Bryson's Wedges

[FrogginBullfish]

I didn't skip anything. You did. I have suggested from the beginning what wedge I think he could add. It's right there in the first post in this thread.

 

I'm completely aware this is an open forum and you are completely at rights to share your opinions. That being said, you haven't provided anything of value to this thread. All you are doing is being overly argumentative, which is an ongoing thing with you, about issues on the peripheral of what this discussion was meant to be about.

 

 

This is an open forum and like you I’m expressing my opinion in a topic. If you don’t like my opinion that’s fine and discussions on forums have those differences. 

Everyone knows that the top players if they have every aspect of their game going will dominate. It’s what made Tiger so great. Most weeks he was dominate in all aspects of the game and even on some occasions he won when one part of his game was lacking. Rory was the same way. The span of time where he had his wedges going and was above avg with the putter he ran off a bunch of victories and majors and it was hard to beat him. DJ when he decided that he needed to work on his wage game ran off majors and multiple win seasons and now that his wedge game and putter have gone cold he can still win.

Bryson was short off the tee and saw how the guys like rory, tiger, Brooks were winning due to their length. He out a plan in place to improve  his distance and he got that results he wanted. 

 

If you look at his stats over the last few years he’s actually improved this year over those years in strokes gained. 

 

 You think him removing a long club for a specialty wedge should be something he should consider to improving his wedge game. I asked earlier and either you skipped it or ignored it. What specialty wedge do you think he should add? And I’ll expand the question to why and in what situations would it be used?

 

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[RickyBobby_PR]

1 minute ago, FrogginBullfish said:

I didn't skip anything. You did. I have suggested from the beginning what wedge I think he could add. It's right there in the first post in this thread.

 

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His 58* is a 60* that’s bent so he obviously has considered his wedge setup to match what he’s trying to do and his other two wedges are also bent from their stamped lofts. He bent his 50* to 47* and his 55* to 52*.

 

[FrogginBullfish]

Again, I'm well aware. His wedges have been bent strong as with his additional speed his spin rates were much too high. His current wedges are also all 37.5" in length.

 

I'll reiterate, my suggestion was a standard length 60° wedge with moderate bounce and a versatile sole grind, however he can alter those from week to week to suit the course needs, specifically to use for difficult short game shots around the green.

His 58* is a 60* that’s bent so he obviously has considered his wedge setup to match what he’s trying to do and his other two wedges are also bent from their stamped lofts. He bent his 50* to 47* and his 55* to 52*.

 

 

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[RickyBobby_PR]

11 minutes ago, FrogginBullfish said:

Again, I'm well aware. His wedges have been bent strong as with his additional speed his spin rates were much too high. His current wedges are also all 37.5" in length.

 

I'll reiterate, my suggestion was a standard length 60° wedge with moderate bounce and a versatile sole grind, however he can alter those from week to week to suit the course needs, specifically to use for difficult short game shots around the green.

 

 

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If he has a bag setup of one length irons because that fits his swing going to something of a different length. That changes feel and swing for him and his game. That would be like someone adding a club to their bag that’s of a different spec than everything else in hopes that is would improve score.

I’ll reiterate pros have their bags setup with a purpose and their scoring clubs are setup to be used for various types of shots. As Faldo pointed out in his reply feel is something important to pros and they rely on it. Changing specs changes feel and in brysons case would probably be worse for his game than better for it.

The fact that he has his wedges bent to certain lofts have account for not only his gapping but the bounce as well. 
 

[FrogginBullfish]

His fairway woods and driver are not single length. He sure manages to do well with those clubs. I think he can handle one club at the other end of the bag just fine as well, especially given that my suggestion wouldn't have him using it on shots beyond 30 yards.

Also, Bryson uses the shafts he does to take the "feel" Faldo is talking about out of his game. He doesn't want to feel the shaft deflect throughout his swing. Faldo's suggestion to switch back to steel alters his "feel" and swing far worse than mine ever could, especially given that my suggestion would still allow him a playable club at the stiffness frequency and swingweight he's looking for with the rest of his irons and wedges. Faldo's doesn't.

If he has a bag setup of one length irons because that fits his swing going to something of a different length. That changes feel and swing for him and his game. That would be like someone adding a club to their bag that’s of a different spec than everything else in hopes that is would improve score.
I’ll reiterate pros have their bags setup with a purpose and their scoring clubs are setup to be used for various types of shots. As Faldo pointed out in his reply feel is something important to pros and they rely on it. Changing specs changes feel and in brysons case would probably be worse for his game than better for it.
The fact that he has his wedges bent to certain lofts have account for not only his gapping but the bounce as well. 
 

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[RickyBobby_PR]

24 minutes ago, FrogginBullfish said:

His fairway woods and driver are not single length. He sure manages to do well with those clubs. I think he can handle one club at the other end of the bag just fine as well, especially given that my suggestion wouldn't have him using it on shots beyond 30 yards.

Also, Bryson uses the shafts he does to take the "feel" Faldo is talking about out of his game. He doesn't want to feel the shaft deflect throughout his swing. Faldo's suggestion to switch back to steel alters his "feel" and swing far worse than mine ever could, especially given that my suggestion would still allow him a playable club at the stiffness frequency and swingweight he's looking for with the rest of his irons and wedges. Faldo's doesn't.

 

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No duh his wolds aren’t single length but all his irons and wedges are so putting different length wedge in is a change.

Feel means different things to different people. The key thing Faldo was talking about is also about consistency. Changing from one length to another in a wedge changes that. 

The “need for him to improve his wedge/shirt game” is based on a perception of it being bad because commentators talked about some shots across 4 rounds and because some stats that are not accurate based on how they are calculated yet with them being in the positive indicate it isn’t as big of a problem as some think.

Bryson is he hottest player on tour right now and his stats overall indicate he will be ok without having to add a specialty club which 99.99999999% of pros don’t put in the bag  to solve a bad shot or two a round or in 4 days

[FrogginBullfish]

His short game is ranked 96th in Strokes Gained. There's room to improve there. That's not based on one week. That's based on every week he's played this year.

Faldo's talk of consistency has no basis in reality. TXG's video today is about that.

Obviously my suggestion would be a change. That's literally the point of suggesting something different he could be doing to improve the area of his game where he stands to improve the most, which is factually his around the green play. That cannot be denied. Just cause he's in the positive doesn't mean he can't stand to improve. He's only gaining 0.05 of a shot per round with his around the green play. That could just as easily be -0.05 and it would mean the same thing. His short game is fine but its not among the best on tour. Not by any stretch.

You continue to ramble on without providing anything of value to this thread. If you don't think there's any changes to suggest, then say that and be done with it. All you're doing right now is derailing a thread with a bunch of peripheral arguments that don't provide value to the question at hand.

No duh his wolds aren’t single length but all his irons and wedges are so putting different length wedge in is a change.
Feel means different things to different people. The key thing Faldo was talking about is also about consistency. Changing from one length to another in a wedge changes that. 
The “need for him to improve his wedge/shirt game” is based on a perception of it being bad because commentators talked about some shots across 4 rounds and because some stats that are not accurate based on how they are calculated yet with them being in the positive indicate it isn’t as big of a problem as some think.
Bryson is he hottest player on tour right now and his stats overall indicate he will be ok without having to add a specialty club which 99.99999999% of pros don’t put in the bag  to solve a bad shot or two a round or in 4 days

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[RickyBobby_PR]

18 minutes ago, FrogginBullfish said:

His short game is ranked 96th in Strokes Gained. There's room to improve there. That's not based on one week. That's based on every week he's played this year.

Faldo's talk of consistency has no basis in reality. TXG's video today is about that.

Obviously my suggestion would be a change. That's literally the point of suggesting something different he could be doing to improve the area of his game where he stands to improve the most, which is factually his around the green play. That cannot be denied. Just cause he's in the positive doesn't mean he can't stand to improve. He's only gaining 0.05 of a shot per round with his around the green play. That could just as easily be -0.05 and it would mean the same thing. His short game is fine but its not among the best on tour. Not by any stretch.

You continue to ramble on without providing anything of value to this thread. If you don't think there's any changes to suggest, then say that and be done with it. All you're doing right now is derailing a thread with a bunch of peripheral arguments that don't provide value to the question at hand.

 

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You think he needs to improve based on some numbers where as he thinks he needed to improve his driving distance and that subsequently improved his other numbers. I disagree and have talked about it from how pros think and that their bags are setup for a reason and that each club is in the bag for a reason.

His top 10 finishes and his win suggest his approach is working. 

You don’t like to have your opinion questioned which is ok and I’ve pointed out why his bag doesn’t need to change and that what you are suggesting doesn’t make sense for a tour pro. He has a coach for his training, nutrition as well as his golf game. If his nutrition or training needed to change then his coach would adjust that and it’s no different than with his golf game and his coach working with him to make changes where needed. There’s nothing Bryson does that doesn’t have a reason for it and a method to achieving it. I’ve had the opportunity to talk with people in the golf business that worked with Bryson when he first came on tour and was trying to get his clubs setup. Bryson is very detailed and involved in the process and provides detailed feedback on what he feels, thinks and wants to see. 
 

He played very little golf during the lockdown, was focused on swing faster and harder along with training to be able to do that. He basically went back on tour with minimal prep and finished in the top 10 of every event and now a win, what’s to say that his numbers won’t improve as his feel and comfortability hitting shots comes back that his short game doesn’t get better. Let’s also not forget that the commentators in his first couple events back noted that despite his increased distance and size his touch was still good. 
 

 

[FrogginBullfish]

I welcome challenges to my opinion actually. But none of what you've said here is a challenge towards my opinion. All you're doing is making peripheral arguments trying to inflate your ego about your knowledge of what professional golfers do with their bags, which btw pretty much everyone here already is aware of. Not one thing you've said in this thread about how pros setup their bags is new information to me and frankly it's not relevant to the discussion which was simply meant to be a way of having a fun discussion about how he could potentially improve the weakest part of his game.

You can challenge me all you want, but without any real facts to back it up, I'm not going to give your opinions much thought. My opinions are built around the facts as presented which I've stated many times in response to you. Everyone on the planet is aware he's made changes to his physique to hit the ball further. He's accomplished that goal. Regardless of whether he continues to pursue distance or tries to maintain the gains he's made, his around the green play is going to be a critical part of his game moving forward. I fail to see how identifying that area as a weakness when he's ranked 96th on tour in that area is a bad thing. He's probably already identifying that as an area to improve on himself.

All I wanted to do was to have a discussion about what he could do to improve that area of his game but you seem keen on not allowing that to happen so I'm going to request that a mod lock this thread up. There's no point in continuing.

You think he needs to improve based on some numbers where as he thinks he needed to improve his driving distance and that subsequently improved his other numbers. I disagree and have talked about it from how pros think and that their bags are setup for a reason and that each club is in the bag for a reason.
His top 10 finishes and his win suggest his approach is working. 
You don’t like to have your opinion questioned which is ok and I’ve pointed out why his bag doesn’t need to change and that what you are suggesting doesn’t make sense for a tour pro. He has a coach for his training, nutrition as well as his golf game. If his nutrition or training needed to change then his coach would adjust that and it’s no different than with his golf game and his coach working with him to make changes where needed. There’s nothing Bryson does that doesn’t have a reason for it and a method to achieving it. I’ve had the opportunity to talk with people in the golf business that worked with Bryson when he first came on tour and was trying to get his clubs setup. Bryson is very detailed and involved in the process and provides detailed feedback on what he feels, thinks and wants to see. 
 
He played very little golf during the lockdown, was focused on swing faster and harder along with training to be able to do that. He basically went back on tour with minimal prep and finished in the top 10 of every event and now a win, what’s to say that his numbers won’t improve as his feel and comfortability hitting shots comes back that his short game doesn’t get better. Let’s also not forget that the commentators in his first couple events back noted that despite his increased distance and size his touch was still good. 
 
 

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[Jmikecpa]

I have in the past played graphite in my wedges with zero issue. These guys tend to agree with that result.

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[Grit Golf]

Another thing to consider with Bryson’s wedges is he went to single length (with 10 degree upright lie angles) as a collegiate golfer, one of the reasons he cited at the time was that one length + the 10* upright put him in an upright plane that alleviated tightness in his lower back. Going with shorter length clubs, or flatter lie angles may be off the table completely for him if he thinks it could lead to or even contribute to an injury. 
 

I don’t know anything about biomechanics or sports therapy etc, but there is a fitter who has a partnership with Cobra selling 39”, upright lie, one length irons specifically for golfers w lower back problems, so there may be something to it?

Another thing I have been curious about with him is, why are the irons 10 up, but the driver isnt? It seems like he is trying to keep the exact same spine angle for every club in the bag (driver down to wedges) and the only way to keep a driver spine angle in your wedges is to lengthen them and stand them up 10 degrees? If he is designing his golf swing with a specific spine angle locked in as a constraint, you will never see standard wedges in his bag. I don’t really know enough about it to say for sure, so please school me on it if I’m way off base.

[Bustaferrari]

On 7/7/2020 at 11:27 AM, RickyBobby_PR said:

He does have his shots planned out. The plan is to hit the ball as far as he can off the tee. He hits FW or Hybrid when he can’t hit driver as seen in the previous weeks when holes that fairway run out where the driver or FW would. Other guys were hitting irons instead of hybrids to find their right distance. 

Of course, but just saying maybe not hit it so close and maybe he is better with a 9 iron. Eitherway I see no problem with him at all since he is winning every week. 

[revkev]

Of course, but just saying maybe not hit it so close and maybe he is better with a 9 iron. Eitherway I see no problem with him at all since he is winning every week. 

Touring pros will hit the ball closer to the hole the closer they get to the green. He will hit it closer from 75 yards with some wedge than 150 with his 9 iron.

Stats are relative, mid pack from 75 yards is going to be better than top shelf from 150.

To be clear we are splitting hairs here.


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