Scratch Golf Controversy

[Shambles 4]

Damn that really puts a whole new spin on Chris's blog. When is his New Wedges supposed to hit the market? Are we talking soon? Because if that's happening soon, you would really have to question the whole point of him doing all this independent testing so he can slant sales in his direction. Now I don't know when he plans on this release, as this is the first I heard this one. This just makes Chris look worse in my eyes. If this was his master plan to belittle other OEM's just to make his product look better. WOW! Especially in light of the David Whitlam (Gauge Design USA) story. I'm sure this happens in many industries where one company says things about another, but I just thought Golf would be one business there would be a higher standard of ethics. Maybe it's just wishful thinking on my part!

 

Tim

 

To my mind there won't be any boutique Japanese club makers benefitting from this discussion. Open designs from open molds and migrating grinders does not speak well of any companies who sell such. They come off as component assemblers who branded a common product that's been adjusted a bit for individuality and sell at a high price.

 

 

Shambles

[xxio 107]

It is surprising how many JDM boutique companies have designs that are based on open molds. They just redesign the cavity a bit, or widen the sole, or make the muscle shape a little different. I would think that it changes the design enough. I know that if you made the sole wider on my Fourteen TC550s it would make them play like a totally different iron. (adding-I'm not saying the TC550s are an open model, just using something I play as an example).

 

The Himeji region keeps churning out product. Very good quality product. The boutique JDMs don't have the R&D finances to splurge on a design from the ground up.

 

By the way what Dave said is true. QualityDayDream has a lot of history on a lot boards.

[Dave 24]

Tells you all you need to know about Chris at the end of the day -

Its easy to hide behind a keyboard and sling crap against the wall - a lot more difficult to actually come forward and address pont by point accusations made.

 

rob

 

Let's face it, if you've been around the boards long enough you hear enough about Chris to know to doubt everything he's about.

[intothegrain 2]

All this goes to show a big part of why I don't like to do too much internet business. I prefer face-to-face, as to get a better measure of the man.

 

To your point - I recently visited Scratch Golf's Tour Department in Chattanooga TN and met Patrick Boyd, Scratch Golf's VP of Custom Sales and Director of Tour Department Operations. Basically he is in charge of making Scratch Golf's professional staff, touring pros and custom order customers happy. He took time out of his day to give me a tour of the facility, where they turn out about 8 clubs per day, all hand made. The addition of Don White, a hall of fame clubmaker, adds to their already legendary ability to combine modern design and fitting techniques with classic materials and workmanship to create very high performance golf clubs.

 

The fact that many touring professionals choose Scratch clubs without being paid to play them is one thing, but combine that with the fact that any hack off the street can get the same treatment as a touring pro makes them a winner in my book.

 

After the tour of the workshop, Patrick took me to the local golf course and performed a fitting for wedges with me. I hit wedges with a variety of grinds and materials, and after moving to the chipping green we found a wedge grind and loft options that work for me. Once I found the best grind, i was able to hit every shot around the greens from just about any lie. Needless to say. I can't wait to get my hands on a custom made wedge from Scratch.

 

I am a +2 handicap and play tournament golf in Florida at the state level. The bottom line for me in a wedge is performance and feel. I don't care if these wedges are made of 1018, 1010, 1025 or 8620 for that matter. If I can score with them, they are going in my bag.

 

I've played Cleveland and Titleist Vokey wedges for years. These are all cast BTW. Most people have been taught to desire a forged club, but just because it's forged doesn't make it better. Scratch's milled 8620 wedges are just as good as their 1018 wedges for most people. Only the most accomplished players using softer golf balls will really be able to tell the difference between the two materials in my opinion.

 

In regards to the debate between Scratch, Miura and TSG, I would have to side with the manufacturers in this case. For one I don't see how misleading customers in the internet era could be of any benefit for either company. Chris may have an agenda or motivation to make his case, or perhaps he's simply misinformed. Either way I call it how I see it, and having seen the attention to detail that Scratch puts into making it's wedges first hand, I can tell you that you will never go wrong with any product they have to offer.

[GolfSpy Dave 1,564]

Thanks for the insight into Scratch. 8 clubs a day really says something about the size of their operation.

Excellent addition to this thread and hopefully the wedges perform as well for you as it sounds like they will.

[Addicted2Golf 9]

To your point - I recently visited Scratch Golf's Tour Department in Chattanooga TN and met Patrick Boyd, Scratch Golf's VP of Custom Sales and Director of Tour Department Operations. Basically he is in charge of making Scratch Golf's professional staff, touring pros and custom order customers happy. He took time out of his day to give me a tour of the facility, where they turn out about 8 clubs per day, all hand made. The addition of Don White, a hall of fame clubmaker, adds to their already legendary ability to combine modern design and fitting techniques with classic materials and workmanship to create very high performance golf clubs.

 

The fact that many touring professionals choose Scratch clubs without being paid to play them is one thing, but combine that with the fact that any hack off the street can get the same treatment as a touring pro makes them a winner in my book.

 

After the tour of the workshop, Patrick took me to the local golf course and performed a fitting for wedges with me. I hit wedges with a variety of grinds and materials, and after moving to the chipping green we found a wedge grind and loft options that work for me. Once I found the best grind, i was able to hit every shot around the greens from just about any lie. Needless to say. I can't wait to get my hands on a custom made wedge from Scratch.

 

I am a +2 handicap and play tournament golf in Florida at the state level. The bottom line for me in a wedge is performance and feel. I don't care if these wedges are made of 1018, 1010, 1025 or 8620 for that matter. If I can score with them, they are going in my bag.

 

I've played Cleveland and Titleist Vokey wedges for years. These are all cast BTW. Most people have been taught to desire a forged club, but just because it's forged doesn't make it better. Scratch's milled 8620 wedges are just as good as their 1018 wedges for most people. Only the most accomplished players using softer golf balls will really be able to tell the difference between the two materials in my opinion.

 

In regards to the debate between Scratch, Miura and TSG, I would have to side with the manufacturers in this case. For one I don't see how misleading customers in the internet era could be of any benefit for either company. Chris may have an agenda or motivation to make his case, or perhaps he's simply misinformed. Either way I call it how I see it, and having seen the attention to detail that Scratch puts into making it's wedges first hand, I can tell you that you will never go wrong with any product they have to offer.

 

Nicely done John (as usual). And welcome - good to see you on here.

[jamo 16]

Great post intothegrain, thanks for the look into Scratch. I am one of those people you mentioned who don't really care that my wedges are cast or forged. I have a forged wedge and it isn't worth it because it has worn way to fast.

[NGage 4]

To your point - I recently visited Scratch Golf's Tour Department in Chattanooga TN and met Patrick Boyd, Scratch Golf's VP of Custom Sales and Director of Tour Department Operations. Basically he is in charge of making Scratch Golf's professional staff, touring pros and custom order customers happy. He took time out of his day to give me a tour of the facility, where they turn out about 8 clubs per day, all hand made. The addition of Don White, a hall of fame clubmaker, adds to their already legendary ability to combine modern design and fitting techniques with classic materials and workmanship to create very high performance golf clubs.

 

The fact that many touring professionals choose Scratch clubs without being paid to play them is one thing, but combine that with the fact that any hack off the street can get the same treatment as a touring pro makes them a winner in my book.

 

After the tour of the workshop, Patrick took me to the local golf course and performed a fitting for wedges with me. I hit wedges with a variety of grinds and materials, and after moving to the chipping green we found a wedge grind and loft options that work for me. Once I found the best grind, i was able to hit every shot around the greens from just about any lie. Needless to say. I can't wait to get my hands on a custom made wedge from Scratch.

 

I am a +2 handicap and play tournament golf in Florida at the state level. The bottom line for me in a wedge is performance and feel. I don't care if these wedges are made of 1018, 1010, 1025 or 8620 for that matter. If I can score with them, they are going in my bag.

 

I've played Cleveland and Titleist Vokey wedges for years. These are all cast BTW. Most people have been taught to desire a forged club, but just because it's forged doesn't make it better. Scratch's milled 8620 wedges are just as good as their 1018 wedges for most people. Only the most accomplished players using softer golf balls will really be able to tell the difference between the two materials in my opinion.

 

In regards to the debate between Scratch, Miura and TSG, I would have to side with the manufacturers in this case. For one I don't see how misleading customers in the internet era could be of any benefit for either company. Chris may have an agenda or motivation to make his case, or perhaps he's simply misinformed. Either way I call it how I see it, and having seen the attention to detail that Scratch puts into making it's wedges first hand, I can tell you that you will never go wrong with any product they have to offer.

 

Sounds like a good day.

 

Hmmm...wonder if he's a Vol?

[Addicted2Golf 9]

BTW, I bet if you lined up 10 players who game Vokeys, at least half would swear that their wedges are forged and not cast.

[Matt Saternus 32]

Thanks for the info, intothegrain, and welcome to the board. The thing that really stands out to me is 8 clubs per day. I can't imagine the kind of care that goes into spending 1/8 of a workday on 1 club. Buying a club like that...that's getting your money's worth.

[GolfSpy Dave 1,564]

Thanks for the info, intothegrain, and welcome to the board. The thing that really stands out to me is 8 clubs per day. I can't imagine the kind of care that goes into spending 1/8 of a workday on 1 club. Buying a club like that...that's getting your money's worth.

Don't you feel the same 'in the zone' kind of feeling with the wood?

 

I think that 8 a day that you can be proud of is fantastic. I would leave in good spirits...

[TWshoot67 37]

To your point - I recently visited Scratch Golf's Tour Department in Chattanooga TN and met Patrick Boyd, Scratch Golf's VP of Custom Sales and Director of Tour Department Operations. Basically he is in charge of making Scratch Golf's professional staff, touring pros and custom order customers happy. He took time out of his day to give me a tour of the facility, where they turn out about 8 clubs per day, all hand made. The addition of Don White, a hall of fame clubmaker, adds to their already legendary ability to combine modern design and fitting techniques with classic materials and workmanship to create very high performance golf clubs.

 

The fact that many touring professionals choose Scratch clubs without being paid to play them is one thing, but combine that with the fact that any hack off the street can get the same treatment as a touring pro makes them a winner in my book.

 

After the tour of the workshop, Patrick took me to the local golf course and performed a fitting for wedges with me. I hit wedges with a variety of grinds and materials, and after moving to the chipping green we found a wedge grind and loft options that work for me. Once I found the best grind, i was able to hit every shot around the greens from just about any lie. Needless to say. I can't wait to get my hands on a custom made wedge from Scratch.

 

I am a +2 handicap and play tournament golf in Florida at the state level. The bottom line for me in a wedge is performance and feel. I don't care if these wedges are made of 1018, 1010, 1025 or 8620 for that matter. If I can score with them, they are going in my bag.

 

I've played Cleveland and Titleist Vokey wedges for years. These are all cast BTW. Most people have been taught to desire a forged club, but just because it's forged doesn't make it better. Scratch's milled 8620 wedges are just as good as their 1018 wedges for most people. Only the most accomplished players using softer golf balls will really be able to tell the difference between the two materials in my opinion.

 

In regards to the debate between Scratch, Miura and TSG, I would have to side with the manufacturers in this case. For one I don't see how misleading customers in the internet era could be of any benefit for either company. Chris may have an agenda or motivation to make his case, or perhaps he's simply misinformed. Either way I call it how I see it, and having seen the attention to detail that Scratch puts into making it's wedges first hand, I can tell you that you will never go wrong with any product they have to offer.

 

 

Thanks for the post. It makes me what to go through that same process some day. I personally can tell the difference between a forged iron and a cast and I love the feel of forge. But I will add this, that casting irons has come along way from what it once was 10-20 years ago. Using CAD with engineers who put their designs to work with using sound slots or dampening vibration pads surely makes some casted clubs not feel near as harsh as they once did. But I'll still say I can feel the difference of a cast iron and forged iron. It's just gotten closer.SCIENCE! I use the analogy of golf balls. I can tell the difference between a TOP FLIGHT and ProV 1. Maybe using those two balls is wrong but back in the days of balata or wound balls vs.2 piece you could feel the difference for sure! Now covers have changes the game a bit but it's all about the science part of the game now.Hope I didn't confuse anyone it's getting late and I've been up for two straight days with only 3 hr. nap. Sorry for the rambling.

 

Tim

[GolfSpy Dave 1,564]

Sleep Tim. We will all be here in the morning...

[Addicted2Golf 9]

Thanks for the post. It makes me what to go through that same process some day. I personally can tell the difference between a forged iron and a cast and I love the feel of forge. But I will add this, that casting irons has come along way from what it once was 10-20 years ago. Using CAD with engineers who put their designs to work with using sound slots or dampening vibration pads surely makes some casted clubs not feel near as harsh as they once did. But I'll still say I can feel the difference of a cast iron and forged iron. It's just gotten closer.SCIENCE! I use the analogy of golf balls. I can tell the difference between a TOP FLIGHT and ProV 1. Maybe using those two balls is wrong but back in the days of balata or wound balls vs.2 piece you could feel the difference for sure! Now covers have changes the game a bit but it's all about the science part of the game now.Hope I didn't confuse anyone it's getting late and I've been up for two straight days with only 3 hr. nap. Sorry for the rambling.

 

Tim

 

I think you are surprisingly coherent if you've only had 6 hours sleep in the last 48. Sactown doesn't make that much sense on a full nights sleep..

[Addicted2Golf 9]

Sleep Tim. We will all be here in the morning...

 

I'm here Huckleberry...

[TWshoot67 37]

Sleep Tim. We will all be here in the morning...

 

 

It's about that time I've been trying to deal with two, three other sites and buying and selling clubs but I had to pull the shaft from my New head I just got so I could put a shaft in tonight so I can DEMO this monster tomorrow. Yes 3 hr's is not enough, but when my New driver arrived I got another burst that kept me going for another 12 hrs. Good Night All.......

[Matt Saternus 32]

Don't you feel the same 'in the zone' kind of feeling with the wood?

 

I think that 8 a day that you can be proud of is fantastic. I would leave in good spirits...

 

Once again, Sactown, you've teed up the ball, but I will not swing.

 

There are definitely times when I hit a stride in the shop. The best thing in the world is having a full day to just build, none of the usual business of "Do 1 operation, walk the dog, do another step, pay some bills."

[intothegrain 2]

To your point - I recently visited Scratch Golf's Tour Department in Chattanooga TN and met Patrick Boyd, Scratch Golf's VP of Custom Sales and Director of Tour Department Operations. Basically he is in charge of making Scratch Golf's professional staff, touring pros and custom order customers happy. He took time out of his day to give me a tour of the facility, where they turn out about 8 clubs per day, all hand made. The addition of Don White, a hall of fame clubmaker, adds to their already legendary ability to combine modern design and fitting techniques with classic materials and workmanship to create very high performance golf clubs.

 

The fact that many touring professionals choose Scratch clubs without being paid to play them is one thing, but combine that with the fact that any hack off the street can get the same treatment as a touring pro makes them a winner in my book.

 

After the tour of the workshop, Patrick took me to the local golf course and performed a fitting for wedges with me. I hit wedges with a variety of grinds and materials, and after moving to the chipping green we found a wedge grind and loft options that work for me. Once I found the best grind, i was able to hit every shot around the greens from just about any lie. Needless to say. I can't wait to get my hands on a custom made wedge from Scratch.

 

I am a +2 handicap and play tournament golf in Florida at the state level. The bottom line for me in a wedge is performance and feel. I don't care if these wedges are made of 1018, 1010, 1025 or 8620 for that matter. If I can score with them, they are going in my bag.

 

I've played Cleveland and Titleist Vokey wedges for years. These are all cast BTW. Most people have been taught to desire a forged club, but just because it's forged doesn't make it better. Scratch's milled 8620 wedges are just as good as their 1018 wedges for most people. Only the most accomplished players using softer golf balls will really be able to tell the difference between the two materials in my opinion.

 

In regards to the debate between Scratch, Miura and TSG, I would have to side with the manufacturers in this case. For one I don't see how misleading customers in the internet era could be of any benefit for either company. Chris may have an agenda or motivation to make his case, or perhaps he's simply misinformed. Either way I call it how I see it, and having seen the attention to detail that Scratch puts into making it's wedges first hand, I can tell you that you will never go wrong with any product they have to offer.

 

A few pictures of the Scratch Golf Tour Department are attached to my article BTW: http://www.intothegrain.com/scratch-golf-tour-department-behind-the-scenes/

[jamo 16]

A few pictures of the Scratch Golf Tour Department are attached to my article BTW: http://www.intothegrain.com/scratch-golf-tour-department-behind-the-scenes/

 

Great pics, thanks for the link.

[Matt Saternus 32]

Roughly how long did the wedge fitting take? I'm really interested in getting this done.