(Evnroll) Sweet Face vs (Cleveland) SOFT

[BADFanBoi Scotty]

I'm curious, does anyone know of any studies on the face technologies of these (And similar) putters?
We could compare the putter tests, but specifically tying the face technologies/ deliberately hitting offline/ off centre etc.

[cnosil]

There have been some;  mostly done by each manufacturer.   The best one that I can't find anymore was a video done by Ping when they had their face  milling.

[azstu324]

I can't say anything about specific data that I've collected, or comparisons to other brands that you've named, but I can definitely confirm that the Cleveland SOFT tech works. As long as the putter face is square, off-center hits seem to still roll true and loss of distance is weirdly minimal.

I've holed 10'+ putts hit off the toe more often than I'd like to admit or deserve. Immediately you get that "damn I hit off the toe" feeling, but the ball seems to roll just like you centered it.

the more I practice, the luckier I seem to get..

[fozcycle]

I have both, an Evnroll ER-6 and a Clevelaland Huntington Beach Soft 11. Never thought about comparing the two. Hmmmm



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Cobra Speedzone Extreme (11.5*) w/ Mitsubishi Tense av Blue Regular; 3W & 5W Cobra King F8 w/ Mitsubishi Tense ck Blue Regular shafts; Tour Edge CBX119 22* Hybrid w/Project X Evenflo Regular shaft; Wilson Staff D-7 5-PW + GW + SW w/UST Mamiya Recoil 460 Regular graphite shafts; Cleveland RTX Zipcore LW(58*) w/DG Spinner shaft. Putter: 33” EVNROLL E6R Bag: Cobra Ultralight Cart bag, Peaccoat Blue.

[Middler]

I've been using Evnroll putters exclusively for several years (ER2 then ER5B) and the face tech works IME. That said, the Cleveland HB Soft putter face tech is the same concept with a different pattern, so I suspect they both handle off center alignment and pace similarly. I'd choose based on other factors between the two but YMMV. I had a Tyne2 and the face tech, similar to Cleveland, is less pronounced and I don't think it was as effective as Evnrolls FWIW. Some of the face tech copiers look to be more window dressing than Evnroll and Cleveland?

[cnosil]

Adding more on the ping test that I saw. What the video showed was that with the groove technology ball speeds in the center were down when compared to non Evnroll type grooves. As the ball missed from the center ball speed increased.

This is because there is less surface at the center of the groove pattern therefore less energy is transferred to the ball as you move toward the toe and heel there is more mass so more ball speed. This causes balls that are hit offcenter to go the same distance as center strikes.

The other aspect of the grooves that is sometimes discussed is line correction. To my knowledge evnroll is the only what I will call
Mainstream company to state this. I think pyramid putters also claims line correction. Since heel and toe hits tend to close and open the face at impact the grooves are supposed to direct
The ball back toward the target line. Other than the two mentioned companies I haven’t seen and independent testing that shows line correction

[Puttingmatt]

I use the evnroll ER2 and the ER5B putters.

These work ,period. YMMV, play what works.

[fozcycle]

So, I have been gaming my E6-R so I benched it for a week and put the Cleveland Huntington Beach Soft 11 in play. My thoughts.....

The HB Soft 11 rolled well, especially on very long putts, often lipping out, leaving me a second putt to finish. The issue I had was I missed on several short putts as well leaving a second tap in.

I used several different setups to putt off the toe, center & heel. They all traveled the same distance.

My EVNROLL E6-R usually gets several one putts per round, sometimes long putts sometimes short. Overall, I am going back to my E6-R as it yields fewer putts per round.


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[Vegan_Golfer_PNW]

So do the millings on Scotty's and Toulon's help with this as well or are those just window dressing and I should just buy a damn SOFT or ER?

[cnosil]

4 minutes ago, rbsiedsc said:

So do the millings on Scotty's and Toulon's help with this as well or are those just window dressing and I should just buy a damn SOFT or ER?

No,  they don't provide any roll correction; they are just a milling pattern and mostly impact feel.   Another option would be the Bobby Grace insert.  

[Vegan_Golfer_PNW]

18 minutes ago, cnosil said:

No,  they don't provide any roll correction; they are just a milling pattern and mostly impact feel.   Another option would be the Bobby Grace insert.  

So you are saying I should buy your ER  

[GolfSpy_BNG]

9 minutes ago, rbsiedsc said:

So you are saying I should buy your ER  

Or mine!

[cnosil]

1 minute ago, rbsiedsc said:

So you are saying I should buy your ER  

The question is what are you trying to accomplish?  If you struggle with off center contact then a putter with groove control can provide some benefit to help even out ball speed.   Some options are Bobby Grace, Cleveland, Older Ping putters with the TR groove face, and EvnRoll.    There are other putters with groove technology that are supposed to provide better roll like TaylorMade, Sik, and Yes!.   Other putters have milling or inserts that are designed to change the feel but don't really have any performance benefit. 

[Vegan_Golfer_PNW]

1 minute ago, cnosil said:

The question is what are you trying to accomplish?  If you struggle with off center contact then a putter with groove control can provide some benefit to help even out ball speed.   Some options are Bobby Grace, Cleveland, Older Ping putters with the TR groove face, and EvnRoll.    There are other putters with groove technology that are supposed to provide better roll like TaylorMade, Sik, and Yes!.   Other putters have milling or inserts that are designed to change the feel but don't really have any performance benefit. 

So I like the milled concept. My old gamer before the Las Vegas was a TM Corza mallet that I did really well with, just wanted to try a milled putter and then got hooked and don't know if i can ever go back to an insert, unless it is the OG White Hot. I don't know if just having a larger grip (currently OS odyssey grip, whereas my TM was SS Slim 3.0) or progressive face technology would help more. Also wanting to try a toe hang style just to see what it would do with my stoke as I feel maybe I adjusted my stroke to be more SB/ST due to the type of putter I use. Basically I am over thinking everything because I don't want to think about the stresses of work right now

[cnosil]

17 minutes ago, rbsiedsc said:

So I like the milled concept. My old gamer before the Las Vegas was a TM Corza mallet that I did really well with, just wanted to try a milled putter and then got hooked and don't know if i can ever go back to an insert, unless it is the OG White Hot. I don't know if just having a larger grip (currently OS odyssey grip, whereas my TM was SS Slim 3.0) or progressive face technology would help more. Also wanting to try a toe hang style just to see what it would do with my stoke as I feel maybe I adjusted my stroke to be more SB/ST due to the type of putter I use. Basically I am over thinking everything because I don't want to think about the stresses of work right now

Sorry about work,  but you are overthinking this....which is ok many of us do.    Milled vs Insert has been an ongoing discussion.  You can make a milled putter fell exactly like an insert by changing the face thickness, deeper grooves, etc.   Why do you say you are hooked on milled putters?    

 

Different putters and designs rotate differently so yes,  the design of the putter can influence the putters rotation through the stroke.  The amount of arc (no such thing as SBST unless you manipulate the stroke) is determined more by setup than anything else. 

 

What are you trying to do or change or fix?     

[Vegan_Golfer_PNW]

7 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Sorry about work,  but you are overthinking this....which is ok many of us do.    Milled vs Insert has been an ongoing discussion.  You can make a milled putter fell exactly like an insert by changing the face thickness, deeper grooves, etc.   Why do you say you are hooked on milled putters?    

 

Different putters and designs rotate differently so yes,  the design of the putter can influence the putters rotation through the stroke.  The amount of arc (no such thing as SBST unless you manipulate the stroke) is determined more by setup than anything else. 

 

What are you trying to do or change or fix?     

I guess i prefer the feel and look of milled putters now. I felt like inserts are cheap or could break whereas a milled putter should be solid. I also feel like i have better distance control.

What i am wanting to fix is just more consistency and cutting down on 3 putts which i know practice would help a lot. I am also a perfectionist due to certain traits about myself and my life, so I don't want to leave any stone un-turned

[dlow206]

9 minutes ago, rbsiedsc said:

I guess i prefer the feel and look of milled putters now. I felt like inserts are cheap or could break whereas a milled putter should be solid. I also feel like i have better distance control.

What i am wanting to fix is just more consistency and cutting down on 3 putts which i know practice would help a lot. I am also a perfectionist due to certain traits about myself and my life, so I don't want to leave any stone un-turned

Be careful with the path you go down on this one, you can get upgraded inserts made of aluminum or copper put in place of the standard insert. Don't ask me why i know this 

https://www.spryevo.com/golf/putter-insert-optimization/

[cnosil]

12 minutes ago, rbsiedsc said:

I guess i prefer the feel and look of milled putters now. I felt like inserts are cheap or could break whereas a milled putter should be solid. I also feel like i have better distance control.

What i am wanting to fix is just more consistency and cutting down on 3 putts which i know practice would help a lot. I am also a perfectionist due to certain traits about myself and my life, so I don't want to leave any stone un-turned

Inserts aren't cheap and hold up very well and will last as long as a milled face.    Inserts are very consistent now and there is no difference between a milled and insert regarding distance control.   Distance control is a tempo/stroke thing.    

So 3 putts is probably a distance control think unless you miss a lot of putts inside 3 feet; which would be a face control issue.   Distance is controlled in a couple of ways;  the first is one length stroke and changing the speed of the stroke to roll the ball a certain distance and the second is changing the length of the stroke with same tempo.    I would recommend the second.     Distance control is a skill that you can only learn by rolling the ball that distance; there are no shortcuts or easier ways.    

Unfortunately, golf isn't about perfection.  It is a sport that you can only control what you can control and you have to manage expectations.  You can hit a putt with the perfect speed on a perfect line and it can still miss.   You can hit a putt off line and with the wrong speed and it can still go in the hole.  

[Vegan_Golfer_PNW]

2 hours ago, cnosil said:

Inserts aren't cheap and hold up very well and will last as long as a milled face.    Inserts are very consistent now and there is no difference between a milled and insert regarding distance control.   Distance control is a tempo/stroke thing.    

So 3 putts is probably a distance control think unless you miss a lot of putts inside 3 feet; which would be a face control issue.   Distance is controlled in a couple of ways;  the first is one length stroke and changing the speed of the stroke to roll the ball a certain distance and the second is changing the length of the stroke with same tempo.    I would recommend the second.     Distance control is a skill that you can only learn by rolling the ball that distance; there are no shortcuts or easier ways.    

Unfortunately, golf isn't about perfection.  It is a sport that you can only control what you can control and you have to manage expectations.  You can hit a putt with the perfect speed on a perfect line and it can still miss.   You can hit a putt off line and with the wrong speed and it can still go in the hole.  

Ya. I feel like I am leaving strokes on the table. 38 putts is way too many. Practice would help. Just need to find the time. 
 

[TR1PTIK]

I don't have a lot of experience to go off of, but I was very interested in the EVNROLL tech and drove to a golf store nearly an hour away more than once just to try them. I couldn't find a single model, grip, or length variation that could match the Scotty Cameron 6m I was gaming at the time - in terms of feel or consistency of strike.

Then I was put in a position where I needed to sell the 6m and find a suitable replacement at a much lower cost. I rolled a few models from Odyssey, Taylormade, Mizuno, and then Cleveland (which hadn't even been on my radar). I won't try to claim it feels as good as my old 6m, but on center strikes it certainly comes close. NOTE: Feel is also highly dependent on putter design and where weight is placed - I experienced this when purchasing the Scotty (different feels between the 6m and 5w for example) and again when selecting the Cleveland HB SOFT I game now.

Verdict is still out on the face technology, but I figured it couldn't hurt. I did however have one putt that seemed to do more than expected recently. Either my perception of strike was way off (doubtful considering how much I work on this specifically), or the tech did it's job because I could have swore that putt came right out of the heel and was immediately calling for the ball to go - I thought it would come up short. Instead I watched it continue to roll end-over-end until it found the bottom of the cup.

That's simply a summary of my experience. Truthfully, as long as you like it and can get the ball in the hole it doesn't matter what putter you use. That's one of the great things about golf!

[cnosil]

Verdict is still out on the face technology, but I figured it couldn't hurt. I did however have one putt that seemed to do more than expected recently. Either my perception of strike was way off (doubtful considering how much I work on this specifically), or the tech did it's job because I could have swore that putt came right out of the heel and was immediately calling for the ball to go - I thought it would come up short. Instead I watched it continue to roll end-over-end until it found the bottom of the cup.

I have experienced the same during most wanted testing and with my own evnroll on the course.

[NRJyzr]

On 3/9/2021 at 7:39 AM, TR1PTIK said:

Verdict is still out on the face technology, but I figured it couldn't hurt. I did however have one putt that seemed to do more than expected recently. Either my perception of strike was way off (doubtful considering how much I work on this specifically), or the tech did it's job because I could have swore that putt came right out of the heel and was immediately calling for the ball to go - I thought it would come up short. Instead I watched it continue to roll end-over-end until it found the bottom of the cup.

 

I've had this happen with my Cleveland Huntington Beach 1, from the initial edition of the HB putters, on a couple occasions.  

I'm not going to complain.

Ironically, I haven't been using it lately, found improvement going to the Snake Eyes head that should be in my sig...