cnosil Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 For the one on the left, if the ball is on the grass, no not a divot.And we differ, I consider it still a divot I’m taking relief. RickyBobby_PR 1 Quote Driver: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven Fairway: TS3 15* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke Hybrids: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype 915H 24* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype Irons: TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite Wedge: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite Putter: TM-180 Testing: Backups: Milled Collection RSX 2, mFGP2, Futura 5W Member: MGS Hitsquad since 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 6 minutes ago, cnosil said: And we differ, I consider it still a divot I’m taking relief. The rules official will tell you that you are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP043 Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 44 minutes ago, LICC said: The embedded ball rule used an illustration. I think it is clear as I stated it. If it has grass and is at fairway level, it is no longer a divot. Did you read the actual words, or just look at the pictures? The words define, the pictures clarify. 20 minutes ago, cnosil said: And we differ, I consider it still a divot I’m taking relief. 13 minutes ago, LICC said: The rules official will tell you that you are wrong. Hahahaha, the one on the lift actually IS a divot, replaced in its hole. Does the grass actually have to be attached to mean it gets no relief, or do replaced divots count? Or maybe some grass clippings would count. BTW, you never answered any of my previous questions, so add this one to the list. HardcoreLooper, RickyBobby_PR, cnosil and 1 other 4 Quote Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnosil Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 29 minutes ago, LICC said: The rules official will tell you that you are wrong. We are talking about changing the rules to get relief from a divot. I consider the one the left to still be a divot since I can clearly see the outline where the grass was replaced. RickyBobby_PR, THEZIPR23 and DaveP043 3 Quote Driver: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven Fairway: TS3 15* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke Hybrids: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype 915H 24* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype Irons: TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite Wedge: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite Putter: TM-180 Testing: Backups: Milled Collection RSX 2, mFGP2, Futura 5W Member: MGS Hitsquad since 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 Grand Canyon sized unrepaired divots... 100%, sand filled or “healed” deal with it. CarlH and Kenny B 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 1 hour ago, DaveP043 said: Did you read the actual words, or just look at the pictures? The words define, the pictures clarify. Hahahaha, the one on the lift actually IS a divot, replaced in its hole. Does the grass actually have to be attached to mean it gets no relief, or do replaced divots count? Or maybe some grass clippings would count. BTW, you never answered any of my previous questions, so add this one to the list. I'll let the record show that you don't know what is or isn't a divot. I answered your questions. Multiple times. You just want to ignore the answer. Chip Strokes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GolfSpy_BNG Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 Sure seems like this place is becoming awfully argumentative and combative. It should be simple. When playing for fun play however you want. When posting scores for tournaments or handicap follow THIER rules because it is THIER tourney or handicap. And this goes for the double penalty thread as well. This ERA of “This doesn’t suit me or what I think so it needs to change” is getting out of hand. downlowkey, CarlH, DaveP043 and 4 others 7 Quote What is in my Sun Mountain C-130 bag or Jones MyGolfSpy bag Driver: Dark speed LS 8* set to -1.5* with an Attas Daaas 4x shaft @ 45” Fairway: F85 3 wood with a XPhplexx Agera X @ 42.5” F85 5 wood with a UST Elements Chrome 7F5 @ 41.5" Driving Iron: Rapture 2-Iron Irons: SMS Pros 4-PW with Steelfiber I95s Wedges: SMS 50* T grind with Steelfiber i110s Glide 4.0 46* zz wedge shaft Glide 4.0 E grind 54* zz wedge shaft Putters: Mezz.1 34” 69* lie EV5.1 black 33.5” 69* lie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THEZIPR23 Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 3 minutes ago, blackngold_blood said: Sure seems like this place is becoming awfully argumentative and combative. It should be simple. When playing for fun play however you want. When posting scores for tournaments or handicap follow THIER rules because it is THIER tourney or handicap. And this goes for the double penalty thread as well. This ERA of “This doesn’t suit me or what I think so it needs to change” is getting out of hand. But I don't want to have to hole every putt. Can we change that rule? GolfSpy_BNG, cnosil, fixyurdivot and 1 other 1 3 Quote Stealth 2+ 9 (Diamana PD 60 S 45") Stealth 2+ 15 (Diamana PD 70 S 43") G425 19 (Raijin 2.0 85x) G425 22 (Raijin 2.0 85x) ZX7 5-9 (KBS C Taper S) Vokey SM9 45 10 F (KBS 610) Vokey SM9 49 08 F (KBS 610) Vokey SM9 55 08 M (KBS 610) Vokey SM9 59 04 T (KBS 610) Spider GT Splitback 34" ProV1 #23 Twitter @THEZIPR23 "One thing Golf has taught me, is that my muscles have no memory." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GolfSpy_BNG Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 5 minutes ago, THEZIPR23 said: But I don't want to have to hole every putt. Can we change that rule? Nope. I’m not budging on this one! fixyurdivot and THEZIPR23 2 Quote What is in my Sun Mountain C-130 bag or Jones MyGolfSpy bag Driver: Dark speed LS 8* set to -1.5* with an Attas Daaas 4x shaft @ 45” Fairway: F85 3 wood with a XPhplexx Agera X @ 42.5” F85 5 wood with a UST Elements Chrome 7F5 @ 41.5" Driving Iron: Rapture 2-Iron Irons: SMS Pros 4-PW with Steelfiber I95s Wedges: SMS 50* T grind with Steelfiber i110s Glide 4.0 46* zz wedge shaft Glide 4.0 E grind 54* zz wedge shaft Putters: Mezz.1 34” 69* lie EV5.1 black 33.5” 69* lie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlH Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 2 hours ago, THEZIPR23 said: But I don't want to have to hole every putt. Can we change that rule? pick it up...it's a gimme fixyurdivot 1 Quote Driver: Rogue ST Max (10.5* set at -1 and neutral) -- Mitsubishi Tensai Blue 55g R shaft Fairway: Rogue ST Max 3 wood (16.5*) and Heaven Wood (20*)-- Tensai Blue 55g R shaft Hybrids: Rogue ST Max 5H (23*)--Tensai Blue 55g R shaft Irons: Apex CF19 6-9, PW, AW -- KBS Tour Graphite TGI 70 shafts R +1/2 inch 3* upright Wedges: Edison 53* and 57* KBS PGI 80 Graphite +1/2 inch 2* upright Putter: L.A.B. DF 2.1 -- BGT Stability shaft Ball: Maxfli TourX...Golf Bag: Pioneer...Shoes: Hyperflex... Glove: Red Rooster Feather My Photography can be seen at Smugmug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 3 hours ago, Shankster said: Grand Canyon sized unrepaired divots... 100%, sand filled or “healed” deal with it. I was being a touch sarcastic gents. In all reality, I only remember being in a divot 3 times in recent years. They were all like 1” deep... tried to hit the first one, topped the heck our of it. The other two... I moved them out of the divot , luckily I don’t keep an official handicap, nor play on tour. So to improve my enjoyment... I made my own “local rule” to whatever cart number I wa driving that day. Kenny B, cnosil, GolfSpy_BNG and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HardcoreLooper Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 How can I feel happy about undeserved good breaks when I won't accept undeserved bad breaks? @PMookie had it right about hitting a tree and bouncing back into play. How can I explain to our First Tee participants that hitting a good tee shot into a divot teaches you perseverance if the rules let you move it? cnosil, PMookie and downlowkey 3 Quote What's in the bag: Driver - F8 - Aldila NV Blue 60 ( S ) 3 Wood (13.5*) - 980F 4 Wood (18*) - F8 - Aldila NV Blue 60 ( S ) 3 Hybrid (19*) - RBZ 4i - PW - D7 Forged - Recoil 760 ( S ) 52* - CBX 58* - CBX Full Face 2 Putter - Craz-e Bag - 2.5 (Blue) Ball - AVX Instagram - @hardcorelooper Twitter - @meovino Facebook - mike.eovino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom the Golf Nut Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 If everyone did what they were supposed to do there wouldn't be an issue. Fix your pitch mark on the green Rake the bunker after you hit out, which includes your foot prints on the way out. Fill you divots in the fairway. Nothing is more irritating than people not leaving the course in good condition for the next player. I feel that the architect designed and built the course to be played the way he intended it. Im sure it wasnt intended to play across indentations in the green, foot prints in the bunker, or deep divots in the fairway. If everyone fixed these things as they play, we wouldn't feel the need to try to change the rules. sirchunksalot, Kenny B and cnosil 3 Quote Driver, TSi 1 S Flex 3 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 5 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 7 Wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 5 Hybrid King Tec MMT R Flex Irons, Tour UST Recoil 95 R Flex (6 - Gap) Wedges, Snakebite KBS Hi- Rev2.0 54* & 60* Agera 35" Ultralight 14-way Cart Bag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny B Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 42 minutes ago, Tom the Golf Nut said: If everyone did what they were supposed to do there wouldn't be an issue. Fix your pitch mark on the green Rake the bunker after you hit out, which includes your foot prints on the way out. Fill you divots in the fairway. Nothing is more irritating than people not leaving the course in good condition for the next player. I feel that the architect designed and built the course to be played the way he intended it. Im sure it wasnt intended to play across indentations in the green, foot prints in the bunker, or deep divots in the fairway. If everyone fixed these things as they play, we wouldn't feel the need to try to change the rules. That's all well and good, and probably has a better chance of happening at a private club where the pro can talk to the members; possibly withholding some playing rights if they don't comply. Playing at a muni, where people don't respect the carts, let alone the course, it will never happen. Some of the worst offenders are the Men's club; they are lazy. Following them first thing in the morning, I could hold up people behind me fixing all the ball marks. They just don't care; only fix a ball mark if it interferes with their putt. AND for a year, we have no rakes for the bunkers, and no sand bottles for divots. I don't see that changing this year. If people don't see equipment to take care of the course now, they are less likely to repair it in the future. JMO. cnosil 1 Quote “We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanoito Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 On 3/27/2021 at 12:58 AM, Shankster said: I was being a touch sarcastic gents. In all reality, I only remember being in a divot 3 times in recent years. They were all like 1” deep... tried to hit the first one, topped the heck our of it. The other two... I moved them out of the divot , luckily I don’t keep an official handicap, nor play on tour. So to improve my enjoyment... I made my own “local rule” to whatever cart number I wa driving that day. Same for me, dude. If memory serves me correctly, I haven't been in a divot more than 3 times in my 10 years of golf. That's probably cause I don't hit the fairways too often, so it's luxury problem you guys are having. HardcoreLooper, Tarheelvolvo and CarlH 3 Quote SpeedZone 9* w/ Aldila Rogue Silver 60 S X2 Hot 3 Deep 14.5* w/ Aldila Tour Green 75 S JetSpeed 5W 19* w/ Matrix Velox T 69 S OR Super LS 3H 19* w/ Kuro Kage Black 80 S JPX919 Forged 4-PW w/ Modus3 105 S Vokey SM7 50/08F, 54/14F & 58/08M w/ Modus3 115 Wedge ER1 34" w/ SuperStroke Fatso 2.0 Pro / H2NO Lite Cart Bag / 3.0 / NX7 Pro LRF My reviews: MLA Putter // Titleist SM7 // PING i500 // PuttOUT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brinkie Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 On 3/8/2021 at 10:26 AM, StrokerAce said: Not a fan of Paige really, but she could be on to something here: What do you think? Did Westwood catch a bad break after hitting a great drive on 18? Not sure about you guys, but when I'm not playing in a match I definitely move it out of any fairway "holes" when I find one. (And I say holes because these are rarely smooth and clean sand-filled divots LOL) First off how can you not be a fan of Paige!? Now that we have that out of the way....I totally agree with the divot rule, how/why should it be different than a sprinkler head or drain cover. Might as well include being able to clean mud balls as well. Quote Golf without a cigar has not been a good use of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 20 hours ago, Brinkie said: First off how can you not be a fan of Paige!? Now that we have that out of the way....I totally agree with the divot rule, how/why should it be different than a sprinkler head or drain cover. Might as well include being able to clean mud balls as well. You get free relief if your ball is on a sprinkler head or drain cover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brinkie Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 22 hours ago, LICC said: You get free relief if your ball is on a sprinkler head or drain cover. I know......That is my point. Why should a divot in the fairway treated differently LICC 1 Quote Golf without a cigar has not been a good use of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnosil Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 I know......That is my point. Why should a divot in the fairway treated differentlyAgree, let’s get rid of sprinklers and drains and play the game like golfs forefathers. You know follow the spirit of the game and get rid of these finely manicured courses. DaveP043 1 Quote Driver: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven Fairway: TS3 15* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke Hybrids: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype 915H 24* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype Irons: TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite Wedge: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite Putter: TM-180 Testing: Backups: Milled Collection RSX 2, mFGP2, Futura 5W Member: MGS Hitsquad since 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 31 minutes ago, cnosil said: Agree, let’s get rid of sprinklers and drains and play the game like golfs forefathers. You know follow the spirit of the game and get rid of these finely manicured courses. That actually has been the trend in golf course architecture for the last 25 years. Going to a more naturalistic and less manicured look. 57 minutes ago, Brinkie said: I know......That is my point. Why should a divot in the fairway treated differently This is 100% correct. Not allowing relief from a divot is illogical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom the Golf Nut Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 32 minutes ago, cnosil said: Agree, let’s get rid of sprinklers and drains and play the game like golfs forefathers. You know follow the spirit of the game and get rid of these finely manicured courses. I'm not sure I can build a pile of sand high enough for my tee shot! cnosil 1 Quote Driver, TSi 1 S Flex 3 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 5 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 7 Wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 5 Hybrid King Tec MMT R Flex Irons, Tour UST Recoil 95 R Flex (6 - Gap) Wedges, Snakebite KBS Hi- Rev2.0 54* & 60* Agera 35" Ultralight 14-way Cart Bag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP043 Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Brinkie said: I know......That is my point. Why should a divot in the fairway treated differently Divots occurred naturally on golf courses even before there WERE rules, they have always been considered a natural and normal part of the challenge of golf. Obstructions (which are defined in the rules as being artificial) occurred later, generally speaking, and the Rules were adapted to address these "new" issues on the course. cnosil 1 Quote Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnosil Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 That actually has been the trend in golf course architecture for the last 25 years. Going to a more naturalistic and less manicured look. Could be if you look at courses like Brandon. But looking at other courses with 100 yard wide fairways and bulldozer created structures seems to say the opposite. The trend seems to be sustainability of a course meaning fewer bunkers, more unkept areas, and shorter less landmass courses. That said, I would guess they still water and keep the fairways pretty immaculate. My intended joke was to get rid of irrigation and drainage; which isn’t going to happen, and just play in the fields like when golf started. Quote Driver: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven Fairway: TS3 15* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke Hybrids: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype 915H 24* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype Irons: TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite Wedge: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite Putter: TM-180 Testing: Backups: Milled Collection RSX 2, mFGP2, Futura 5W Member: MGS Hitsquad since 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP043 Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 4 minutes ago, cnosil said: My intended joke was to get rid of irrigation and drainage; which isn’t going to happen, and just play in the fields like when golf started. You need to explain jokes to some people. cnosil, GolfSpy_BNG and THEZIPR23 3 Quote Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnosil Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 I'm not sure I can build a pile of sand high enough for my tee shot! Watch Laura Davies, she has a good process for making a tee Quote Driver: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven Fairway: TS3 15* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke Hybrids: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype 915H 24* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype Irons: TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite Wedge: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite Putter: TM-180 Testing: Backups: Milled Collection RSX 2, mFGP2, Futura 5W Member: MGS Hitsquad since 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 54 minutes ago, cnosil said: Could be if you look at courses like Brandon. But looking at other courses with 100 yard wide fairways and bulldozer created structures seems to say the opposite. The trend seems to be sustainability of a course meaning fewer bunkers, more unkept areas, and shorter less landmass courses. That said, I would guess they still water and keep the fairways pretty immaculate. My intended joke was to get rid of irrigation and drainage; which isn’t going to happen, and just play in the fields like when golf started. Using a bulldozer or not, or the number of bunkers, has nothing to do with it. The predominant trend has been for a naturalistic and not manicured look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlH Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 2 hours ago, Brinkie said: I know......That is my point. Why should a divot in the fairway treated differently Because sprinkler heads and drain covers are immovable obstructions as defined by the rules. A divot is not. Quote Driver: Rogue ST Max (10.5* set at -1 and neutral) -- Mitsubishi Tensai Blue 55g R shaft Fairway: Rogue ST Max 3 wood (16.5*) and Heaven Wood (20*)-- Tensai Blue 55g R shaft Hybrids: Rogue ST Max 5H (23*)--Tensai Blue 55g R shaft Irons: Apex CF19 6-9, PW, AW -- KBS Tour Graphite TGI 70 shafts R +1/2 inch 3* upright Wedges: Edison 53* and 57* KBS PGI 80 Graphite +1/2 inch 2* upright Putter: L.A.B. DF 2.1 -- BGT Stability shaft Ball: Maxfli TourX...Golf Bag: Pioneer...Shoes: Hyperflex... Glove: Red Rooster Feather My Photography can be seen at Smugmug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brinkie Posted April 24, 2021 Share Posted April 24, 2021 20 hours ago, CarlH said: Because sprinkler heads and drain covers are immovable obstructions as defined by the rules. A divot is not. Thanks, I know the rules. If you could move a divot then your argument may be valid. LICC 1 Quote Golf without a cigar has not been a good use of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brinkie Posted April 24, 2021 Share Posted April 24, 2021 21 hours ago, DaveP043 said: Divots occurred naturally on golf courses even before there WERE rules, they have always been considered a natural and normal part of the challenge of golf. Obstructions (which are defined in the rules as being artificial) occurred later, generally speaking, and the Rules were adapted to address these "new" issues on the course. I guess everyone is missing my point. If you stripe a drive down the middle of the fairway and land in a divot 275 yards away that cannot be seen from the tee, why should you be punished for that when someone else in the group can drive it into another fairway and find a perfect lie and line because it's an area others haven't hit from frequently LICC 1 Quote Golf without a cigar has not been a good use of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted April 24, 2021 Share Posted April 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Brinkie said: I guess everyone is missing my point. If you stripe a drive down the middle of the fairway and land in a divot 275 yards away that cannot be seen from the tee, why should you be punished for that when someone else in the group can drive it into another fairway and find a perfect lie and line because it's an area others haven't hit from frequently There is no good reason to fail to give a free drop out of the divot. If a maintenance worker put the same hole in the fairway, it would be ground under repair and a free drop. Brinkie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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