Nippon Modus players, question for you guys

[Manimal26]

13 hours ago, Scottyrocket53 said:

Thanks Manimal! I'm going on a buddies golf trip this coming up week I will report how it worked out. The course can be different than the range. I'm not expecting any huge regrets though. My entire goal was to give myself the best fit possible than it's probably all user error after that. 

The ego took a hit not playing almost blades but getting back into the 70's is the goal this next year. 

You're welcome! I would rather score low than say I play blades  ... Checking ego at the door can be hard to do so congrats on you for doing it!

[chisag]

2 hours ago, Manimal26 said:

You're welcome! I would rather score low than say I play blades  ... Checking ego at the door can be hard to do so congrats on you for doing it!

 

... Something I will just never understand. Playing MB's when you are not a very elite ball striker, with swing speed to burn and likes to work the ball I think it is like playing golf and walking the course with shoes 1 size too small or 2 sizes too big and hurt your feet because you think they look good but they don't make them in your size. Your equipment should always enhance your ability, not diminish it. The game is hard enough with properly fit equipment. As always if score is irrelevant to you, playing whatever brings you the most joy is perfectly understandable. I know there are several on every golf forum that really enjoy playing "classic" equipment. 

[Manimal26]

12 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... Something I will just never understand. Playing MB's when you are not a very elite ball striker, with swing speed to burn and likes to work the ball I think it is like playing golf and walking the course with shoes 1 size too small or 2 sizes too big and hurt your feet because you think they look good but they don't make them in your size. Your equipment should always enhance your ability, not diminish it. The game is hard enough with properly foot equipment. As always if score is irrelevant to you, playing whatever brings you the most joy is perfectly understandable. I know there are several on every golf forum that really enjoy playing "classic" equipment. 

I love that guy on the course ... its how I got my P7TW for dirt cheap... I played a round yesterday with 3 drivers a 4h  6i-9i and 5 wedges plus my putter... going to make a separate post, but scored really well...  

[Bigbobtheman]

All this is individualized- however, if helpful for others will share my experience.

Ideally we should all consider the lightest shaft we can control very well, this increases swing speed.

But this is not intuitive or guessable, meaning I hit a 105, therefore I should test 105 in all lines.  wrong assumption.

I have hit tons of clubs and shafts and demos trying to get it most right.

You all need to consider the same.  Make sure the results from your swing that day matches a swing from another day.  Also, try to hit inside and outside.  I made this mistake crushing xxio x iron inside with fitter and then when purchased big set, hit outside and was a balloony high flying mess and had to talk my way into getting funds back (masking taped the clubs hit outside)

Also short iron and longer iron respond differently and might require a different shaft or head for optimum performance.  This topic is not intutive and is very hard.  2 Good fitters likely will lead to 2 different but confident results.

For instance, I had a similar experience as one above with the 105.  Ordered a $175 club to test but found the 105 had little feel for me.  Felt light and boardy and low flying and didn't help with my occasional right miss or dispersion.  Weight category and description I thought was no brainier but it just wasn't.

(I have an 85 mph swing with 7 iron.  105 should have fit great, but in that weight preferred the amt red or black in these lighter weights that helped me feel the shaft.  I came from graphite and really preferred feeling my shaft.)

Never considered a 120 modus but landed on the modus 120 in a regular shaft paired with a honma 747 V head.  Tons of feel came back and I was sweet spotting my shots again with buttery forged feel.  (giveaways on ebay right now for some reason)

Keep in mind a ball can gain or lose you 800-1000 rpm easily.   The shaft should be chosen for flights of the ball and control and what gives you most comfort (while not being so heavy you lose tons of distance.  Often when people "test" clubs to see how they feel they really are just testing the shaft.  I did the same thing till I understood the shaft made a club comfortable, not the head.

Also a game improvement club, may not be.  for instance I was fitted into a small players cavity.  Never considered, but the smaller sole made it easier for me to hit through turf, so don't rule out!

A combo worth trying for similar spec player as me is the t300 with red shaft.  Lots of feel, huge launch and distance and spin.  But Im still too young for all that help.  For reference I hit a 7 iron 155.

I enjoy my clubs!

 

[Manimal26]

@Bigbobtheman welcome to MGS... Handling something at the moment but thanks for sharing

[bens197]

10 hours ago, Bigbobtheman said:

All this is individualized- however, if helpful for others will share my experience.

Ideally we should all consider the lightest shaft we can control very well, this increases swing speed.

But this is not intuitive or guessable, meaning I hit a 105, therefore I should test 105 in all lines.  wrong assumption.

I have hit tons of clubs and shafts and demos trying to get it most right.

You all need to consider the same.  Make sure the results from your swing that day matches a swing from another day.  Also, try to hit inside and outside.  I made this mistake crushing xxio x iron inside with fitter and then when purchased big set, hit outside and was a balloony high flying mess and had to talk my way into getting funds back (masking taped the clubs hit outside)

Also short iron and longer iron respond differently and might require a different shaft or head for optimum performance.  This topic is not intutive and is very hard.  2 Good fitters likely will lead to 2 different but confident results.

For instance, I had a similar experience as one above with the 105.  Ordered a $175 club to test but found the 105 had little feel for me.  Felt light and boardy and low flying and didn't help with my occasional right miss or dispersion.  Weight category and description I thought was no brainier but it just wasn't.

(I have an 85 mph swing with 7 iron.  105 should have fit great, but in that weight preferred the amt red or black in these lighter weights that helped me feel the shaft.  I came from graphite and really preferred feeling my shaft.)

Never considered a 120 modus but landed on the modus 120 in a regular shaft paired with a honma 747 V head.  Tons of feel came back and I was sweet spotting my shots again with buttery forged feel.  (giveaways on ebay right now for some reason)

Keep in mind a ball can gain or lose you 800-1000 rpm easily.   The shaft should be chosen for flights of the ball and control and what gives you most comfort (while not being so heavy you lose tons of distance.  Often when people "test" clubs to see how they feel they really are just testing the shaft.  I did the same thing till I understood the shaft made a club comfortable, not the head.

Also a game improvement club, may not be.  for instance I was fitted into a small players cavity.  Never considered, but the smaller sole made it easier for me to hit through turf, so don't rule out!

A combo worth trying for similar spec player as me is the t300 with red shaft.  Lots of feel, huge launch and distance and spin.  But Im still too young for all that help.  For reference I hit a 7 iron 155.

I enjoy my clubs!

 

This thread has taken on a life further than I had ever expected and offered some very good points I never considered.  Thanks to so many of you for giving some awesome feedback on this ridiculously good iron shaft line.  

A lot of bias has been debunked along the way.  Take for example, the stiff offerings for the 105 and 120 taper tips are only 7 grams difference in weight.  Speaking for myself, I never imagined a significant difference in playability between an iron shaft from a different weight class.  There is an overwhelmingly consistent "opinion" that the 120 is a far better feeling and performing shaft than the 105.  

[Manimal26]

@Bigbobtheman I want to break your post down a tad and I will section it off so its easier to follow

13 hours ago, Bigbobtheman said:

Ideally we should all consider the lightest shaft we can control very well, this increases swing speed.

I am not sure who told you this, but I could not disagree more. I would also be happy to video my self on a launch monitor for proof. That being said my Ping G410 4 hybrid I ordered with the Tensei Pro-Blue 80TX... Carry was around 230 ball speed 140ish... Fit into a GD-AD-DI 95X (100g) and picked up club head speed carry was around 245 and ball speed 145. 

Why did this happen? Well the easy answer and uneducated would be something along the line...... it was the increase in overall weight allows my body to engage properly, which is actually not correct. The physical answer is people forget impact is a Force (F= Mass x Acceleration) and depending on how you load and unload the club imparts forces on you that are equal and opposite. Except that is in a straight line and a golf swing is an arcing distance (s (arc length)= \int^{b}_a\sqrt{1+(\frac{dy}{dx})^2}dx). This means the force generated gets released over over each degree or arc (radian for you standard folks) creating a system of levers (or a fulcrum point) that creates a mechanical advantage. This is where swing weight comes in and why its measured on a 14 fulcrum point scale. This is why you are seeing people like Bryson (physics major) use extremely counter balanced shafts so he can maintain swing weight while increasing the weight of the head which has the most direct contact with the ball...

Of course your ability to generate ground force and other factors play a part, but my message is shaft weight is a tool.

Swing weight will affect feel and swing mechanics. This in turn influences ball flight and human performance. For example, if a club is too light, (swing weight too low) it won’t have a good feel and the player will generally be inconsistent returning the club’s face squarely to the ball at impact. Therefore, the opposite will be true if a club is too heavy, (swing weight is too high) it will feel unwieldy and the player will probably have a jerky swing and become fatigued easily.

The total weight of the club affects the golfer’s balance and tempo. The relationship between shaft, head, and grip weight is an important parameter and relates to the club’s swing weight. Players will tend to misinterpret total weight during a swing, confusing a lack of squareness of hit or lack of balance with the club being too heavy and say "I need a lighter shaft". When the ball is struck squarely, with a proper weight golf club and a balanced swing, you seldom hear about heavy clubs.

13 hours ago, Bigbobtheman said:

Also, try to hit inside and outside

The ball is not concerned with swing style. It responds to being struck without any prejudice toward the striker. It doesn’t ask what particular swing method is being used, nor does it care about one’s handicap, club affiliation, sex, or age. The ball follows the laws of physics, whether the player uses an open or square stance, has a fast or slow backswing, an overlapping or ten-fingered grip, a firm or cupped wrist, inside out outside in, over the top you name it. A swing emphasizes leverage as an applied force as the primary source of power.

as Yoda said there is no try... Matt Wolfe is a great example of this and way outside  to inside yet he hits draws or fades on command.

13 hours ago, Bigbobtheman said:

Also a game improvement club, may not be.  for instance I was fitted into a small players cavity.  Never considered, but the smaller sole made it easier for me to hit through turf, so don't rule out!

This is a very true statement... your fitter caught something most miss. It is one of the first things I look at and its probably the most talked about concern on the PGA tour... 

 

13 hours ago, Bigbobtheman said:

The shaft should be chosen for flights of the ball

The shaft flight ex. High Mid low etc are marketing terms. In all reality it changes very little... Pick the head that gives you the flight and use the shaft to fine tune it.

That's about it for me! @dlow206 @Chip Strokes @ncwoz

[Manimal26]

@bens197 see my response above and why 7g can make a world of difference 

[chisag]

... Manimal, I can't speak for anyone else but one of the most misunderstood concepts in golf is what works best for any given individual can be radically different although STILL within the parameters of the original concept. Like " Ideally we should all consider the lightest shaft we can control very well" which is a sound concept. Of course the "lightest" shaft may be 130gm iron shaft or a 75/85 gm wood shaft for a strong, hard hitting player. I have always said something similar "everyone should play the most forgiving iron they can effectively play" and for some like Tiger/Rory/Dustin effectively means a MB and for some less skilled ball strikers it effectively means a full set of hybrid irons. 

... Of course the flip side is when someone says you should play the lightest shaft or the most forgiving irons without taking into consideration every player is different and "lightest" can mean anything from 130gms to 65gms and everything in-between in an iron shaft. Personally I went from 130 gm shafts to 95gms. 85gms proved to be too light for my swing so 95gms is the lightest I can effectively play and it gives me the best combination of distance and control. 

[Manimal26]

@chisag the point I am trying to make is there is no right or wrong... Shoot for 20+ years the only iron shaft choice was a DG s300

[chisag]

4 hours ago, Manimal26 said:

@chisag the point I am trying to make is there is no right or wrong... Shoot for 20+ years the only iron shaft choice was a DG s300

 

... Yup, and I agree there is no right or wrong and certainly no one size fits all. But there is always a starting point that works for the majority of players, then from there you can find out if you are outside the "norm" and what will work best for you. 

[Manimal26]

19 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... Yup, and I agree there is no right or wrong and c certainly no one size fits all. But there is always a starting point that works for the majority of players, then from there you can find out if you are outside the "norm" and what will work best for you. 

sidebar graphite is the way of the future in all clubs see you have picked up on that already

[bens197]

1 hour ago, Manimal26 said:

@bens197 see my response above and why 7g can make a world of difference 

Ok. I was referring more to how different the shafts play despite the proximity to weight within the same line. The most common feedback among Modus3 users is the 105 didn’t feel and or perform as nice as the 120, not the weight.

[Manimal26]

2 hours ago, bens197 said:

Ok. I was referring more to how different the shafts play despite the proximity to weight within the same line. The most common feedback among Modus3 users is the 105 didn’t feel and or perform as nice as the 120, not the weight.

Ahh... well the modus 120 when it was a prototype was called the DP for dual profile... it was designed for people who both early released and late released... the 120 also has an incredibly soft butt section for an iron which for some translates to better feel

[chisag]

3 hours ago, bens197 said:

Ok. I was referring more to how different the shafts play despite the proximity to weight within the same line. The most common feedback among Modus3 users is the 105 didn’t feel and or perform as nice as the 120, not the weight.

 

... Amen. I play 95gm graphite in my irons and have played graphite for a good 15 years now, but I really disliked the 105's in my P790's and really liked the 120's in my Z Forged. You would think the 105's would be a better fit since I play 95's but the 120's feel and perform much better for me. 

[RollingGreens]

7 hours ago, bens197 said:

Ok. I was referring more to how different the shafts play despite the proximity to weight within the same line. The most common feedback among Modus3 users is the 105 didn’t feel and or perform as nice as the 120, not the weight.

I would say that the modus 120 allows me at least to have a better feel for releasing the club head, in comparison to the dynamic golf S300 which felt like swinging a sledgehammer

[bens197]

25 minutes ago, RollingGreens said:

I would say that the modus 120 allows me at least to have a better feel for releasing the club head, in comparison to the dynamic golf S300 which felt like swinging a sledgehammer

And that’s why this was such a “wow” moment for many of us. If it weren't for MGS, I would still be fighting DGS300’s without having any idea of what options are in the market. For any of us who played in the 80’s into the 2000’s, it was true temper or true temper. 
 

I completely agree with you and for the first time in a very long time, I feel so GD confident with my irons now that I have the Modus 120. 

[RollingGreens]

7 minutes ago, bens197 said:

And that’s why this was such a “wow” moment for many of us. If it weren't for MGS, I would still be fighting DGS300’s without having any idea of what options are in the market. For any of us who played in the 80’s into the 2000’s, it was true temper or true temper. 
 

I completely agree with you and for the first time in a very long time, I feel so GD confident with my irons now that I have the Modus 120. 

Originally having tried over the summer in a set of rogue pros the S300s I contemplated not even playing stiff shafts. I though I might need to soft step or play a firm or regular shaft. Couldn’t believe the difference in shaft characteristics you could feel. Major difference with the modus 120. Definitely a friendlier shaft and I would say more forgiving with its balance

[bens197]

42 minutes ago, RollingGreens said:

Originally having tried over the summer in a set of rogue pros the S300s I contemplated not even playing stiff shafts. I though I might need to soft step or play a firm or regular shaft. Couldn’t believe the difference in shaft characteristics you could feel. Major difference with the modus 120. Definitely a friendlier shaft and I would say more forgiving with its balance

Much more forgiving but also a lot more responsive in the hands.  The softer butt end really does it for me.

Keep us posted on what you do.  I would be curious to see how profound the differences are between regular and stiff for your trial.  I could have gone X but went Stiff as #1, I am getting older but #2, the dispersion was the same.

[RollingGreens]

11 hours ago, bens197 said:

Much more forgiving but also a lot more responsive in the hands.  The softer butt end really does it for me.

Keep us posted on what you do.  I would be curious to see how profound the differences are between regular and stiff for your trial.  I could have gone X but went Stiff as #1, I am getting older but #2, the dispersion was the same.

Will do. My swing speed is 88-90mph. I ended up going with the stiff flex. Looking forward to significant improvements 

[Scottyrocket53]

An update and a comment. As there has been a few posts about the Modus 105 vs 120 here was my experience. The 120 felt like the worst shaft I have ever hit. It felt terrible in my hands and very boardy. Manimal had explained why it felt that way to me in another post. I then went with the 105 S and much, much better for feel.

Played in Florida last weekend with my new JPX 919 F, Modus 105 S shafts. The 5-6 irons were a beast. Great flight and distance. The 5 iron has basically thrown my 25 degree hybrid out of the bag, they go the same distance but the 5 is more controlled on misses. I struggled with the mid irons, 7-9 and not sure why. Probably swing related but I think I am used to a more blade type of look and feel but I will argue against myself in the next sentence. The PW and Gap were right on and I could change distances and flights with these clubs. 

I think the 105's are going to work out with this iron head. I came from T-100 so a little chunky but I expected that. What really amazed me was how I wasn't penalized a ton for a thin miss like I was with the T-100 but I'm sure that's expected. Just for a reference 6I SS for me is about 72 mph. I also release early which I hate but it's there!

 

[bens197]

1 hour ago, Scottyrocket53 said:

An update and a comment. As there has been a few posts about the Modus 105 vs 120 here was my experience. The 120 felt like the worst shaft I have ever hit. It felt terrible in my hands and very boardy. Manimal had explained why it felt that way to me in another post. I then went with the 105 S and much, much better for feel.

Played in Florida last weekend with my new JPX 919 F, Modus 105 S shafts. The 5-6 irons were a beast. Great flight and distance. The 5 iron has basically thrown my 25 degree hybrid out of the bag, they go the same distance but the 5 is more controlled on misses. I struggled with the mid irons, 7-9 and not sure why. Probably swing related but I think I am used to a more blade type of look and feel but I will argue against myself in the next sentence. The PW and Gap were right on and I could change distances and flights with these clubs. 

I think the 105's are going to work out with this iron head. I came from T-100 so a little chunky but I expected that. What really amazed me was how I wasn't penalized a ton for a thin miss like I was with the T-100 but I'm sure that's expected. Just for a reference 6I SS for me is about 72 mph. I also release early which I hate but it's there!

 

Glad to see they work for you!

[Murray06]

Have any you guys who play modus shafts in their irons tried the regio formula shafts? I see on their website that the 3/4 variants have different target players dependent on which modus version you use

[RollingGreens]

On 2/9/2021 at 6:53 AM, Murray06 said:

Have any you guys who play modus shafts in their irons tried the regio formula shafts? I see on their website that the 3/4 variants have different target players dependent on which modus version you use

I haven’t. I want to say their is another sub where this was discussed. It follows too close of a “one size fits all” models for me, I like to go with what works in my irons, wedges, and woods. Not what should work based upon another product I use

[RobotDoctor]

On 2/22/2020 at 5:02 PM, bens197 said:

For those of you who currently play the Modus, what were you playing before you switched and what compelled you to make the change?

 

I was a long time TT DG S300 player.  Love the feel and the shot profile.  However, I found that it became harder to load the shaft in my later 40s than it was in my early 30s (I changed from X100s to S300s around the time I hit 30).  The Nippon Modus3 Tour 120 shaft still had a stiff tip which I want in an iron but the mid section was softer so I am able to load this shaft without any additional effort.  While the shot trajectory is a wee bit higher it is still acceptable for me.  I use a choked down lower iron if I need to keep the irons lower.

I still use the Modus 120 stiff shafts today (6 years later) and still love them.  I love the feel, I love the shot trajectory, I love the dispersion of the shots, I simply love this shaft!!!! This has become my go-to shaft and will be until I have to go to regular shafts someday.

[bens197]

16 minutes ago, RobotDoctor said:

 

I was a long time TT DG S300 player.  Love the feel and the shot profile.  However, I found that it became harder to load the shaft in my later 40s than it was in my early 30s (I changed from X100s to S300s around the time I hit 30).  The Nippon Modus3 Tour 120 shaft still had a stiff tip which I want in an iron but the mid section was softer so I am able to load this shaft without any additional effort.  While the shot trajectory is a wee bit higher it is still acceptable for me.  I use a choked down lower iron if I need to keep the irons lower.

I still use the Modus 120 stiff shafts today (6 years later) and still love them.  I love the feel, I love the shot trajectory, I love the dispersion of the shots, I simply love this shaft!!!! This has become my go-to shaft and will be until I have to go to regular shafts someday.

I can say from my short experience that I have had the exact same results. Not just that, the confidence I have in my irons has increased tenfold. 

[RollingGreens]

10 minutes ago, bens197 said:

I can say from my short experience that I have had the exact same results. Not just that, the confidence I have in my irons has increased tenfold. 

totally true. Hitting more greens and feel like I am able to attack the course with confidence 

[Tsecor]

what DG shaft compares to the Modus 120 profile? 

Edited February 25, 2021 by Tsecor

[RickyBobby_PR]

8 minutes ago, Tsecor said:

what DG shaft compares to the Modus 120 profile? 

Maybe the dg105 although the tip in the 105 would be stiffer but those two shafts are mid flight profiles. 

[bens197]

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Maybe the dg105 although the tip in the 105 would be stiffer but those two shafts are mid flight profiles. 

 

1 hour ago, Tsecor said:

what DG shaft compares to the Modus 120 profile? 

I am going to say its incomparable.  Based upon what I've read throughout this forum, WRX as well as my own personal experience of playing over 32 years.  The characteristics of this particular 120 shaft are so unique that I couldn't suggest anything alike.

 Soft feel, higher launch, low spin, lighter weight is almost a unicorn of design.  This one has no Pepsi to its Coke.