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21 hours ago, Micah T said:


I can only think of 2 par 5’s I play regularly that I can’t reach: one is 600+ from the blues and bunkered on both sides from 260-290. The other is 570+ from the tips, and would require me to carry a 4iron 225 over a 50 yard wide pond directly guarding the front of the green. Par is a great score on the former, and birdie is a 50/50 proposition on the latter if you play it as a 3 shot par 5.


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I presume the holes and yardages you refer to are from the longest tees?  I'm guessing you're a pretty long hitter and if that's the case, don't you think you should be reaching par 5's in two more often?  Simply from a distance perspective, it seems to me that amateurs, if choosing the appropriate tee lengths, should be somewhat in line with pro stats for putting eagle attempts.  Is my reasoning off base here? 

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I just dont get home in two often so not many eagles on my resume. I dont hit driver off the tee often these days so thats part of it. #1 hole at my home course I will run one up a few times a year in the summer but have yet to eagle it. Put a new driver in the arsenal and just tonight I changed my grip slightly so Im hoping that helps my squaring up issue. 

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I presume the holes and yardages you refer to are from the longest tees?  I'm guessing you're a pretty long hitter and if that's the case, don't you think you should be reaching par 5's in two more often?  Simply from a distance perspective, it seems to me that amateurs, if choosing the appropriate tee lengths, should be somewhat in line with pro stats for putting eagle attempts.  Is my reasoning off base here? 

I can’t speak for anyone else, but the longer the club, the less accurate I am. So getting on in 2 comes with the possibility of a big miss with a 3 wood or a 3 iron. If I move up, then everything is reachable with a 7 iron or less. But as far as eagle attempts, I’ve had plenty; converting those is another story altogether.


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After thinking about all this I came to realize that if I want to have a possibility of making an eagle I need to play somewhere other than my home course. We have three par 5's. From the white tees they are 470, 472, and 503.  Not to bad for length. (Blue is 493, 506, 538) The issues are in the course design. The first hole hitting through a narrow chute to a medium dog leg left, with a narrow fairway. Hills on the right and left side. The big hill to your left makes the tee shot blind, right side is all trees. Your second shot will be blocked by trees if you are to far right. The green is elevated , long and narrow, and the left side is surrounded by bunkers, right side a big hill with thick rough. This hole is the best opportunity.

The second par five is a very narrow up hill blind drive and you must be able to move the ball to the right. If you don't you are blocked by trees. This forces you to punch a shot over the top of the hill and let it roll down to the bottom. Then you are left with 100 yards and an uphill elevation change of about 20 to 30 feet. If you can fade it, your second shot will be from a down hill lie unless you are a shorter hitter. You will be hitting across a drop in the fairway. If you don't hit it well the ball will go into what we call "the valley of death" The green is tucked behind trees to your right and guarded in the front by two large bunkers. So you have to move the ball to the right twice with precision and distance. (If I ever want to try a ball I haven't played i take a walk into the valley of death and come out with half a dozed balls.) 

The third is just not reachable due to design. You have to drive to the right to avoid the overhanging tall trees, second shot is from a down hill lie back to the left to a very uphill green guarded by a large bunker on the left side. The green is probably 40 plus feet up.  So even if you smoke a drive, your 3 wood from a down hill lie will not have enough elevation to get close to getting up on the green. 

I have birdied them all but only got close to an eagle on the first one a couple of times and the second one only once. Never made them.  Mountain golf is tough. 

 

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I believe that I've chipped in or holed out from the fairway for eagle more times than I've putted for eagle.

Driver: :callaway-small: Rogue ST Max (10.5* set at -1 and neutral) -- Mitsubishi Tensai Blue 55g R shaft

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Reading the comments here by so many that almost never have an eagle chance is making me wonder if I'm an outlier, or maybe my courses are. Most of the courses I play have at least one par 5 that I can reasonably expect to hit the green on occasion, Certainly not always (or even most of the time), but often enough that I expect at least one eagle putt every few rounds. For you guys who want a good shot, may I recommend Circling Hills GC, in Harrison, OH (Cincinnati)? The front has three par 5's, two of which I expect to reach at least one out of three times. (I've never hit the other, though I've tried a couple times.) The back has two par 5's. I've never seen anybody reach the first, but 17 is a 90° dogleg left where, if you can place your drive accurately, you need to hit it between 210 and 230. Shorter and longer is blocked, but hit that sweetspot and you've got 150-170 in to a flat green that's easy to putt.

Moose, my cat, is Siamese

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3 hours ago, Siamese Moose said:

Reading the comments here by so many that almost never have an eagle chance is making me wonder if I'm an outlier, or maybe my courses are. Most of the courses I play have at least one par 5 that I can reasonably expect to hit the green on occasion, Certainly not always (or even most of the time), but often enough that I expect at least one eagle putt every few rounds. For you guys who want a good shot, may I recommend Circling Hills GC, in Harrison, OH (Cincinnati)? The front has three par 5's, two of which I expect to reach at least one out of three times. (I've never hit the other, though I've tried a couple times.) The back has two par 5's. I've never seen anybody reach the first, but 17 is a 90° dogleg left where, if you can place your drive accurately, you need to hit it between 210 and 230. Shorter and longer is blocked, but hit that sweetspot and you've got 150-170 in to a flat green that's easy to putt.

I need to get out more.. Plain and simple....  If I think back I only had opportunities before I moved to TN and joined our club.  Out of 18 holes there are only 2 without elevation changes and they both are par 3's. All 4 par 3's have the same yardage between 165 and 175 from the whites. But due to elevations you wind up using the same club on all four.   I think I just pissed myself off!  I got to get out more...……  I smell a road trip in my future. 

Golf near the mountains has it's challenges. Many an up hill, down hill, side hill lie. The only thing you can count on being flat is your tee shot.

The course designers get creative. There is another course nearby that has what would be a easy reachable par 4 on a straight shot but its designed to be a par 5. The hole looks like the letter "Z". You hit 8 iron to a turn, 9 iron to the next turn, then PW into the green. The trees are very tall and you can't go over them or through them.

Hey its golf! 

 

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So very close yesterday on the 504 yard, #6 at Desert Hills. Driver + 3w left me on the short grass apron to a front flag position and a 15 foot uphill putt for Big Bird.  Ran it past the cup by a foot+, but made the knee knocker.  Very little wind help and hit both woods about as well I as can... so it looks like 500 yard par 5 holes is my limit.

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I can only remember a handful of eagle putts... my only eagle I've made was a fluke (5 wood block that the wind grabbed and it stopped to 2 feet)

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 3/1/2021 at 11:23 AM, Siamese Moose said:

Reading the comments here by so many that almost never have an eagle chance is making me wonder if I'm an outlier, or maybe my courses are. Most of the courses I play have at least one par 5 that I can reasonably expect to hit the green on occasion, Certainly not always (or even most of the time), but often enough that I expect at least one eagle putt every few rounds. For you guys who want a good shot, may I recommend Circling Hills GC, in Harrison, OH (Cincinnati)? The front has three par 5's, two of which I expect to reach at least one out of three times. (I've never hit the other, though I've tried a couple times.) The back has two par 5's. I've never seen anybody reach the first, but 17 is a 90° dogleg left where, if you can place your drive accurately, you need to hit it between 210 and 230. Shorter and longer is blocked, but hit that sweetspot and you've got 150-170 in to a flat green that's easy to putt.

Never played Circling Hills but I’ll have to check it out! 

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I’ve had one on a 230 yard par 4 at an executive course, made the putt, but not sure if that counts


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I hit the ball pretty long off the tee, so if I can play courses at 6900-7200 I will, so I don’t get a lot of eagle chances. When I play with some friends who like the 6400-ish length I’ll get a couple a month on the Par 5s, so it just really depends on the length of the course I’m playing. There are two par 5s on the public course I play that I can easily hit in two when teeing off from the Blue tees.

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I lipped out an eagle putt today....drove the front edge of the green on a short par 4.
Had a 45 foot uphill putt....hit the edge of the cup and got a full 360 power lip out


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On 3/24/2021 at 8:18 PM, PMookie said:

I hit the ball pretty long off the tee, so if I can play courses at 6900-7200 I will, so I don’t get a lot of eagle chances. When I play with some friends who like the 6400-ish length I’ll get a couple a month on the Par 5s, so it just really depends on the length of the course I’m playing. There are two par 5s on the public course I play that I can easily hit in two when teeing off from the Blue tees.

Tee selection is HUGE in this discussion.  There are a few courses I play where I feel the white are too short and blue a little long... particularly under certain wind conditions. Part of my reason for creating the thread was to get a sense of how often folks are getting legit eagle attempts.  I mean looking at the pro's, it seems like they get tons of chances... so why shouldn't we?

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My length definitely helps me get more eagle chances than most. I probably get about a dozen or so eagle putts a month on average. I have have been fortunate to have a couple rounds with multiple eagles and a couple of round with 4 eagle putts. Coolest one definitely has to be that I can say I have hit a 600 yard par 5 in 2 with a driving iron. Granted it was from 3,500+ feet of elevation but I'm taking it!

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After reading @DPattGolf's last comment on elevation it got me thinking. It seems that golf course design and length are to certain standards regardless of elevation.  So an average golfer in Florida at sea level would have to hit roughly two clubs more than someone at 3 or 4 thousand feet above sea level to achieve the same distance. I played a few times in Denver and had to adapt to the elevation. I was a club and a half longer.  Loved the drives but figuring out the club into the green took some getting used to. I actually made a chart based on "for every 1000 feet above sea level you hit 2 percent further".  I used to keep it in my golf bag so I wouldn't have to calculate until I got used to playing there. I know that I would have more eagle opportunities at elevation than at home. Obviously the older you get the less opportunities present themselves as well due to distance loss.

 

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Tee selection is HUGE in this discussion.  There are a few courses I play where I feel the white are too short and blue a little long... particularly under certain wind conditions. Part of my reason for creating the thread was to get a sense of how often folks are getting legit eagle attempts.  I mean looking at the pro's, it seems like they get tons of chances... so why shouldn't we?

One thing I didn’t mention earlier is my propensity to 3 putt once I’m outside of 35 feet; and when I’m on in 2, there’s a good chance I’m outside my 2 putt range. I play from the tips most often, sometimes being back there keeps me from reaching trouble, other times it’s to give my higher handicap buddies a better chance during match play.


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I had a short chip eagle on the #2 par 5 and nearly did the same on #11 at Desert Hills this morning.  I've never had two eagles in a round... dang that would have been fun to card. Both were big drives and 3w second shots.  I would have putted the 3rd shot on #2 but there was a set of sprinklers in my line... good damn thing they were there 🤣.  

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Through six rounds this year I have made 4 eagles so far.  I made 3 of them on par 5s and last Friday holed a wedge on 16 from 127 yards for a deuce.  Now what I will say is that for 2 of the 3 I made on par 5's so far this year the par was just a number on a scorecard and they were really long par 4s where my second shot was 8 iron or less.  The real three was on a longer par 5 that I came into with lumber.  We do a season long Ringer event at my home club and I made eagle on five holes last year alone, two of which were par 4s.  I generally putt well when I have a shot at the big bird.....now the 6 footer to save par is another story.

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  • 1 month later...
On 4/2/2021 at 5:45 PM, Jmikecpa said:

Now what I will say is that for 2 of the 3 I made on par 5's so far this year the par was just a number on a scorecard and they were really long par 4s where my second shot was 8 iron or less. 

There does not seem to be a hard and fast rule on what the minimum yardage is for par 5 designation (471-690 often cited).  This makes sense though as the holes layout; elevation change, slope, hazards, dog-leg, could make a 460 yard hole much harder to reach in two than a wide open 510 yard hole.  To me, if the average distance player can occasionally reach the green with two better than average shots, that makes it a good par 5 layout. 

I've played courses with tees in my normal range (6200-6500) whose par 5's are just not reachable with two better than average shots (typically heavily bunkered or water guarded fronts).  Like the pros, I like having a chance at Big Bird's.

 

 

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