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Pebble Creek Owner wants Brownfield designation to redevelop land


fozcycle

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https://tampabaytimes-fl.newsmemory.com/?publink=0af3467a7
 
Golf course eyes development
BY C.T. BOWEN

Times Staff Writer

NEW TAMPA — A golf course owner wants to turn green fairways into brownfields.

Ace Golf, owner of the Pebble Creek Golf Course just east of Bruce B. Downs Boulevard, is seeking a brownfields designation from Hillsborough County as a precursor to cleaning contaminants from the land and selling it for residential development.

If granted, the designation means the property cleanup will be done under the jurisdiction of the county’s Environmental Protection Commission, rather than the state Department of Environmental Protection. The brownfield label also carries a tax credit for Ace Golf to help reduce the remediation cost.

Some residents in the more than 1,300-home Pebble Creek subdivision are objecting, fearing that calling the land environmentally damaged will stigmatize the neighborhood and hurt property values.

Others don’t like the potential end result: Up to 300 new single-family homes on the 150

9A


acres that have played host to birdies, eagles, divots and duffers for more than five decades.

“I’ve heard no compelling evidence that the contamination is widespread or imminent as an ecological (danger) to the homeowners, especially if the course remains a course,’’ said Frederick Pearce of Fairwood Court.

He and his wife, Lisa, bought their home seven years ago because of the course, and he called the brownfield application “a subterfuge’’ to allow the land to be rezoned more quickly.

“A brownfield designation next to our homes will decimate our property values,’’ agreed Juliana Karp, a 22-year resident of Norchester Circle, who said the area still hasn’t recovered fully from the 2008 housing crisis.

But a clean up is inevitable, and asking for the county’s blessing is not an attempt to sidestep the normal zoning process, said representatives for Ace Golf.

“The reality of this site is the golf course won’t be there forever,” said one the company’s attorneys, Travis Hearne. “Remediation will be required to reuse this property.”

The environmental request adds a few strokes to a nowfamiliar public debate across the region: The closure of community golf courses amid dwindling interest in the sport decades after developers used putting greens and sand traps as the prime amenity to sell home lots in new neighborhoods.

See Walden Lakes in Plant City, Quail Hollow near Wesley Chapel and the Links in Hudson as recent examples of shuttered courses in residential developments.

There also is the high profile debate over the proposed development of the former Tides Golf Club in unincorporated Seminole in Pinellas County and a prior brouhaha over development plans for the Bardmoor Golf and Tennis Club, also in Seminole. Neither development plan has progressed.

Quoting National Golf Course Owners Association forecasts, Ace Golf president Bill Place said more than 800 courses will close nationally over the next 10 years.

“We’re trying to get ahead of this,” said Place, who purchased the Pebble Creek Golf Course in 2005.

Ace Golf owns three other courses in the area and bought Pebble Creek “not as a development site and never with any intention to build on the site. We are (course) operators,” said Place.

The club has 73 full members, only 20 of whom are residents of Pebble Creek, he said. The turnout on a recent sunny, 75-degree afternoon illustrated his point. Half of the two dozen parking spots reserved for members sat empty.

“That’s typical,’’ he said.

The course, he said, is operating at a break-even margin and he doesn’t anticipate it being financially viable over the next five years. It didn’t used to be this way. At its peak in the 1990s, the course had 300 members, Place said.

The Pebble Creek Golf Course dates to 1967, back when Bruce B. Downs Boulevard was a twolane road still known as 30th Street. In the ensuing years, luring northern retirees to a golfing lifestyle became a common business model for Florida’s residential developers.

But market oversaturation, younger people preferring other recreational outlets, and developers trying to divest themselves of ongoing course maintenance costs changed the golf landscape.

Man-made lagoons, bicycle and hiking trails, nature preserves and even farm-to-table community gardens in so-called agri-hoods have replaced golf courses as the touted amenities in 21st century subdivisions.

Course operators have more than video games and cycling trails with which to compete — they have each other. There are 20 golf courses in Tampa and 31 more within 20 miles, according to the website golflink.com. Pebble Creek’s location, less than 1.5 miles south of Pasco County, also meant it had to compete for golfers with courses there, including one of Place’s other holdings, Plantation Palms in Land O’ Lakes.

Business at Pebble Creek dropped, Place said, after he bought, refurbished and reopened Plantation Palms in 2016, two years after the previous owners had shut it down.

Place said Pebble Creek needs a new $500,000 irrigation system and it must replace the roof at the banquet hall at a cost of $90,000. This comes just two years after the owners put a new roof on the cart barn and installed new air conditioning and new carpeting and window treatments in the banquet facility.

The expenses have left owners of aging courses in a dilemma. Invest or sell?

When a developer came calling two years ago, Place listened. But the redevelopment plans landed in the rough when soil samples showed high levels of arsenic and dieldrin from insecticide applications, particularly on the greens and tee boxes.

The pitch for the brownfield destination is a chance for a mulligan to advance the redevelopment plans from 13th Floor Homes of south Florida.

About 40 residents attended a Nov. 30 community meeting with none of the speakers voicing support for the plans, attendees said. And the objections continued Dec. 2, during the first of two public hearings before Hillsborough County commissioners.

Pearce said the course should be nominated for historical designation. The state has recognized 53 courses as part of its Florida Historic Golf Trail including the Temple Terrace Golf and Country Club, and the Babe Zaharias, Rocky Point and Rogers Park golf courses in Tampa.

Shane Billings of Cypress Shadow Avenue suggested the county consider buying the land through its environmental land conservation program.

The community push back didn’t go unnoticed by commissioners.

“I am monitoring the issue closely and will support the neighborhood’s interest,” said Commissioner Ken Hagan.

The commission vote on the brownfield application is scheduled for Wednesday after a second public hearing, but the county staff has recommended rejecting the designation because it does not carry the required economic benefits. Closing the course, banquet hall and restaurant would eliminate 36 jobs, while creating six new full-time positions, according to county documents.

Place said previously that the remediation work, including removing up to two feet of soil from the greens and tee boxes, would proceed regardless of the commission’s stance on the brownfield request.

“You can’t take away the fact,” Place said, “that this is contamination and something has to be done about it.”

Contact C.T. Bowen at ctbowen@tampabay.com or 813-435-7306. Follow @CTBowen2.


This was in the Tampa newspapers yesterday.
 
I may be looking for a new home.
 
 

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I had a course 2 miles from me which was very nice. Original owners sold it. New partners went in on it together and they didn't put any profits back into the course. Slowly went down hill. Finally they decided to sell it. They didn't get offered what they wanted. Then went to auction with a reserve. Didnt meet the reserve by 100k and they turned the offer down. One night they came back and sprayed all the greens with vegetation killer to piss off the housing community around the course and brought down the value of houses on the golf course. Then they cut everything into 1 acre plots and are selling it off with no zoning. So now you have nice golf community houses with small prefab houses thrown in. Some people are just plain vendictive ________. you know what I want to say!

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Yesterday, Ace Golf asked for “brownfield” designation so he could get financial relief for the cleanup needed to sell the property to housing developers. Below is the article from the paper...

https://tampabaytimes-fl.newsmemory.com/?publink=10458d35e


The next step to save the course is for “The Friends of Historic Pebble Creek” to file for historic designation. If they are successful, then the property must continue to be run as a golf course. Please note, that there have been several golf course companies that want to buy Pebble Creek and run it as a golf course. However, Ace Golf does not want another owner to compete with his other course, just 10 miles away.




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Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

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1 hour ago, fozcycle said:

Please note, that there have been several golf course companies that want to buy Pebble Creek and run it as a golf course. However, Ace Golf does not want another owner to compete with his other course, just 10 miles away.

That's just a dick move.

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2 hours ago, fozcycle said:

 Please note, that there have been several golf course companies that want to buy Pebble Creek and run it as a golf course. However, Ace Golf does not want another owner to compete with his other course, just 10 miles away.
 

There's the reason, right there!

We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.”

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2 hours ago, fozcycle said:

Yesterday, Ace Golf asked for “brownfield” designation so he could get financial relief for the cleanup needed to sell the property to housing developers. Below is the article from the paper...

https://tampabaytimes-fl.newsmemory.com/?publink=10458d35e


The next step to save the course is for “The Friends of Historic Pebble Creek” to file for historic designation. If they are successful, then the property must continue to be run as a golf course. Please note, that there have been several golf course companies that want to buy Pebble Creek and run it as a golf course. However, Ace Golf does not want another owner to compete with his other course, just 10 miles away. Hope “The Friends of Historic Pebble Creek” win the battle.  




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And now it all becomes clear! The almighty dollar speaks again. Screw a bunch of people over, but still making sure he keeps getting his income from the other course. 

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  • 1 month later...
On 12/17/2020 at 6:02 PM, fozcycle said:

Yesterday, Ace Golf asked for “brownfield” designation so he could get financial relief for the cleanup needed to sell the property to housing developers. It’s a common issue related to evitonmental protection addressed in students papers as you can see here

https://writingbros.com/essay-examples/environmental-issues/


The next step to save the course is for “The Friends of Historic Pebble Creek” to file for historic designation. If they are successful, then the property must continue to be run as a golf course. Please note, that there have been several golf course companies that want to buy Pebble Creek and run it as a golf course. However, Ace Golf does not want another owner to compete with his other course, just 10 miles away.




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The planning of the course must be agreed with the environmental authorities because the golf course is a large project that involves the destruction of ecosystems or local biogeocenoses. It seems to me that your recommendations will help create a correct approach. We must learn from our mistakes

Edited by bobfily
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Last week they were checking the bunkers for pesticides so I told them if they found any, they came in with the new sand they just installed last month.


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Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

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  • 2 months later...

Update, the owner swapped GM’s for all 3 courses and we now have a former Pebble Creek GM.   Scuttlebut has it he is getting ready to retire and will be closing the course when he retires.   We anticipate the owner filing for a zoning change.  The process takes about two to three months which gives the PC property owners time to communicate with their county commissioners regarding the request.  The Friends of Historic Pebble Creek was formed this year to keep it as a golf course.

Currently, the course is dry as a bone with no grass on most tees.  They are short several maintenance staff.....seems it’s easier to get unemployment money than go to work.  They hired 2 new employees but they never showed up for work.

As a result of the course conditions we have lost a bunch of weekly regulars.  

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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19 minutes ago, fozcycle said:

Update, the owner swapped GM’s for all 3 courses and we now have a former Pebble Creek GM.   Scuttlebut has it he is getting ready to retire and will be closing the course when he retires.   We anticipate the owner filing for a zoning change.  The process takes about two to three months which gives the PC property owners time to communicate with their county commissioners regarding the request.  The Friends of Historic Pebble Creek was formed this year to keep it as a golf course.

Currently, the course is dry as a bone with no grass on most tees.  They are short several maintenance staff.....seems it’s easier to get unemployment money than go to work.  They hired 2 new employees but they never showed up for work.

As a result of the course conditions we have lost a bunch of weekly regulars.  

Hate to see things like this happen.

As far as the workers showing u that seems to be a huge problem throughout FL and the US.

Rick

 

 

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4 hours ago, Rickp said:

Hate to see things like this happen.

As far as the workers showing u that seems to be a huge problem throughout FL and the US.

Have the same problems with employees around me too. With the unemployment pay increase from COVID people are making more money staying home. Every store and fast food chain around me is currently short staffed and hiring.   

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On 12/15/2020 at 4:05 PM, fozcycle said:

The environmental request adds a few strokes to a now familiar public debate across the region: The closure of community golf courses amid dwindling interest in the sport decades after developers used putting greens and sand traps as the prime amenity to sell home lots in new neighborhoods.

I'd be surprised that any golf course communities are truly safe from such action/changes in land use.  We are looking to purchase in a Del Webb community that, at least for the foreseeable future, seems safe from such change.  Since the 4 courses are owned by the HOA, it would require a majority vote by the homeowners... don't see that happening in my lifetime. But I know of two golf course communities in WA in which the course was owned by the original developers/land owners and was bulldozed to make more homes.  Lipoma Firs was a really cool, 27 hole course.  Clearly there is more $$$ to be made in housing than golf 😕.

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30 minutes ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Have the same problems with employees around me too. With the unemployment pay increase from COVID people are making more money staying home. Every store and fast food chain around me is currently short staffed and hiring.   

Exactly!!

Rick

 

 

Left Hand, 

Driver; PXG 0311XF Cypher 50 gr Senior  
5 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr       
7 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr      
5 hybrid; Cally Steelhead, Hazardous R2     
Irons; Mizuno JPX 923HM 7-GW Recoil 460 F2
Wedges; Titleist S9 54*, Mizuno SW 56*

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13 minutes ago, fixyurdivot said:

I'd be surprised that any golf course communities are truly safe from such action/changes in land use.  We are looking to purchase in a Del Webb community that, at least for the foreseeable future, seems safe from such change.  Since the 4 courses are owned by the HOA, it would require a majority vote by the homeowners... don't see that happening in my lifetime. But I know of two golf course communities in WA in which the course was owned by the original developers/land owners and was bulldozed to make more homes.  Lipoma Firs was a really cool, 27 hole course.  Clearly there is more $$$ to be made in housing than golf 😕.

I believe that has happened in Myrtle Beach, Deer Track & Island Green come to mind.

I'm sure Big Stu and Grand Stranded remember them and a couple more.

Rick

 

 

Left Hand, 

Driver; PXG 0311XF Cypher 50 gr Senior  
5 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr       
7 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr      
5 hybrid; Cally Steelhead, Hazardous R2     
Irons; Mizuno JPX 923HM 7-GW Recoil 460 F2
Wedges; Titleist S9 54*, Mizuno SW 56*

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2 hours ago, Rickp said:

I believe that has happened in Myrtle Beach, Deer Track & Island Green come to mind.

I'm sure Big Stu and Grand Stranded remember them and a couple more.

Possum Trot,  one of the Wild Wings and Waterway Hills in MB are others.

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1 minute ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Possum Trot,  one of the Wild Wings and Waterway Hills in MB are others.

Yup!!  You got it.  I liked one of the Wild Wings but don’t remember which one.

shot one of my best rounds @ Waterway, even par for 18 with a nasty hangover. Long time ago.

Rick

 

 

Left Hand, 

Driver; PXG 0311XF Cypher 50 gr Senior  
5 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr       
7 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr      
5 hybrid; Cally Steelhead, Hazardous R2     
Irons; Mizuno JPX 923HM 7-GW Recoil 460 F2
Wedges; Titleist S9 54*, Mizuno SW 56*

Putter; Waaay too many to list

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10 minutes ago, Rickp said:

Yup!!  You got it.  I liked one of the Wild Wings but don’t remember which one.

shot one of my best rounds @ Waterway, even par for 18 with a nasty hangover. Long time ago.

Having my clubs on the back of the chair lift going over the Intercoastal Waterway was stressful to saythe least. 

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  • 1 month later...

Demise of Pebble Creek GC.... rumours are that that the owner, Bill Place is going to shutter the club at the end of July.  No filings have been reported for zoning changes, so our guess is the course will be closed.  The best option for the Saturday game is to merge with Plantation Palms GC, just 10 miles away.  The winter drought is now over so we can expect rain on a regular basis.  The greens are much better, they have a driving range and the course is longer.  We will probably lose several players as their drive will be 15 minutes longer, but will gain about a dozen more that are already playing there.

I feel sorry for the homeowners on the course who bought knowing it was a golf community, but, alas, life goes on....

 

This will be the second course shuttered where I played.....Ugh!

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

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You would think with golf interest picking up the courses on the verge of closing would have some second thoughts and try to milk all they can out of the course for a while longer. Over 500,000 people started playing golf in 2020. There were 61 million more rounds played in 2020 than in 2019 which was a 14% increase.  Cha Ching.

:titleist-small: Driver, TSi 1 S Flex

:cobra-small: 3 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex

:cobra-small: 5 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 

:cobra-small: 7 Wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 

:cobra-small: 5 Hybrid King Tec MMT R Flex

:cobra-small: Irons, Tour UST Recoil 95 R Flex (6 - Gap)

:cobra-small: Wedges, Snakebite KBS Hi- Rev2.0 54* & 60*

:cobra-small: Agera 35"

image.png Ultralight 14-way Cart Bag

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2 minutes ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

You would think with golf interest picking up the courses on the verge of closing would have some second thoughts and try to milk all they can out of the course for a while longer. Over 500,000 people started playing golf in 2020. There were 61 million more rounds played in 2020 than in 2019 which was a 14% increase.  Cha Ching.

You are right......Pebble Creek GC has been busy with all areas making money.  The owner is just trying to make some easy money, hoping to eventually get a zoning change and selling to a major developer for big bucks.  He can shutter the course, continue to pay taxes and hope for a better County Commission down the road. The current commission did not take kindly to his trying to get the brownfield designation last year.

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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On 4/28/2021 at 8:24 PM, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Having my clubs on the back of the chair lift going over the Intercoastal Waterway was stressful to saythe least. 

Got that right😱

Rick

 

 

Left Hand, 

Driver; PXG 0311XF Cypher 50 gr Senior  
5 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr       
7 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr      
5 hybrid; Cally Steelhead, Hazardous R2     
Irons; Mizuno JPX 923HM 7-GW Recoil 460 F2
Wedges; Titleist S9 54*, Mizuno SW 56*

Putter; Waaay too many to list

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3 hours ago, fozcycle said:

This will be the second course shuttered where I played.....Ugh!

So, it's your fault then...

In the bag:
Driver: :titelist-small: TSR2 Project X HZRDUS Black 5.5
Fairway: :callaway-small: Apex UW 19° & 21° Project X HZRDUS Smoke RDX Black 5.5

Irons: :mizuno-small: JPX 923 HMP 5-PW UST Mamiya Recoil 95 F4
Wedges: :mizuno-small: T-22 Denim Copper 48°, 52° & 56° UST Mamiya Recoil 95 F4
Putter :Sub70: Sycamore 005 Wide Blade
Bag: 
:Ogio: Alpha Convoy 514
Balls: :callaway-small: Chrome Soft X

Cart: :CaddyTek: CaddyLite ONE Ver. 8


God Bless America🇺🇸, God save the King🇬🇧, God defend New Zealand🇳🇿 and thank Christ for Australia🇦🇺!

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1 hour ago, MattF said:

So, it's your fault then...

Ha Ha….I guess so…..

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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Looks like July 31st will be the last day to play golf at Pebble Creek in New Tampa. The staff are pretty disappointed.  I guess the Saturday Game and the weekly Seniors games will all move to Plantation Palms, located just 10 miles away.  I do not know what the local HOA is going to do to protect their property values.  
 

Plantation Palms GC already has a Saturday game so we will piggyback off them until November then decide how to merge. I use a proprietary formula in excel to identify the top 5 rounds then average the Stableford points.  The other group uses the old +1 point added to the previous week for every +3 points above their quota, if they cash, etc. We will have to vote on which game to go forward.  Merging two 40+ groups will mean a lot of work running the game.

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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19 hours ago, fozcycle said:

Looks like July 31st will be the last day to play golf at Pebble Creek in New Tampa. The staff are pretty disappointed.  I guess the Saturday Game and the weekly Seniors games will all move to Plantation Palms, located just 10 miles away.  I do not know what the local HOA is going to do to protect their property values.  
 

Plantation Palms GC already has a Saturday game so we will piggyback off them until November then decide how to merge. I use a proprietary formula in excel to identify the top 5 rounds then average the Stableford points.  The other group uses the old +1 point added to the previous week for every +3 points above their quota, if they cash, etc. We will have to vote on which game to go forward.  Merging two 40+ groups will mean a lot of work running the game.

got this email today:

 

Dear Members,

 

Pebble Creek Golf Club will close permanently following our last day on July 31st after 54 years of operation.  We sincerely thank you very much for your patronage and friendship.

 

We hope you will continue with us and consider a special offer to transfer your membership to Plantation Palms Golf Club in nearby Land O Lakes -- please see below.

 

My wife and I purchased Pebble Creek in 2005.  At the time, the club was losing money and was in a sad state of disrepair and neglect.  We invested over $2million over the first few years to replace the greens, renovate the course and clubhouse, and to replace aging equipment.  We got into the business solely to run it as a golf club.  It did not occur to us that it would be anything else.

 

The club made its first profit under our ownership in 2008.  It was profitable through 2010, experienced a downturn in 2011 and 2012, made money again from 2013 to 2016, and then has declined steadily since then with losses after capital investment and interest from 2018 to 2020.  Recently, we have had some increase due to covid related outdoor recreation popularity, but not enough to warrant continued operations.

 

Coincidentally, our 2016 renovating and re-opening of Plantation Palms Golf Club just 15 minutes’ drive from Pebble Creek unexpectedly contributed to Pebble Creek’s losses.  Plantation Palm’s proximity, superior layout and new facilities pulled both golf and event customers from Pebble Creek.

 

What success Pebble Creek Golf Club had was largely due to the popularity of Mulligans Pub and the growth and profitability of the banquet business as we expanded our banquet room twice and added the outdoor patio.  Without these ancillary businesses, the golf course would not have survived alone.  Nationally and locally, golf rounds have steadily declined over most of the last 10 years, as younger people turn to other sports, videos and electronics.  Fewer rounds, fewer members and increasing price competition have left less and less money to cover the high fixed costs of maintaining 120+ acres.

 

Even in our surrounding Pebble Creek community, there are just 20 golf club members from the over 1300 homes.  The club cannot survive on this.

 

Additionally, Pebble Creek Golf Club’s finances do not support the ongoing capital investment needed to continue.  The original 54-year old irrigation system is on its last legs and will require $500,000+ to replace.  A $100,000+ clubhouse roof replacement will also be needed.  And, there is also a need to replace over $500,000 in aging maintenance and restaurant equipment.  This is another reason why potential buyers have not stepped up to take over and continue operating as a golf club.

 

Three years ago, a builder asked us to consider selling the club for residential development.  With club finances declining each year and no golf buyers on the horizon, it became clear that this was our best and perhaps only option.  We entered into a contract to sell to the builder, but during preliminary inspections, it was discovered from soil tests that arsenic and other contamination existed from early chemical applications that would require cleanup to meet state-mandated thresholds.  The builder exited the contract.

 

Over the past 9 months, we paid an independent environmental testing firm to do extensive soil testing to determine exactly what cleanup is necessary and what it may cost.  Based on this data, we are working with a new builder that will have us doing the $1M+ soil cleanup to make the property acceptable to state levels and to their satisfaction for safe development.  We have stipulated with the developer that they must work with the community and the Pebble Creek Homeowner’s Associations to design a plan and amenities that provide the most acceptable and mutually beneficial outcome.

 

The next phase is yet to be determined for Pebble Creek Golf Club, but once the golf course is closed, the club will not re-open.  The property’s underlying use is residential and units remain in the original Pebble Creek Community development plan.  If development is approved, it will only be with community concurrence that will limit the number of units, provide for higher-priced single family homes, and add amenities and traffic control features desirable to the community.  

 

This is not what we originally planned for Pebble Creek Golf Club, but it is the most viable solution we know as experienced, long-term golf course operators.  We have enjoyed running the club for over 15 years and have tried to set the stage for the future with a responsible, community-focused builder that will do right for Pebble Creek.

 

Sincerely,

Bill Place and Su Lee

 

 

Special Offer to Current Pebble Creek Members

 

After 4 years of renovation, Plantation Palms is nearly restored to its 4-star Golf Digest rating and was voted 2nd Place (Silver) “Best of the Best” Golf courses by the Tampa Bay Times readership.  Pebble Creek Member Special Offers include:

 

- Full Golf Members – no cart fees through August. No dues increases for a year.

- Cart Lease members – no cart lease charge for August

- Player Development Memberships (PDM) include free walking and $10 cart fee after 1pm. No member dues for Pebble Creek PDM members in August.

- LED Lighted 9-acre driving range with Covershots shaded grass tees. Range Balls are half price for all members.  All Pebble Creek members will receive a free small bucket each visit during August.

- Free Weekly Golf Clinic Saturday Mornings at 9:30am

- Golf Leagues on Wednesday and Friday Nights – Wed Scramble League, Friday Night Quota Points League – just $5 for full golf members and $10 for PDM members. Includes greens fee, cart fee, range ball token and closest to pin prize payout

- 18 Hole Miniature Golf Course – One free round every day in August for member and one guest

- An expanded Mulligans Irish Pub with a large veranda, and a large banquet facility.

 

These offers are valid as stated for members transferring their memberships from Pebble Creek to Plantation Palms by August 1st.  Our Pebble Creek and Plantation Palms Golf staff will be available with membership forms to assist with transfers and to answer any questions you may have.

 

With the 7/31 closing, Pebble Creek charging privileges will be suspended starting on 7/1.  We apologize to those who have loved and played Pebble Creek for so long.  We wish that the golf market was such that this closure would not be necessary.  We hope you will give Plantation Palms a try and give us the opportunity to serve you there.

 

Sincerely,

Bill Place and Su Lee

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open?upn=W3AnzcFit5ixLMXQOtWrs8KMtEJL-2FThis received on the day I won the Saturday Gsme….what a let down.

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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From the Tampa Bay Times today, C.T. Bowen reports....

New Tampa’s Pebble Creek golf course to close

The 54-year-old Pebble Creek Golf Club, once the centerpiece of a burgeoning New Tampa community, is closing next month.

The shutdown is in anticipation of the 150-acre property being converted to residential development. It comes six months after owner Bill Place of Ace Golf unsuccessfully sought a Hillsborough County brownfield designation to help with the cost of cleaning chemical contaminants from the soil.

Place, who purchased the club in 2005, announced the closing, effective July 31, in a letter to club members over the weekend.

In it, he repeated much of the same information he shared with Pebble Creek residents and Hillsborough County officials last year during his brownfield application.

Notably, the 1,300 Pebble Creek homeowners account for just 20 club memberships.

“The club cannot survive on this,” said Place.

There are other financial considerations, as well. The course, clubhouse and restaurant need $1.1 million worth of capital investments including a new irrigation system and clubhouse roof, he said. The planned environmental cleanup carries a $1 million price tag. The club hasn’t been profitable since 2018 and even a pandemic-induced spike in golf rounds didn’t make it worthwhile to remain open.

Fred Pearce, 70, is one of the 20 members residing in Pebble Creek and said he plays three rounds a week.

“I think it’s a death knell to the community — it was built around a golf course that’s been here for 50 years — so it’s a sad day for the community,” said Pearce.

Pearce said he anticipated neighbors’ vocal opposition to the brownfield application would be duplicated when Place applied to rezone the land for residential use.

In December, commissioners rejected Place’s brownfield application after numerous residents objected. They said labeling the land as environmentally damaged would stigmatize the neighborhood and hurt property values.

Place, however, said the remediation work would proceed under state jurisdiction, minus the hoped-for tax credits that would have accompanied the county’s brownfield designation. At the time, the plan called for building up to 300 homes on the property.

Place said then the club had just 73 members down from a high of 300 in the 1990s. It mirrors troubles at other community golf courses facing dwindling interest in the sport decades after developers used golf courses as the prime amenity to sell home lots in new neighborhoods.

Place told the Tampa Bay Times he has not finalized a contract with a home builder but expects to do so within a month. The rezoning process likely would start 90 days later, he said.
 

image.jpeg

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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So sorry, Foz - Plantation Palms is a good track but it’s very hard to leave “home” and all the memories that are buried there. 

Taylor Made Stealth 2 10.5 Diamana S plus 60  Aldila  R flex   - 42.25 inches 

SMT 4 wood bassara R flex, four wood head, 3 wood shaft

Ping G410 7, 9 wood  Alta 65 R flex

Srixon ZX5 MK II  5-GW - UST recoil Dart 65 R flex

India 52,56 (60 pending)  UST recoil 75's R flex  

Evon roll ER 5 32 inches

It's our offseason so auditioning candidates - looking for that right mix of low spin long, more spin around the greens - TBD   

 

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5 hours ago, revkev said:

So sorry, Foz - Plantation Palms is a good track but it’s very hard to leave “home” and all the memories that are buried there. 

Thanks Rev. I have over a dozen years running a Saturday game at Pebble Creek.  We are going to merge with the smaller Saturday game at Plantation Palms.  The course is getting better every day. I’ve been playing there once a week for the past year. 

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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  • 1 month later...

One week until the final round……

DE045A5B-849E-4F92-9A25-5A79C212CB03.jpeg

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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So, some of the members have left and joined a weekday membership at Heritage Isles, about 4 miles west of Pebble Creek.  Some quit and are now playing at Lexington Oaks, about 8 miles north.  The res5 of us have taken the offer from Mr Place and transferred membership to Plantation Palms, about 10 miles northwest.  We get free cart plan ($160) for August and our monthly membership will remain the same as at Pebbl3 Creek for one year.  Currently, the membership at PP is about $30/month higher than PC.

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

Fairways:  image.png.80321f01fc46450b6f428c7daf7b3471.png0211 5W & 7W w/ Evenflo Riptide CB  regular shaft and Tour Edge E521 9W w/Fubuki HD50 regular shaft

Hybrid: None in bag at the moment

IronsTitleist T300 5-PW w/Fubuki MV Senior graphite shafts w/Golf Pride Tour

Wedges: Edison forged 49*, 53* and 57* wedges with KB PGI Senior shafts(80 grm).

Putter: 33” Evnroll ER6R or  ER2 or Bellum Winmore Model 707,   or Nike Method Core Drone  w/Evnroll Gravity Grip

Bag: Vice cart bag(Black/Lime). 

Ball: Snell MTB Prime X, Maxfli Tour/S/X CG, Titleist Pro V1x or Titleist TruFeel

Using Shot Scope X5 and Pinned Rangefinder

 

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