What am I leaving (if anything) on the table?

[Grit Golf]

 

I got a chance to hit 10 drives on skytrak with my new driver and a quality ball, the Srixon Z Star. These are typical for me, no gross miss hits, nothing deleted.

 

PXG 0811XF Gen2 - 9.0*

PX HZRDUS Smoke Yellow 6.0 (Stiff)

Weights as toe-side as possible (promote fade)

Adapter in standard setting

 

 

Ignore swing speed and smash factor, skytrak doesn’t track these it just “guesses”.

 

My concerns:

1. 600ish rpm of draw spin against 2000ish rpm backspin = OB if the ball starts left

2. I’m pretty sure the peak height (19 yards or 57 feet) is way too low to be optimal?

3. Initial ball direction (face) was more sporadic than my previous driver (Cobra Ltd w Fuji speeder stiff), I think my swing is too slow/smooth for the yellow smoke 6.0 and I’m having to load the shaft more aggressively than I would like to “feel it” to load up

 

What should I do next? Should I loft up at the adapter (open the face a bit)? Set the adapter to the PXG setting (flat)? Ditch the yellow smoke 6.0? Sell this thing on eBay and go get fit (I know that comment is coming)?

 

 

 

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[DPattGolf]

I would think an additional 5-8 yards of peak height could do wonders for u. 

[NM01]

Ball speed and launch are all over the place. I’m guessing probably hitting low heel strikes.

I would work on hitting center of the face consistently and see what you numbers look like at that point.

 

[Micah T]

Can you play on the LM more? You’d want peak height to be 100 ft ball park, sometimes adjustments in loft can do that, but sometimes a different shaft is needed...

As someone who just had a driver fitting there is no way I would’ve gotten my specs dialed myself, but if you have access to a LM and free time...


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[Micah T]

Can you play on the LM more? You’d want peak height to be in the 100 ft ball park, sometimes adjustments in loft can do that, but sometimes a different shaft is needed...

 

As someone who just had a driver fitting there is no way I would’ve gotten my specs dialed myself, but if you have access to a LM and free time...

 

 

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[Grit Golf]

These were mostly out of the center, some slightly high some slightly low, nothing way out there. That said, no deletes, pretty typical of 10 drives on a course, which is what I think makes sense to optimize against?


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[Grit Golf]

Can you play on the LM more? You’d want peak height to be in the 100 ft ball park, sometimes adjustments in loft can do that, but sometimes a different shaft is needed...
 
As someone who just had a driver fitting there is no way I would’ve gotten my specs dialed myself, but if you have access to a LM and free time...
 
 
Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy
 

I’ll rip another 10 shots in the max loft setting and see what that does, more spin and launch would both be beneficial I think? If that fails I’m gonna pull the speeder 661 and throw a PXG tip on it.


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[Grit Golf]

Can you play on the LM more? You’d want peak height to be in the 100 ft ball park, sometimes adjustments in loft can do that, but sometimes a different shaft is needed...
 
As someone who just had a driver fitting there is no way I would’ve gotten my specs dialed myself, but if you have access to a LM and free time...
 
 
Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy
 

I’ll rip another 10 shots in the max loft setting and see what that does, more spin and launch would both be beneficial I think? If that fails I’m gonna pull the speeder 661 and throw a PXG tip on it.


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[Grit Golf]

Did another 5 in the PXG setting (-1.5 lie) and saw essentially the same numbers.



Set it to the big plus (plus 1.5 loft) and it immediately did not look like it was setting up right to the ball. Before my first shot I played w my grip for like 20 seconds and still couldn’t get it to set up right.



I think I ended up delivering with an open face on 7-8 of these, my launch angle shot way up, my spin shot way up, and I’m now both fading and drawing the ball. The good news at this setting is:

1. I think if I spend some time with it I can wrap my head around how to square the face.

2. 6-700 rpm of side spin against 2800-3000rpm of backspin is much less catastrophic.

3. Carry distance is up, height is up, and total distance is the same.

The bad news is this shaft has a totally different loading pattern than the speeder I am used to. I’m going to prep the speeder I was gaming for the PXG and see what that combo looks like. I’m not ruling out that I could “grow into” the smoke, because it does seem to reward a late release which I’m working on, but it’ll take some tinkering.



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[zrumble]

1 hour ago, Grit Golf said:

Did another 5 in the PXG setting (-1.5 lie) and saw essentially the same numbers.



Set it to the big plus (plus 1.5 loft) and it immediately did not look like it was setting up right to the ball. Before my first shot I played w my grip for like 20 seconds and still couldn’t get it to set up right.



I think I ended up delivering with an open face on 7-8 of these, my launch angle shot way up, my spin shot way up, and I’m now both fading and drawing the ball. The good news at this setting is:

1. I think if I spend some time with it I can wrap my head around how to square the face.

2. 6-700 rpm of side spin against 2800-3000rpm of backspin is much less catastrophic.

3. Carry distance is up, height is up, and total distance is the same.

The bad news is this shaft has a totally different loading pattern than the speeder I am used to. I’m going to prep the speeder I was gaming for the PXG and see what that combo looks like. I’m not ruling out that I could “grow into” the smoke, because it does seem to reward a late release which I’m working on, but it’ll take some tinkering.



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You’re not leaving much on the table for distance. You are hitting it with near peak efficiency, and all the charts say at 95mph swing speed max carry is somewhere around 225. IF I was going to nitpick, you should be somewhere between the two settings. Your launch is great on the lower setting but too high on the second, and vice versa regarding spin. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 13-14 degrees of launch with 2800RPMs should be the target. 
That being said, I’d be more concerned with face direction. You do not want to start trying to guess a two-way miss. Zeroing out the path to face relationship at impact will also optimize launch. 

[John W Sutch]

If you can try a 44.5 inch shaft, go to R flex and a little lighter say 55 grams. I had a lot of problems with heel strikes and the shorter shaft allowed for consistent center face strikes. My swing speed is about the same. May help.

[Grit Golf]

I pulled the cobra adapter off the Fujikura Motore Speeder 661. The pull was the cleanest and most professional pull I've ever done on a driver shaft. ALSO, the bore to hosel depth of the cobra and pxg adapters match exactly, which is pretty neat. I'm not superstitious, but I am a little stitious -- and that pull went so well I'm thinking this shaft might do some magic for me in the new head!

Just gotta wait 24 hrs for it to cure..

[Grit Golf]

Hey there cool cats and and kittens - and anyone following along who doesn't identify with that statement. Here are the numbers with the speeder installed:

Let's sum up:

1. Ballspeed: about the same
2. Launch: nearly 2 degrees higher
3. Backspin: nearly 1000rpm higher (part of this has to be how I'm "reacting" to the shaft)
4. Offline: 2 for sure OB balls vs 5 in the Smoke. There is a 2 way miss, but I would rather aim for center than aim 30 yards right and hope it comes back.
5. Carry: +12 yards
6. Total: +3 yards
7. Height: +9 YARDS (+28 feet), or 50% higher!

The smoke is too much shaft for me (at least in 6.0) in really every way. The launch is too low, the spin is way too low, and in order to feel it load up the way I want to I'm really having to get after it and couldn't get comfortable with it in my first 30-40 shots. When I settled back into the familiar speeder after the first few shots (remember, no deletes) I was able to start to feel the path and begin to neutralize it. I was also able to relax and stay in my stance and keep my balance. The last two balls I hit were absolute sweeties and they were effortless.

What's left on the table?

I probably could find a shaft that I could get along with the profile of that was a bit lower launching, a bit lower spinning, and a bit more stable than the speeder. I'd probably save 1 costly driver per round and maybe a few yards. Depending on how the speeder/pxg pans out over a half dozen range sessions and days on course I may go get fit, or maybe not. For me tinkering is part of the fun and I play for fun - so dropping $300 on a fitting and shaft (or another $300 on a different head) isn't really worth the 1 extra fairway or the few yards more. If I can't settle into something with the speeder, then I probably will.

BACK/LOW CG Driver Heads - my limited experience

What turned me on to the PXG 0811XF Gen 2 was the extreme back and low weighted CG (the lowest one measured by mygolfspy in 2019). TXG did a video touting back and low CG placement making heads virtually hook proof (they were talking about the ping g max). In my experience, that's not the case. I was hooking the PXG + smoke than I was with the Cobra LTD + speeder, and Cobra LTD is not an extremely forgiving back CG head. Comparing the Cobra LTD head to the PXG head with the same shaft (speeder) there was an improvement, to be sure, but the head alone isn't magical, and in fact the the PXG head is way lower spinning than I would have guessed. Back and high CG to me would seem to offer more insurance against a hook, because the additional back spin from a higher cg adds insurance for a lower spin player. What I will say about the PXG head is that I did see an improvement in ball speed consistency over the LTD so far.

Flat lie angle setting - my experience

The MGS report on high swing speed drivers for 2020 had a pro tip about flat lie angle drivers helping reduce a hook. Over 10 shots hit back to back between the standard and -1.5 lie setting, my numbers were nearly identical for side spin. Take it with a grain of salt, but don't count on a flat lie setting to be a magic cure - its one small piece of the puzzle that seems to matter much less than the shaft, and the head. You have to get everything working together to optimize your numbers.

Unless you enjoy going through the process yourself and figuring stuff out, its probably best to go see a quality fitter!

  

 

[NM01]

31 minutes ago, Grit Golf said:

probably could find a shaft that I could get along with the profile of that was a bit lower launching, a bit lower spinning, and a bit more stable than the speeder. I'd probably save 1 costly driver per round and maybe a few yards. Depending on how the speeder/pxg pans out over a half dozen range sessions and days on course I may go get fit, or maybe not. For me tinkering is part of the fun and I play for fun - so dropping $300 on a fitting and shaft (or another $300 on a different head) isn't really worth the 1 extra fairway or the few yards more. If I can't settle into something with the speeder, then I probably will.

A shaft itself isn’t going to dramatically add or drop launch or spin. That’s a human thing. Now finding a shaft that lets you deliver the club better would be what would improve the strikes.

The fact your launch and spin changes from shot to shot to me indicates you have inconsistent face contact. With that type of launch and spin you are either hitting low on the face consistently and possibly even have a negative aoa. Do you know your aoa or have a place you could get on a monitor that tracks that.

[Grit Golf]

3 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

A shaft itself isn’t going to dramatically add or drop launch or spin. That’s a human thing. Now finding a shaft that lets you deliver the club better would be what would improve the strikes.

The fact your launch and spin changes from shot to shot to me indicates you have inconsistent face contact. With that type of launch and spin you are either hitting low on the face consistently and possibly even have a negative aoa. Do you know your aoa or have a place you could get on a monitor that tracks that.

Skytrak spin data isn’t quite perfect, so I think it’s a bit of reading error shot to shot combined w some inconsistency from me. These were not all perfect shots, but there also weren’t any horrible mishits. To your point, the speeder was finding the middle better for me, and I definitely thing I’m deliver more spin loft (higher dynamic loft, negative AoA) w the speeder vs the smoke. That’s a me thing, I think, just how I react to the shaft.

I’ll have to head out to 1899 (a sim golf place w trackman over here) and see what it looks like!

[NM01]

2 hours ago, Grit Golf said:

Skytrak spin data isn’t quite perfect, so I think it’s a bit of reading error shot to shot combined w some inconsistency from me. These were not all perfect shots, but there also weren’t any horrible mishits. To your point, the speeder was finding the middle better for me, and I definitely thing I’m deliver more spin loft (higher dynamic loft, negative AoA) w the speeder vs the smoke. That’s a me thing, I think, just how I react to the shaft.

I’ll have to head out to 1899 (a sim golf place w trackman over here) and see what it looks like!

I don’t have much familiarity with sky track so not sure about their spin accuracy. 
 

i agree the speeder is a probably a better fit. The yellow 6.0 is quite stiff and your swing speed is on the low end of someone that would fit into that shaft. 
 

Get some foot spray as well and see where you make contact on the face and see what your numbers are for that shot. 

[Grit Golf]

The PXG face and the Srixon ball is leaving visible ball smudges where I’m hitting it and I’m able to wipe it off in between shots. Nearly all of the 140s were about dead perfect, the 130-somethings were a little left a little right a little high a little low. Ball speed is definitely impacted by where it hits the face. The other thing to remember is 1mph of swing speed is ~1.5 mph of ball speed. So if there is any variation in how fast I swing, even by as little as 2 mph, it will show up as a 3mph difference in ball speed.