Putting Ball

[Kor.A.Door]

13 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

there is an interpretation on specifically this topic, rule 18.3.  if he has announced and played a provisional, the provisional only becomes the ball in play if he hits it from nearer the hole than the original was likely to be, before the original was found.

Yes that is correct, once the second stroke is played with the provisional ball (fourth stroke for the hole). That is the ball in play. If the original ball is found before the next stroke, the provisional ball is invalid and cannot be used and he must proceed with the original ball. What I was trying to say is that although he cannot declare a ball lost, a player can instruct that he doesn’t want anyone to look for it, if someone does look and they find it, the player will be pissed, but he must play the original ball at that point. 

[perseveringgolfer]

1 hour ago, Kor.A.Door said:

Yes that is correct, once the second stroke is played with the provisional ball (fourth stroke for the hole). That is the ball in play. If the original ball is found before the next stroke, the provisional ball is invalid and cannot be used and he must proceed with the original ball. What I was trying to say is that although he cannot declare a ball lost, a player can instruct that he doesn’t want anyone to look for it, if someone does look and they find it, the player will be pissed, but he must play the original ball at that point. 

Almost!

The provisional can be hit as many times as you want up to where the original ball is, or is thought to be, and it's still classed as the provisional until that point.

 

[perseveringgolfer]

1 hour ago, Kor.A.Door said:

You can’t declare it lost, you CAN instruct that nobody is to look for it. That’s what I am talking about. If the people you are playing with are Jerks, then you may be SOL. Yes, if it is found, the provisional ball is no longer an option. You have to play the first ball and with the new rules there are options. 

What are the 'new rules options' you are referring to as I'm not clue'd up on them all?

[TR1PTIK]

On 6/16/2019 at 6:51 PM, HardcoreLooper said:

What is the logic behind this?  Back in the bad-old-days of balata, we used to do this in friendly rounds because the balls would get lopsided after a few holes and not putt straight (and that's if you didn't cut it).  You'll lose a modern ball before you can really do damage to it.

Most guys I know do it because they want a clean ball and others (older players) continue to do it out of habit or misconceptions about the modern golf ball.

[Kor.A.Door]

1 hour ago, perseveringgolfer said:

What are the 'new rules options' you are referring to as I'm not clue'd up on them all?

If the ball cannot be found, you can drop in the fairway at the point at which the ball would have come to rest and 90° out from that point and incur a 2 stroke penalty. If you have played a provisional ball, it does not have to be played. you can choose to drop in the fairway 90° from where the ball would have come to rest and incur a 2 stroke penalty.  If the ball is found, you have choices as well, you can play it as it lies, you can take an unplayable lie, drop within 2 club lengths with a penalty stroke, and play from there, or you can take the ball 90° out to the fairway and drop and play your 4th stroke.

Scenario: let’s say you hit a tee shot far, but it went into the woods, and you aren’t sure if you can find it, you can play a provisional, and let’s say you hit it straight but it’s only 220 yards. Your first ball cannot be found. You have 2 options under the new rule. If your first ball that is lost would have been 290 yards from the tee box, you can drop atthe edge of the fairway and play your 4th shot, or you can go back to your second ball, and play your 4 shot from 70 yards back. This is how the club pro explained it to us. 

The new rule is meant to speed up play, so in the above scenario there really isn’t a reason to hit a provisional ball, because if you find it you play that ball under the new rules, if you don’t find it you will drop on the edge of the fairway and play your 4th shot. 

The only time I can think that hitting a provisional from the tee is if your first ball was hit into the trees 80 yards off the tee box, by hitting a provisional from the tee you could potential make it so your 4th stroke would be much farther down the fairway. 

Remember the old rule for lost ball or OB was stroke and distance, this new rule allows so you don’t have to go back and tee again. 

Now if the trees or area where you hit the ball are red staked or white stakes you would proceed under those rules. The course I play at has lots of trees, and not all of them are penalty areas, some of them are part of the course, and you have to proceed under the rules. 

 

[perseveringgolfer]

12 minutes ago, Kor.A.Door said:

If the ball cannot be found, you can drop in the fairway at the point at which the ball would have come to rest and 90° out from that point and incur a 2 stroke penalty. If you have played a provisional ball, it does not have to be played. you can choose to drop in the fairway 90° from where the ball would have come to rest and incur a 2 stroke penalty.  If the ball is found, you have choices as well, you can play it as it lies, you can take an unplayable lie, drop within 2 club lengths with a penalty stroke, and play from there, or you can take the ball 90° out to the fairway and drop and play your 4th stroke.

Scenario: let’s say you hit a tee shot far, but it went into the woods, and you aren’t sure if you can find it, you can play a provisional, and let’s say you hit it straight but it’s only 220 yards. Your first ball cannot be found. You have 2 options under the new rule. If your first ball that is lost would have been 290 yards from the tee box, you can drop atthe edge of the fairway and play your 4th shot, or you can go back to your second ball, and play your 4 shot from 70 yards back. This is how the club pro explained it to us. 

The new rule is meant to speed up play, so in the above scenario there really isn’t a reason to hit a provisional ball, because if you find it you play that ball under the new rules, if you don’t find it you will drop on the edge of the fairway and play your 4th shot. 

The only time I can think that hitting a provisional from the tee is if your first ball was hit into the trees 80 yards off the tee box, by hitting a provisional from the tee you could potential make it so your 4th stroke would be much farther down the fairway. 

Remember the old rule for lost ball or OB was stroke and distance, this new rule allows so you don’t have to go back and tee again. 

Now if the trees or area where you hit the ball are red staked or white stakes you would proceed under those rules. The course I play at has lots of trees, and not all of them are penalty areas, some of them are part of the course, and you have to proceed under the rules. 

 

That rule wasn't adopted I'm afraid.

You can use it in a bounce/friendly game but it's not an actual new rule as such, more the pity.

[chisag]

... It is a rule, just not a universal rule. It can be instituted as a local rule at any course, in league play or in tournament play if designated ahead of time.  

[DaveP043]

the local rule says that if you play a provisional, you are not allowed to use the fairway drop option.  please read local rule e-5

[perseveringgolfer]

12 minutes ago, chisag said:

... It is a rule, just not a universal rule. It can be instituted as a local rule at any course, in league play or in tournament play if designated ahead of time.  

Local rule for non qualifying competitions only. If qualifying for any handicap alterations the R&A are very clear it cannot be used.

[chisag]

26 minutes ago, perseveringgolfer said:

Local rule for non qualifying competitions only. If qualifying for any handicap alterations the R&A are very clear it cannot be used.

 

... R&A?  You can't even figure out what side of the road you are supposed to drive on. 

Edited June 25, 2019 by chisag

[perseveringgolfer]

30 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... R&A?  You can't even figure out what side of the road you are supposed to drive on. 

The correct side! 

[Kor.A.Door]

8 hours ago, perseveringgolfer said:

That rule wasn't adopted I'm afraid.

You can use it in a bounce/friendly game but it's not an actual new rule as such, more the pity.

Umm, yes it was as a local rule

Edited June 26, 2019 by Kor.A.Door

[Kor.A.Door]

8 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

the local rule says that if you play a provisional, you are not allowed to use the fairway drop option.  please read local rule e-5

Sorry, that is right on the provisional, I  misunderstood what we discussed at the club. We were discussing many subjects regarding all of the new rules changes, and I misunderstood what was being said. 

Edited June 26, 2019 by Kor.A.Door

[HardcoreLooper]

On 6/25/2019 at 11:17 AM, TR1PTIK said:

Most guys I know do it because they want a clean ball and others (older players) continue to do it out of habit or misconceptions about the modern golf ball.

Want a clean ball for putting? Bring a towel to the green. Get a big player's towel for extra tour sauce. 

And if you haven't yet figured out that modern balls don't go out of round, I can't help with that. 

[TR1PTIK]

1 hour ago, HardcoreLooper said:

Want a clean ball for putting? Bring a towel to the green. Get a big player's towel for extra tour sauce. 

And if you haven't yet figured out that modern balls don't go out of round, I can't help with that. 

I don't disagree, but for casual rounds I don't really care either. To each their own...