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Why are we losing long term avid players ?


Big money

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Been running into a rash of former golf partners that were extremely avid long term golfers.Im perplexed why they are leaving this great game?And it’s quite a bit more than I anticipated.All skill levels from scratch - to - high cappers.What is going on?

Keep it in the short stuff

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5 minutes ago, Twofer said:

Been running into a rash of former golf partners that were extremely avid long term golfers.Im perplexed why they are leaving this great game?And it’s quite a bit more than I anticipated.All skill levels from scratch - to - high cappers.What is going on?

Have you asked them?

Driver     Awaiting NEW Driver (after 10 yrs)  
4 Wood   Callaway Big Bertha Steelhead plus 4+  :callaway-small: Callaway shaft in 'Firm' flex

Hybrid     Titleist 910H 19*    :titelist-small:   Diamana ahina 'flower' shaft in 'S'

Irons         Mizuno MP18SC 4-PW   :mizuno-small:  N.S Pro Modus3 Tour 105 in 'S'

Wedges    Callaway Mack Daddy forged in black 50* and 54*  :callaway-small:   KBS Tour in 'R'

Putter        'YES' Tracy 11 C groove 34.5"

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36 minutes ago, perseveringgolfer said:

Have you asked them?

Hmmm 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Yeah... that's odd. People generally do things for specific reasons. Financial, health, work, family, etc. But few people just give up on things they are passionate or avid about.

My Sun Mountain bag currently includes:   TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 771CSI 5i - PW and TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png PFC Micro Tour-c 52°, 56°, 60 wedges

                                                                               :755178188_TourEdge: EXS 10.5*, TWGTLogo2.png.06c802075f4d211691d88895b3f34b75.png 929-HS FW4 16.5* 

                                                                                :edel-golf-1: Willimette w/GolfPride Contour

 

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Actuarial tables combined with biomechanical deterioration 😉.  I know several folks here in my area that said they use to play but have given up the game due to shoulder, back, hip, elbow, you name it, issues. 

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I have a few friends whom I consider avid golfers who have given it up in the last few years.

In those cases health was the issue. Frankly my enjoyment for playing the game has waned. It’s very difficult to go from shooting in the low 70’s to struggling to break 80. It’s just as much fun.

I love to practice and enjoy playing for fun with friends but I don’t play anywhere near as much golf as I did five years ago.




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I'll give it to the OP, he's really concerned about growing the game and making sure no one quits. Besides this thread, there's also:

and

 

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:mizuno-small: ST-Z 15* Kai/li Blue R Flex
:mizuno-small: ST-Z 4h Linq Blue R Flex
:cleveland-small: Launcher 5h
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So many possible reasons...

Can you find a way to have fun when you're not playing well?

@Big money nailed it in his answer above.  If you're wrapped up in your score, if you let it be the sole factor in your enjoyment, you're eventually going to quit.

 

Are you short on time because of changes in your life (spouse, kids, job)?

Is there any way around that?  I basically quit playing when my oldest was born.  But when she was old enough, I had a club in her hands.  For a few years, my playing was mainly limited to the three pitch-n-putt holes at the TFT location where she was in classes and I volunteer.  Eventually she got old enough to graduate to "real" courses and I was playing "real" golf again.  

Courses like Canal Shores that have rates for five and six hole loops that can be played in an hour or so at lunch or after work are on the right track.  Most significant others will give you an hour to get some exercise.  No reason that can't be on a golf course.  Keeping clubs in the hands of busy people is the best way to keep avid golfers in the game.  If you can play a few holes every week, you're still a golfer, and you'll go play 18 on those few occasions when you get the chance.

 

Are financial realities getting in the way?

This is a tough one, but are you willing to take a step down and play a majority of your golf at a lower quality course to stay in the game?  Some people would rather quit.  I basically stopped playing when I was out of college and had no money, but I also didn't work very hard to find affordable golf where I lived.

 

Are you losing distance?

If so, can you put your ego aside and play courses from tees that let you hit the clubs the designer envisioned (shoutout @chisag)?  Know what's fun?  Putting for birdies.  Know what's not fun?  Hitting fairway woods into greens designed to receive 7 iron shots.  

 

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Driver - :cobra-small: F8 - Aldila NV Blue 60 ( S )
3 Wood (13.5*) - :titleist-small: 980F 
4 Wood (18*) - :cobra-small: F8 - Aldila NV Blue 60 ( S )
3 Hybrid (19*) - :taylormade-small: RBZ
4i - PW - :wilson_staff_small: D7 Forged - Recoil 760 ( S )
52* - :cleveland-small: CBX
58* - :cleveland-small: CBX Full Face 2
Putter - :ping-small: Craz-e
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6 hours ago, Big money said:

It’s just such a difficult game . And many might give up if they can’t be at the competitive level they were used to. 

I have a friend, with a lower handicap than mine, text me yesterday saying he played so badly at the weekend he's seriously considering stopping, giving up an expensive membership and just playing a few fun rounds each summer on public courses.

We've all been there

Driver     Awaiting NEW Driver (after 10 yrs)  
4 Wood   Callaway Big Bertha Steelhead plus 4+  :callaway-small: Callaway shaft in 'Firm' flex

Hybrid     Titleist 910H 19*    :titelist-small:   Diamana ahina 'flower' shaft in 'S'

Irons         Mizuno MP18SC 4-PW   :mizuno-small:  N.S Pro Modus3 Tour 105 in 'S'

Wedges    Callaway Mack Daddy forged in black 50* and 54*  :callaway-small:   KBS Tour in 'R'

Putter        'YES' Tracy 11 C groove 34.5"

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For most it’s likely one if 3 main reasons - time, money, physical.
As others have said, enjoyment of the game and the ‘why do you play?’ factor matter as well.
When one of the big three prevents players from enjoying the game or overcomes their motivation to play most are going to stop playing.


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Wedges:   :cleveland-small: CBX2 Zipcore  52*, 56* Project X Catalyst Spinner Graphite Shaft

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I was checking in at the Pro Shop and a guy walked up behind me obviously irritated. While he didn’t state his reason for doing so he did ask the Pro to cancel his membership. The Pro’s response was typical of what I tend to see across the industry...........an attitude of arrogance and indifference.

 

People may remember what you say, they could remember what you do, they will always remember how you make them feel. I’ve met some really great folks on the Golf Course and I’ve met twice that number of Arrogant a$&holes. There is so much competition for people’s time and money, in order to remain competitive you must be completely committed to customers experience. Whenever I take a break it’s usually related to the negative attitudes around me and not the sport itself. I’m perfectly ok with playing bad because I have realistic expectations. I play a lot of 9 hole golf so time is also not a factor.

 

I think the number one reason Golfers leave the sport is because of a decline in the enjoyment factor. The Golf Community as a whole needs to spend more time developing a culture committed to the players overall experience.

 

 

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1 hour ago, SteddyGolf said:

I was checking in at the Pro Shop and a guy walked up behind me obviously irritated. While he didn’t state his reason for doing so he did ask the Pro to cancel his membership. The Pro’s response was typical of what I tend to see across the industry...........an attitude of arrogance and indifference.

 

People may remember what you say, they could remember what you do, they will always remember how you make them feel. I’ve met some really great folks on the Golf Course and I’ve met twice that number of Arrogant a$&holes. There is so much competition for people’s time and money, in order to remain competitive you must be completely committed to customers experience. Whenever I take a break it’s usually related to the negative attitudes around me and not the sport itself. I’m perfectly ok with playing bad because I have realistic expectations. I play a lot of 9 hole golf so time is also not a factor.

 

I think the number one reason Golfers leave the sport is because of a decline in the enjoyment factor. The Golf Community as a whole needs to spend more time developing a culture committed to the players overall experience.

 

 

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I have a beautiful muni course 1.5 miles from my front door. I refuse to play it because of the arrogant, stuffy attitude that generally pervades the whole place. It was built with tax payer money and billed as a golf course for the citizens of Massillon. Yea.... what a joke. We got fleeced.... the only citizens that matter are the elite and affluent... the rest of us aren't wanted, and it shows in the attitude toward us "regular" citizens.

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I agree with the last few posts.The sport is really trending more elitist.And going back to its 1960ish “ I’m better than you roots”.Its real obvious every where I go.Kinda holding back and not saying a lot but just enjoying the game.It is getting to the point where the members are starting to look down more on others more than I can remember.If it keeps trending this way I might be looking into new hobbies as well.The nerve of these people and the aura they give off is just so toxic for growing the game.Im at the point now in my life where instead of fighting a bad situation.Im going to just walk away with my head held high.So yes!! I can see why many avid golfers walk away.Only so much one can take of elitist a*holes.And the sad thing they see nothing wrong with the way they act or how their cronies act.And I was actually very pleased my son never had any interest as of late for golf.Im not going to promote this game to anyone knowing what I know.Was always a huge backer of this game.No more,at times I’m embarrassed telling my friends I play golf.Honestly,,...If your an a**hole, or rich elitist than you most likely play golf.

Edited by Big money

Keep it in the short stuff

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1 hour ago, Edveed said:

I agree with the last few posts.The sport is really trending more elitist.And going back to its 1960ish “ I’m better than you roots”.Its real obvious every where I go.Kinda holding back and not saying a lot but just enjoying the game.It is getting to the point where the members are starting to look down more on others more than I can remember.If it keeps trending this way I might be looking into new hobbies as well.The nerve of these people and the aura they give off is just so toxic for growing the game.Im at the point now in my life where instead of fighting a bad situation.Im going to just walk away with my head held high.So yes!! I can see why many avid golfers walk away.Only so much one can take of elitist a*holes.And the sad thing they see nothing wrong with the way they act or how their cronies act

While I value your opinion, I couldn't disagree more. Yes I do play at a (relatively inexpensive) private club, but we also play a lot at Munis and other public courses. I've found other golfers very welcoming and interested in promoting the sport/hobby to others. I play frequently with single digit handicappers and they could care less that I'm a high handicapper. We go out to have fun and of course play the best we can. Maybe the friendliness is just a Midwest thing....hmmm probably not . 

Are there elitist clubs and snobby people - well of course,  but those clubs and people would be the same whether they were golf, tennis, yacht, etc. clubs.  

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19 minutes ago, tony@CIC said:

While I value your opinion, I couldn't disagree more. Yes I do play at a (relatively inexpensive) private club, but we also play a lot at Munis and other public courses. I've found other golfers very welcoming and interested in promoting the sport/hobby to others. I play frequently with single digit handicappers and they could care less that I'm a high handicapper. We go out to have fun and of course play the best we can. Maybe the friendliness is just a Midwest thing....hmmm probably not . 

Are their elitist clubs and snobby people - well of course,  but those clubs and people would be the same whether they were golf, tennis, yacht, etc. clubs.  

I agree with you Tony. I play with a wide variety of players and don't often experience this kind of snobbery. When I do, it's often guys that are that way off the course and that don't really enjoy the game to the same extent I do. Simply put, they aren't there because they are actually passionate about the game. If they were, they'd probably be a little bit happier to be playing it.

Driver: :mizuno-small: ST190 9.5* Fujikura Atmos Blue 5S
Fairway Wood: :mizuno-small: ST190 15* Fujikura Atmos Blue 6S
Hybrid: :mizuno-small: CLK 17* Fujikura Speeder EVO HB
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I’m noticing many a golf forum is dying a slow death due to Instagram and other media outlets. But My golf spy forum is still alive and well. The banter on here is like no other. I love the honesty and opinions by so many. 

Again, people leave golf who were avid because of how damn hard the game is. Golf manufactures are pushing the boundaries trying to make this game more user friendly. But no matter how hard They try . It’s still such a darn hard game. People just get sick of hacking it all over day in and day out. The median score is still 95 I believe for 18. And that is a hacking round no matter how you look at it 

Keep it in the short stuff

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39 minutes ago, TR1PTIK said:

I agree with you Tony. I play with a wide variety of players and don't often experience this kind of snobbery. When I do, it's often guys that are that way off the course and that don't really enjoy the game to the same extent I do. Simply put, they aren't there because they are actually passionate about the game. If they were, they'd probably be a little bit happier to be playing it.

Yup - those people are probably miserable at everything they do. 

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Cobra  Radspeed 3W/RIptide Shaft
:ping-small:  410  Hybrids 22*, 26*

Cobra Speed Zone 6-GP/Recoil ESX 460 F3 Shafts 

:titelist-small: SM7 54* Wedge

:ping-small: Glide 3.0  60* Wedge

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:1590477705_SunMountain: And  BAG Boy

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2020 Official Teste:SuperSpeed: Beginning Driver Speed  - 78

2019 Official Tester :ping-small:  410 Driver

2018 Official Tester :wilson-small: C300

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Could it be that for many people golf is no longer a game but has become an overwhelming focus that eventually they burn out on?

When it was just a game, people bought a set of clubs, went and practiced or played a round and that was it. They enjoyed the round of golf or their “golfing time” and that was it until they got to the course to do it again.

Now, in addition to practicing and playing, “golfing time” has taken more and more of their time. There are golf forums to discuss golf 24 hours a day. Online shopping to search for a new club that will help them improve because the practice isn’t working. Custom fittings, launch monitors, shot tracking, 24 hour golf tv channels, YouTube golf videos, etc. Maybe the people leaving have just said enough is enough. What started as a fun game became an overwhelming presence in their lives and was no longer fun.

How many here or on other forums enjoy buying a new piece of equipment more than actually playing? After awhile the fun of purchasing new gear is less and less fulfilling until finally they realize they just spent $1000’s and are no better or happier in the game.





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It's really disheartening to hear you guys having bad experiences like you are.  I play by myself quite a bit, which means I get paired up fairly frequently, and I really don't tend to run into snobbery or crappy attitudes.  Of course, I play the bulk of my solo golf at cheap courses, so the clientele tends to be down-to-earth.

I won't let someone else ruin this great game for me, but I also won't hang out somewhere that doesn't make me feel welcome.  There are plenty of unpretentious places to play.  They may not be architectural gems or perfectly manicured, but they're fun and that's all that matters.

What's in the bag:
Driver - :cobra-small: F8 - Aldila NV Blue 60 ( S )
3 Wood (13.5*) - :titleist-small: 980F 
4 Wood (18*) - :cobra-small: F8 - Aldila NV Blue 60 ( S )
3 Hybrid (19*) - :taylormade-small: RBZ
4i - PW - :wilson_staff_small: D7 Forged - Recoil 760 ( S )
52* - :cleveland-small: CBX
58* - :cleveland-small: CBX Full Face 2
Putter - :ping-small: Craz-e
Bag - :1590477705_SunMountain: 2.5 (Blue)
Ball -  :titleist-small: AVX
Instagram - @hardcorelooper
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10 hours ago, HardcoreLooper said:

It's really disheartening to hear you guys having bad experiences like you are.  I play by myself quite a bit, which means I get paired up fairly frequently, and I really don't tend to run into snobbery or crappy attitudes.  Of course, I play the bulk of my solo golf at cheap courses, so the clientele tends to be down-to-earth.

I won't let someone else ruin this great game for me, but I also won't hang out somewhere that doesn't make me feel welcome.  There are plenty of unpretentious places to play.  They may not be architectural gems or perfectly manicured, but they're fun and that's all that matters.

I also play cheap courses, because I can't afford to pay $50.00 and higher greens fees more than a couple of times a season. Most of the people I come into contact with are very down to earth people. It's the higher priced courses where the attitudes creep in. These aren't what I would call high end courses, but they are a cut above the normal muni and public courses. There is nothing to be done about it.... people will always be what they are, regardless.

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I dont remember the last time I got paired with anyone that i wouldn’t want to tee it up with again. I play as a single frequently and never run into these snobs and I play fairly expensive courses several times a year. I’ve also worked some demo days in the past at high end clubs and met lots of down to earth members.

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Just played one of the highest rated munis in the northeast (morning rounds are $120, thankfully we played in the afternoon!) and the staff and members couldn’t have been more gracious. I’ve also played events at private courses and it was the same there - nothing but welcoming attitudes.

Not sure where snobbish elitism is creeping in, in fact with the explosion of golf-related social media it seems like more people from all walks of life are out there on the course giving it a chance.


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:mizuno-small: ST-X 10.5* Kai'li Blue R Flex
:mizuno-small: ST-Z 15* Kai/li Blue R Flex
:mizuno-small: ST-Z 4h Linq Blue R Flex
:cleveland-small: Launcher 5h
:cleveland-small: Launcher CBX 6i-PW
:cleveland-small: CBX 54* & 58*
:cleveland-small: Huntington Beach #10
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I haven't played at my muni in quite a while. Maybe I'll give it another shot. I've heard that they brought new faces in and were trying to get more people to play. It was originally an 18 hole course, but they got greedy and decided to put a 3rd 9 in. The original 18 was very nice, but they changed things around to accommodate the extra 9 and basically ruined what they had. I know a lot of people that play golf, but not many of them will bother playing this course.

 

Anyway..... I don't run into the snobbery much at all. But the few times I played this course, it left a bad taste in my mouth. You know the saying..... get a bad steak and you won't be back?

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... Having played 107 rounds in 117 days last winter in Phoenix and paired up with others 98% f those rounds, I can count the a$$holes on one hand. Lots of expensive resort courses, although I always used TeeTimes/Golfnow so perhaps the clientele was more down to earth than baying the high prices crowd. Not only would I say the majority were not arrogant, I found most to be extremely friendly and very enjoyable partners.

... I had one guy in a cart with his wife jumping on me and the other guy pushing a cart for moving while they were addressing their shots. After 2 holes and on a long par 5 I had to politely tell him we are walking and do not have the luxury of hanging back 20 yds while they address their shots, hit and then drive off in their carts, so when we are 40 yards away on the other side of the fairway we were gonna keep walking and if he could not deal with that, maybe they should just let us go ahead. Obviously when we were very near either of them we stopped and waited while they played their shots. He relented reluctantly and said he was playing poorly and our walking was a distraction but he understood we had to move to keep up with the group in front. Other than a couple of arrogant stock brokers, the rest of the people I was paired up with produced a most enjoyable round of golf. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
Irons:       :titleist-small:         '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :taylormade-small: Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
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There are so many things that can make a player quit. I have played this game for many years and while I no longer can play it at a high level (for me) I still love to play. I have had partners leave the game because of family commitments, money, health, and death. Others who just hated the fact it took so long to play the game. It gets to be frustrating when you no longer can play the game well any more and have to wait to make each crappy shot because of players who are slower than a ice floe. If you can't find something that will let you have an enjoyable day on the links you are probably going to leave the game. 

I played to a single digit handicap until age caught up to me. Now I do sometimes feel sorry for myself when I hit, for me, a great tee shot and just can't reach the green in two because of lack of distance. Yet yesterday I had 180 to the middle of the green and hit a beautiful 3 wood to the front of the green. No matter what else I did that day I had my one thing that would make me come back the next time. So I guess the other thing that may make people leave is ego. 😮

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I have played this game for 24 years. I have worked as an asst pro at a public and a private facility for 7 years. I have played courses from podunk munis to super expensive country clubs. One of the great joys of playing has been the people I have met. Most of my current friends I have met on the course or because of golf and those friendships have lasted over 20 years. Yes I have run into people who I wouldn't want to play with again but they are FAR out numbered by the ones that I enjoy playing with. 

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

:ping-small:          G425 19 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:ping-small:          G425 22 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:srixon-small:            ZX7 5-9 (KBS C Taper S)

:titleist-small:            Vokey SM9 45 10 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 49 08 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 55 08 M (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 59 04 T (KBS 610)

:taylormade-small:     Spider GT Splitback 34"

 :titleist-small:           ProV1 #23

Twitter             @THEZIPR23

 

"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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Personally I've seen two major reasons- time and personal enjoyment. People don't seem to have time for it simply, even 9 holes. And that feeds into the other. Take someone who was a single digit handicap. As they play less and less odds are scores will go up. They're not playing like that know their abilities allow, never mind that they went from 3 rounds a week to 1 and no practice time. Their goals and reasons haven't changed.

This is something I am going through now too. My first child will be born any day now cbd I've spent most of the summer preparing for it. I need to refocus and just enjoy getting to play golf. It's a very fun priviledge still, and just trust that my game will bounce back as time frees up.

Take Dead Aim

Take Dead Aim

Driver: PXG 0211 10.5* 

Fairway: Titleist 917 F3 15*

Hybrid: Adams Idea Pro Boxer Gold 18*

Irons: MacGregor MT-86 Pro

Wedges: Vokey 50/54/58

Putter: SeeMore X2 Costa del Mar

Ball: Srixon Z-Star

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I feel like I need to follow up with a disclaimer. I rarely ever experience arrogant, stuffy people on the golf course.... even on very nice courses that cost more than I should spend. I usually make new friends and have a very enjoyable time.

My little dig was directed at the Golf course/club house employees/higher ups/ whatever term fits. The muni I mentioned was a very arrogant, pompous atmosphere.... unless you were a prominent business person, Massillon Tiger football coach, council person or just very affluent, they just didn't give two s**ts about you.... and gave you a hard time about everything. That's no way to run a successful muni course and expect to stay in business. 

Things may have changed, because I've heard that there has been a changing of the guard, so to speak. I hope so. It's a very nice course that should be enjoyed by everyone that pays taxes.... not just the few that thought they could pull a fast one. This course has been around since 1995.... I haven't played it since at least 2005. I probably should give it another shot.

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