I tried. I really tried...

[dru_]

.. to like the Arccos Golf system. It is such a great idea in theory.  It sounds amazing, but it just isn't quite there yet, and that is coming from a tech-nerd that is perfectly willing to deal with some of the things....

[AGutierrez7]

I've always wondered about the Arccos system, thought about making the purchase. What about it turns you off from it tech-wise? 

[cnosil]

7 hours ago, dru_ said:

.. to like the Arccos Golf system. It is such a great idea in theory.  It sounds amazing, but it just isn't quite there yet, and that is coming from a tech-nerd that is perfectly willing to deal with some of the things....

More detail on your experience would really be helpful.   You could find out how others dealt with those issues and would be informative for those who don't have the sensors. 

[StrawberryShortCake]

9 hours ago, dru_ said:

.. to like the Arccos Golf system. It is such a great idea in theory.  It sounds amazing, but it just isn't quite there yet, and that is coming from a tech-nerd that is perfectly willing to deal with some of the things....

Why? what were the tings that bothered you about the system? What were the pros and cons?

[LeftyHawk]

I gotta say I've tried the Arccos system, and GPS systems. Always returned to my trusty rangefinder. For me the tech stuff gave me way too much information. All I really need is the yardage, the other variables like elevation, wind, temp and such I can determine for myself. Plus the tech stuff was slowing me down on the course trying to digest what information it was giving me, provided it could connect with the satellite.  And the tech stuff for me couldn't account for lie.

So I went back to me range finder and been happy since.

Chris  

[2puttbogey]

2 hours ago, StrawberryShortCake said:

Why? what were the tings that bothered you about the system? What were the pros and cons?

I can't give his experience, but mine was too much babysitting the system. What I mean is putting is a mess ( but they are honest about how to handle it), like a tap in. If you hit one OB an the take a drop good luck figuring that out. The last thing that made me sell it was I play the same course and wanted to see where shots went on each hole.  Not sure if the information is unavailable or hard to find, but that was enough to make me feel it wasn't worth it.

[cnosil]

I gotta say I've tried the Arccos system, and GPS systems. Always returned to my trusty rangefinder. For me the tech stuff gave me way too much information. All I really need is the yardage, the other variables like elevation, wind, temp and such I can determine for myself. Plus the tech stuff was slowing me down on the course trying to digest what information it was giving me, provided it could connect with the satellite.  And the tech stuff for me couldn't account for lie.
So I went back to me range finder and been happy since.
Chris  

While arccos has GPS capacc BBC Uluru, I think most people are interested in the analytics. What was you experience with the stat tracking?

[Nolan220]

12 hours ago, LeftyHawk said:

I gotta say I've tried the Arccos system, and GPS systems. Always returned to my trusty rangefinder. For me the tech stuff gave me way too much information. All I really need is the yardage, the other variables like elevation, wind, temp and such I can determine for myself. Plus the tech stuff was slowing me down on the course trying to digest what information it was giving me, provided it could connect with the satellite.  And the tech stuff for me couldn't account for lie.

So I went back to me range finder and been happy since.

Chris  

I am in the same boat I really liked Arccos idea but sometimes it more of a hassle .. I can grab the range finder and know the yardage and grab the club and swing ( or slice into the woods ) 

[Middler]

I’ve been using AutoShot with my Garmin Approach S20, it does shot tracking including club distances as well, though I gather Arccos is more sophisticated? It’s novel, but it wasn’t that accurate, and it took some editing to correct about 10% of shots after a round. And I’d never try to use the stats while playing. At any rate, after some 20 rounds with it, I’m going to disable it on my S20 - an interesting novelty, but not that useful ongoing. YMMV

[heavygolffeels]

I abandoned it after 1 round as well. Too much work for me. 

[Grit Golf]

I start the round and leave my phone in my pocket. At the end of the round when I’m home I’ll make a few edits or add anything missed, it adds no extra work for me and the stats are awesome.

It made me realize that my short game is my roadblock when I thought it was tee and approach. It also over time has shown actual distances for certain clubs on the course that has made me smarter about what to rotate in and out.

I occasionally will pop the app open on the course to get distance to a hazard, or a “plays like” number, but it never feels like “too much”. My day job is a web developer/database admin, so your mileage may vary.


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

[KTM]

14 hours ago, Grit Golf said:

I start the round and leave my phone in my pocket. At the end of the round when I’m home I’ll make a few edits or add anything missed, it adds no extra work for me and the stats are awesome.

It made me realize that my short game is my roadblock when I thought it was tee and approach. It also over time has shown actual distances for certain clubs on the course that has made me smarter about what to rotate in and out.

I occasionally will pop the app open on the course to get distance to a hazard, or a “plays like” number, but it never feels like “too much”. My day job is a web developer/database admin, so your mileage may vary.


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

This mirrors my experience with it. I use an Apple Watch and it’s nice being able to glance at my watch for the distances. I keep my score on a scorecard and write in how many putts per hole, if I used my putter off the green for a chip, and if I had any penalty strokes on each hole. Afterwards I go into the app and make the edits. For a history of your shots on each hole, you can only access that information through the website along with a lot more info than what the app provides. My only dislike of the system is the sensors, I find myself tightening each one prior to making a shot to make sure it’s in there good since they can back out over time. If they had reversed the threads (tighten by turning left), then for right handed players I think they wouldn’t back out as much.
 

I am not tech savvy.

[Dennisavery]

I have a shotscope and my home course has gps rangefinders on the carts. This past weekend I played at another course and decided to forgo technology, just use the markings on the course and estimate it - relying more on intuition. I hit 14 out of 18 greens in regulation for the first time in my life. I played 9 holes several times this week with similar results. I think I will lay the Shot scope to the side for a while.

Sent from my moto g(7) supra using Tapatalk

[dru_]

Sorry, posted this, and then got sucked into a honeydo project that has eaten my life for the last month or so.  The problem for me and the Arccos system is not any one thing, but death by a hundred cuts.
 

• Must carry the phone in the front pocket ( the newer device that removes this requirement wasn't available yet )
• Because the phone uses the microphone you cannot use headphones while the app is active
• The Apple Watch app was prone to crash/disconnection ( other apps do not suffer this, Golfshot, GolfGameBuddy, The Grint, etc )
• The screw in sensors had an odd fitment with the midsize Lamkin grips I used that led them to backing out over time and creating a pinch point gap
• Putting required frequent adjustments.
• Managing penalty strokes is a bit painful.
• The system always assumes full swings, and thus distance data is skewed, rendering many of its tools ineffective.
• The system is, sadly, tied to GPS data and suffers for accuracy in heavy canopy areas ( ALL of north GA ). 

Ultimately, what broke the camels back for me was the the mix of trying to deal with the myriad of quirks in the system.

Knowing what I do now, I realize that many of the quirks can be solved by using the combination of the Caddie Link and the Smart Grips, a $300 investment, with a $100 recurring subscription is a pretty stout cost of entry for something that still requires a good bit of babysitting if you want to realize the benefit of the analytics behind the system. 

[MaxEntropy]

Personally, I understand most of your issues, but they are not deal-breakers for me.

1 hour ago, dru_ said:

The system always assumes full swings, and thus distance data is skewed, rendering many of its tools ineffective.

This part is not true, though. The "Smart Range" filters out outliers (good and bad), so the more you play, the better the filtering will be. The club metrics might still show the punch shots in the scatter plot, but Arccos says they are not used in the calculations.

[dru_]

5 minutes ago, MaxEntropy said:

Personally, I understand most of your issues, but they are not deal-breakers for me.

This part is not true, though. The "Smart Range" filters out outliers (good and bad), so the more you play, the better the filtering will be. The club metrics might still show the punch shots in the scatter plot, but Arccos says they are not used in the calculations.

I read that too, but after about 20 rounds with them, my 7i distances continued to reflect it's use for the little half swing punches...

[TR1PTIK]

I've been using shot tracking devices for several years (my first device was the original Game Golf device, purchased about 1 year after it released) and most of the negative reviews I've seen can be placed into two categories: "Lack of Understanding/Lofty Expectations" and "Legitimate Gripes". From what I read above, the negatives listed could be split right down the middle:

• Legitimate Gripes - phone in pocket, use of microphone, Apple Watch integration and reliability, GPS accuracy.
• Lack of Understanding/Lofty Expectations - sensor fitment, putting adjustments, penalty strokes, club distances.

While not an ideal fix, the newly released solution for "phone in pocket/use of microphone" is Link. I wish it would have come about sooner or been part of the original product, but I'm guessing Arccos didn't realize how much of an issue this would be for some golfers.

GPS accuracy is one of those things that simply is what it is unfortunately. Unless you want to strap on something quite a bit bulkier and more expensive, I'm not sure what else to tell you. 

I don't have any firsthand experience with the Apple Watch. I don't own one. Perhaps it is simply a matter of Arccos needing to devote more attention to their coding, or maybe the issue is more complex than that.

When it comes to sensor fitment, I have found the solution for Arccos to be much better than Game Golf, Golf Pad, or Shot Scope Sensors (all of which are very similar). Game Golf support actually recommends gluing the sensors to the grip in order to keep them from backing out - ridiculous! I'll admit I have standard size grips so the solution may work a bit better for me than it would for you, but all it takes is a little bit of electrical tape wrapped around the juncture in question. I have had zero issues.

Putting adjustments... A fair bit of the problem with putting is tied to GPS accuracy, but putting is also where users tend to miss the most "tagged shots". The reason for this could be as simple as a conceded putt or gimme, or it could just be that you only had a tap-in left and Arccos didn't register because whatever requirements needed to trigger a "tag" simply weren't met. It's a shortcoming felt by every shot tracking device available as far as I know and isn't something likely to be fully corrected anytime soon.

Penalties... I'm not sure what your expectations here are, but there's really no good way to automatically detect a penalty and even if there were, how would the device know how many strokes to apply? Thankfully, the process of adding penalty strokes is incredibly easy and consistent across all devices currently on the market - open the app, select the shot in need of penalty strokes, add however many strokes are required, add a new shot from the spot where the ball was last played (if taking a stroke and distance penalty), then go on about your round.

Finally, the issue of club distances. This one is, again, super easy and has nothing to do with Smart Range though (if I recall correctly) Smart Range was developed to help with this particular problem. All you have to do is go into the club data and deselect partial swings or atypical shots so they aren't factored into your averages. If done after every round it takes all of maybe 2 minutes.

Anyway, this is how I personally reason with the shortcomings of shot tracking devices. I don't expect it to alleviate all (or any) of your frustrations, but I've seen a number of user complaints like yours that could have benefited from information like this prior to making a purchase so I decided to share. It is for this very reason that when a buddy of mine recently asked me about Arccos, I asked to speak with him on the phone so I could go over some of the limitations and describe what he might be able to expect on the course. He had his first round with it yesterday and says he really likes it. Even better, we can see each other's data now which just adds to the fun.