Effortless vs powerful LOOKING swing

[RaginCajun]

Everyone has either played with or seen these two completely different types of players. First, the person who looks like they are taking a practice swing but then watch the ball rocket off of his 7i club face and end up 180+ yards down the fairway. Secondly, the person who takes their backswing then proceeds to swing their club so fast you hear the air tearing and the ball whimper before contact. Both are equally impressive for polar opposite reasons. 

Both swings are mechanically sound, with distance, dispersion, and accuracy all being equal. Which swing would you rather have?

[cnosil]

Both are essentially effective swings that are the same from an impact perspective.

Since I want to play golf for a long time, the one that guarantees no injuries .

Visually I’d prefer the smoother swing. People seem more impressed the Els like swing
Than a Bryson like swing.

[GolfSpy MPR]

Two approaches to swinging it 135mph:

If it takes swinging like Bryson and I can make it work, fine. But I'd much rather do it like Nienaber.

[sirchunksalot]

I'm going to go with the effortless looking swing, I just think the risk of injury is less likely. Plus, there's just something about watching players like Els, Couples, and Nienaber take such a smooth swing and watching the ball rocket off the face. 

[BNewton51]

Since I am not being paid for my play I'll 100% take the swing that will naturally age and stay with me for life!  Everyone wants to hit the ball like some of these pro's but at what cost?  We're all amateurs who practice infrequently and play on average what 1-2 times a week if that for some.  I'll never understand the disconnect in reality that some folks have.  You're just not gonna get it like those cats unless your training every day of the week, hittin balls every day of the week and have some world class eye-hand coordination.  

But, to the point I'd take Nienaber every day of the week personally. 

[GolfSpy BOS]

36 minutes ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

Two approaches to swinging it 135mph:

If it takes swinging like Bryson and I can make it work, fine. But I'd much rather do it like Nienaber.

Count me in the Nienabar "Effortless" group.  That swing looks like it will age very well and lead to fewer injuries.  Not to mention its just more aesthetically pleasing.  Gotta make it look easy when the cart girl is in range.  

 

[RickyBobby_PR]

A Couples, Els, DLIII swing would be nice to have. Bryson’s isn’t one to shy away from.

The swing I want is the one that minimizes my chance of injury thru effective mechanics.

[RaginCajun]

To play devils advocate here, even if risk of injury and longevity were the same no one would want a powerful looking swing? 

Do you think the effortless style is something youre "born with" or players learn to swing like that? 

[GolfSpy BOS]

To play devils advocate here, even if risk of injury and longevity were the same no one would want a powerful looking swing? 
Do you think the effortless style is something youre "born with" or players learn to swing like that? 

Even with injury risk the same I think I like the look of the effortless swing. It does feel like those guys like are born with that perfect flow and rhythm vs guys like Bryson who we know are trying to do different things with their mechanics to optimize results.

It *looks* like the smooth guy would be more consistent day to day, even if that isn’t true.

[fixyurdivot]

Oh effortless for sure... it is WAY, WAY cooler and chicks dig it .

[DPattGolf]

1 hour ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

Two approaches to swinging it 135mph:

If it takes swinging like Bryson and I can make it work, fine. But I'd much rather do it like Nienaber.

One isn't inherently better than the other. One will be great for some players but the opposite will be bad for them.

Now there are 2 big reasons as to why Bryson's swing visually looks more powerful than Wilco's even though the clubhead speed is relatively similar.

1) Bryson has a quicker tempo and transition than Wilco

2) Wilco's finish visually appears to be more controlled

 

While I definitely believe that Bryson could still create the same speed while having a more "effortless" looking swing than he does now, there are definitely a couple of natural advantages that Wilco has over Bryson that makes it easier for him to have that "effortless" looking swing while creating tons of speed.

Now this first part is purely speculation but I highly suspect that Wilco has a wingspan that is greater than his height (like often seen in basketball players). This would allow him to create a much wider swing and the ability to gain speed far easier than Bryson even though they stand only an inch apart in height. Secondly Wilco's hand position at the top of his backswing is quite high and significantly higher than Bryson. Most of the longest hitters in the world have similarly high hands (See DJ and Cameron Champ). This has been a staple component of Professional Long Drivers for years and part of the reason for the huge success seen by both Jamie Sadlowski in the 2000's and Kyle Berkshire right now.  If you look Bryson's Moe Norman style single plane swing makes this very difficult for him to replicate an frankly makes his speed a bit more impressive

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

Give me effortless. And coming from someone that has a “powerful” swing it’s not a long term swing I’ll be able to use in 15 years lol. Effortless, effortless, and effortless please 

[russtopherb]

Effortless 8 days a week. Far easier on the body and something that will work for years.

Frankly, I do not care one bit what my swing looks like. Does it get the ball close to where I want it to? Then that's the swing for me.

[cnosil]

1 hour ago, RaginCajun said:

To play devils advocate here, even if risk of injury and longevity were the same no one would want a powerful looking swing? 

Do you think the effortless style is something youre "born with" or players learn to swing like that? 

If you take everything away except for look,  there really is not difference in the swings.  I think swing mechanics are driven by how your body works so I guess you could say that effortless is something your are "born with" or destined to have. 

[dlow206]

Assuming all other variables are equal including injury risk, I will take the effortless, looks more aesthetic. Again, all other variables equal.

[RaginCajun]

Alright, so not the mixed bag I was hoping for. In almost all other sports its a compliment to be described as strong, powerful, etc... I guess there isnt much room for that in a gentlemans game. 

@DPattGolf brought up a very interesting point. I never thought to look at proportions along with transition speed, but it makes total sense. Maybe a slower/smoother backswing coupled with a slower tempo will give a more effortless look.  

 

[Tom the Golf Nut]

15 minutes ago, RaginCajun said:

Alright, so not the mixed bag I was hoping for. In almost all other sports its a compliment to be described as strong, powerful, etc... I guess there isnt much room for that in a gentlemans game. 

@DPattGolf brought up a very interesting point. I never thought to look at proportions along with transition speed, but it makes total sense. Maybe a slower/smoother backswing coupled with a slower tempo will give a more effortless look.  

 

I was told many years ago to slow down my back swing. He said to me " You don't hit anything on the way back and trying to stop and be in the proper position to start the down swing is much harder" It made complete sense, so I slowed down the back swing all the way to the top and became more accurate. I'm not as slow as Sungjae though!

[TR1PTIK]

Effortless always. I want to play consistent golf and feeling like I have to swing out of my shoes every time is unlikely to provide that. I'd argue that even some "powerful" swingers actually have an effortless swing. Rory and Tiger are good examples - especially current Tiger. While both certainly lash at the ball every so often, for the most part their swings are pretty smooth (especially when viewed in-person). I never realized just how smooth Tiger (and many other tour players swings) are until I saw them firsthand, on the range at the 2018 PGA.

[cnosil]

I was told many years ago to slow down my back swing. He said to me " You don't hit anything on the way back and trying to stop and be in the proper position to start the down swing is much harder" It made complete sense, so I slowed down the back swing all the way to the top and became more accurate. I'm not as slow as Sungjae though!

It is interesting how swing philosophies change. That was what we used to hear....low and slow on the backswing. Seems like with today’s speed and distance focus that the desire is fast back and through.

One of things my instructor has has me doing is swing my wedge extremely fast to try and get about 15 more yards than my normal swing. I asked him what the purpose was and paraphrasing His response was that it helped the sequencing and that it actually improved the normal swing dynamics.

[cnosil]

Effortless always. I want to play consistent golf and feeling like I have to swing out of my shoes every time is unlikely to provide that. I'd argue that even some "powerful" swingers actually have an effortless swing. Rory and Tiger are good examples - especially current Tiger. While both certainly lash at the ball every so often, for the most part their swings are pretty smooth (especially when viewed in-person). I never realized just how smooth Tiger (and many other tour players swings) are until I saw them firsthand, on the range at the 2018 PGA.

Agree 100% the swings look so different in person and are much smoother in person. I wonder how much our perception is influenced by their footwork. Looking at Bryson and long drivers like Kyle Berkshire they put so much energy into their swing that the lower body spins out. I watched some video on Chris Comos Instagram where he had the two of them over to his house and it showed how similar their mechanics are. They showed some overheard shots of Kyle and it is amazing to me how much his left foot moves during the follow through.

[Kenny B]

Bryson's single plane swing is inherently better overall for the body than a silky smooth swing.  Everything turns together on the downswing so there is less stress on the lower back, similar to WLD players.  He built up his body to ensure that his core can handle the stress of his swing speed.  Not all, but many of the smooth effortless looking swing, players have back problems.  When you come down to impact with a squat move at the same time as you post up on your lead leg, it puts the back in a very bad position at impact.  I worry about that in the smaller players that generate a lot of speed.  

[Kenny B]

11 minutes ago, cnosil said:

It is interesting how swing philosophies change. That was what we used to hear....low and slow on the backswing. Seems like with today’s speed and distance focus that the desire is fast back and through.

One of things my instructor has has me doing is swing my wedge extremely fast to try and get about 15 more yards than my normal swing. I asked him what the purpose was and paraphrasing His response was that it helped the sequencing and that it actually improved the normal swing dynamics.

My instructor says the same thing; he said use the 60.

[TR1PTIK]

1 minute ago, cnosil said:

Agree 100% the swings look so different in person and are much smoother in person.

TRULY. The cameras don't just add LBS, they add speed lol!

2 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I wonder how much our perception is influenced by their footwork.

I'm sure quite a bit. Thinking about that specifically, how would you categorize Jordan Spieth's swing?

 

 

[DiscipleofPenick]

I've spent the last 2 years improving Swing A. There's a difference between swinging fast and swinging hard. Keep control, square the ball, and watch it go.

Take Dead Aim

[cnosil]

I'm sure quite a bit. Thinking about that specifically, how would you categorize Jordan Spieth's swing?
 
 

If I look at upper body smooth, but if I focus on feet I would say powerful.

[Kenny B]

10 minutes ago, TR1PTIK said:

TRULY. The cameras don't just add LBS, they add speed lol!

I'm sure quite a bit. Thinking about that specifically, how would you categorize Jordan Spieth's swing?

 

 

Weak and erratic according to the stats, but it's smooth with body turn that doesn't stress the back as much as most other players.  I like the swing; seems he fixed the chicken wing, but needs to get it more under control.

BTW, I picked Spieth to win a tournament this year.

[TR1PTIK]

14 minutes ago, Kenny B said:

Weak and erratic according to the stats, but it's smooth with body turn that doesn't stress the back as much as most other players.  I like the swing; seems he fixed the chicken wing, but needs to get it more under control.

BTW, I picked Spieth to win a tournament this year.

There's no way he doesn't bounce back. I think he shot himself in the foot trying to add some distance, but he has a remarkable amount of talent and athleticism. Hopefully 2021 is the year we see him return to form. Still holding out for Rickie Fowler as well.

[silver & black]

I was a power swinger in my younger days (40 - 55), not so much now. I'm 61 now.  I have transitioned to a smoother swing from back swing to contact. I will say that I have lost distance: very noticeable last season. I need to work on proper contact this coming season. I think I'm already at full extension at contact, which is killing distance.... I think. 

Edited January 9, 2021 by silver & black

[fixyurdivot]

21 hours ago, Tsmithjr9 said:

I've spent the last 2 years improving Swing A. There's a difference between swinging fast and swinging hard. Keep control, square the ball, and watch it go.

Take Dead Aim
 

Agree.  But I must admit that, after having crapped up a drive on a preceding hole, I often "take it out" on the next tee box and just as often crush one down the runway.  Not sure if I'm swinging faster or swinging harder but the result has me thinking I should do it more often .

[DiscipleofPenick]

Agree.  But I must admit that, after having crapped up a drive on a preceding hole, I often "take it out" on the next tee box and just as often crush one down the runway.  Not sure if I'm swinging faster or swinging harder but the result has me thinking I should do it more often .

Harvey Penick said always keep a little in reserve, you never know when you may need it. It's good to be able to go get it when you have to.

Take Dead Aim