.  We already see tour players using the G410, and there is no doubt that 20+ handicaps could game the G410 as well.  Throw in the SFT and LST heads and Ping has created a line of drivers that literally fits every golfer. 

I believe the $499 price point is right in line with where it should be.  $500 is the going rate for a new premium driver, and that is just a fact of life.  The G410 is the total package and is appropriately priced. Can someone find a used driver from 2017 or 2018 that performs close to the G410 for less money?  Of course they could. But if someone is looking for a new driver in 2019, the G410 should absolutely be at the top of the list to try.

Score: 19 (out of 20 points)

 

Conclusion

So if you’ve made it through the entire review and reached the conclusion, you already know what I am going to say here.  If you have skipped to the conclusion with hopes of getting a quick recap, you’re in luck.

The Ping G410 Plus driver is simply the most well balanced driver I have ever gamed.  It gives me great ball speeds and fantastic stability that result the best drives that I have ever hit.  Throw in the adjustable hosel and weight ports and you have a driver that can be customized to fit just about any golfer.  

A driver should give you confidence the moment you pull it from the bag, remove the headcover and set it down behind the ball and for me the Ping G410 Plus does just that.  I am excited to have the G410 Plus as my driver moving forward and will continue to post updates throughout this thread as the season progresses.

 

Final Score: 95 out of 100 points

[tony@CIC 22,684]

Stage 1 

First and foremost, thank you MGS Mods for selecting me to be an official tester for the G410 SFT.

My name is Tony, I just turned 72 and even though I started playing after I retired, I am obsessed with this game. Prior to retirement I always thought golf was a silly game – after all, how hard could it be to get that LITTLE white ball into that BIG hole. Numerous times on the way home we would pass several fairways at our Club’s golf course and on those cold, or rainy days we would invariably see someone out there playing. My son and I would laugh and talk about those crazy guys out there – what could they be doing or thinking, playing golf in the cold or rain! And then it happened for some unknown reason my wife and I decided to start playing golf. It took one game for me to catch the bug and become obsessed with the game!

 We’re fortunate to live adjacent to a combined Marina and Golf Club with an Arthur Hills 18-hole Links course in northwest Ohio. It is a picturesque course adjacent to Lake Erie, with strong headwinds and it is also a qualifying course for the U.S.Open.   

These past few years have been a long journey. After being fit for G20’s, I took lessons from the head pro which was interesting to say the least, as he was telling me to do several things at once. It reminded me of that Einstein story of taking up golf where he threw 5 balls back at the instructor and said catch, the instructor responded I can’t do that – yes exactly!  With those lessons in the back of my mind I went off to the driving range. The irons weren’t too bad, but my drives had a beautiful slice that from an aerial view would have made a fishing hook proud.

Enter instructor 2 at a Muni. We worked on a lot of things, but he always focused on Position, Grip and Alignment.  Several lessons later: the driver had become more of a fade with a too frequent slice, the irons were ok, and the chipping was a big improvement (due to lots of practice in the backyard).  At this point my index is still in the 30’s because when the driver is working, the irons aren’t and vice versa. Exit this instructor as he decided to move to South Carolina.

I found a new instructor, who immediately recognized a couple of issues and I started working on the improvements, including spine angle and a stronger grip.  Now it’s a consistent draw. Not so bad since most of our penalty areas (aka water hazards) are on the left (remember I’m a lefty).  In the meantime, my driver evolved into a GBB with an Aldilla SR flex shaft. With lots of work at the range, reading and playing as much as possible, my index dropped last summer to a 22 and I did break 90. Oh, and as a side note I was an Official Tester for W/S C300’s – thank you Mods!

This past Fall, we got to play at our course until late November – my index did bump up slightly but only because there’s something about shivering in cold weather that’s not conducive to golf.

 Overall game evaluation 1-10 with 10 being best/most consistent

Driver = 5

Irons = 7

Wedges = 9

Putter = 6

This past Winter I spent my time reading even more and watching instructional videos and when weather allowed, a few trips to a heated driving range. Since I was working on my swing, I intentionally slowed it down to around 76-80 mph (using my SC200) to focus on accuracy. With the slower SS I was getting a much narrower dispersion.  I didn’t pay much attention to distance since it was cold, generally windy and the range was using their “winter” balls. Next step will be working on SS. 

Then the MGS Official Testing for the G410 SFT happened and I was lucky enough to be selected. My reason for applying was threefold: #1 gain more consistency resulting in a narrower dispersion, #2 distance, and #3 sound. Note: with my G20 I could tell by the sound when I had a mishit.  On our course, the first two priorities take the penalty areas out of play for me, along with the potential for higher % GIR’s.

First impression:

With the GBB and SR flex shaft as background, and a prior fitting with the Ping G and SR shaft (which I didn't buy), I ordered the driver with 10.5* loft and the Alta CB 55 shaft in SR flex which is about 10 grams lighter than the Aldilla. The G410 also came with Tour Velvet grips. I’m a big fan of MCC+4 and with my XL glove size, I decided to order it with the orange option which is their jumbo grip.  

 

The driver arrived very quickly, especially given the “less than common” configuration of a lefty head and a SR shaft. The grip initially felt too large – but I did have a pair of FJ rain gloves on when I tried it. Putting one normal golf glove it felt fine. However, at some point I'll replace with the MCC+4. The head is what I expected with a satin finish on top. What was a nice surprise is how good the bottom looks with the red “streaks”.  I never noticed that in the stores.  It looks so good in the bag – I hate to put the cover over the driver.

The head cover, however,  is good looking and a nice improvement over previous Ping covers.

The one thing that was a slight surprise, but only because I didn’t pay attention to the online description is that the weight on the SFT is fixed. In the scheme of things that’s not a big issue for me. However, if you want a sliding weight, you’ll have to move to the G410 Plus.  

The connector is easily adjustable, and the instructions are clear and concise. If you happen to lose the instructions – no worries the connector is clearly marked and has eight settings. Of course, the club did come with a wrench, however, I doubt I’ll be adjusting it once it gets set at the Fitter’s.

Next steps;

Get to a fitter to set the correct loft adjustment. My guess is that it’ll be either set at neutral or .06*  configuration. While I’m at the Fitter, I’m bringing my GBB as well to do a “head to head” comparison. It’ll be my Ping vs. Callaway challenge so stay turned for that.

Additionally, with 2 lesson certificates that my wife gave me for Christmas – I’m going to use one to further improve my drives. My expectations are that the 410 SFT gets me 7-10 additional yds.  plus, a much narrower dispersion and looking for that 5 to move to at least a 7 or 8. .

Let the battle of my drivers begin!

 

[tony@CIC 22,684]

Welcome to Stage 2 of my review of the Ping SFT! Unlike other reviews, stories or articles, I’m going to give you my conclusion first and then tell you why.

Am I happy with the 410 SFT – NO I’m not.  I am THRILLED with it! There is nothing I don’t like about it.

https://vimeo.com/337165176 

So, a bit of background, for those of you that didn’t read my stage 1. I started my driver experience a few years ago with a G20 which was the result of my Club’s fitting day.  That driver went through literally tens of thousands of hits on both the driving range and the course. Many hits later and coupled with lessons, I still had a nagging slice.  Even more lessons later (I’m a slow learner), combined with a GBB which has lots of opportunities to eliminate the slice with an adjustable hosel and a sliding weight, the result was now a push fade. Oh and in between I had a lesson with a recommendation to use a stronger grip. Yup that takes care of the push fade and moves it into the pull hook category.  This is great - I now know that I can “work” the ball. Too bad I can only do it by accident!

But wait, after reading many tomes on shaft’s, with my low to mid 80’s SS I figured out that I needed a senior flex shaft. So now out goes the Hzrdus X Green stock shaft and in comes an Aldilla senior flex.  Yes, I know that I need some expert advice – but that’s the commonsense thing you do only after things don’t work out – right?

Ok, so here I am – late winter 2019 at the driving range with the Aldilla shaft in that GBB and they are mostly pull hooks. Not getting much distance but then it is winter = very cold and old range balls. That’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it.

And now a marvelous opportunity comes along from MGS to be a tester for the 410. (Note Mod’s have I told you how much I like you ). What’s not to like after all it’s always the arrow not the Indian right? This time I decide to go to a real fitter – too bad he’s booked until May 1^st.   So, with SS in hand I go to the Ping site and follow their onsite fitting tool. The result is a 410 SFT with a Soft Flex (aka Senior), standard length shaft. Ok, I was good with that so off goes the spec to Golfspy Stroker. Order me up a SFT, standard length CB-55 shaft with the Jumbo GP Velvet Grip. Talk about speedy customer service – it only took a few days to arrive. Opps sorry Stroker did I forget to mention I’m a lefty - no problem Ping’s superior customer service came through, as they overnighted the new lefty SRT to me.  So on to the evaluation:

Let’s start with looks: Score = 9 out of 10

Perhaps it’s because I spent so much time with a beaten-up G20, I’m very comfortable with the matte finish. But then it’s not something I pay attention to as I’m standing over the ball.  Overall pretty standard Ping driver look with the “Turbulors” on top but with a striking series of red stripes on the bottom. As reported in my Stage 1, the stripes look good enough that you don’t want to put a cover over them.  The only thing better would be if they had red flames instead of stripes on the bottom.  The cover is a nice upgrade from previous years, incorporating the Ping 410 logo with red stripes and it slips on and off easily. I’m glad they did away with the old “sock” type of covers from years ago that were more difficult to take on and off.

 

Sound and Feel: Score = 9 out of 10

Before I got to the fitter, I had a chance to use the driver both at a range and on the course. I also took my GBB along on several occasions as a comparison. I quickly realized that even without the fitter dialing it in for me this club was going straighter than my GBB and my G20.  The one thing I really didn’t like about my GBB (outside of the pull hooks) was the sound – more dull than the sharp crisp sound I had with my G20. The sound of the SFT is a bit clunkier if you hit it off the toe but overall a much better sound experience.  I can tell, without looking up how I hit the ball – which as a side note helps me keep my head down.  I am hitting - the ball well. Is it the SFT or am I getting better? Not sure and who cares .

 

Basic Characteristics: Score = 18 out of 20

 Thankfully, it’s now May 1^st, so onto the fitter and none too soon because a big complaint is that I’m not getting the distance that I thought I would. This is my first real fitting session (I’m not counting Club fitting days) and initially it was a bit unusual because I’m hitting in front of an audience (a few “guests had stopped by). The result is I’m spraying the ball all over the place (see Trackman graph below).  Very Embarrassing! Finally, they leave, and I calm down and I’m driving the ball relatively straight. The first thing the fitter said to me is ‘you’re going to really make me work for this aren’t you’. He then proceeds to put me into a Ping 400 Max and Ping 410 Plus as a comparison to make sure I didn’t make a mistake ordering the SFT vs. the Plus.  Neither 400 or 410 Plus worked well for me and then he puts me into a Regular Flex CB-55 shaft on the SFT and I immediately pick up 14 yards of carry at 2 mph less of SS and a close dispersion.  He also stated that because of my swing (which he termed “violent”), I need a slightly shorter shaft,  so for $72 I ordered a 45 1/4” Regular Flex and as a result I should expect slightly more yardage gain.   Obviously, I need continued work on my swing especially on the “Attack Angle”, but the following trackman graph is very telling.  I only included the SR Flex shaft = dark green, the regular flex shaft = turquoise and final loft adjustment to the regular flex shaft = brown.  I didn’t include the other combinations as they weren’t relevant and would make the graph tougher to read. Additionally, there is a fair amount of dot overlap – however, the turquoise and brown dots are still representative. Obviously, the (somewhat faint) horizontal line represents center line and yardages. The brown dots were the result of the SFT set at 6* loft, which is what I’m sticking with since those drives are closest to the center 0 yds to approximately 15 yds right (draw).

Again, based on the numbers: Attack Angle, Face Angle, etc. I still have some work to do on my swing. However, regardless of the that, I am still more consistent and longer with the R Flex than I was with the SR Flex. And longer than my GBB and G20.

Note: My on-course results are averaging 200 + yds.

My score of 18/20 is based on the following;

The sound: it’s more of a thwack vs. a thud of the GBB.  Since not quite as crisp as my G20, but still nice.

Trajectory is high – but then that’s the result of both the shaft and the loft adjustments by the fitter and it’s working for me.

Accuracy: If I had to give marks for just this as a category it’d be 20/20. It is right on the money.  I am nailing the fairways right down the middle or close to it!

Adjustability: It’s currently dialed in by the fitter for optimization. Could I easily adjust it? Of course, but why would I want to since the fitter has it dialed in. However, keep in mind that the SFT doesn’t have a sliding weight, on the other hand I don’t think I need one.

 On-Course Performance: Score = 40 out of 40

 I don’t have access to ARCCOS or another measuring device so I’m including 2 pic’s of the GPS app for our course. As a point of reference, this hole #10 at our Club is a 462 yd par 5,– so the first night with the new R Flex shorter shaft, I drove it approx. 207 yds smack dab in the middle of the fairway. (A special note to Mods reading this, I’d like to be an Official Tester for ARCCOS  .  

This SRT, especially for high handicappers like myself, makes one want to do a happy dance!

 This driver inspires my confidence and as a result I’m scoring better – that says it all! I have a high level of confidence that when I walk up to the tee I’m going to launch the ball straight and high. At this point, with really less than a month in (because of the shaft change), I would advise Ping not to change a thing when it comes to the actual club. Let me say this again: this SFT is straighter and longer than my GBB and G20. I see more GIR’s in my future.

On the other hand, I do feel that the online fitting tool steered me to the wrong shaft – the Senior Flex vs. a Regular Flex (cut down). I’m now even more convinced of the importance of a real fitting – not just a fitting day at the course or a casual tryout in a big box store.

 Play it or Trade it? Score 20 out of 20  

 You’ll have to pry this driver out of my hands before you get it back! I won’t even let my men’s league partner (who’s also a lefty) try it. I’m not going to give it up for anything!

 

Overall Score 96 out of 100

 

[PING Apologist #9 4,568]

STAGE-1

TESTER INTRODUCTION for: Official MGS 2019 PING G410 SFT Driver Review

SUBMITTED BY: PING Apologist #9

 Greetings Fellow Spies! My name is Robert and I am here to share my initial thoughts about one of PING’s newest driver models for 2019; The PING G410 SFT (Straight Flight Tech).

First, I must thank everyone at MGS and the fine folks at PING Golf for entrusting me to test & evaluate the performance of this newest driver. It is a true honor and one that I take very, very seriously. I hope that my experiences with it will help you determine whether or not it lives up to the maker’s claims and if it will be worthy of your hard-earned dollars to consider buying for yourself. Stay tuned as I hope to answer both of those questions over the next several weeks.

 

A bit about myself as a “golfer”. I live, work & play here in Southwestern Idaho, and though I’ve golfed here and there over the span of 30 years, I’ve never really considered golf as a serious hobby. But just over a year-and-a-half ago, I got the bug and started the journey with club purchases, constant upgrades and endless tinkering. Now I consider golf to be my “primary” hobby with fly fishing being a close second.

My golf skill-set at this point is still mostly self-taught and I sit at a rather high and unfortunate 21 handicap. I’d much rather go out and play than practice most days, and this mentality probably holds me back quite significantly. My game strengths are chipping, wedge play, short irons and I love hitting my 3 and 5 woods. However, hitting driver is still an adventure for me. Even though I currently game the G400 SFT which is supposed to correct a slice (and why I chose it), my general shot shape is still a fade and my miss is the bad slice right. About 50% of my drives are “good” and travel 230-240-yds with a slight cut...Here's a "good-un"...

 

Just like many, I really need to be able to make driver more of a consistent asset and not a continued enigma since I tend to use it a lot. I hit it on most par-4s & almost all par-5’s. I do not possess enough distance with my longer irons for those 160-190 yard shots (my true weakness) to avoid hitting driver from most tees. My 3 & 5-woods will save me usually when I need a 190-220 shot and sometimes I can get to some par-5’s in two with one of those clubs, but not too often. Plus, driver is just plain fun to hit! I need and want one that helps me have consistent distance and most of all, goes straight!

After MGS declared the G400 LST as the Most-Wanted Driver of 2018  (https://mygolfspy.com/2018-most-wanted-driver), I knew I had to get into a 400…and pronto! That’s just what I did last August, and all though I didn’t fit into the  (then) vaunted LST, the SFT model was a better suited to me and it remains my current gamer.

So when PING announced the pending release of the new G410 line late last year, I was honestly a bit surprised. To me it seemed that the G400 series was cooking along just fine and really hadn’t been out long enough to be in need of any sort of upgrade. PING is constantly noted for their engineering prowess, and they too are also known for not just willy-nilly releasing new gear out to market “just because”. My first question I had for them when introducing this new line-up was “Why?” Was there something wrong with the G400’s?! Was an improvement needed so quickly???!!

Their mantra has always been that a replacement line of golf clubs must have some true data to back up the fact that they really outperform the one they are intended to replace. This current paradox shall be the primary crux of my evaluation and I am very curious if this “improved” design does indeed give enough added benefits that are good enough to kick my beloved G400 out of the bag...

But let’s be honest here. Ping hasn’t truly embraced the “adjustability” trend, especially with their driver, however this newest offering seems to have finally addressed that; especially considering other clubs in this same generation (like their newest G410 hybrids) now offer removable shafts and an adjustable hosel, where the same clubs from the 400 series did not. For driver they now have 8-way adjustability up from 4-way options before which did not include any loft settings. This is a leap in PING’s thinking, but is it too late and too redundant? 

Well, here is what PING states about the G410 SFT (https://ping.com/clubs/drivers/g410-sft

 “The G410 SFT (Straight Flight Technology) provides maximum fade and slice correction while delivering all the performance benefits of the G410 Plus such as a high MOI and faster ball speed. A fixed weight on the extreme perimeter and 50% more heel-side CG than G400 ensures straighter ball flights. A lighter D1 swingweight helps square the face at impact.”

And this is what they had to say about the G400 SFT (https://ping.com/clubs/drivers/g400-sft

 “The G400 SFT (Straight Flight) is custom-engineered with more heel-side tungsten weighting and a lighter swingweight to help square the face and generate right-to-left shot bend (right-handed golfers). The multi-material design combines reduced drag and a thinner, stronger, faster T9S+ forged face to increase speed and distance. With a combined MOI over 9,000 and a deep CG, improved accuracy leads to tighter dispersion.”

Are the G410 drivers better than the G400’s? Both descriptions sound very, very similar with the only exception being that the 410 has “50% more heel-side CG” than the 400 which you can easily (I hope) see below.

Standard-issued swing weights are similar (both D1) and they both claim “faster” ball speed which is this year’s buzz term from everybody this year, or so it seems…. We shall see and I intend to find out if that 50% is the “shiznay” or just so much smoke.

Just a day after I was awarded this honor, I set an appointment for a fitting. While my current driver was fitted to me, it was done so without the aid of a launch monitor. This time was to be my first foray into a hitting bay with a fitter. It was ugly. Swing speed was lower than I thought (only 90 at best) and I couldn’t seem to hit one straight to save my life. Add to that, they didn’t have a demo SFT head, so had to hit the “Plus” head with the weight in the “Draw-Bias” position which I don’t believe has the same “umph” for the draw-bias an actual SFT head does. Anyhow, I tried several shafts, and though the slices continued to rack up on the monitor, I settled for the Mitsubishi Tensei CK Orange in stiff.

Regular flex just felt weird and I didn’t see much in the way of improvement, so I stuck to stiff which also will allow a more accurate “apples-to-apples” comparison between it and my 400. I had it cut down by ½” from the 45.75” norm which actually makes it a D0 swing weight according to my official PING "Birth Certificate".

And I had the standard size GP Tour Velvet grip put on which suits me just fine...

As for testing, I will put this 410 in direct competition with my 400, which may wind up being a bit of a battle...

So, I will be gathering side-by-side data on the range with my basic launch monitor, shot scope app, in hitting bays with launch monitors and then game them and see if there are any differences at all between their performance. Most of all, I want to know if the added 50% of heel-side CG will help me have a more consistent and straight ball flight that is noticeably better than my 400...

Strap in Spies and please send me any questions or testing ideas you’d like to see done. I will be happy to also share my "first-impressions" with you, just ask. I am here at your service. Please be looking for my Phase-II coming soon. Thanks for reading! Cheers all!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PING Apologist #9 4,568]

PING G410 SFT Driver - Stage 2 Review - Ping Apologist #9

 

Welcome back for my Stage-II review! It’s been a wet-n-wild 6-weeks or so since I received this weapon and I’ve done my best to put it through its paces. 5 or 6 different range-only sessions coupled with at least that many rounds have been all I could muster, but it has been enough for me to come to my conclusions. I’ve used every hosel position, tried a different shaft and even re-gripped it already. Although I know I’ve fallen a little short in the hard-data-gathering aspect of things, this review is certainly heavy with “analog” thoughts and feelings on getting a new driver more from the point-of-view of the average guy buying golf equipment off the rack which I believe is more in spirit line with the majority of golfers in the world.

 

LOOKS

 

          What can I say? Black goes with everything and when red is in the mix, it becomes a classic (if somewhat sinister…think Black Widow) look that should appeal to many. The tone of red PING uses on this series of clubs is subdued and definitely not overpowering. I think, gives the club a business-only kind of look and then add a few chrome touches and I think you have a winner.  Even with the stock Alta CB Red shaft plugged in, the matte paint on it keeps it from a distracting the user and from also blinding your playing partners with some sort of “look-at-me” freaky bling.  The crown is nice to look at and has less of those famous “dragonfly” effects on top and I think it looks “better”.  Also of note, the similarly-famous Turbulators appear to be a bit more prominent than the G400 and the face has a bit more detail to it.  All these aspects combine into a package that should be appealing to most everyone. My only gig is the head cover. It was a little hard to squeeze on & off and I’d ask that a revisit be done to reintroduce covers that have an outer cuff that you can put your fingers into and use to pull it down over the head easier.

 

SCORE: 9/10

 

SOUND & FEEL

 

          Literally, my very first experience hitting this club had me asking myself out loud: “What the Hell was PING thinking..??!!” I was not pleased with the sound it makes at ALL. In fact it seemed to be on par with the sound my old G-Series driver made (think of an empty garbage pail falling over), which I absolutely HATED. Then after hitting it side-by-side with my G400, I was devastated. The G400 has much more of a quiet “thunk” compared to the re-visited “toink” I was hearing again from this G410. For me, PING went backwards on this one. The major appeal to me for saving up and buying the G400 last August was mainly because it sounded WAY better than the G. This driver sounds almost as loud as a G and has taken some time to get used to. (Disclaimer: Try as I might, my efforts to put together a sound comparison between my 400 & 410 all failed and I’ve omitted them for lack of quality.) Sorry PING. You lost me on this one…

          Now as for feel, not much I can iterate here other than…well…it just feels good. Normal. Expected. The big 455cc head on the end of my shortened (-1/2”) shaft with the factory-set D0 swing-weight gives me confidence to let-er-rip. The materials used and the supreme engineering behind it all are amazing and lend to a positive mindset when drawing it from the bag and whirling it about. I’d say it simply feels “natural”. Mis-hits are obvious by both sound and feel, but while a mis-hit won’t shatter your teeth out, you certainly do get immediate feedback that this last shot was something other than center-punched. With this club, I can usually tell before I look at the face where it came off from both the feel & the dreaded sound it made.

SCORE: 6/10 (only 1-pt given for sound, 5-pts for feel)

BASIC CHARACTERISTICS

 

          PING claims that the “SFT” (Straight Flight Technology) built into this head by placing a single heavy weight off center near the shaft area on the back of the head, provides “maximum fade and slice correction”. For me..? Not so fast! I can still slice the snot out of any given shot even with an impact in the sweet spot. So, no. This is not a magic club and it will NOT automatically correct a crummy swing. Do not buy this club with that false expectation. While I believe this technology does help, if you continue to come in steep and swipe across the ball, a-slicing you will go.

          The new “8-lobe trajectory tuning” hosel is certainly a departure from the 4-way adjustment of the recent past for PING. You can make some pretty wholesale changes to not only loft (+or- 1 or 1.5*), but now can change the lie angle a bit between -1* and +1*. I played around with these settings quite a bit and will most likely continue to do so while I continue to fine tune, but nearly every time I deviated from -1* down in loft, I always seemed to come back to that setting. Different shafts I want to try will start this game all over again, but it sure is nice to have these additional fitting options to try out on your on and on the fly. Kudos to PING for this engineering marvel!

          The forged face is awesome and durable. The before-mentioned prominent turbulators certainly lend to a very easy and repeatable aiming point at address and again the matte finish to the top of the head makes addressing the ball a pleasure without distraction from any sort of glare.

SCORE: 20/20

 

ON-COURSE PERFORMANCE

 

          During my early testing of this club, I fiddled with a stronger grip after it was pointed out to me that I had regressed back to a weak one. Though it felt a bit odd, I began to warm up to it and immediately began seeing better and longer iron shots and it also really woke up the driver on the range-especially in the distance category. The very next session at the range really proved this out and I was pounding them hard with one registering in at 270!!! Taking this new-found grip to the course however, turned out to not be an instant magic elixir with the driver. I continued to struggle with “power fades” and it seemed that hitting into the short grass was just not in the cards. In fact, the first 18 played solely with this driver, I had a total of ZERO fairways hit. Not cool. However, if/when I could find my ball, I was usually 10 to even 30-yds further up and THAT was a huge bonus and this simply meant to me that I had to do a better job at finding the right, repeatable grip and right swing to suit this club’s potential. It’s there…I just have to learn to unlock it better. A few more rounds after this have been better, but I am still struggling a bit with it but refuse to fault the club for my flaws. I know the consistent 240-260 is there. It is up to me to control that power better. More to come on this one, but at the time of this posting, I remain at a steady 22 HCP and still score in the mid to low 90’s even with this beast at my disposal. Tough call here, but my score is:

SCORE: 20/30

 

MISCELLANEOUS

 

          PING has really stepped-up with their “no up-charge” shaft offerings and for no more than the standard retail price of this club, you can be fitted into several brands and models that not too long ago, would have been considered “premium” or “elite” shaft options. It seems just a year or two ago one would have been charged an obscene amount of cash to get shafts like these and now they are available to us “common” folk... I dig my Mitsubishi Chemical Tensei Orange 60 and further love that if I paid for this head and that shaft with my own dollars, it would not have exceeded the retail off-shelf price of one from Dick’s (or wherever) with the stock Alta shaft in it. Add to this PING’s vaunted and legendary customer service. For me, A#1 bar none. They will bend over backwards to assist you and always do things right.

SCORE: 10/10

 

PLAY IT, or TRADE IT?

 

          Sorry G400… You are gone…

For me, a round-ish 50-year-old and one who has struggled for distance, the 410 SFT driver fits the bill and has displaced the 400 and now resides permanently in my bag. That night on the range where I was hitting everything well, it was just obvious that the G410 was better than the G400…even despite my misgivings about the way the 410 sounds. Screw it! At this point I’ll take every yard I can get, so I sold off my G400 and used those funds to get a girlfriend for my G410 driver…a brand new G410 7-wood… This little club ROCKS! It filled the gap I had between 5i & 5w and for me reflects just how good the whole darned G410 line is as an over-all series. Stock shaft, stock grip and stock setting. Right off the rack, a monster. My G410 SFT clubs are in play, no apologies!

SCORE: 20/20

 

CONCLUSION

 

FINAL SCORE: 85/100

 

          TRY ONE!!! IMMEDIATELY!!! You will not be disappointed and you may even be surprised. With the addition of the G410 LST (Low Spin Tech) drivers just a few days ago, the PING G410 line is finally complete and should appeal to just about all types of golfers. As for my personal misgivings about the sound my driver makes, don’t let that little gig prevent you from giving one of these a whirl. It may grow on you and is distinctive enough to maybe even be proud of. To me, the investment made of your hard-earned dollars will be instantly realized as a solid investment into your golfing future.

          Thank-you for reading and please feel free to ask me any questions you have at any time.

 

Edited May 26, 2019 by PING Apologist #9
spelling

[fixyurdivot 18,140]

Ping G410 Plus Driver Review - Stage 1

Hello to all my fellow MGS’s who visit the Official Product Testers sub forum for some no-nonsense, candid Intel about all the new products that promise to rock our golf world.  For me personally, this sub forum and the product reviews written by the staff are what made MyGolfSpy my choice as the golf forum to spend time being part of.   

First off, a HUGE Thank You to MGS and PING who, along with other manufacturers, make these product testing opportunities possible!  What a fantastic way to engage us mere mortal, non-professional golfers, and get feedback from a wide cross-section of players.  Seriously, the whole “product tester” thing is crazy cool and I am both honored and excited to have been selected for the Ping G410 Driver testing!!

I would also like to give a quick shout out and Thank You to George at Desert Hills GC, Yuma, AZ for offering to do my club fitting.  When I told him the situation (being selected by MGS as a product tester), he scheduled me right in so I could get the data back for the order.  If you are ever in Yuma, AZ, play a round at Desert Hills and say hi to George and Drew - great guys doing a fantastic job running that course.

My Background

So, just who is this @fixyurdivot dude?  My name is Bill, now 58 and I started golfing about age 7 in Ft. Lauderdale, FL.  My Dad absolutely loved the game and introduced me to it.  A used set of junior Chi-Chi Rodriguez clubs and a plaid golf bag became the tools of my trade. On Saturdays, myself and a couple of other neighborhood friends would get dropped off at a course where we’d get lessons and then play a small par 3 until late afternoon when someone would pick us up.  A year later, I was playing in Junior Golf of America (JGA) and spending Saturday’s chewing up courses around south Florida which included Doral CC, Jackie Gleason Inverrary and Bonaventure GC.  I never won a single event but the memories are still with me.

I continued to play the game all my life – with bursts of focused effort/interest followed by periods of lackadaisical play. While in the Air Force, I once again got the bug and played quite a bit.  I shot my lowest round ever (74) at Mather AFB in Sacramento, CA.  Upon getting my Mechanical Engineering degree, my wife and I relocated to WA where I went to work for Boeing.  I soon joined a work golf league and played pretty regularly – up until the last 5 or so years of my 30 years with them when travel, workload, and responsibilities made finding time a challenge.

In 2016 I opted for early retirement and we moved to the golf capital of the world – Montana!  Now I must confess that fly fishing is my #1 passion and I handle a 5 weight much better than a 5i, but golf is a really, really close second and I soon found myself playing the local courses.  Combine that with our “snowbird” travel from Nov-Mar here in Yuma, AZ, where I play 3 times a week, and my fly rods are feeling left out.

My Golf Game

My current game has been pretty steady and I typically shoot in the 80’s.  I don’t keep an official handicap, but my math has me at 13 presently.  My best official handicap (11) was in the early 90’s. Inconsistency tends to be my nemesis – shooting a 38 on one side and a 47 on the other.  Staying clear of “blow-up” holes when having a good round going is also problematic and most often it’s a drive gone OB that was the cause.  I would say iron play is my strength as is my chipping.  I have a pretty compact swing (not a huge rotation), not a really long hitter, and my typical driver ball flight is straight to slight fade.  Another challenge I have is keeping swing tempo down.  I’ve really been focusing on that the last couple of years and made BIG improvements, but I still get in trouble with that.

I find myself playing courses much smarter these days then years ago.  I lay up a bit more rather than trying to reach a par 5 in two – and to be honest, I’m still hitting as far, or further than a decade ago.  While I still take aggressive lines off the tee, particularly when I’m driving well, I pay more attention to course conditions when choosing to do so.  The “swing for the fence” mentality has slowly changed to a “manage the course” approach.  I also find the "swing easy, hit well and far" approach to work for me.

What’s in my bag?

Well, let’s just get right to it – I still play PingEye 2 irons.   I purchased these new in 1988 and have been playing them ever since.  Up until last year, I gamed a Callaway Great Big Bertha, 8.5 degree driver.  What can I say; I’m German-Irish stubborn, frugal, and not easily hooked by slick marketing and bling. It was only after repeated suggestions (ok, harsh teasing) from friends, that I needed to move into the current century in golf technology, that I purchased my current Callaway Razr-Fit driver in January 2018.  I was fitted for the driver and it was among three I tested at the Kartsen Golf Facility at ASU.  I immediately saw significant improvement in driving distance, accuracy, and forgiveness – silently asking myself why the hell I did not make that upgrade years earlier. 

Bill's Antique Clubs:

So, this opportunity to test PING's newest driver technology is really interesting in my case.  Having just made a logarithmic shift in driver technology, 1990 to 2014 circa, how much more could I possibly be missing?  I am hitting the Razr-Fit very well and have confidence with it.  The G410 Plus has a steep hill to climb. Will it reduce those OB score killers?  Will its selectable “draw/fade” weight option, or 8 position shaft tuning feature allow me to get more draw ball flight? Will it yield faster club head speeds and carry distance?  We shall see…. we shall see.

First Impressions

To be brutally honest, I do not find the G410 to be the sexiest looking driver.  In fact, to me, it has a Chevy Truck vs. Lamborghini look to it.  More utilitarian than posh, it has a brutish appearance that simply says “I’m ready for work”.  The black, matte finish crown has no contrasting sheen areas, no logos, and no ball alignment mark.  The “Turbulators” (small raised humps) on the crown are carried over from the G400 for improved aerodynamics – faster club head speed.  At 455 cc in size, the G410 looks pretty compact compared to many of its competitors.  This is a plus for my taste as I really dislike the “VW Bug on a stick” look.  In comparison to my current driver, which is also smaller in look for a 458cc size, the G410 gets a thumbs up.  At address, it looks great to my eye. The head cover is of nice quality and well made; sporting the PING logo and G410 designation. The graphics on the Alta CB shaft picks up the red accent on the driver head quite nicely and looks great.  

The Spec Sheet:

The sole of the driver, interestingly enough, provides a bit more glitz with the PING name in bold chrome letters along with the G410 moniker.  The leading edge of the sole has a black mirror chrome appearance which transitions into a v-shaped wear area.  The forged face is fairly nondescript having a milled finish with contrasting white and light grey groove marks.  It's as if PING is saying “it’s not the bling on the outside, but what’s under the hood that really matters”... and I'd be the first to tell you I'm good with that.

Ping’s first “moveable weight” system for ball flight control is likewise kept demure with only a thin, red pin stripe following the arc of the weight track along the trailing edge of the head.  The weight can be moved from the center “neutral” to either a forward “fade” or rear “draw” position.  This feature is the principal difference between the "Plus" and "SFT" - the latter having a fixed periphery weight designed to prevent fade/slice ball strikes.  On the surface, these seem a bit "gimmicky" to me. I'm really curious just how this feature will affect ball flight.  I still tend to push more than pull shots and would love to see this feature work as advertised. This is something I will be evaluating and reporting on. 

 

My Fitting

My fitting took place at the range and using the ES14 launch monitor. George had all of the available driver lofts and the four shafts.  Both my Callaway GBB and my current Callaway Razr-Fit are 8.5 degree loft.  Because I tend to still hit these pretty high, I told George I think the 9 degree would be a good baseline for me - he agreed. I started off warming up with my 6i and he used that to get some initial impressions of my swing and speed.  He suggested the Alta CB Red in stiff, standard length. I hit the first half dozen or so shots well, fairly straight, and out just past the 200 yard marker.  I then had a couple of hard pulls left.  He switched me to the regular stiffness shaft and I again hit the first handful pretty straight and to about the same distance, but with higher trajectory.  We then change from the neutral (0) to the (-) position - which changes loft from 9 to 8 degrees.  I started seeing a bit more fade and contact marks out towards the toe. We changed back to the stiff shaft and with the same (-) setting. I was back to hitting more to center, with lower trajectory.  He felt I could probably make either the regular or stiff work, but that I would likely see more accentuated pull and fade with the regular when I really lean into the shot.  I asked about the other available shafts; (Project X Even-Flow, Tour, and Alta Distanza) and he said that except for the Distanza the others were more tailored for a player with much faster swing speed. 

What's Next

OK Mr. G410 you’ve peaked my interest, but this is range time, not game time.  What are you bringing to the course?  Next up are some initial rounds with the Razr-Fit left at home – providing no emergency backup .  Hopefully I can squeeze in another day at the range using their LM for some further fine tuning of the loft/lie and some head to head data against my Razr-Fit. We will then be heading back home to Montana where I have scheduled some time later this spring with a club fitter in Bozeman that has a ForeSight GC Quad launch monitor.  My plan is to repeat the comparison with my current driver, but also get ball flight data using game balls.  As the snow and frost clears, more rounds will be played ultimately seeing if PING's new “top gun” is better than my $60.00 Razr-Fit.  Stay tuned for updates and Stage 2.

Thank you so much for taking the time to read!

[fixyurdivot 18,140]

Stage Two - Review of PING's G410 Plus Driver

Again, THANKS SO MUCH to MGS for this opportunity!  If there is a cooler golf program going on anywhere on the i-net, I haven't found it. Also a shout out and thank you to George at Desert Hills G.C. in Yuma, AZ, and Woody Spainhower (PGA) of Pureshot Golf in Bozeman, MT for their assistance.  I really appreciate it guys! 

Looks (8 out of 10 points)

As I stated in my Stage 1 review, to my eye, the G410 is very modest in appearance.  As compared to say Callaway's Epic Flash and Cobra's F9 Speedback, the G410 kind of reminds me of the Ford Bullitt Mustang - minimal pinstriping, chrome, and badging. You know, that modest looking car that pulls up alongside the hot rod and then watches the hot rod vanish in the rearview mirror.  It's not to say the G410 is dull in appearance, but that it's not among those on the rack that jumps out at you with bold colors and bling. From address, it has a very subdued silvery-black matte finish. The small raised "turbulator" ribs on the top of the crown are the only features that really stand out. I do like that, for a 455cc size head, it is a compact design and does not come close to the "turtle on a stick" look.  The matte finish has actually grown on me since switching from my Razr-Fit which has a high gloss, deep black finish.  

The adjustable weight nests inside a slot running around the periphery and is not visible at address.  It is a clean look and well designed.  The forged face is likewise low key having typical V-shaped ball strike zone with alignment marks to each side. The modest amount of bling is on the sole plate where the chrome PING logo and G410 label are located.

Sound & Feel (8 out of 10 points)

The G410 ranks high in both sound and feel.  Admittedly, I'm not one that is picky or pays much attention to how clubs sound.  Perhaps that simply due to the fact that I have such a limited resume of clubs played.  I find the sound of this driver to be acceptable and very similar to the handful of modern technology drivers I have tested in recent years.  At some point, I should scout out a brand/model that sounds like a sledgehammer striking a Sequoia tree and one that sounds like ball peen hammer striking a garbage can lid - so I have a good reference .  I place much more value on feel and find the G410 quite solid.  I don't notice that much difference in feel be it a slight mishit or hitting dead center.  

Range Performance (19 out of 20 points)

Much like that nondescript Mustang Bullitt, the G410 does all its talking on the track.  Those who are getting to know me on the forum know by now that I am not a golf tech junkie.  I always suspect the marketing folks as being 97% baloney.  Combine that with the frugal side of me and you have a "hard sell" - the customer the sales guy/gal would prefer to pass on.  My recent switch from a Callaway GBB Warbird (90's circa) driver to my Razr-Fit (2014 circa) driver definitely made a positive shift in my game.  But, to be totally honest, I would in no way have considered buying a PING G410 thinking it would offer improvement commensurate with the investment. 

At the range during my fitting, I was immediately seeing a difference in ball flight - a bit lower, more piercing path.  I followed this session up again with a head to head test against my Razr-Fit.  I had no doubts that the G410 was a top shelf driver.  It follows the extremely popular and highly rated G400 driver. My personal interest, and hopefully of interest to others who, like me, fall on the "show me, I'm from Missouri" side of buying decisions, is just how much better can a handful of years make in golf driver technology?

Club	Smash Factor	Spin	Ball Speed	Club Speed	Carry Distance
Razr-Fit	1.47	2132	128	87	206
Driver	1.46	2203	130	89	209
	1.46	2218	131	90	211
	1.42	2394	128	90	206
	1.47	2174	132	90	213
	1.51	1978	133	88	215
	1.48	2102	130	89	213
	1.50	2096	129	90	212
	1.46	2223	130	89	210
	1.49	2138	131	90	214
	1.47	2165.8	130.2	89.2	210.9
G410 Plus	1.52	1954	137	90	222
Driver	1.51	1978	133	88	218
	1.47	2160	131	89	215
	1.43	2386	132	92	213
	1.51	1978	133	88	215
	1.44	2404	133	93	215
	1.52	1936	134	88	217
	1.51	1978	133	88	215
	1.46	2248	134	92	217
	1.50	2042	135	90	219
	1.49	2106.4	133.5	89.8	216.6

So the numbers show improvements across the board. Is an extra 6 yards of carry distance worth the price of admission?  I wish the LM had total distance as well because I suspect the more piercing ball flight increased this data point even more.  I followed this test up with a comparison at Pureshot Golf in Bozeman, MT.  Woody Spainhower is my golf fitter and recently opened this very nice facility in June 2018.  When I asked him if he would be willing to help out with this review, using his state-of-art launch monitor equipment, he said absolutely!  

Once again I chose to test the Callaway Razr-Fit to the PING G410 Plus.  I know some suggest these reviews shouldn't necessarily focus on comparing the feature club to a competitor, but for me, it really helps make the review meaningful.  I look at it this way; if I'm about to spend $500.00 on the latest technology driver, it needs to prove itself against my regular gamer. We started off with the Razr-Fit (which I hadn't hit for over two months now) and then switched to the G410. Worth noting is that we had just completed a second iron fitting exercise which lasted a good hour (more on that in another thread).  But, to be sure, I was warmed up - perhaps even working on the bottom half of my tank.  Oddly, I wasn't striking the G410 as well as I've been and Woody immediately asked what base loft and adjusted loft setting I had (9 degree nominal, set to 7.5 degree).  He noticed that my spin rate and ball apex was too low.  He adjusted it to the (+) setting, or 10 degree loft.  That change got my spin rate into a range he liked and raised my ball height.

MGS's 2019 Most Wanted Golf Swing (Don't blink or you'll miss it )

Initial data with G410 as I had it set and playing it:

Woody Spainhower at PureShot Golf (pay no attention to the man at the controls )

My standard ball flight (yeah, don't I wish )

We also noted that the with the change in loft setting, my ball strike zone had shifted back towards center.  The last thing I asked him about was the "sliding weight system" and whether they really work. I explained that I purposely chose the Plus model for the versatility of adjustment.  Swings can/do change over time and I really like the pretty wide range of adjustability this driver offers.  We switched from my "neutral" setting to "draw" and, indeed, we saw a slight shift (lessening) of my typical left to right fade.

Shift in strike area

On-Course Performance (40 out of 40 points)

Well, I wouldn't have anticipated it, but the G410 proved even better on the course than it did on the range.  I now have 14 rounds played using this driver and the results are very good. Both of my lowest scoring rounds in Yuma were with this club in the bag. I know it's not the reason for the scores, but in both rounds, the driver was working well. Still capable of slicing one into the canyon or duck hooking one into the creek - oh sure, absolutely.  But much like I saw with the switch from the Great Big Bertha WB to the Razr-Fit, those are much less frequent and mishits change from slices to fades and hooks to draws... these modern drivers are just much more forgiving.  I'm still making small adjustments with the club.  Most recent has been lowering my tee height slightly.  I found myself tending to hit a bit high a time or two a round and skying one straight but short. With today's ball flight analysis and loft and CG (neutral to draw) changes, I'm excited to see of even better course performance in is store!

Play it or Trade it? (18 out of 20 points)

So this is both an interesting and difficult question.  Would I choose to pay $500.00 for the relatively marginal gains in ball flight data/performance?  The answer is no.  Now if the changes were on the scale of improvement the G410 and the Razr-Fit offer to what I'd been playing for the better part of 20 years - absolutely, and this would be a 20 out of 20 score.

Actually, that's not true.  I know exactly what I'm going to do.  It's staying in the bag and is my new gamer driver unless it starts misbehaving badly at which time the Razr-Fit will be gassed and ready to go. 

Conclusion (Final 93 out of 100 points)

The PING G410 Plus is everything as advertised.  With a nice selection of no upcharge, high end shafts, it is, IMO, a top shelf competitor.  When I was shopping for a new driver in 2018, I tested TaylorMade, Cleveland, PING, Adams, Callaway, and Titleist - both current and prior year models.  All had their pro's and con's but all did offer a significant shift in forgiveness - and most improved distance performance as well.  I settled on the used Razr-Fit mostly by chance and have been really happy playing it since January 2018.  On a whim, I stopped at a PING Demo while in Yuma, AZ and tested the G400... I hit it well and there was something about it I really liked. Had I not just purchased the RF, I would likely have pursued a G400.  When I was selected to test the G410, I was thrilled.  Everything I'd been reading suggested that this driver was an improvement over the G400 - with the added benefit of more adjustability. Based on my testing of this driver, I agree. 

Thanks for following along Spies. I hope I've done this review justice and you find the information helpful.

[STUDque 12,381]

 

 

This is looking promising

_________________________________________________________

And now, the main event:

Combined Stage 1 and 2, written by STUDque,  30 August 2019 

 

BLUF
SPOILER ALERT: The Ping G410+ is the BEST driver I’ve ever hit.  Period.  This review could start and end with that but what good is a claim without proof?  Keep Reading.

About Me
Maybe not like Phil, but I hit bombs.  Or at least, now I do.  I’ve always had the luxury of distance off the tee but could rarely harness the power.  I’ve tried a lot of drivers with a lot of different shafts and way too many adjustment tool configurations.  Enter G410+

 Specs
Adam asked the forum staff to run through a TruGolfFit fitting and provide feedback…after I had already submitted my order for G410+.  This process made me both happy and sad.  Happy because the tool recommended G410+ as my top driver but sad because it selected a different shaft.  Feedback from an iron fitting I had last summer indicated I was hitting the ball too low with too much spin.  The solution was a higher launching, lower spinning shaft.  I did not get fit for this driver but I applied that concept to my selection when I chose the Tensei CK Orange and a 10.5* head.  The Tensei was the highest launching option available to me in X flex.  The different shaft recommendation from TGF brought nerves while awaiting delivery but, after the range and a few rounds, my concerns relaxed.  I’m not saying TGF is wrong (since I never did get to try the EvenFlow Black), but I am saying that the Tensei is a good fit for me.

 

Looks (10 out of 10 points) 
I love me some turbulators.  The decision to move away from the dragonfly was a wise one.  I didn’t hate the dragonfly look, but I didn’t exactly love it either.  Going back to smaller turbulators with some slight shape changes in the head really do it for me.  The ball is framed nicely without the need for a painted alignment aid.  The bottom graphics and badging look slick in red and black to bring the whole look together.  In my opinion, Ping has totally nailed the look.

 

Sound & Feel (9 out of 10 points)
The Most Wanted tests have shown us that sound and feel, while totally subjective, actually play a role in the user’s opinion of the club.  This leaves the door open for people to dislike the G410+ because this driver is loud.  KABLAMOOOOOO.  Not too far from a shotgun sound.  People know when you’ve hit and especially when you’ve really caught it.  On misses, it doesn’t sound like a different pitch, thud, whatever; it just changes in volume.  The better you’ve struck it, the louder it is.  I’ve uploaded portions of my session at Top Golf so you can hear it for yourself.  4 points for sound because I’m sure it’s not for everyone // Feel is top notch for both quality of life and quality of feedback.  Impact feels fantastic but you still manage to gleam feedback as to where on the face you made contact.  Due to the intense forgiveness, you wouldn’t know from the ball flight so the feel provides the little secret only you know.  5 points for feel, unmatched.

 

Basic Characteristics (20 out of 20 points)
Initially, the ball flight was on the high side at stock settings (weight in the middle and loft at a neutral 10.5*).  I tinkered a bit with my swing before deciding to bust out the adjustment tool.  After trying multiple options during a range session, I settled on the small “-” and the weight in the draw position.  This has been my sweet spot and it hasn’t been changed since.  Now, my ball flight is a mid-high and it’s cutting right through the wind but still high enough to clear most trees. 

 Around mid-summer, I fought a wipey fade pretty bad with all my clubs.  This prompted some aggressive practice at putting a draw back into my game.  While my swing isn’t always delivering, the club certainly is.  A proper draw swing yields a powerful draw flight for some extra roll out and placement.  I’ve given this some effort in the past with previous drivers and was only able to produce a severe hook, not a draw.  G410+ is giving me just enough to turn it over without hitting it off the planet. 

The incredible forgiveness has resulted in superb accuracy which, in turn, has resulted in optimal performance in pressure situations.  In case you didn’t follow, I competed in a stroke play amateur tournament this summer and finished T-1 in my flight (lost in playoff) thanks to some great driving.  The boom stick put me in Position A1 on almost every hole I pulled it.  As I mentioned in feel, you can really feel the strike location even if the ball flight doesn’t reflect it.  THIS is the biggest factor in forgiveness to me.  Nothing like hitting it off the heel but still flying 250 down the middle.  It can be your dirty little secret J

 Arccos captured some pretty staggering results driver over driver.  I realized a 44 yard, 17% increase from a driver smart distance of 256 all the way up to my new smart distance of 300 yards on the nose.  There is a LOT of data logged for both clubs so this is no fluke, G410+ is the real deal.  Don’t get me wrong, I had potential for 300+ in my last driver and every one before that, but the newfound consistency allows me to swing away with confidence and power.  I’m cranking driver over 300yards about half of the time I pull driver. Since I often need less-than-driver, this equates to 4-5 per round.  This would be fine if the drives were 301, 302, etc….but they’re getting out to 315, 320, and further with a longest of 331.  That long end of the distance is NOT something I used to have.  KABOOM is right!

 I couldn’t be happier with the basic characteristics of the G410+.  This baby has so much to offer to so many players.  Would you like to be straight and long?  Golf is the most fun it’s ever been for me thanks to this amazing wonder stick.

 

On-Course Performance (30 out of 30 points)
This has been a fantastic experience.  The i500 review from last year was a lot of fun, but there’s nothing like letting driver rip all summer.  On course, this baby performed amazingly.  I can count on my hand the number of poor shots I’ve hit with it.  This is the same number of drives that are the Indian’s fault.    Moreso, there’s a number of drives that were also the Indian’s fault but the arrow saved the day. 

 On course, I’m able to attack in a way I’ve never done before.  With this, comes a learning curve of selecting new targets and discovering the proper lines around the course.  That learning period brought some errors into play as well but I’m overall more dangerous on the tee. 

 Prior to this test, length wasn’t really holding me back from reaching Par 5’s in two…it was the accuracy AND length.  This summer, I’ve landed safely in GUR three times and converted one of them into an eagle.  That’s three more than I had all of last year or the year before combined.  Pretty staggering.  This straight length is giving me more chances at reaching these Par 5’s and being able to convert is a great feeling.

 I can’t say I’d change anything at all.  Maybe a new paint scheme for the next series just to keep people buying them but the performance is absolutely there.  Ping has totally nailed this one.  For many of my golfing years, I hadn’t really looked much at Ping due to the funky look they put on a lot of their clubs.  Recent years have opened my eyes to the sheer performance quality (and improved looks) of their lines from top to bottom.  I already looked at them as a legit player in the iron category but it’s great to see the performance carries all the way up to the big guy. 

Miscellaneous (8 out of 10 points)
The whole package has been delivered.  In addition to the performance qualities, the little creature comforts are fantastic as well.  The tool is easy to use and looks nice, plus the headcover is top shelf.  I’m typically a custom HC guy but I elected to use the stock HC for this test.  It slides on/off easily, carries a nice look, and has shown no signs of wear.  It’s also really nice that the usual corners have been cut into curves for an easier-to-wield offering.

 One thing I’ll ding the driver on here is the weight.  I don’t like the fact that it comes out and needs to be placed when deciding to move it.  I get that this is (or should be) a one-time adjustment but I believe the slider would’ve been a better choice.  There’s bound to be players that prefer the weight between Draw and Neutral or Neutral and Fade.  2 points off for that.

 

Play it or Trade it? (20 out of 20 points)
What do you think?  Absolutely, PLAY IT.  I love this driver to the moon and back and wouldn’t trade it for the world.  I’ll let other people give it a swing, but I don’t intend on letting it out of my sight.  The G410+ has transformed my game and I’m so thankful for this opportunity to test it.  Whatever price it’s listed at, it’s worth it.

 

Conclusion
Yes indeed, Ping G410+ is the best driver I’ve ever hit.  I did get the chance to demo other current-year drivers and still feel this way.  Top to bottom, it’s the best and you should give it a swing to see if it fits your game.  It’s got a deadly combination of distance and accuracy with just enough adjustability to create a setup suitable to most players’ games.  Couple this with a robust no-upcharge shaft offering and you’ve got yourself a winner.  Give it a try!

Final Score: (97 out of 100 points)

 

Epilogue:  I was a big fan of the texturizing on the face.  If you run your fingernail over it, it'll catch & rattle like teeny tiny iron grooves.  I can't say for certain, but it feels as if this roughness contributes to the forgiveness of the club.

 

Finally, a swing/contact/sound/flight video.  This was at the Top Golf at National Harbor, DC.  The net at the back is 200 yards away but I can't say how tall exactly it is.  Most of the shots were hitting the 4th & 5th section up and boinging back into play.  Very happy with the explosiveness and piercing flight.  According to the Top Golf data gatherer, exit speed hovered around 165mph for most shots.  

 

Thanks for reading!

[JonMUSC08 971]

Looking forward to seeing how much better the G410 is than some one their current equipment. Its great club and in some instances, the guys could benefit from the tech but most importantly getting the right fit with the shaft will make a world of a difference.

[Nunfa0 6,102]

Nice start boys I have the G400 LST in the bag and it's a beauty so I will be watching with interest to see how you all go....

[GolfSpy_APH 8,401]

Great start all! Looking forward to stage 2 and seeing how they all play out for you.

[jlukes 16,688]

My Stage 1 has been posted right here  ------>  Stage 1

[Shankster 33,161]

Great start boys! I’ll be clicking the subscribe button for this one. Send it!

[blackngold_blood 7,019]

Great stuff so far.  @jlukes  I am surprised that the Ping G410 unseated the fitted TS2 so quickly.  I have always been under the expectation that the differences between 2 well fitted drivers would be fairly small.  I know you don't want to give away too much right now but I am curious if you saw more distance, better dispersion, or both?

[jlukes 16,688]

1 hour ago, blackngold_blood said:

Great stuff so far.  @jlukes  I am surprised that the Ping G410 unseated the fitted TS2 so quickly.  I have always been under the expectation that the differences between 2 well fitted drivers would be fairly small.  I know you don't want to give away too much right now but I am curious if you saw more distance, better dispersion, or both?

Mitigation of the big miss was the big factor. Flat lie angle + weight in toe on the G410 is proving to be very beneficial. 

[PING Apologist #9 4,568]

On ‎04‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 11:10 PM, PING Apologist #9 said:

Stage 1 placeholder

Hey Spies!!!! My stage-I is up. I hope you have a chance to check it out!!!

Digest it if willing and fire away with any questions or comments. I really didn't elaborate on my "initial impressions" so much, so reply here and I will be more than glad to answer your questions about anything about my experiences so far with this baby. Remember, I am here to help you and I want you all to have a great reading experience about it, so if there is anything I can help with, go ahead and respond here...Standing by.

[PING Apologist #9 4,568]

On ‎04‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 10:59 PM, jlukes said:

Ping G410 Plus Driver - Stage 1 Review - jlukes

Well it has been almost 2 whole years since I participated in official MGS forum testing and I have to admit, it feels great to be back in the fold!  I have previously tested the Sun Mountain 3.5LS Stand Bag (which I still use), Evnroll ER2 putter (which I am taking to my grave with me), and Mizuno JPX 900 Tour irons (the only reason I am not still gaming these is that through fitness and lessons I increased my swing speed to the point where I needed to change shafts).  What you should notice is that I do not apply to test everything and anything, and when I do apply to test something, it is a product that I am sincerely interested in doing a thorough long-term review for.

I am going to use some of the background from previous forum reviews because a lot of that information hasn’t changed! My name is Joe and I am from Central NJ.  I have been playing golf for about 23 years (since I was 12) and I am about a 4.1 handicap at the moment.  I started hitting balls when I was much younger - my grandfather cut down an old 9 iron and 5 wood and gave them to me so I could hit balls in my backyard.  I remember my first 9 holes being when I was about 11 years old - I shot 63 with my dad.  I started playing in County tournaments when I was about 13 years old and played varsity golf in High School.  My first job when I was at the local driving range/mini golf, and all through High School I worked at golf course taking care of the carts, running bags, and eventually became the starter.  I have always enjoyed being around the game of golf in any capacity and I have found that it is truly a game for life.  My son is just over 2 and he is already addicted to the game.  I hope that he continues to see what a fun game this is and it becomes something we can bond over for years to come.

 

When it comes to my golf game, I would say I have quite a few strengths.  I am a long hitter (Carry my driver > 270 yards), I have an okay wedge game, and I am a good putter.  Time is my enemy when it comes to golf; not being able to practice and play as much as I’d like (more than once a week or so) prevents me from being consistent.  I have rounds where I am pounding it off the tee, but I can’t hit a GIR, and then I have rounds where I am a little wonky off the tee, but my short game saves me.  Everything finally came together for me in November 2016 when I shot a personal best of -1 71, beating my previous best of +2 74.  I am the type of golfer that can be extremely competitive, but I also love fun, no-pressure rounds with my buddies.  A lot of the guys I golf with are not as good as me, but I do not care in the least.  I enjoy playing with all skill levels and I have no problem giving advice and helping someone with their game if asked (and only if asked).  I enjoy walking the course as much as possible and nothing frustrates me more than long rounds.  I see no reason why an average round should take over 4 hours, no matter what the golfers’ skill levels are.  

If you want to know a bit more about my swing, I have a swing overhaul thread I have been chronicling here:  

 

It has been an interesting spring as I work to keep the momentum up from my winter lesson programs and I will update that thread with updates on my swing changes as the season goes on.  But for the sake of this review, you should know that my driver swing speed is around 113-116 MPH and I play a bit of a draw.  I have an upwards angle of attack and my miss is primarily a hook.  Here is a video of my driver swing from the end of February 

 

 

For me, driver is my weapon.  I play aggressive off the tee because if there is anything that modern analytics and “strokes gained” has taught us, it is that distance is king and that taking advantage of my ability to hit it long is key to me scoring low.  I pull driver every opportunity I have.  I am no more accurate with my fairway wood or hybrid, so there is no reason for me to sacrifice distance by laying up off the tee unless a hole absolutely calls for a lay up.  I try to get on or close to all Par 5s in two, and I try to get myself as close as possible on all Par 4s so that I can be hitting a wedge into the green if the yardage dictates.

I wasn’t always a great driver of the ball.  I used to have quite a negative attack angle which resulted in low launch and high spin.  No amount of head and shaft changes (much to my dismay) could correct a bad attack angle, so in 2014 I went through a swing change and learned to hit up on my driver.  Once I got a positive angle of attack locked in, I noticed I gained 15+ yards of carry on my drives!  

I have been through quite a few drivers since high school - some were great, others were mistakes (due to lack of knowledge about fitting and purchasing on a whim)

TaylorMade 320
TaylorMade r5
TaylorMade r11
TaylorMade RBZ Tour
Cobra Amp Cell
Callaway Big Bertha Alpha (fitted)
Cobra Bio Cell+
Srixon 545
TaylorMade M1 (fitted) 
TaylorMade M2 (2017) (fitted)
Cobra F8+ (fitted)
Titleist TS2 (fitted)

When the Ping 410 Plus testing was unveiled, I knew it was a testing that I wanted to put my name in the hat for.  Ping received such outstanding reviews on their G400 line and I knew that that the G410 had to be something special in order to follow the G400.  With that being said, I have never gamed a Ping club before.  I do have a few old Ping putters, but I never really even given an extensive look to Ping Metalwoods and Irons.  Thankfully, I was selected for this great testing opportunity and I get to see what Ping is all about!

There are a number of selling points/claims that I will be keeping an eye on throughout testing:

Turbulators - do they really increase swing speed?

Adjustability - Well the G410 Plus is the most adjustable driver Ping has ever made.  Does the weight track (3 fixed positions) actually work?

Hosel Adjustment -  The G410 Plus features a brand new adjustable hosel from Ping, one that now includes “flat” settings.  Do they make a difference?

I will put these three elements, as well as the general performance of the G410 Plus to the test over the coming months with the hope of providing the best information for the MGS forum.

At the time of being selected for this review, I was gaming a Titleist TS2 driver that I was fit for at Club Champion.  I truly believe that fitting is necessary to maximize what a golf club can do for a player.  I chose the TS2 during my fitting because it provided me with the best combination of distance and accuracy.  The Cobra F9 and Epic Flash SZ were longer, but I had trouble with both distance and lateral dispersions.  

When I was selected for G410+ testing, I immediately went to my local range, who happens to be a Top 100 Ping fitter, and got a basic fitting for the G410+.  Unlike other OEMs, Ping does not offer a wide selection of no-upcharge shaft options.  The only two shaft options that were really even under consideration for me were the Evenflow Black and the Ping Tour.  However, I know from past fittings that I do not get along with the Evenflow series, so it came down to the Ping Tour.  We set up the G410+ in a 9-degree head a Ping Tour 65X shaft and it was clear right away that it was the combination I would submit to Ping for testing. I asked Ping that it play 45" at a D3 swing weight.  After I received my club I tested the swing weight and length at a shop and wasn't surprised to see Ping delivered on the nose.  

 

During the testing period I will be testing the G410 on the range, on the course, and on launch monitors.  While I will be touching on how the club fits me, I will try to remain focused on validating the performance claims from Ping to see if the G410 stacks up with the rest of the drivers on the market.  I want my review to be as interactive as possible, so please ask me as many questions on this testing thread and I will attempt to address them all.  You won’t have to wait for my Stage 2 to head how things are going.  All testers will be actively participating in the thread to provide updates as we go - so we can continue the conversation from day to day.

So I mentioned that the TS2 was my gamer going into this testing, but if you are a regular on the forum, you would have noticed that as of this Stage 1 (April 3rd), I have sold my TS2.  Without divulging too much right now, my 3 range sessions and 2 rounds were enough for me to know that the G410 Plus was going to be better for me going forward.  Furthermore, I believe a good testing write-up should be about the individual club in the test and not about a club going head to head with another club.

So does the Ping G410 Plus carry the torch that was lit by the G400 series?  Early results are positive and I look forward to sharing the rest of my thoughts with the MGS community as the testing progresses.

I've watched yer damn swing vid a dozen times and I'm here to tell you that I H8U...! I need just a bit of that mojo..! Nice work on this so far Bud! Can't wait to hear more!

[PING Apologist #9 4,568]

On ‎04‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 11:02 PM, tony@CIC said:

Stage 1 

First and foremost, thank you MGS Mods for selecting me to be an official tester for the G410 SFT.

My name is Tony, I just turned 72 and even though I started playing after I retired, I am obsessed with this game. Prior to retirement I always thought golf was a silly game – after all, how hard could it be to get that LITTLE white ball into that BIG hole. Numerous times on the way home we would pass several fairways at our Club’s golf course and on those cold, or rainy days we would invariably see someone out there playing. My son and I would laugh and talk about those crazy guys out there – what could they be doing or thinking, playing golf in the cold or rain! And then it happened for some unknown reason my wife and I decided to start playing golf. It took one game for me to catch the bug and become obsessed with the game!

 We’re fortunate to live adjacent to a combined Marina and Golf Club with an Arthur Hills 18-hole Links course in northwest Ohio. It is a picturesque course adjacent to Lake Erie, with strong headwinds and it is also a qualifying course for the U.S.Open.   

These past few years have been a long journey. After being fit for G20’s, I took lessons from the head pro which was interesting to say the least, as he was telling me to do several things at once. It reminded me of that Einstein story of taking up golf where he threw 5 balls back at the instructor and said catch, the instructor responded I can’t do that – yes exactly!  With those lessons in the back of my mind I went off to the driving range. The irons weren’t too bad, but my drives had a beautiful slice that from an aerial view would have made a fishing hook proud.

Enter instructor 2 at a Muni. We worked on a lot of things, but he always focused on Position, Grip and Alignment.  Several lessons later: the driver had become more of a fade with a too frequent slice, the irons were ok, and the chipping was a big improvement (due to lots of practice in the backyard).  At this point my index is still in the 30’s because when the driver is working, the irons aren’t and vice versa. Exit this instructor as he decided to move to South Carolina.

I found a new instructor, who immediately recognized a couple of issues and I started working on the improvements, including spine angle and a stronger grip.  Now it’s a consistent draw. Not so bad since most of our penalty areas (aka water hazards) are on the left (remember I’m a lefty).  In the meantime, my driver evolved into a GBB with an Aldilla SR flex shaft. With lots of work at the range, reading and playing as much as possible, my index dropped last summer to a 22 and I did break 90. Oh, and as a side note I was an Official Tester for W/S C300’s – thank you Mods!

This past Fall, we got to play at our course until late November – my index did bump up slightly but only because there’s something about shivering in cold weather that’s not conducive to golf.

 Overall game evaluation 1-10 with 10 being best/most consistent

Driver = 5

Irons = 7

Wedges = 9

Putter = 6

This past Winter I spent my time reading even more and watching instructional videos and when weather allowed, a few trips to a heated driving range. Since I was working on my swing, I intentionally slowed it down to around 76-80 mph (using my SC200) to focus on accuracy. With the slower SS I was getting a much narrower dispersion.  I didn’t pay much attention to distance since it was cold, generally windy and the range was using their “winter” balls. Next step will be working on SS. 

Then the MGS Official Testing for the G410 SFT happened and I was lucky enough to be selected. My reason for applying was threefold: #1 gain more consistency resulting in a narrower dispersion, #2 distance, and #3 sound. Note: with my G20 I could tell by the sound when I had a mishit.  On our course, the first two priorities take the penalty areas out of play for me, along with the potential for higher % GIR’s.

First impression:

With the GBB and SR flex shaft as background, and a prior fitting with the Ping G and SR shaft (which I didn't buy), I ordered the driver with 10.5* loft and the Alta CB 55 shaft in SR flex which is about 10 grams lighter than the Aldilla. The G410 also came with Tour Velvet grips. I’m a big fan of MCC+4 and with my XL glove size, I decided to order it with the orange option which is their jumbo grip.  

 

The driver arrived very quickly, especially given the “less than common” configuration of a lefty head and a SR shaft. The grip initially felt too large – but I did have a pair of FJ rain gloves on when I tried it. Putting one normal golf glove it felt fine. However, at some point I'll replace with the MCC+4. The head is what I expected with a satin finish on top. What was a nice surprise is how good the bottom looks with the red “streaks”.  I never noticed that in the stores.  It looks so good in the bag – I hate to put the cover over the driver.

The head cover, however,  is good looking and a nice improvement over previous Ping covers.

The one thing that was a slight surprise, but only because I didn’t pay attention to the online description is that the weight on the SFT is fixed. In the scheme of things that’s not a big issue for me. However, if you want a sliding weight, you’ll have to move to the G410 Plus.  

The connector is easily adjustable, and the instructions are clear and concise. If you happen to lose the instructions – no worries the connector is clearly marked and has eight settings. Of course, the club did come with a wrench, however, I doubt I’ll be adjusting it once it gets set at the Fitter’s.

Next steps;

Get to a fitter to set the correct loft adjustment. My guess is that it’ll be either set at neutral or .06*  configuration. While I’m at the Fitter, I’m bringing my GBB as well to do a “head to head” comparison. It’ll be my Ping vs. Callaway challenge so stay turned for that.

Additionally, with 2 lesson certificates that my wife gave me for Christmas – I’m going to use one to further improve my drives. My expectations are that the 410 SFT gets me 7-10 additional yds.  plus, a much narrower dispersion and looking for that 5 to move to at least a 7 or 8. .

Let the battle of my drivers begin!

 

Oh man tony, that opening pic is just absolutely breath-taking..! What a great write-up too! I'm very excited to hear what you have for us on stage-II! Cheers Pal!