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Most Wanted Drivers 2017 vs 2019


JudgeSmails

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I have a question about driver testing. So I have been playing the 2017 GBB Epic, and recently kind of lucked into and Epic Flash head. I was curious what (if any) the performance difference would be. So I went to your 2017 Most Wanted and your 2019 Most Wanted to compare the numbers. Odd finding, not just the Epic line, but on pretty much all drivers across the board, the 2017 numbers for ball speed and distance are higher. Ball Speeds are about 5mph higher and Carry distance is about 10 yards more. This is across the board on all drivers. Any change in testing between those 2 years to explain that?

I submitted this question to MGS on facebook and they haven't responded, maybe someone here (or an MGS Staffer) has some ideas?  Thanks

82030797_10216449537177318_5857714030235353088_n.jpg

Edited by JudgeSmails

Driver:    :honma:TR20 10.5*

Hybrids:   :callaway-small: Epic SuperHybrid 3 18*   Epic 4h 23*   

Irons:    :mizuno-small:JPX900 Hot Metal 5-GW

Wedges:  :cleveland-small:CBX2 52* 56* 60*

Putter:  :EVNROLL:EV8

Ball:    :bridgestone-small:Tour BXS

 

 

 

 

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At present, there is no way to compare Most Wanted Testing across years, because the tester pools are different each year. Those overall differences that you're seeing between 2017 and 2019 are not differences in clubs, but differences in the guys swinging them.

:titleist-small: TS3 9.5°, Tensei Blue
:755178188_TourEdge: CBX T3 15°, Project X HZRDUS Black
:callaway-small: Epic Super Hybrid 18°, Aerotech Steel Fiber FC HYB S
:755178188_TourEdge: C722 21°, Ventus Blue 8S
:touredgeexotics: CBX Iron-Wood 25°, Project X HZRDUS Black 6.0
:Sub70: 639 CB, Aldila NV 95 Graphite, 6–PW
:cleveland-small: CBX 48°
:mizuno-small: T22 54° and 60°
:edel-golf-1: EAS 4.0, Garsen G-Pro grip
:taylormade-small: TP5x and Tour Response

Full WITB with pictures

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2 minutes ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

At present, there is no way to compare Most Wanted Testing across years, because the tester pools are different each year. Those overall differences that you're seeing between 2017 and 2019 are not differences in clubs, but differences in the guys swinging them.

Thank you!  I kind of figured that was it, but wanted to check.  OBV comparing the 2 most wanted tests won't do me much good then, so it's off for my own comparisons 🙂

 

Driver:    :honma:TR20 10.5*

Hybrids:   :callaway-small: Epic SuperHybrid 3 18*   Epic 4h 23*   

Irons:    :mizuno-small:JPX900 Hot Metal 5-GW

Wedges:  :cleveland-small:CBX2 52* 56* 60*

Putter:  :EVNROLL:EV8

Ball:    :bridgestone-small:Tour BXS

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, JudgeSmails said:

Thank you!  I kind of figured that was it, but wanted to check.  OBV comparing the 2 most wanted tests won't do me much good then, so it's off for my own comparisons 🙂

Over the years, I've seen a lot of requests for cross-year testing, even just included the previous year's winner in the next year's testing. I think time is the main obstacle; each club added to the test adds a lot more shots.

:titleist-small: TS3 9.5°, Tensei Blue
:755178188_TourEdge: CBX T3 15°, Project X HZRDUS Black
:callaway-small: Epic Super Hybrid 18°, Aerotech Steel Fiber FC HYB S
:755178188_TourEdge: C722 21°, Ventus Blue 8S
:touredgeexotics: CBX Iron-Wood 25°, Project X HZRDUS Black 6.0
:Sub70: 639 CB, Aldila NV 95 Graphite, 6–PW
:cleveland-small: CBX 48°
:mizuno-small: T22 54° and 60°
:edel-golf-1: EAS 4.0, Garsen G-Pro grip
:taylormade-small: TP5x and Tour Response

Full WITB with pictures

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1 hour ago, JudgeSmails said:

Thank you!  I kind of figured that was it, but wanted to check.  OBV comparing the 2 most wanted tests won't do me much good then, so it's off for my own comparisons 🙂

 

I would watch reviews for the 2017 clubs and comparable 2019 clubs on YouTube done by the same reviewer.  I can't imagine most of them have changed their swings that much in two years. That would be closer to what you're looking for.

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2 hours ago, JudgeSmails said:

Thank you!  I kind of figured that was it, but wanted to check.  OBV comparing the 2 most wanted tests won't do me much good then, so it's off for my own comparisons 🙂

 

 

... I have always said these kinds of tests are just a starting point. I swing around 100 mph with a smooth and deliberate transition and have a positive AOA. So someone testing the same driver that has a 100 mph swing with an aggressive transition, short hard hitter with a negative AOA will have zero similar results with any driver/shaft combo. And driver shaft combo is also huge for anyone looking at any tests. The Atmos Tour Spec Blue is a great fit for my swing and for fun I tried the Atmos Tour Spec Black and lost distance and trajectory as well as feel because it felt like I was not unloading the shaft producing the illusion that I needed to swing harder. Otoh after playing the Even Flow Blue I tried the Even Flow Black and it worked well for me. No amount of testing by others will give me results that my independent testing will produce. 

... So while given some results with a combined number of golfers does provide a starting point, what anyone may find for their individual swing can be very different than the tests, so as you point out "it is off for my own comparisons" and exactly what most of us will need to do. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
Irons:       :titleist-small:         '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :taylormade-small: Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli     Maxfli Tour

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19 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... I have always said these kinds of tests are just a starting point. I swing around 100 mph with a smooth and deliberate transition and have a positive AOA. So someone testing the same driver that has a 100 mph swing with an aggressive transition, short hard hitter with a negative AOA will have zero similar results with any driver/shaft combo. And driver shaft combo is also huge for anyone looking at any tests. The Atmos Tour Spec Blue is a great fit for my swing and for fun I tried the Atmos Tour Spec Black and lost distance and trajectory as well as feel because it felt like I was not unloading the shaft producing the illusion that I needed to swing harder. Otoh after playing the Even Flow Blue I tried the Even Flow Black and it worked well for me. No amount of testing by others will give me results that my independent testing will produce. 

... So while given some results with a combined number of golfers does provide a starting point, what anyone may find for their individual swing can be very different than the tests, so as you point out "it is off for my own comparisons" and exactly what most of us will need to do. 

Yeah, totally agree...it was just going to be a starting point 

Driver:    :honma:TR20 10.5*

Hybrids:   :callaway-small: Epic SuperHybrid 3 18*   Epic 4h 23*   

Irons:    :mizuno-small:JPX900 Hot Metal 5-GW

Wedges:  :cleveland-small:CBX2 52* 56* 60*

Putter:  :EVNROLL:EV8

Ball:    :bridgestone-small:Tour BXS

 

 

 

 

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57 minutes ago, TwoCoatsOfWax said:

I would watch reviews for the 2017 clubs and comparable 2019 clubs on YouTube done by the same reviewer.  I can't imagine most of them have changed their swings that much in two years. That would be closer to what you're looking for.

I did do some of that...there are a few comparisons out there

Also, are you just finishing up the second coat now?

Driver:    :honma:TR20 10.5*

Hybrids:   :callaway-small: Epic SuperHybrid 3 18*   Epic 4h 23*   

Irons:    :mizuno-small:JPX900 Hot Metal 5-GW

Wedges:  :cleveland-small:CBX2 52* 56* 60*

Putter:  :EVNROLL:EV8

Ball:    :bridgestone-small:Tour BXS

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

Over the years, I've seen a lot of requests for cross-year testing, even just included the previous year's winner in the next year's testing. I think time is the main obstacle; each club added to the test adds a lot more shots.

These test already require a ton of time. adding more clubs from previous years really does not sweeten the pie in my mind. 

Driver: Callaway Paradym Triple diamond 10.5 Ventus black TR 6x

3 wood ; Callaway Paradym triple diamond 15 degree, Ventus black TR 7x

Apex UW 19 degree, Ventus black TR 8x

Utility Iron: Mizuno Pro Fli Hi 4 utility, Ventus blue HB 90X

Irons: Callaway Apex MB 5-PW, KBS $ taper 130x

Wedges: Callaway Jaws Raw 50, 54, 58, KBS $ taper 130x

Putter: Wilson Staff TM22, hand torched, KBS cutter putter shaft, Super stroke Pistol GT 1.0

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If it's a time issue, curious as to why MGS doesn't put out a call for forum members in the surrounding area to come down and lend a hand. I'm sure many would jump at the chance to check out the facility, meet the staff, and have a hand in creating a Most Wanted product - I know I would!

In my :ping-small: Hoofer:

:ping-small: G410 LST 10.5* - Kai'Li White 60 X-flex

:nike-small: VRS Covert 3W 15* - Kuro Kage 65 S-flex

  :titelist-small:  T200 4-GW, DG X100 Tour Issue - Tester

:ping-small: Glide 2.0 Stealth 54.12 SS & 58.10 SS

:ping-small:  Zing 2 LW - 60*

:ping-small:  Anser 2

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If it's a time issue, curious as to why MGS doesn't put out a call for forum members in the surrounding area to come down and lend a hand. I'm sure many would jump at the chance to check out the facility, meet the staff, and have a hand in creating a Most Wanted product - I know I would!

They have an open door policy and on one of the past no putts given Harry said to shoot him an email and you could be a tester. I have even seen signs at local courses and golf shops.

 

I am pretty sure they do have a limit on the number of testers for each product. This is due to space limitations at the facility (2 gc quads, and 1 putting green) and who they can fit in during the day. This years driver test is roughly a 40 hour commitment for each tester. 4 drivers each session with a total of 9 sessions. Each session is an hour plus which includes some warm up time, following the prescribed protocol; and providing subjective feedback. I get in 1 to 2 sessions a week.

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   :taylormade-small:TM-180

Testing:   SPGC_logo.jpg

Backups:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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54 minutes ago, cnosil said:

They have an open door policy and on one of the past no putts given Harry said to shoot him an email and you could be a tester. I have even seen signs at local courses and golf shops.

 

I am pretty sure they do have a limit on the number of testers for each product. This is due to space limitations at the facility (2 gc quads, and 1 putting green) and who they can fit in during the day. This years driver test is roughly a 40 hour commitment for each tester. 4 drivers each session with a total of 9 sessions. Each session is an hour plus which includes some warm up time, following the prescribed protocol; and providing subjective feedback. I get in 1 to 2 sessions a week.

Thanks so much to you and all of our testers.  I remember seeing this result a few years back - where the prior year's ball speed and yardages were greater so I asked and it was exactly because of the difference in the testing pool. 

I also remember a year or two where we had some information about each of the testers - these very nice when looking for a starting point.  Since I haven't really been in the driver market the past few years perhaps its been there and I've missed it.

Taylor Made Stealth 2 10.5 Diamana S plus 60  Aldila  R flex   - 42.25 inches 

SMT 4 wood bassara R flex, four wood head, 3 wood shaft

Ping G410 7, 9 wood  Alta 65 R flex

Srixon ZX5 MK II  5-GW - UST recoil Dart 65 R flex

India 52,56 (60 pending)  UST recoil 75's R flex  

Evon roll ER 5 32 inches

It's our offseason so auditioning candidates - looking for that right mix of low spin long, more spin around the greens - TBD   

 

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This is an intriguing idea, but the logistics would be....   interesting.  🙂

The Rick Shiels "5 years of XXXX drivers" videos are the closest to this, such as I've seen.   <shrug>

Driver: TM Original One 11.5* set to 11*, Aldila NV75 X, 43.5" -or- SpeedZone, HZRDUS Black 75 6.5, 43.5"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, RIP Beta 90, 42" -or- Stage 2 Tour, NV105 X, 42.5"
2h or 3h:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, Aldila NV105 S -or- RIP Alpha 105 S
Irons:  3-PW Mizuno MP37, Recoil Proto 125 F4 (reshaft in progress, slowly); 1i & 3-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S; 2-PW Golden Ram TW282, RIP Tour 115 R
GW: Dynacraft Dual Milled CNC 52*, Steelfiber 125 S; Scratch 8620 DS 53*, Steelfiber 125 S
SW:  Ram TG-898 56*, DGX ss2x; Ram Tom Watson 55*, DGX ss2x; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS; PM Grind 19 58*, stock shaft
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34"; Ping Scottsdale TR Craz-E, 35"; Cleveland Huntington Beach 1, 35"
Ball:  Wilson Staff Duo Professional, Bridgestone Tour B-RXS, Callaway Chrome Soft

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@JudgeSmails the club speed is missing from the 2019 testing. The club and ball speed will be similarly correlated. If 2019 testing was abt 99-100mph then there's an interesting difference in performance.

Charleston, SC

HDCP 13.0

  • Driver: :taylormade-small:  M6 9* with 65g Stiff Mitsubishi Tensei Red shaft
  • 3 wood: :ping-small:  G425 stiff shaft
  • 5 wood: :taylormade-small: Stealth 2 stiff shaft
  • 4-gw irons:  :mizuno-small: JPX 921 Hot Metal w/ X-stiff KBS 130gr shafts (soft stepped)
  • Wedges: :taylormade-small: MG3 52, 56, 60 
  • Putter: 34" Scotty Cameron 12.5
  • Ball: :titelist-small: ProV-1x
  • Tracked By: :Arccos:

MGS Tester '20 - :ping-small: G710 Iron Review

MGS Tester '19 - :918457628_PrecisionPro:Precision Pro NX9 HD Pro laser rangefinder

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[mention=55830]JudgeSmails[/mention] the club speed is missing from the 2019 testing. The club and ball speed will be similarly correlated. If 2019 testing was abt 99-100mph then there's an interesting difference in performance.

 

Still impossible to correlate. Don’t know how many players are in the stats for the various swing speeds and we don’t know where the player was hitting it on the face. My 100mph toe hits will potentially have less ball speed than a players 95mph sweet spot hit. To do any real comparison, you would have to have the entire set of data

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   :taylormade-small:TM-180

Testing:   SPGC_logo.jpg

Backups:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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  • 1 month later...

Not sure if anyone else has mentioned it, but TXG just started doing some comparison videos with drivers a few models old.  I'm not sure if the got an OG Epic to compare to or not though.

:callaway-small: Epic Max LS 10.5 - Motore X F3 6X | :cobra-small: Speedzone 5-wood - Ventus Blue 8S | :titelist-small: TSi3 20* Hybrid - KBS Proto 85S

:edel-golf-1: SMS Pro 4-PW - Steelfiber i110S | :taylormade-small: MG3 Raw Black 50.09, 54.11, 58.11 - DG TI S200

:EVNROLL: ER2B | :titelist-small: Pro V1x | :918457628_PrecisionPro: NX9 Slope | Jones Trouper R | :CaddyTek: CaddyLite EZ v8

 

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14 minutes ago, B.Boston said:

Not sure if anyone else has mentioned it, but TXG just started doing some comparison videos with drivers a few models old.  I'm not sure if the got an OG Epic to compare to or not though.

The ones I’ve seen lately have been model year replacement like rogue vs mavrik, m5/6 vs sim/max. Not sure their setup/policy with the various manufactures but I would guess something that’s more than 1 release cycle back they don’t stock and more than likely have sent back to the oem

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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I’d still like to see last years winner in the mix... testers will be different, etc, and all that is true. But it will still be hit by the same testers this time around, and one more club wouldn’t make that big a difference. And if it does, then I would drop a club that is known to not be in the top 3 or 4. It’ll still be apples to apples for this years testing.

 

:titleist-small: TSr2 on tensi blue stiff

:cobra-small: Speedzone 3-wood on Tensi blue S

:callaway-logo-1: Epic Max 5 and 7 woods on HZRDUS  Reg flex

:callaway-logo-1: Paradym 9 wood on HZRDUS reg flex

:taylormade-small: P770 / P790 combo set on Ventus R-6 shafts 6-AW

:mizuno-small:  T22 Denim Copper 54°, 58° on Kinetic X Trajectory 

:EVNROLL: ER3 or,

:edel-golf-1: E.A.S. #4   (“Fang” or “Adele”)
 

:titelist-small: ProV1x, or, Maxfli Tour X

:callaway-small: .Org 14 cart bag

Adidas Tour 360 , or Sketcher shoes

 

 

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This was one of TXGs recent Instagram posts. I’m excited for these videos. Can’t wait to see the M2 video.

IMG_4627.JPG


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Driver-  :taylormade-small:  2016 M2 12* Tensei Red Stiff

Wood(s)- :ping-small:  G400 5 Wood 16.9*/ 7 Wood 21.1* Alta CB Stiff

Irons-:mizuno-small:   JPX 900 Forged 6-GW NS Pro 950GH 

Wedges- :cleveland-small:   RTX 3 54*  588 RTX 2.0  58*   RTX 4 64*

Putter-  :taylormade-small:  Spider Tour Black 

Instagram- @patrickleeleep

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This was one of TXGs recent Instagram posts. I’m excited for these videos. Can’t wait to see the M2 video.

IMG_4627.thumb.JPG.0d66c7b8fa2aa3416707ef35f2a8d7e8.JPG


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy


That should be a really good compare!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:callaway-small: Epic Max LS 10.5 - Motore X F3 6X | :cobra-small: Speedzone 5-wood - Ventus Blue 8S | :titelist-small: TSi3 20* Hybrid - KBS Proto 85S

:edel-golf-1: SMS Pro 4-PW - Steelfiber i110S | :taylormade-small: MG3 Raw Black 50.09, 54.11, 58.11 - DG TI S200

:EVNROLL: ER2B | :titelist-small: Pro V1x | :918457628_PrecisionPro: NX9 Slope | Jones Trouper R | :CaddyTek: CaddyLite EZ v8

 

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Some screenshots from the TXG channel and their recent videos. Of course this is with Matt so it’s not showing a lot of off center hits which is where most of the clubs have improved I would think.

IMG_4674.JPG

IMG_4692.JPG

IMG_4693.JPG


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Driver-  :taylormade-small:  2016 M2 12* Tensei Red Stiff

Wood(s)- :ping-small:  G400 5 Wood 16.9*/ 7 Wood 21.1* Alta CB Stiff

Irons-:mizuno-small:   JPX 900 Forged 6-GW NS Pro 950GH 

Wedges- :cleveland-small:   RTX 3 54*  588 RTX 2.0  58*   RTX 4 64*

Putter-  :taylormade-small:  Spider Tour Black 

Instagram- @patrickleeleep

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  • 1 month later...

As far as comparisons go I have played a Callaway XR16 Pro for the last 3.5 years and I love it.  However, I had a chance to get an Epic Flash Sub-Zero for a great deal here recently.  So I went out to compare them, same day, same shaft, same ball and same swing (or as consistent as one can repeat their swing).  After all the hype of the Epic Flash I was surprised that the XR16 out shined it in every aspect.  It was longer, straighter and sounded better in my opinion.  So what does this mean, for me it makes me think that Driver Technology hasn't really improved as much as we would think in the last 4 years.  However, I must admit that the biggest take away is that the shaft and head combination is HUGE!!!!  I am sure that if I found another shaft that fits me and the EP Flash, that I would see better results from the EP Flash, maybe not better than the XR16 but improved from my current shaft with that head.  I know that it will take something very impressive to get the XR16 Pro out of my bag.    

Hit'em straight and not too often!!!

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 2/28/2020 at 5:01 PM, patrickleeleep said:

Some screenshots from the TXG channel and their recent videos. Of course this is with Matt so it’s not showing a lot of off center hits which is where most of the clubs have improved I would think.



IMG_4692.JPG




Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Has the Cobra stalled mid air? 

I love Cobra drivers and really considering changing my old Bio Cell to F9 or SZ but those figures don't give me the confidence boost I was hoping for!

 

:cobra:  Bio Cell (set to 10.5 deg), Project X, Stiff.
:cobra:  Baffler Rail F 15.5deg -  Fujikura Motore 60g Stiff

:cobra:  3/H Baffler Rail H 19 deg -  Fujikura Motore 65g Stiff

:taylormade: : 4i - 9i: Tour Preferred CB - Project X 95 6.0

:titleist: 48deg - (not sure what S it is, it's so old!!)

:taylormade: 52deg - Tour Preferred

:titleist: 54deg - SM6 (F grind)

:titleist: 60deg - SM6 (K grind)

:odyssey: White Ice - 2ball

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3 hours ago, JoceratorsTree said:

Has the Cobra stalled mid air? 

I love Cobra drivers and really considering changing my old Bio Cell to F9 or SZ but those figures don't give me the confidence boost I was hoping for!

 

What does “stalled mid air” mean? 

Cobra makes good drivers and the latest release is another good one. Just like any other club it will fit some and won’t fit others

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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3 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

What does “stalled mid air” mean? 

Cobra makes good drivers and the latest release is another good one. Just like any other club it will fit some and won’t fit others

I just mean that from those numbers above the Cobra SZ doesn't appear to have picked up any distance on the 2017 model compared to TM. 

I love Cobra and I am on my 4th driver of theirs down through the years and will continue to support them... but I would've liked to see an improvement in the numbers vs 2017 model.

 

:cobra:  Bio Cell (set to 10.5 deg), Project X, Stiff.
:cobra:  Baffler Rail F 15.5deg -  Fujikura Motore 60g Stiff

:cobra:  3/H Baffler Rail H 19 deg -  Fujikura Motore 65g Stiff

:taylormade: : 4i - 9i: Tour Preferred CB - Project X 95 6.0

:titleist: 48deg - (not sure what S it is, it's so old!!)

:taylormade: 52deg - Tour Preferred

:titleist: 54deg - SM6 (F grind)

:titleist: 60deg - SM6 (K grind)

:odyssey: White Ice - 2ball

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33 minutes ago, JoceratorsTree said:

I just mean that from those numbers above the Cobra SZ doesn't appear to have picked up any distance on the 2017 model compared to TM. 

I love Cobra and I am on my 4th driver of theirs down through the years and will continue to support them... but I would've liked to see an improvement in the numbers vs 2017 model.

 

 

... If you are Cobra driver fan, I would still demo the new clubs, especially the Xtreme SZ driver. I am not telling you anything you probably don't already know, but every swing is different. I never hit the LTD really well and for my swing the F9 was a huge improvement. I have not hit my Xtreme yet but am hoping it is as long as my F9 but more forgiving with improved accuracy. One thing for sure is my swing and Matt's swing have zero in common, so those numbers and comparison mean nothing to me.  

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
Irons:       :titleist-small:         '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :taylormade-small: Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli     Maxfli Tour

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37 minutes ago, JoceratorsTree said:

I just mean that from those numbers above the Cobra SZ doesn't appear to have picked up any distance on the 2017 model compared to TM. 

I love Cobra and I am on my 4th driver of theirs down through the years and will continue to support them... but I would've liked to see an improvement in the numbers vs 2017 model.

 

For some it will take somewhere between 3-5 years before they see improvements in performance in some areas of launch characteristics especially the ones who have consistent contact and that contact being around the center of the face. Matt from TXG is pretty consistent in contact and delivery so he is one that in many brands won’t see noticeable differences in a 3 year span. Matt’s also not one that prefers or has success with the lower spinning drivers.

If you look at the numbers the difference are what many sources consider pretty much the same because they are very small differences but some more spin and launch isn’t a bad thing. The part that many ignore is the standard deviation. The new driver improved in the several of those categories. 

 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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2 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... If you are Cobra driver fan, I would still demo the new clubs, especially the Xtreme SZ driver. I am not telling you anything you probably don't already know, but every swing is different. I never hit the LTD really well and for my swing the F9 was a huge improvement. I have not hit my Xtreme yet but am hoping it is as long as my F9 but more forgiving with improved accuracy. One thing for sure is my swing and Matt's swing have zero in common, so those numbers and comparison mean nothing to me.  

 

2 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

For some it will take somewhere between 3-5 years before they see improvements in performance in some areas of launch characteristics especially the ones who have consistent contact and that contact being around the center of the face. Matt from TXG is pretty consistent in contact and delivery so he is one that in many brands won’t see noticeable differences in a 3 year span. Matt’s also not one that prefers or has success with the lower spinning drivers.

If you look at the numbers the difference are what many sources consider pretty much the same because they are very small differences but some more spin and launch isn’t a bad thing. The part that many ignore is the standard deviation. The new driver improved in the several of those categories. 

 

This is why I love MGS, I get an education on Donald Rumsfeld Points (what I call the things I don't know that I don't know) and I'm happy to get them so, genuinely, thanks both for the advice.

I will definitely try out the SZ for myself and with a bit of luck it will be in the bag for when the Covid lockdown lifts! 

:cobra:  Bio Cell (set to 10.5 deg), Project X, Stiff.
:cobra:  Baffler Rail F 15.5deg -  Fujikura Motore 60g Stiff

:cobra:  3/H Baffler Rail H 19 deg -  Fujikura Motore 65g Stiff

:taylormade: : 4i - 9i: Tour Preferred CB - Project X 95 6.0

:titleist: 48deg - (not sure what S it is, it's so old!!)

:taylormade: 52deg - Tour Preferred

:titleist: 54deg - SM6 (F grind)

:titleist: 60deg - SM6 (K grind)

:odyssey: White Ice - 2ball

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