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I'm looking seriously at purchasing new irons and wedges from either Ben Hogan or Sub 70. With that in mind, I was also contemplating shaft and lie-angle options. Maybe getting fitted for a "softer" shaft with a lower kick point in my mid to long irons? Possibly tweeking the lie angles flatter in my short irons & wedges to prevent a left miss? Has anyone else made these type of adjustments?

I plan to drop $49.95 @ PGA Tour Superstore for the "Tour Van Experience" and iron fitting. FWIW I'm middle-aged, 6' 3" approx 250 lbs. Driver swing-speed was between 100-105 mph. A good swing produces a nice medium-high draw. Bad swings can result in pull-hooks or blocks. I haven't been fitted for anything since 2007 and that was only with an old school lie board. 

Any advice or feedback from more knowledgeable golfers will be appreciated.

Edited by J.B. TexasEx
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My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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Check this article out: http://blog.globalgolf.com/2017/12/how-to-read-your-divots/

Your divot will tell you about your swing path, lie angle, and how your club interacts with the ground.

My clubs droop at impact due to shaft flex so I address the ball with the outer half of the club slightly risen and the heel to middle grounded. My clubs are 2* up. But my sand and lob are standard lie but about 3/8" over length. I have a long torso and average arms giving me 37" wrist to floor at only 5'10.5" tall. 

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My recommendation is to take advantage of both of those companies demo programs. Get them both at the same time and put them head to head. They both charge you $20 to demo 2 clubs. It would be $40 well spent.

As for tweaking the angles I had the opposite miss than you, and would miss right. I was able to bring it back to center (most of the time) by raising my lie angle to 4 degrees upright. TXG had a great video recently on the impact of adjusting lie angles and how it changes other things like swing weight. i.e. flattening the lie increases swing weight and also effectively lengthens the club. So by going more upright it was good that I also had an extra 1/2" on my irons. I've linked the video if you are interested.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6a1Sr6gb98

 

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WITB:
:ping-small:  G Driver: (10.5 / s-flex)
:bridgestone-small: J38, 3W (15 / s-flex)
:titelist-small:  980F, 5W (19) s-flex
pxg-small.jpg 0311, 4-PW, (+1/2" / +2 up) ProjX LZ 6.0
pxg-small.jpg 0311 wedges, 52, 56, 60 degree
TommyArmour.jpg.d3c9da7d74a401e95b625f92af834200.jpg Impact No.3, Putter 35"

Dexterity: Right-handed

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11 hours ago, Tap In said:

My recommendation is to take advantage of both of those companies demo programs. Get them both at the same time and put them head to head. They both charge you $20 to demo 2 clubs. It would be $40 well spent.

As for tweaking the angles I had the opposite miss than you, and would miss right. I was able to bring it back to center (most of the time) by raising my lie angle to 4 degrees upright. TXG had a great video recently on the impact of adjusting lie angles and how it changes other things like swing weight. i.e. flattening the lie increases swing weight and also effectively lengthens the club. So by going more upright it was good that I also had an extra 1/2" on my irons. I've linked the video if you are interested.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6a1Sr6gb98

 

Thanks!

I'll look to see if TXG has any recommendations about shaft flexes, too. Bottom line is I need to get fitted for shafts and I'll have no problem going to an R flex in my longer clubs (or the full bag, if necessary). Higher launch is desirable with mid to long irons and fairways. I'm even considering a 7-wood.

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My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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11 hours ago, J.B. TexasEx said:

I'm even considering a 7-wood.

I have entered into that same debate recently. I currently have a big gap problem due to not hitting my 4i well.
carry distances:
19 degree 5w - 230
22 degree 4i - 200
25 degree 5i - 197

So I can either get a wood, hybrid or utility iron to fill the gap, or just spend the time figuring out the 4i issue. Part of me wants a 7-8 wood just to see how it goes since I hit the 5w so well. It is my go-to club from most tee boxes when I must hit the fairway. (Note: I know that some people will comment that a 9w is the equivalent of a 4i but the number is irrelevant as long as it fits the gap.)

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WITB:
:ping-small:  G Driver: (10.5 / s-flex)
:bridgestone-small: J38, 3W (15 / s-flex)
:titelist-small:  980F, 5W (19) s-flex
pxg-small.jpg 0311, 4-PW, (+1/2" / +2 up) ProjX LZ 6.0
pxg-small.jpg 0311 wedges, 52, 56, 60 degree
TommyArmour.jpg.d3c9da7d74a401e95b625f92af834200.jpg Impact No.3, Putter 35"

Dexterity: Right-handed

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12 hours ago, Tap In said:

I have entered into that same debate recently. I currently have a big gap problem due to not hitting my 4i well.
carry distances:
19 degree 5w - 230
22 degree 4i - 200
25 degree 5i - 197

So I can either get a wood, hybrid or utility iron to fill the gap, or just spend the time figuring out the 4i issue. Part of me wants a 7-8 wood just to see how it goes since I hit the 5w so well. It is my go-to club from most tee boxes when I must hit the fairway. (Note: I know that some people will comment that a 9w is the equivalent of a 4i but the number is irrelevant as long as it fits the gap.)

Our distances are comparable.

I rarely hit my 4i off the fairway due to inconsistent ball-striking and can't stand hybrids because I hook them. A 7w may be more versatile, especially out of the rough. Hell, look at the specs on some OEMs' clubs these days. Only a 2-degree gap between the 4i and 5i? Why carry both?


My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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I think you are on the right track. Getting the fitting is the way to go.  Can’t go wrong with either club.

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Driver Mavrik Subzero set to 9.5. 
Rougue 4 wood 16.5

Titleist 818 hybrid 21

Callaway Apex pro black dot 4 through P

Callaway Jaws 50/10,, MD 4 56/10, and Titlest SM 6 60/12

SC Futura 5.5

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On 5/26/2020 at 2:10 PM, TimoTe said:

Check this article out: http://blog.globalgolf.com/2017/12/how-to-read-your-divots/

Your divot will tell you about your swing path, lie angle, and how your club interacts with the ground.

My clubs droop at impact due to shaft flex so I address the ball with the outer half of the club slightly risen and the heel to middle grounded. My clubs are 2* up. But my sand and lob are standard lie but about 3/8" over length. I have a long torso and average arms giving me 37" wrist to floor at only 5'10.5" tall. 

Smart post here. Is there any thought about reading your divot and changing your swing instead of changing the club? 

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Brandon Johnson, MBA
Capt (Sep.) US Air Force 

Ohio State Executive Director
 
😄218-310-5755
 
 
 
uc?export=download&id=0BxStKdyHnin3bU8xRGFvOGpFSms&revid=0BxStKdyHnin3L2ROUEN2Y2hZcWNuWEsrMllDMXpDL1F6ZmNNPQ
 
 

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20 minutes ago, Bohnson said:

Smart post here. Is there any thought about reading your divot and changing your swing instead of changing the club? 

Sure, but I've hit bad shots and couldn't ascertain much of anything from the divots. But, you're a +1 and I'm a 14 so it's relative. Swing changes are easier for some people. But, if I can mask a swing flaw with a minor club tweak why not do it? 

The fact that there's no OEM standard for shaft flexes and/or torques only adds to the confusion and challenge of getting fit properly. If it were easy to "change your swing" why aren't there one-size-fits-all club specs? Think about it.

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My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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54 minutes ago, Bohnson said:

Smart post here. Is there any thought about reading your divot and changing your swing instead of changing the club? 

I would say path can be fixed by a swing change. 

Lie can sometimes be fixed by addressing the ball either more upright or more flat, but can be limited to the physical characteristics of the club and player. 

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I flattened the lie angles on all my irons to remove a left miss. Every once in awhile I’d have a sweeping draw that I wasn’t planning on despite feeling like I put a good swing on the ball. It helped a lot. I prefer to fade the ball so it lands softer (I’m not worried about distance). 

I also spent a lot of time working on my swing path. Learning to read divots is good advice. I also read the flight of the ball. Starts left = swing path. Turns left = closed clubface. 

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P790s/M5 Driver/F9 3wood/F9 hybrid/MG2 wedges/Ardmore putter

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39 minutes ago, jddaigneault said:

I flattened the lie angles on all my irons to remove a left miss. Every once in awhile I’d have a sweeping draw that I wasn’t planning on despite feeling like I put a good swing on the ball. It helped a lot. I prefer to fade the ball so it lands softer (I’m not worried about distance). 

I also spent a lot of time working on my swing path. Learning to read divots is good advice. I also read the flight of the ball. Starts left = swing path. Turns left = closed clubface. 

How much did you flatten your lie angles? Just curious

I'm thinking maybe 2 degrees?


My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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29 minutes ago, J.B. TexasEx said:

How much did you flatten your lie angles? Just curious

I'm thinking maybe 2 degrees?

2 degrees. 

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P790s/M5 Driver/F9 3wood/F9 hybrid/MG2 wedges/Ardmore putter

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1 hour ago, TimoTe said:

I would say path can be fixed by a swing change. 

Lie can sometimes be fixed by addressing the ball either more upright or more flat, but can be limited to the physical characteristics of the club and player. 

I have the "physical characteristics" of a slightly overweight 51 year old. 😉 

I'm not averse to making a swing change, but my irons are over 20 years old. I just thought it'd be fun to fine tune the specs if/when I purchase a new set of clubs. Maximize what I've got to work with, so to speak.

 

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My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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7 hours ago, J.B. TexasEx said:

I have the "physical characteristics" of a slightly overweight 51 year old. 😉 

I'm not averse to making a swing change, but my irons are over 20 years old. I just thought it'd be fun to fine tune the specs if/when I purchase a new set of clubs. Maximize what I've got to work with, so to speak.

 

I play with some guys in their 60s-80s, so I play them using only 4 clubs where some are older than they are (I'm 43). 2 are hickory shafted clubs - a putter and a mashie niblick (says 7 on it but plays like a 9i). Then a Ping Eye2 Driver with a steel shaft. And an 80s Doug Sanders Radar Chipper. 

It makes the field much more competitive, but I still beat them by a stoke or two. 

I bring it up to say that the clubs don't matter if you can't put a proper swing on it. 

I'm all for buying the best gear you can afford. Having good gear makes the game more enjoyable. Having more fun makes you want to play more. 

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Swing looks pretty good. You make it work. The older people get, the more I tell them to stick with what they got. Looks like your takeaway could be cleaned up. A little handsy. Pull the club inside. You do a good job of correcting with your hands at impact since you are under the plane.

I’d say work that takeaway (hand path) and it should help! If you start good, you’ll have a better chance of ending good!


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

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Brandon Johnson, MBA
Capt (Sep.) US Air Force 

Ohio State Executive Director
 
😄218-310-5755
 
 
 
uc?export=download&id=0BxStKdyHnin3bU8xRGFvOGpFSms&revid=0BxStKdyHnin3L2ROUEN2Y2hZcWNuWEsrMllDMXpDL1F6ZmNNPQ
 
 

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3 hours ago, Bohnson said:

Swing looks pretty good. You make it work. The older people get, the more I tell them to stick with what they got. Looks like your takeaway could be cleaned up. A little handsy. Pull the club inside. You do a good job of correcting with your hands at impact since you are under the plane.

I’d say work that takeaway (hand path) and it should help! If you start good, you’ll have a better chance of ending good!


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Yeah, I've fought the inside takeaway my whole life.

Thanks for the tip.


My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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UPDATE: PGA Superstore will bend 8 forged irons for only $30, so I'm gonna try 2-degrees flat in my E thru 4-iron.

Hopefully, this will help eliminate my left miss ala Hogan. Not that I'm expecting it to result in a tour-quality power fade.


My :1590477705_SunMountain: C-130 cart bag currently includes;

Driver: :srixon-small: z565 10.5*, Miyazaki Kaula Mizu 6 S-Flex
Fairways:  :callaway-small: X-Hot 15* & 18*, Project X PXv R-Flex
Irons: :benhogan-small:Apex Plus, 4-PW, Apex S4-Flex
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CG10; 50*, 54*, 58*, Dynamic Gold W-flex 

Putter: Ray Cook Blue Goose or Tour Edge HP #10 Red
Grips: Golf Pride MCC-Plus 4 & Lamkin UTx
Ball: Kirkland Signature 3-Piece 

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1 hour ago, J.B. TexasEx said:

UPDATE: PGA Superstore will bend 8 forged irons for only $30, so I'm gonna try 2-degrees flat in my E thru 4-iron.

Hopefully, this will help eliminate my left miss ala Hogan. Not that I'm expecting it to result in a tour-quality power fade.

IF you can ask them to measure your club specs (loft/lie) for each after they perform the bend. Also, the method I follow for checking my lie angles is below:

"The ink line on the back of the ball technique for dynamic lie fitting is simple and logical. A heavy ink line is drawn on the ball with a Sharpie pen. The ball is placed on the ground with the line vertical and facing the clubhead. After impact, a faint image of the ink line is transferred to the clubface. If the line is perfectly vertical on the clubface, the lie of the club is correct for the golfer. If the ink line tilts in an angle up toward the toe side of the face, the lie of the club that was hit is too upright so the correct lie has to be flatter than the lie of the club being hit. Vice versa — if the ink line angles up toward the heel side of the face, the correct lie has to be more upright than the lie of the test club." SOURCE: (TOM WISHON / http://www.golfwrx.com/277293/the-best-way-to-fit-lie-angle/ )

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