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Where did Counterbalanced putters go?


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Back in 2013-2014 when Callaway launched the Tank, and I bought a Cleveland 38” counterbalanced putter, they were everywhere! Most companies had a least one model, and the offerings for new styles came each year. Now, they’re nowhere to be seen! What happened?!

How many of you played one, which one, what length, and if you don’t play it anymore, what do you use now? Why’d you switch away?

 

As I mentioned, I had a Cleveland Almost Belly one, and then had an Odyssey, then I moved away from them. Not sure why....

 

Here’s an article MGS did back in 2013 on these putters:

 

https://mygolfspy.com/counterweighted-putters-the-anchor-ban-answer/

 

 

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I think with the emergence of heavier putter grips and grips like super stroke that come with weight kits, length is no longer really needed to create counterbalance. 

All of my putters are 34" and are counterbalanced to some degree with super stroke grips and a counterbalanced weight (25g in my 355g putter heads and 50g in my 370g head). 

 

 

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Stroke Lab putters are counterbalanced. Mine is 33.5".

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I -think he is referring to the longer above the hands type counterbalanced putters.  They were typically in the 36-38" range and were created as an alternative to belly putters.   

 

But I think the answers are being provided are correct as well as a lack of people willing to purchase.  

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I -think he is referring to the longer above the hands type counterbalanced putters.  They were typically in the 36-38" range and were created as an alternative to belly putters.   
 
But I think the answers are being provided are correct as well as a lack of people willing to purchase.  

Yes. Correct. I play a 37” putter now which isn’t counterbalanced, but I liked having that weight above my hands.


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Fairway: Ping G425 15*, Ping Tour 70X

Hybrid: Ping G425 22*, Ping Tour 80X

Irons:  Ping i230 4-GW, TT DG X100

Wedges: :edel-golf-1: SMS 50D/54V/58D:Nippon:Modus 130 stiff, +1”

Putter:  :edel-golf-1: EAS 1.0

Ball: Titleist 2023 AVX

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I previously had a 31" putter, then I purchased the Ping Sigma G Doon counterbalanced putter a few years ago.  Fitted at Ping HQ.  It's 34" long and most of the grip is above my hands.  I won't be changing putters anytime soon, but it will have to be regripped soon.  The end of the grip is worn from fighting with the other club grips in my bag.

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Nike had an amazing counter balanced system that gave the ability to adjust where the counter balance point was. 

Stroke lab has done a good job with a newer counter balanced system. That all being said I believe there is just a preference to normal length putter rather then the long ones. ?

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Yea the weight above the hands is what gives a true counterbalanced feel. I still game a betti ss#3 cb at 38 inches. One reason i think they have disappeared is its a little harder to have good distance control on longer putts.

That’s my preference as well, having the longer shaft. I’ve never really felt the same sensation when I’ve tried the “standard length” CB options. I’d be curious to buy one again and do a putting challenge to look at lag putting.


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Nike had an amazing counter balanced system that gave the ability to adjust where the counter balance point was. 
Stroke lab has done a good job with a newer counter balanced system. That all being said I believe there is just a preference to normal length putter rather then the long ones. ?

I’m sure that’s the case, putter length. I just don’t have the same feel of CB because there isn’t any weight above the hands like there was on the Cleveland that I first bought years ago.


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Driver: Ping G430 Max 9*, Ping Tour 70X

Fairway: Ping G425 15*, Ping Tour 70X

Hybrid: Ping G425 22*, Ping Tour 80X

Irons:  Ping i230 4-GW, TT DG X100

Wedges: :edel-golf-1: SMS 50D/54V/58D:Nippon:Modus 130 stiff, +1”

Putter:  :edel-golf-1: EAS 1.0

Ball: Titleist 2023 AVX

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Counter balanced "putter" works excellent in theory and on paper.... but for my game, it took away a lot of the "feel", which is a big part of my game on the putting surface.

To a point the counter balanced putter interfere with my visualization , believe it or not.  Maybe it's just me .   Time will tell if the counter will bounce back like many other golf related inventions.  More than 50% of today's "new" stuff held a pattern at one time in the past.  

If you have the engery to dig through the expired golf patterns, you might find something which you could reinvent.   I'd made my billions if I could find a smart way to strengthen the human body and the connection to the eyes.   I guess eye/hand coordination could be trained.

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1 hour ago, release said:

If you have the engery to dig through the expired golf patterns, you might find something which you could reinvent.   I'd made my billions if I could find a smart way to strengthen the human body and the connection to the eyes.   I guess eye/hand coordination could be trained.

Alpha waves and neurofeedback to train the brain to function more effectively.

Interesting article that has some application to golf...

https://gunshowtrader.com/blog/shooting-accurately/

We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.”

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5 hours ago, Apolloshowl said:

Nike had an amazing counter balanced system that gave the ability to adjust where the counter balance point was. 

Stroke lab has done a good job with a newer counter balanced system. That all being said I believe there is just a preference to normal length putter rather then the long ones. ?

I think the name counterbalanced is being used for two different things. Technically “counterbalancing” is a club that has its weight moved more towards each end, and away from the middle. Stroke labs certainly have this. Then there are the type with the longer shafts and weight above the hands. This was designed to stabilize the head much like a belly putter used to. In my opinion, putters like the stroke lab, while Technically are counter balanced, they don't really do that. 

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6 hours ago, Moose4282 said:

I think the name counterbalanced is being used for two different things. Technically “counterbalancing” is a club that has its weight moved more towards each end, and away from the middle. Stroke labs certainly have this. Then there are the type with the longer shafts and weight above the hands. This was designed to stabilize the head much like a belly putter used to. In my opinion, putters like the stroke lab, while Technically are counter balanced, they don't really do that. 

I disagree on your definition:  counterbalance is to neutralize or cancel by exerting an opposite influence.  You counterbalance the grip to reduce the feel of the headweight.  Stroke lab does have a counterbalance,  but the strokelab concept is more about distribution of weight from the shaft to the head and grip ends of the putter.  Counterbalance weights can be placed anywhere above or below the balance point.  Typically it is placed above to help players better handle the heavy putter heads.  

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26 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I disagree on your definition:  counterbalance is to neutralize or cancel by exerting an opposite influence.  You counterbalance the grip to reduce the feel of the headweight.  Stroke lab does have a counterbalance,  but the strokelab concept is more about distribution of weight from the shaft to the head and grip ends of the putter.  Counterbalance weights can be placed anywhere above or below the balance point.  Typically it is placed above to help players better handle the heavy putter heads.  

But weight at or below the hands doesnt really count. Your hands are the axis in which the club swings. If the weight is directly under the hands, There will be a very slight counterbalance effect, but not even close to having significant weight above the hands. 

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18 minutes ago, Moose4282 said:

But weight at or below the hands doesnt really count. Your hands are the axis in which the club swings. If the weight is directly under the hands, There will be a very slight counterbalance effect, but not even close to having significant weight above the hands. 

???   Your hands aren't the axis.  In the putting stroke (or golf swing for that matter) the body doesn't rotate around the hands.    Counterbalancing is simply about moving the balance point of the club.  That can be accomplished by adding weight above or below the balance point. Slight or not, it is still counterbalancing and that depending on your sensitivity to weight even a gram or two could influence the feel. 

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28 minutes ago, Moose4282 said:

But weight at or below the hands doesnt really count. Your hands are the axis in which the club swings. If the weight is directly under the hands, There will be a very slight counterbalance effect, but not even close to having significant weight above the hands. 

I believe the word you were looking for was fulcrum, not axis 

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2 minutes ago, jlukes said:

I believe the word you were looking for was fulcrum, not axis 

Fulcum may not be right either;  will depend on how you swing the putter. 

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13 hours ago, Apolloshowl said:

Nike had an amazing counter balanced system that gave the ability to adjust where the counter balance point was. 

Stroke lab has done a good job with a newer counter balanced system. That all being said I believe there is just a preference to normal length putter rather then the long ones. ?

Nike marketed it as the Counter Flex system. And I agree with your assertion that it's amazing.

This one is a shade under 38" and I am currently trying to get it dialed in as an Armlock gamer (thumbing my nose at the former Nike Oven brain trust).

1899728426_MethodMadness.thumb.jpg.ddc018032370ab1bcb509a23d1a909c2.jpg

My personal take on the counter weighting game: Adding mass to the handle, be it traditional or protracted in length, affects stroke awareness. And innately encourages (in theory) people with certain tendencies, to swing the entire putter on the same arc. Opposed to inadvertently incorporating additional wrist coil and release, relative to their shoulder motion. In other words, a simpler modern stroke to help limit the liability of modern green speeds.

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15 minutes ago, downlowkey said:

Nike marketed it as the Counter Flex system. And I agree with your assertion that it's amazing.

This one is a shade under 38" and I am currently trying to get it dialed in as an Armlock gamer (thumbing my nose at the former Nike Oven brain trust).

1899728426_MethodMadness.thumb.jpg.ddc018032370ab1bcb509a23d1a909c2.jpg

My personal take on the counter weighting game: Adding mass to the handle, be it traditional or protracted in length, affects stroke awareness. And innately encourages (in theory) people with certain tendencies, to swing the entire putter on the same arc. Opposed to inadvertently incorporating additional wrist coil and release, relative to their shoulder motion. In other words, a simpler modern stroke to help limit the liability of modern green speeds.

Counter flex was a pretty cool solution by Nike.  But I just can’t get comfortable with the length of the putter.  

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2 hours ago, cnosil said:

???   Your hands aren't the axis.  In the putting stroke (or golf swing for that matter) the body doesn't rotate around the hands.    Counterbalancing is simply about moving the balance point of the club.  That can be accomplished by adding weight above or below the balance point. Slight or not, it is still counterbalancing and that depending on your sensitivity to weight even a gram or two could influence the feel. 

I used the wrong term, its fulcrum not axis. Imagine a seesaw. The middle triangle where in connects  is the fulcrum. Thats where your hands connect to the club. If there is no shaft on the other side of the fulcrum, it dont matter how the weight is distributed, its all on one side of the fulcrum. Now if its swinging, more weight away from the fulcrum would “feel heavier”. So by moving weight to the handle, right on top of the fulcrum or near, you lighten its swingweight, it will “feel” lighter to swing. Now if we put weight on the oppisite side, the effect is MUCH greater, you now have a force counter acting the force in the other side of the fulcrum. All in all its supposed to “quiet” any wrist action one may have. I know people say “ my wrists are locked”... well they think they are, but they arent 😉

 

9800440D-7BB2-4725-B2CB-91533A35AEAF.png

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3 hours ago, JohnSmalls said:

Counter flex was a pretty cool solution by Nike.  But I just can’t get comfortable with the length of the putter.  

Using it as it was originally intended, I didn’t care for the feel either. But I’ve been slowly adding loft (~5 degrees) to setup as an Armlock and it’s giving me a pretty pristine path and feels great now.

I’m actually actively hunting Counter Flex putters. Specifically, to harvest their adjustable hardware and pair with some other heads (Bettinardi QB6, BG Amazing Grace NYC). Finding those Nike Method CF wands, in the minty condition that @GolfSpy MPR passed this one down to me, is truly rare. From a perspective of overall tech packages, it’s one of the most intriguing putters I’ve ever owned and he gave me an unbelievable deal on it.

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10 hours ago, Moose4282 said:

I used the wrong term, its fulcrum not axis. Imagine a seesaw. The middle triangle where in connects  is the fulcrum. Thats where your hands connect to the club. If there is no shaft on the other side of the fulcrum, it dont matter how the weight is distributed, its all on one side of the fulcrum. Now if its swinging, more weight away from the fulcrum would “feel heavier”. So by moving weight to the handle, right on top of the fulcrum or near, you lighten its swingweight, it will “feel” lighter to swing. Now if we put weight on the oppisite side, the effect is MUCH greater, you now have a force counter acting the force in the other side of the fulcrum. All in all its supposed to “quiet” any wrist action one may have. I know people say “ my wrists are locked”... well they think they are, but they arent 😉

 

9800440D-7BB2-4725-B2CB-91533A35AEAF.png

I understand what you are saying and what you are saying is correct.  The point of my original post was that counterbalance does not have to be above the hands with a longer shaft.   extending the shaft adds weight on the other side of the fulcrum.  This means I can put a lighter weight in the end vs a heavier weight in a shorter shaft.    You are now getting into swingweight which is influenced by the weight above and below the balance point of the putter.  As for the "feel",  some people prefer to feel the weight in the head of the putter because they try to swing the head of the putter.  Others, like you describe, want to feel their hands move the putter so putting more weight near their hands provides that feel.   Also, swingweight is a static measurement that can be influenced in a lot of ways;  what it doesn't take into account is total weight,   both of those influence the feel and how the player responds with the club in their hands.   There is a lot more to weighting putters and golf clubs; for example  I can give you a putter swingweighted at E2 that weights 2 pounds and one at D2 that weights 100 pounds,  the lower swingweight putter won't feel lighter to swing.

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7 hours ago, cnosil said:

I understand what you are saying and what you are saying is correct.  The point of my original post was that counterbalance does not have to be above the hands with a longer shaft.   extending the shaft adds weight on the other side of the fulcrum.  This means I can put a lighter weight in the end vs a heavier weight in a shorter shaft.    You are now getting into swingweight which is influenced by the weight above and below the balance point of the putter.  As for the "feel",  some people prefer to feel the weight in the head of the putter because they try to swing the head of the putter.  Others, like you describe, want to feel their hands move the putter so putting more weight near their hands provides that feel.   Also, swingweight is a static measurement that can be influenced in a lot of ways;  what it doesn't take into account is total weight,   both of those influence the feel and how the player responds with the club in their hands.   There is a lot more to weighting putters and golf clubs; for example  I can give you a putter swingweighted at E2 that weights 2 pounds and one at D2 that weights 100 pounds,  the lower swingweight putter won't feel lighter to swing.

No i agree, just wish there was a better term to seperate the two, yes technically they are both counterbalanced, but they are different concepts.

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I made my own by fitting a long grip on my old Callaway Warbird Putter extending the putter length by 3". The grip has a screw in plug at the top that has and internal thread. I drilled a hole in a piece of round bar and using a Stainless steel bolt screwed it in to the internal thread then screwed it the plug back in to the top. Then I tried it and slowly removed weight until I found the perfect balance. I only use this putter when the greens are wet or in winter if the greens are left long.

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On 4/30/2020 at 6:31 PM, PMookie said:

 

Back in 2013-2014 when Callaway launched the Tank, and I bought a Cleveland 38” counterbalanced putter, they were everywhere! Most companies had a least one model, and the offerings for new styles came each year. Now, they’re nowhere to be seen! What happened?!

How many of you played one, which one, what length, and if you don’t play it anymore, what do you use now? Why’d you switch away?

 

As I mentioned, I had a Cleveland Almost Belly one, and then had an Odyssey, then I moved away from them. Not sure why....

 

Here’s an article MGS did back in 2013 on these putters:

 

https://mygolfspy.com/counterweighted-putters-the-anchor-ban-answer/

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

The Evnroll gravity grip accomplishes this same technology right?

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The Evnroll gravity grip accomplishes this same technology right?

The Evnroll gravity grip accomplishes this same technology right?

Any counterbalance accomplishes the goal. The question is why did companies move away from the counter balance above the hands using an extended shaft; most were 3” extensions.

The Evnroll gravity grip does provide counterbalance but instead of putting the weight in the shaft, the weight is below the shaft

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   :taylormade-small:TM-180

Testing:   SPGC_logo.jpg

Backups:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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1 hour ago, cnosil said:

 


Any counterbalance accomplishes the goal. The question is why did companies move away from the counter balance above the hands using an extended shaft; most were 3” extensions.

The Evnroll gravity grip does provide counterbalance but instead of putting the weight in the shaft, the weight is below the shaft

 

I see the guys doing the arm lock are using 38" shafts. Kuchar, DeChambeau

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I see the guys doing the arm lock are using 38" shafts. Kuchar, DeChambeau

A bit of a different approach. Fitting a armlock isn’t about really counterbalancing but finding the right “anchor point” to ensure it fits properly.

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   :taylormade-small:TM-180

Testing:   SPGC_logo.jpg

Backups:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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