Pro's should act like Pro's

[Middler 2,407]

Seems as though the days of athletes, movie stars, politicians or captains of industry as role models or good examples are largely long gone. All we can do is hope that “erosion” doesn’t accelerate? At least golf hasn’t fallen as far as most other sports. And frankly fans are stoking the behavior, fans behavior in the gallery has eroded dramatically too, and many fans applaud and support bad behavior when it’s directed at another team. All you can do is support the behaviors you want to see, and let the chips fall. I won’t watch the WMS tournament, and I don’t root for Bryson or Sergio - but I don’t pretend to influence anyone else. Legislating manners isn’t an option...first world problems anyway.

[Siamese Moose 375]

6 hours ago, cnosil said:

 

Rules have changed while you can’t replace a club damaged in anger it can be used or repaired

Under Rule 4.1:

A player is allowed to keep using and/or to repair any club damaged during the round, no matter what the damage and even if the player damaged it in anger.
A player is not allowed to replace a damaged club, except when it is damaged during the round by an outside influence or natural forces or by someone other than the player or his or her caddie.



https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules-hub/rules-modernization/major-changes/adding-clubs-to-replace-a-club-damaged-during-round.html

 

Thanks for the update! There's a reason I'm not a rules official.

[tony@CIC 18,528]

Seems as though the days of athletes, movie stars, politicians or captains of industry as role models or good examples are long gone. All we can do is hope that “erosion” doesn’t accelerate? At least golf hasn’t fallen as far as most other sports. And frankly fans are stoking the behavior, fans behavior in the gallery as eroded dramatically too, and many fans applaud and support bad behavior when it’s directed at another team. All you can do is support the behaviors you want to see, and let the chips fall. I won’t watch the WMS tournament, and I don’t root for Bryson or Sergio - but I don’t pretend to influence anyone else. Legislating manners isn’t an option...first world problems anyway.

Well said


Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

[BNewton51 485]

On 8/8/2020 at 2:17 PM, Tom the Golf Nut said:

So here's my rant for today. We are golfers and enjoy watching the elite of the game make shots we all dream of making  and try to win tournaments. To me there is nothing worse than watching a select few of the elite throw temper tantrums. We have seen clubs thrown, clubs snapped in half on purpose, clubs thrown in the water. Putters slammed into the greens. Wedges slamed into the side of greens when missing a sand shot. Spitting on the greens.

I know there have been some fines inforced in some instances, but these guys have money and probably don't care about the fine. They get their equipment for free and have it replaced within the same day.  So they dont care about the equipment either. We all get disappointed when we hit a bad shot. What can be done to get these guys to act professionally on television? They are setting a poor example of how a "Gentlemens Game" should be portrayed.

Yes I know " Gentlemens Game" is old school terminology, so lets just say they should act with respect for the game. Maybe the media should talk more about the cost of the fines and embarrased them.

Maybe the golfer should be forced to play the rest of the tournment without that club if it was done on purpose.

Ok , my rant is over. How do you feel about this?

Your thoughts and or feelings are NOT that far off the mark.  In fact, I'd offer that they are pretty much spot on. 

For me, I harken back to my participation in High School and College athletics.  I was fortunate, something that kids of later generations were not as fortunate with, to have coaches that always preached the mantra "Play like you've been there before... Act like a champion, be a champion!"   The unfortunate thing we are seeing in Golf isn't too much different than what we see play out on a daily basis in society.  

Frankly, I think that getting disappointed and or upset is part of the game we love so much.  NO ONE has ever perfected it.  NO ONE!  So knowing that, a player must go through the process of a round expecting highs and lows.  When the lows hit, it doesn't do you any good to flip out and or act like you're a two year old.  Great article on Golf Digest I read about Tyrell Hatton.  I'll include the link below.  His Caddy had the best response to his players complaints about Grass and or a bad shot.  Grass, "Do you think Tiger complains about the grass at the various courses he plays at?  No.   You want to be the best you need to be able to play it anywhere!"  Bad Shot, "Who hit it there?  Get on with it and hit your next shot better!"  

Point being, golf has its good and it's bad as far as how it's viewed.  The whole Gentlemen's game comments being viewed as elitist etc.  Personally, I think its all a farce.  Should golf be more accessible to the masses, yes.  Is it elitist, no!  Anyone who wants to can play the game.  But that even all said, there are rules for decorum and appropriate behavior.  And if you are playing a round with people you don't know or in front of people at a tournament, then for goodness sake you should have the common sense to understand that you shouldn't act a fool.  I guess with great money, though, common sense often is absent.  Sadly. 

 

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/tyrrell-hatton-pga-tour-European-tour-world-rankings-top-10

[deauxrite 297]

I stopped swearing on the golf course a couple of years ago.  I was playing in a group and I missed a short putt.  Called myself a couple of bad names etc..  I really did not think too much of it at the time.  After the round was over one of the older players in the group pulled me aside and asked me if I had any idea how my little temper tantrum affected the rest of the group.  He explained to me that I was playing a game with other people and that my attitude, demeanor and language had an effect on the game of the others.  To be honest, I had not thought of it that way.  Now..I try to remember that my behavior not on reflects on me..but has an effect on those playing around me.

[Middler 2,407]

On 1/11/2021 at 9:54 AM, deauxrite said:

I stopped swearing on the golf course a couple of years ago.  I was playing in a group and I missed a short putt.  Called myself a couple of bad names etc..  I really did not think too much of it at the time.  After the round was over one of the older players in the group pulled me aside and asked me if I had any idea how my little temper tantrum affected the rest of the group.  He explained to me that I was playing a game with other people and that my attitude, demeanor and language had an effect on the game of the others.  To be honest, I had not thought of it that way.  Now..I try to remember that my behavior not on reflects on me..but has an effect on those playing around me.

That’s funny, the guys I play with tell me the opposite. When I hit a bad shot one of three things come out of my mouth, dumbass, where are you going (usually a pull) or uh-oh. Most of them cuss after a bad shot, but it’s forgotten within seconds (as intended) - there are no outbursts or sulking after. Every once in a while they’ll tell me ‘you can get mad and cuss you know.’ Last time they did after I three putted, I gave them an MFer, they felt better...

[Tom the Golf Nut 3,365]

On 12/29/2020 at 12:41 PM, BNewton51 said:

 And if you are playing a round with people you don't know or in front of people at a tournament, then for goodness sake you should have the common sense to understand that you shouldn't act a fool.  

 

 

Spot on!

I get to play a lot of golf for my company. Golf with customers, charity golf events, customer sponsored events and such. I know I am representing my company and to some extent have to be an entertainer. I want the people I'm with to have a good time and remember me in a good way. Too many times I have seen people get plastered, fall out of the cart, puke on the golf course. To think that they were representing their company leaves a bad taste in my mouth (no pun intended). Will I have a drink on the course with the customer, sure,  maybe one or two at the most. But I know I am representing my company and although I am playing golf I still am working to build a relationship. You don't want to be remembered for throwing clubs, cursing, having a temper tantrum or anything negative. When you hear people say that there is a lot of business done on the golf course, it's true, trust me.

But back to the Pro's.  They make a lot of money. They are on TV, and there are millions of people watching you. Act like a professional.      

[BNewton51 485]

3 minutes ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Spot on!

I get to play a lot of golf for my company. Golf with customers, charity golf events, customer sponsored events and such. I know I am representing my company and to some extent have to be an entertainer. I want the people I'm with to have a good time and remember me in a good way. Too many times I have seen people get plastered, fall out of the cart, puke on the golf course. To think that they were representing their company leaves a bad taste in my mouth (no pun intended). Will I have a drink on the course with the customer, sure,  maybe one or two at the most. But I know I am representing my company and although I am playing golf I still am working to build a relationship. You don't want to be remembered for throwing clubs, cursing, having a temper tantrum or anything negative. When you hear people say that there is a lot of business done on the golf course, it's true, trust me.

But back to the Pro's.  They make a lot of money. They are on TV, and there are millions of people watching you. Act like a professional.      

absolutely!

It's a cultural problem here in this country, if I'm being honest.  Where in the past this type of behavior was frowned upon, these day's it's promoted like it's a sign of their competitive prowess.  Frankly, I watch a guy do any of the above I instantly am turned off and will not support him.  I get the whole frustrations, but if you're THAT frustrated and angered then it begs the question why are you playing a professional sport?   More over, then I'd love to know WHY more of these companies aren't sitting back asking themselves is this really good for our brand?  Just blows my mid. 

[fixyurdivot 10,575]

Sorry to hear about this.  This guy is a real grinder. 

Angel Cabrera: Two-time golf major winner arrested in Brazil - CNN

[tchat07 1,451]

I personally cannot stand when the camera zooms in on the person who has done something wrong or just had something bad happen. It applies to all sports in my opinion, the running back who just fumbled to zoom in on his face on the bench, the guard who missed the game winning shot and they leave the camera on them as they cry. I would rather watch the joy of success and victory than the ugly or sad side of failure and losing.

Sent from my SM-G950U using MyGolfSpy mobile app

[Kenny B 25,039]

2 hours ago, tchat07 said:

I personally cannot stand when the camera zooms in on the person who has done something wrong or just had something bad happen. It applies to all sports in my opinion, the running back who just fumbled to zoom in on his face on the bench, the guard who missed the game winning shot and they leave the camera on them as they cry. I would rather watch the joy of success and victory than the ugly or sad side of failure and losing.

 

"The thrill of victory and the agony of defeat."  It seems we are destined to see both, but I agree with you.

[ChiefMikeOfficer 165]

On 1/11/2021 at 8:54 AM, deauxrite said:

I stopped swearing on the golf course a couple of years ago.  I was playing in a group and I missed a short putt.  Called myself a couple of bad names etc..  I really did not think too much of it at the time.  After the round was over one of the older players in the group pulled me aside and asked me if I had any idea how my little temper tantrum affected the rest of the group.  He explained to me that I was playing a game with other people and that my attitude, demeanor and language had an effect on the game of the others.  To be honest, I had not thought of it that way.  Now..I try to remember that my behavior not on reflects on me..but has an effect on those playing around me.

 

On 1/13/2021 at 7:19 AM, Middler said:

That’s funny, the guys I play with tell me the opposite. When I hit a bad shot one of three things come out of my mouth, dumbass, where are you going (usually a pull) or uh-oh. Most of them cuss after a bad shot, but it’s forgotten within seconds (as intended) - there are no outbursts or sulking after. Every once in a while they’ll tell me ‘you can get mad and cuss you know.’ Last time they did after I three putted, I gave them an MFer, they felt better...

I see (and have experienced) both sides of this. It definitely can be a humorous thing, and simply swearing doesn't really bother me or my friends, but there's a fine line between a simple reaction and an awkward situation.

Back in my Fr-So year of college, my game was in shambles, with embarrassing snap hooks OB and hosel rockets surprisingly common (right as this was starting, I won a tournament despite 2 shanks, but it was downhill from there and didn't turn around for ~2 years). In a casual summer round with 2 HS golf buddies, I threw a 3-hole tantrum - started when I swiped away a gimme that accidentally damaged the green right in my buddy's line, and two holes later, spiked my driver into the ground after snapping two OB (shaft shattered - to this day, that's the only club I've ever broken out of anger). I sensed it was awkward for them (they were needling me for my poor play, as we all expect, but then suddenly stopped), but I couldn't get over myself. I haven't talked to either of them for years, likely just because life took us different directions, but I still think back to that day and wonder if that's the day we started drifting apart. That's one thing that's changed my behavior on the course.

On the other side, one close friend today has a hell of a temper on the course, and it's hilarious. We place o/u bets on how many club throws he has in each round, joke with him about it, etc. We mostly view it as his role in the group. He normally keeps a good attitude outside of his brief shot reactions. But sometimes it does get a little awkward...

One of the best pieces of advice I've ever received (and have relayed to many others) was from a college teammate that was a total a-hole (but also a sage?): When I was struggling with my game and getting mad about almost every shot, he told me "you're not good enough to get that mad about that shot". At first I told him to f off (because 1-2 years prior, I was way better and didn't accept my current performance); after it sunk in, that ended up being one of the moments that made me actually enjoy the game more - I still try to compete from time to time and do get frustrated, but not nearly to the point that I used to, and find it much easier to accept the outcome (especially with a demanding job - can't expect to be a +3 without actually putting in the practice time). 

[braincramp 231]

What is entertaining to me is the fact that the powers that be in the PGA offices and TV want the viewer to get the close up experience of being next to the players in the most frustrating game on the face of the earth and expect everyone to be the perfect little choir boy. It ain't happenin'. If they don't want slip ups like JT's they need to time delay the broadcasts or get cheaper mics.

[fixyurdivot 10,575]

14 hours ago, Kenny B said:

"The thrill of victory and the agony of defeat."  It seems we are destined to see both, but I agree with you.

That brings back memory of the ski jumper on "Wide World of Sports" program... that image left an indelible mark. 

[Kenny B 25,039]

Just now, fixyurdivot said:

That brings back memory of the ski jumper on "Wide World of Sports" program... that image left an indelible mark. 

Yeah, that was run for years.  Fails happen, but that's all we saw with the technology available at the time.  However, with today's cameras they want to get as close as they can to catch emotional responses.  I draw the line at showing inappropriate actions that kids (no matter how old) might emulate.

[blackngold_blood 4,605]

I have refrained from commenting while trying to get my thoughts together on this subject. 

1st. The thrill of victory and the agony of defeat. You can not have one without the other. If you want professionals to "act" like professionals, it goes both ways. Would you be happy if every winner commented with the old answer of "Hard work paid off. I will enjoy it tonight then back to work tomorrow." to every question?  Of course not. Emotion is what makes the stories great and horrible but without one the other doesn't exist. 

2nd. Why as a society do we feel that other people need to act/talk in a certain way that we think is "correct".  These professionals are not playing to be role models. They are playing for money. Money for themselves and for some athletes money to help others. As a parent, if you don't like how they act and don't want your kid seeing it, don't let them watch. These athletes don't need to act a certain way because kids are watching.  Parents need to take responsibility and let their own kids know what is right and wrong and how to act. 

3rd. Gentlemen's Game and Tradition are terms used by golfers all the time. They are also used by those that describe what is wrong with the game. Every sport must evolve or it will eventually be non existent. 

4th. I do not throw or break clubs personally. I also dont condone damaging ANY property that isn't yours. Do I curse on the course?  Occasionally yes.  I will never hold another person responsible for my actions and I won't hold anyone to a higher standard than I do myself. 

Pros don't need to act like pros. They need to act and speak in a manner that is true to who they are and who they want to be. That is it.  It is our choice to watch and support them or not. 

Rant over

[Tom the Golf Nut 3,365]

1 hour ago, blackngold_blood said:

4th. I do not throw or break clubs personally. I also dont condone damaging ANY property that isn't yours. Do I curse on the course?  Occasionally yes.  I will never hold another person responsible for my actions and I won't hold anyone to a higher standard than I do 

That was the intent of the original post. So if you don't do those things then you are saying its ok for them to have lower standards than you hold yourself to.  I didnt mention anything about cursing. To each their own on that point. But I will say I belong to a private country club in the Bible Belt. You let a few fly and it's like so motion on the course. Everyone stops and looks. I learned to refrain.

The only point was, if you are in the public spotlight do the right thing. You could potentially be a role model for someone. If a pro has to take a leak while on the course he goes to the Porta John.  He doesn't go pee on a tree. Why because people are watching. 

I respect your opinion, we each have our own. You can see by the diversity of all the contributions to the original post.

 

[blackngold_blood 4,605]

4 minutes ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

So if you don't do those things then you are saying its ok for them to have lower standards than you hold yourself to

I may not have been clear but this is not the intention or what I was trying to say. 
 

What I was trying to say is just  because I don’t do these things doesn’t mean I NEED/HAVE to expect someone else to not do them. I don’t hold any athlete to any standard because it isn’t any of my business or my responsibility/right to do so. 
 

I get that we are on a golf forum and discuss many issues but just because they are on TV doesn’t mean they have to uphold any specific values or act in a certain way.  As long as they are within the rules of whatever they are involved in, it isn’t any concern of mine or anybody else’s what they do. 
 

I just find it frustrating that people feel the need to push their own values and morals on someone else. 
Pros should act like pros, pants/collared shirt, pace of play, and certain clubs are for certain people are all similar in my mind.  

Im just giving you my thoughts. I understand that you feel a different way and that is fine.  I will just move along now as this thread is clearly not for me. 
 

 

[fixyurdivot 10,575]

I didn't act like a pro today. After missing the 6th birdie putt I muttered dumba$$.  Dave and Jan both agreed.  They were also really disappointed in my efforts to pull the chilled birdie juice from the bag which never saw the light of day 

[BIG STU 7,642]

On 1/13/2021 at 9:03 AM, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Spot on!

I get to play a lot of golf for my company. Golf with customers, charity golf events, customer sponsored events and such. I know I am representing my company and to some extent have to be an entertainer. I want the people I'm with to have a good time and remember me in a good way. Too many times I have seen people get plastered, fall out of the cart, puke on the golf course. To think that they were representing their company leaves a bad taste in my mouth (no pun intended). Will I have a drink on the course with the customer, sure,  maybe one or two at the most. But I know I am representing my company and although I am playing golf I still am working to build a relationship. You don't want to be remembered for throwing clubs, cursing, having a temper tantrum or anything negative. When you hear people say that there is a lot of business done on the golf course, it's true, trust me.

But back to the Pro's.  They make a lot of money. They are on TV, and there are millions of people watching you. Act like a professional.      

Ha Ha tell you something else NOT to do in a company golf event with customers shoot 65 or 66. Was working for a company part time because I had 2 trucks leased there. Well one of the wheels asked me said he heard I played a little golf. He did not know I was playing the Minis on and off from time to time. We played a fairly short easy course from the mid tees. I played WFO as was my style. I remember I got a weird look from the wheel after the round. My old man heard about that and told me "You don't do that crap in a business setting. You know come to think of it I never played another business round.