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Why are Lofts getting JACKED


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Ok so I'm trying to understand why lofts are getting so much stronger. Im under the option that the strengthening of lofts is driven primary by marketing and not by true need. I will gladly admit I'm wrong if there are requirements for the lofts getting stronger to compensate for tech but I'm just curious why.

 

So my understanding and opinion. The tech improvements in irons over the last 20 years has been significant, lower CG for higher flight and better decent angles, more perimeter weighting for forgiveness, thinner faces for more ball speed. All these improvements are fantastic if you need those things. I have also noticed over the last 10-15 years the standard 8 club set has shifted from 3-PW to 4-GW.

 

I know we are in a marketing driven society and when a 7 iron is tested at the fitter and has less loft and goes longer it makes us want to pay money but it's always a 7 and not a true comparison. Also wanting to show off and say we hit our 7 iron 180 yards compared to your buddy who had to hit 6 or 5 makes us feel strong.

 

So are we really gaining anything by adjusting lofts or are we just slowly changing the number on the bottom of the club?

 

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There's obviously some marketing involved as the average weekend warrior does want to hit the ball longer and straighter.

However, it's also a technical thing. When you lower the CG, you inevitably increase launch angle through the gear effect. It also decreases spin. High launch, low spin and the ball speed gains from the lower lofts and thin faces, which increase energy transfer, mean the ball goes a long way and maintains decent stopping power through descent angle.

It's a trade-off. If they kept more traditional lofts, you'd have launch angles that are too high and you don't get the same ball speed retention with the extra loft.

Ultimately, it's about getting fit for the right clubs for you. I see so many people ranting about jacked lofts when they play blades. Companies still make blades. There's no need to get riled up over a company offering a club that's not meant for you.

There are plenty who can still get by using traditional sets of clubs, but what companies are finding out through the game improvement categories are that traditional sets don't work for everyone and these are the types of clubs that can help make the game more fun for those people and can potentially help them to play better golf without investing a lot of money and time into lessons and playing more often.

As technology advances, we may see loft jacking regress back to more traditional numbers but for the time being it is a necessary part of that slice of the market.



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42 minutes ago, pozzit said:

 

Ok so I'm trying to understand why lofts are getting so much stronger. Im under the option that the strengthening of lofts is driven primary by marketing and not by true need. I will gladly admit I'm wrong if there are requirements for the lofts getting stronger to compensate for tech but I'm just curious why.

 

So my understanding and opinion. The tech improvements in irons over the last 20 years has been significant, lower CG for higher flight and better decent angles, more perimeter weighting for forgiveness, thinner faces for more ball speed. All these improvements are fantastic if you need those things. I have also noticed over the last 10-15 years the standard 8 club set has shifted from 3-PW to 4-GW.

 

I know we are in a marketing driven society and when a 7 iron is tested at the fitter and has less loft and goes longer it makes us want to pay money but it's always a 7 and not a true comparison. Also wanting to show off and say we hit our 7 iron 180 yards compared to your buddy who had to hit 6 or 5 makes us feel strong.

 

So are we really gaining anything by adjusting lofts or are we just slowly changing the number on the bottom of the club?

 

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17 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Why is there no length standards, flex standards, headweight standards, shoe size standard, etc.  You can say they lofts are jacked and no one can really provide a good reason why.  Like you said, clubs launch higher and travel farther.  Marketing is all about distance;  most players won't buy clubs that go 10 yards less than their current clubs.    Ultimately the number on the bottom of the club is and has always been meaningless;  find the clubs that allow you to hit the ball a specific distance.  If that is labelled 7, 33*, A, 150 yrd, or something else,  does it really matter?

 

 

This is my question as well 

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Jacked lofts don’t exist. Numbers in the bottom of an iron are arbitrary and chosen by the manufacturer. There’s no standard in golf.

pick a style of club and look at the specs for each company in that style.

launch, spin and land angle are what matters. The manufacturers work to get irons into a certain window. 

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My only issue with it is some manufacturers don’t make corresponding wedges. I personally would like to see more set GW’s. It is a full shot club for most everyone, yet we have to try and match a specialty wedge in there. There are a lot of sets with GW’s for sure... but a few in my preferred iron category lacks. That 50°/51° square soled wedge.

Speaking in my own preferences of course. I’d love to see a Blueprint GW...


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I had an issue with my Hot Metal Pros for this reason. The PW was 45*, but went 150 yards. My 50* is and Edel and goes 120 yards, leaving a ridiculous gap.



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I’m with the OP here. It’s difficult to find an iron with some forgiveness that doesn’t make the ball travel further, loft-to-loft. My Hot Metal Pro PW was 45*, my Ping i210 was 46*.... The HMP went 15 yards further. Why??? Yep, folks want more distance and need it, I guess, but it’s hard to shop for clubs with some offset, forgiveness, and not have the ball go super high, spin low, and go further. Hot faces leave huge gaps at the wedges... See my previous post!

 

 

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Why is there no length standards, flex standards, headweight standards, shoe size standard, etc.  You can say they lofts are jacked and no one can really provide a good reason why.  Like you said, clubs launch higher and travel farther.  Marketing is all about distance;  most players won't buy clubs that go 10 yards less than their current clubs.    Ultimately the number on the bottom of the club is and has always been meaningless;  find the clubs that allow you to hit the ball a specific distance.  If that is labelled 7, 33*, A, 150 yrd, or something else,  does it really matter?
 
 
First off you right it doesnt matter and my point in this discussion was to try to understand if I was missing something. I completely agree if clubs were A,B,C or some how allowed you to put your own distances on there that what is truly important to the golfer.

My main point is to understand if I was incorrect in my belief that deceasing lofts was only intended from a marketing standpoint. Although I think that is a main driver there are probably some merit to helping lower the trajectory.

My concern is that it could hurt the game and players to compete over unimportant arbitrary number that in an actual round mean nothing. If the other guys hit his 7 iron 190 that shouldn't affect what club I hit from 190. I want players to make logical decisions on how it affects there dispursion and distance control and ignore the fact that the 7 goes a mile and a half.

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That is an issue that most brands haven't really addressed.

Mizuno, though, have the JPX line of wedges that I think would be more in line performance wise with the HMP irons.

PXG is one of the only manufacturers that I know of that offers their GI (0211 and 0311XF) and SGI (0311 SGI) irons all the way through to a LW so you're at least getting the same tech throughout the set which makes gapping easier. They even offer a GW in their Players (0311 P) iron.

The issue really just comes in when you go from a club designed for distance, i.e. the iron set, to a club designed for control, i.e. the specialty wedges.

I’m with the OP here. It’s difficult to find an iron with some forgiveness that doesn’t make the ball travel further, loft-to-loft. My Hot Metal Pro PW was 45*, my Ping i210 was 46*.... The HMP went 15 yards further. Why??? Yep, folks want more distance and need it, I guess, but it’s hard to shop for clubs with some offset, forgiveness, and not have to ball go super high, spin low, and go further. Hot faces leave huge gaps at the wedges... See my previous post!


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The issue really just comes in when you go from a club designed for distance, i.e. the iron set, to a club designed for control, i.e. the specialty wedges. MyGolfSpy mobile app 

 

 

 Interesting I would say that the irons are more about distance control then just distance. I need my driver and woods to go far I need my irons and wedges to be exact.

 

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Your irons sure. But what I'm saying there specifically applies to people gaming GI, SGI or Player's Distance irons but then transition directly into specialist wedges.

 
 
 
 
 

 Interesting I would say that the irons are more about distance control then just distance. I need my driver and woods to go far I need my irons and wedges to be exact. 
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6 hours ago, pozzit said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 Interesting I would say that the irons are more about distance control then just distance. I need my driver and woods to go far I need my irons and wedges to be exact.

 

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Distance control means different things to different people.

some want to flight the ball down and hit different distances with the same club.

others want consistent distance which is another form of control where they don’t catch a hot one from the fairway and fly a green.

companies know golfers want to hit the ball far and so they market distance which is easier to sell than accuracy. Some guys want to hit their 7 iron the same distance they did when they were younger.

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Thats a good point RickyBobby distance control does mean different things to different people. I was referring more toward a consistent distance. I need my 8 iron to fly 10 yards further then my 9 and 10 yards less then my 7. The need is for a small window of distance.

I will agree distance sells just like 0-60mph times on cars, girls in bikinis in beer commercials and low low prices on Black Friday.

I just feel there may be some disservice to golfers by being lured to needing to hit it further with less club instead of hitting the club with the consistent distance and forgiveness that is needed.

Saying all that I appreciate all the feedback so far I have a feeling being on a forum for a golf company driven by making decisions based on the right data and not taking the marketing dollars and promoting players to but the best club on all metrics.

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17 minutes ago, pozzit said:

Thats a good point RickyBobby distance control does mean different things to different people. I was referring more toward a consistent distance. I need my 8 iron to fly 10 yards further then my 9 and 10 yards less then my 7. The need is for a small window of distance.

I will agree distance sells just like 0-60mph times on cars, girls in bikinis in beer commercials and low low prices on Black Friday.

I just feel there may be some disservice to golfers by being lured to needing to hit it further with less club instead of hitting the club with the consistent distance and forgiveness that is needed.

Saying all that I appreciate all the feedback so far I have a feeling being on a forum for a golf company driven by making decisions based on the right data and not taking the marketing dollars and promoting players to but the best club on all metrics.

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That is some tight gapping. For most companies they look to get 15 yards between clubs.

theres a large number of golfers out there that want to hit the ball far. They don’t care that it might go to far or that the gap is 17 yards instead of 12. I think most golfers would prefer to hit an iron over a hybrid so if a 4i goes the same distance and hybrid and is almost as say to get in the air that’s not a bad thing for most. Everyone wants golf to be easy so what does it matter if someone plays clubs that go high and far? What does it matter if that person has a gap that’s bigger or smaller than someone else prefers? The golfer looking at the gi/sgi type of club is buying it because they are inconsistent with contact on the face and thus distance. If the golfer is out playing and has a good time or is just happy to be playing that’s all that matters.
 

the great thing about golf is there are lots of brands with lots of choices from baby blades to almost a full set of hybrids. Find what works for you and play that. 

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50 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

That is some tight gapping. For most companies they look to get 15 yards between clubs.

My gapping on my irons is about 10 yards between each iron, so I'm not sure which company you are referring to (my irons are the PING G irons on my 5-9 irons).

Here's a breakdown of what is in my bag, distance wise, with my irons:

  • 3 hybrid - 205 yds
  • 4 crossover - 195 yds
  • 5 iron - 185 yds
  • 6 iron - 175 yds
  • 7 iron - 165 yds
  • 8 iron - 155 yds
  • 9 iron - 145 yds
  • PW - 125 yds
  • GW - 115 yds
  • SW - 100 yds
  • LW - 90 yds

So beyond the massive gap between PW and 9 iron, most of my gapping is about 10 yards.

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Before I was fit for my current set my fitter gave me an input sheet and asked that I record about 5-6 rounds and all my shot distances, what club I used, and the results of those shots. It even asked for weather conditions - wind, wet/dry, temp, etc. I then sent the data to my fitter before my fitting day arrived. Then when I arrived he had another questionnaire form that I filled out which we discussed prior to starting the actual fitting. This questionnaire requested other basic data such as typical ball flight patterns, scores, hcp., type of turf I normally play from, balls used, expectations, strong or weak points in my game, my age, etc. etc.

Back to the topic of this thread - I can't tell you the lofts of my irons except wedges (I have the data somewhere) but they are set at what's generally considered traditional lofts. The results of my fitting wasn't increased distance or higher/lower ball flight. I was mostly interested in accuracy which increased dramatically. My irons like most everyone else's are numbered. All I know when I play a certain numbered iron are my expected distances. I do not rely on another players club selection when making a shot. Sure I ask from time to time but it's immaterial to what I select because their clubs were not made for me. 

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. I do not rely on another players club selection when making a shot. Sure I ask from time to time but it's immaterial to what I select because their clubs were not made for me. 


Exactly. If I ask another player about club selection I really want to known if you hit the shot well and how far do you normally hit the club not the number on the bottom.

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13 hours ago, PMookie said:

I’m with the OP here. It’s difficult to find an iron with some forgiveness that doesn’t make the ball travel further, loft-to-loft. My Hot Metal Pro PW was 45*, my Ping i210 was 46*.... The HMP went 15 yards further. Why??? Yep, folks want more distance and need it, I guess, but it’s hard to shop for clubs with some offset, forgiveness, and not have the ball go super high, spin low, and go further. Hot faces leave huge gaps at the wedges... See my previous post!

 

 

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While I believe there are numerous options for forgiveness without huge distance gains you are correct in the fact that there are gaps that the OEM's are creating with the lofts. I believe that they will catch up eventually but having a wedge go 150 when your gw goes 120 is a huge problem. When I got my P790's this is the one thing I was worried about so I had the short irons bent 2* weak. I try to base all my gaps off my PW @ 135, it worked but off the rack it would have been a big problem. With my 785's they are bent 1* strong in order to achieve the same distance with my PW. 

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1 hour ago, GSwag said:

My gapping on my irons is about 10 yards between each iron, so I'm not sure which company you are referring to (my irons are the PING G irons on my 5-9 irons).

Here's a breakdown of what is in my bag, distance wise, with my irons:

  • 3 hybrid - 205 yds
  • 4 crossover - 195 yds
  • 5 iron - 185 yds
  • 6 iron - 175 yds
  • 7 iron - 165 yds
  • 8 iron - 155 yds
  • 9 iron - 145 yds
  • PW - 125 yds
  • GW - 115 yds
  • SW - 100 yds
  • LW - 90 yds

So beyond the massive gap between PW and 9 iron, most of my gapping is about 10 yards.

12-15 yards is a normal gap for the majority of irons and recommended down thru wedges.

what one sees will be dependent on that person and how the deliver the club into the ball as launch & spin and consequently land angle will be affected.

the good thing about most clubs is they can be adjusted to get what gap a player wants.

1 minute ago, THEZIPR23 said:

While I believe there are numerous options for forgiveness without huge distance gains you are correct in the fact that there are gaps that the OEM's are creating with the lofts. I believe that they will catch up eventually but having a wedge go 150 when your gw goes 120 is a huge problem. When I got my P790's this is the one thing I was worried about so I had the short irons bent 2* weak. I try to base all my gaps off my PW @ 135, it worked but off the rack it would have been a big problem. With my 785's they are bent 1* strong in order to achieve the same distance with my PW. 

Off the top of my head Titleist and Callaway offer multiple set wedges to gw or sw to fit into their players, gi/sgi irons and TaylorMade might as well with the m irons.
 

theres always going to be a gap in bags whether it’s from irons to woods or irons to wedges. Those who play the more forgiving irons would need to buy more wedges and would be able to drop hybrids because the irons cover that gap and wedges are cheaper than hybrids. Those who play a smaller iron head would have gaps at the top.

 

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Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

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3 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

12-15 yards is a normal gap for the majority of irons and recommended down thru wedges.

what one sees will be dependent on that person and how the deliver the club into the ball as launch & spin and consequently land angle will be affected.

the good thing about most clubs is they can be adjusted to get what gap a player wants.

Off the top of my head Titleist and Callaway offer multiple set wedges to gw or sw to fit into their players, gi/sgi irons and TaylorMade might as well with the m irons.
 

theres always going to be a gap in bags whether it’s from irons to woods or irons to wedges. Those who play the more forgiving irons would need to buy more wedges and would be able to drop hybrids because the irons cover that gap and wedges are cheaper than hybrids. Those who play a smaller iron head would have gaps at the top.

 

You are correct, it is very difficult to gap a bag from top to bottom with off the rack lofts. I had the P790 gaps dialed in because of changing the lofts. I would have to look but I believe I had them weaker on the short iron and then somewhere around 6 & 7 iron they normalized and then 4 & 5 iron were stronger. 785's are all strong but with the different tech this is expected. OEM's need to cater to the majority and until they start changing the numbers on the bottom they are not helping the average golfer. 

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

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 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 59 04 T (KBS 610)

:taylormade-small:     Spider GT Splitback 34"

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"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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1 hour ago, THEZIPR23 said:

You are correct, it is very difficult to gap a bag from top to bottom with off the rack lofts. I had the P790 gaps dialed in because of changing the lofts. I would have to look but I believe I had them weaker on the short iron and then somewhere around 6 & 7 iron they normalized and then 4 & 5 iron were stronger. 785's are all strong but with the different tech this is expected. OEM's need to cater to the majority and until they start changing the numbers on the bottom they are not helping the average golfer. 

The average golfer doesn’t know and probably doesn’t care what the loft on their irons are. They care how far they go. I play a lot of golf with random people as I tend to play solo and usually last minute. I don’t remember the last time anyone talked about the loft on their irons. They were all about when I have x distance I pull y club. Many also like that they hit their new x club farther than their old one and don’t account for anything related to the design of it. I’ve been to numerous demo days and the vast majority of golfers are looking for one thing and that is does this club go farther than my current one...that applies to woods and irons. 
 

it’s the internet golfers and the better players that have issue with the perceptions of jacked lofts and are the ones looking to make sure their bag is gapped correctly. So the notion of companies doing a disservice to the average golfer is that gets projected onto the average golfer

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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2 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The average golfer doesn’t know and probably doesn’t care what the loft on their irons are. They care how far they go. I play a lot of golf with random people as I tend to play solo and usually last minute. I don’t remember the last time anyone talked about the loft on their irons. They were all about when I have x distance I pull y club. Many also like that they hit their new x club farther than their old one and don’t account for anything related to the design of it. I’ve been to numerous demo days and the vast majority of golfers are looking for one thing and that is does this club go farther than my current one...that applies to woods and irons. 
 

it’s the internet golfers and the better players that have issue with the perceptions of jacked lofts and are the ones looking to make sure their bag is gapped correctly. So the notion of companies doing a disservice to the average golfer is that gets projected onto the average golfer

This is exactly my point. I am able to gap my clubs properly due to my knowledge. I can combat what OEM's do with lofts. The average golfer has no idea and relies on the OEM's to provide proper gaping for them and they are not doing that. 

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

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"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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3 minutes ago, THEZIPR23 said:

This is exactly my point. I am able to gap my clubs properly due to my knowledge. I can combat what OEM's do with lofts. The average golfer has no idea and relies on the OEM's to provide proper gaping for them and they are not doing that. 

They don’t care to do it. There average golfer wants and easy fix and isn’t into the nuts and bolts of the club. Most don’t get fit. 
 

don’t most consumers rely on a company to do stuff for them? People take their cars to mechanics for maintenance because they either don’t want to do it, don’t have time to do it or don’t want to know how to do it. Same for many other professions. Why would/should golf be any different?

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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4 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

They don’t care to do it. There average golfer wants and easy fix and isn’t into the nuts and bolts of the club. Most don’t get fit. 
 

don’t most consumers rely on a company to do stuff for them? People take their cars to mechanics for maintenance because they either don’t want to do it, don’t have time to do it or don’t want to know how to do it. Same for many other professions. Why would/should golf be any different?

Yes they use a mechanic, just like I use myself as a mechanic for my clubs. But there are fundamental things that everyone expects from a car that are provided by manufacturers. When I hit a PW and go down to a GW on next shot I should be able to expect that the gap is manageable. This was the case for countless years and now it is not. 

I just bought a new TV, I expect the picture out of the box to look good to the average person. I was able to adjust the settings to my preferences, something that a lot of people will not do. Same should be applied to golf.  

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

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"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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22 minutes ago, THEZIPR23 said:

Yes they use a mechanic, just like I use myself as a mechanic for my clubs. But there are fundamental things that everyone expects from a car that are provided by manufacturers. When I hit a PW and go down to a GW on next shot I should be able to expect that the gap is manageable. This was the case for countless years and now it is not. 

I just bought a new TV, I expect the picture out of the box to look good to the average person. I was able to adjust the settings to my preferences, something that a lot of people will not do. Same should be applied to golf.  

The bolder part is the case for you but not for every golfer. The average golfer doesn’t care about that. Most still play the same wedge lofts they always played because that’s what they are used to.  Companies aren’t doing a disservice to the golfer. If they were then the sales numbers would reflect than and they would change their approach but companies like Callaway are making huge profits and outside of forums golfers aren’t complaining about lofts, gaps, and so on. 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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13 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The bolder part is the case for you but not for every golfer. The average golfer doesn’t care about that. Most still play the same wedge lofts they always played because that’s what they are used to.   

And their game is suffering because the current lofts are not matching the wedges being played. 

16 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

  Companies aren’t doing a disservice to the golfer. If they were then the sales numbers would reflect than and they would change their approach but companies like Callaway are making huge profits and outside of forums golfers aren’t complaining about lofts, gaps, and so on. 

How would sales suffer if average golfers don't realize what is happening?

:taylormade-small:     Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") 

image.png.dee92ef6cebb2ac4a3883744fc248f12.png     Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43")

:ping-small:          G425 19 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:ping-small:          G425 22 (Raijin 2.0 85x)

:srixon-small:            ZX7 5-9 (KBS C Taper S)

:titleist-small:            Vokey SM9 45 10 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 49 08 F (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 55 08 M (KBS 610)

 :titleist-small:           Vokey SM9 59 04 T (KBS 610)

:taylormade-small:     Spider GT Splitback 34"

 :titleist-small:           ProV1 #23

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"One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory."

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26 minutes ago, THEZIPR23 said:

And their game is suffering because the current lofts are not matching the wedges being played. 

How would sales suffer if average golfers don't realize what is happening?

This is exactly where my head is at. The average golfer sees my 7 iron goes x yards further and they are happy with that but neglect to realize this means the gap in wedges has increased and gap in woods/hybrid is decreasing. Also looking at some of the lofts in common clubs they are not evenly distributed. Many clubs are using 2.5-3* gaps in long irons then up to 5+* gaps in PW and GW if they offer one. This tells me they are trying to balance the gaps but can cause more issues.

I get the average golfer could care less about specs but I'm sure they care about how they deal with different shots on the course and are suffering at these gaps.

Driver:  Ben Hogan GS53
4W:  Maltby KE4 
2i: Maltby KE4 FDI 
4-PW:  Maltby TS-1 - C-Taper 120g 
50,54,58: Maltby TSW

Putter:  L.A.B. DF2.1 Accra Shaft 2023 Forum Testers - L.A.B. Putters
Ball: Mixed prefer ProV1 or Snell
Handicap: 9.2  -  Best Score: 72 (E) Springdale CC, Canton NC -2022

2020 Forum Tester - Ben Hogan GS53 Driver

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4 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The average golfer doesn’t know and probably doesn’t care what the loft on their irons are. They care how far they go. I play a lot of golf with random people as I tend to play solo and usually last minute. I don’t remember the last time anyone talked about the loft on their irons. They were all about when I have x distance I pull y club. Many also like that they hit their new x club farther than their old one and don’t account for anything related to the design of it. I’ve been to numerous demo days and the vast majority of golfers are looking for one thing and that is does this club go farther than my current one...that applies to woods and irons. 
 

it’s the internet golfers and the better players that have issue with the perceptions of jacked lofts and are the ones looking to make sure their bag is gapped correctly. So the notion of companies doing a disservice to the average golfer is that gets projected onto the average golfer

Doesn't this just confirm what the OP was asking/suggesting in the first place?

I was anti-jacking to start,  veered towards indifferent, but am now thinking it is hurting more golfers than helping.  My current irons are at least 1-1.5 clubs longer than the old Wilson blades I have. Is that from 40 years of technological advances?  Some of it is, I am sure. But I bet a majority of the distance gain is because the old 8 iron has the loft of my new 9 iron. 

Does the number on the sole matter?  Of course not. But if the average golfer is going to chase an 8 iron that goes farther, they are going to get wooed by the new 8 iron that is essentially their old 7. I don't have any concrete data, but I bet the trend has left many golfers with more long irons that they can't actually hit (or if they can,  the 4 doesn't often go further than the 5) and they now have a giant gap between their set PW and what they thought was a GW that no longer fits that gap. What do they have to show for the new set?  The same scores because they created as many problems as they fixed.

I think that IS a disservice to the unknowing weekend warrior because they are pitched a solution to improve their game that doesn't necessarily fix anything. Just because they don't know doesn't mean its not an issue. 

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