Jump to content
TESTERS WANTED! ×

Recoil v Steelfiber v MMT iron shafts?


Middler

Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, yungkory said:

Interesting that people feel the steelfibers are boardy. I'm usually really sensitive to stout shafts because I'm weaksauce, but I didn't find the i95 S to feel harsh. They felt very similar to the Modus 105S that I've been gaming for the last 7 years or so. I didn't expect the steelfibers to fit me best after what everyone said about them.

Can't wait till the new sticks get here!!

Those were the i95 S parallel tip right (the Private Reserve)? Usually the boardy comment is in regard to the i95 CW. 

Follow my golf journey to break into the 80s

Tester for the Titleist TSi Driver

Spring 2020 MGS Tester for the Fujikura Motore X Shaft

Updated 07/15/2022
Driver:callaway-small: Rogue St Max LS - Autoflex
Fairway Woods:callaway-small: Rogue Max St 3HL and 7 Wood
Irons:mizuno-small: JPX 921 Hot Metal 5 to AW - Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Stiff parallel tip
Wedges:ping-small: Glide 4.0 54 and 58
Putter:  :ping-small: PLD Custom Kushin 4

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been playing recoil shafts for a few years now, and while I can't do a personal comparison to this others I can say that switching from the s300 shafts that came in my Mizuno irons to the recoil shafts was a great change for me. I love the feel and launch. I wasn't looking for more distance, and sure to some recent physical limitations I won't be chasing distance any time soon, do it all comes down to the feel, launch, and as you seem to be looking for, the effect on joints and tendons. I love me recoils. 

P-Dru

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I recently switched from Recoil 90's to Aerotech Steel Fiber FC 80's when I purchased new irons and am very pleased with them.  I'm an 18 handicap using game improvement irons.  Can't say how much of it is do to the shafts as opposed to the irons themselves (both sets are Callaway oversized).  The differences are not enormous, but positive.  And as a 72-year-old high handicapper, I certainly don't find the Aerotech's too "stout" or at all difficult to swing.

I also switched to graphite shafts around age 60, when I started having wrist and elbow issues.  I think they've helped a lot.   Good luck.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, chisag said:

 

... Oh Boy, they most assuredly do not. Lots of research regarding this false claim. When I had my first serious bout of tendonitis I tried all the inserts including Sensicore and while the feel was more dampened the shock to my elbow was not. First time I switched to graphite in my irons (frowned upon at that time) but it made all the difference for my tendonitis and have not had an issue until playing my MIM's with Nippon 950GH shafts and the tendonitis came back. Installed Steelfiber 95's and it disappeared again.  

I have been hitting the Steelfiber shafts for about 6 weeks now. Not having any issues with wrist or elbow pain anymore and they are just as long and accurate as steel. Speaking for me - I Love Them!

Driver: :titelist-small: TSI3 - 10*, Hzrdus Smoke 6.0 Stiff

Driver: :taylormade-small: Stealth Plus - 10.5*, Oban Kiyoshi Purple O4Flex-65 Grams Purred
3 Wood: :taylormade-small: SIM - 15*, Graphite Design Tour AD DJ5 Stiff
Hybrid: :titelist-small: TS3 - 19*, Hzrdus Smoke 6.0 Stiff
Irons: :titelist-small:  5 - PW T150, with Nippon Zelos 7 Reg, 4 iron - U505 with Project X HZRDUS Black Stiff

Wedges: :titelist-small: Vokey SM 8 - 50*, 60* Standard Wedge Shafts

Wedge: :taylormade-small: Milled Grind 3 MG3 56* S200 shaft

Putter:  :scotty-cameron-1: Studio Select Newport 1.5        
Putter:  :scotty-cameron-1: Phantom X 5.5
Ball: :titelist-small: Pro V1x

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’ve tried all 3 shafts in various weights:

Steelfiber 95S.  Hated it!

MMT 105TX. Liked, but not great!

Recoil 110 F4 Prototype was hands down best of the bunch for me!   Dispersion was very good.  Best launch numbers, an smooth feel 

I was fitted at a local country club an Recoil wasn’t in the top 10 shafts recommended for my swing!   
 

I went thru 3 sets of irons w the top 3 shafts, recommended at my fitting.  None of them just felt right!     An then reshafted an old set of irons w the Recoils!   Winner! Winner!   Cost me a few Grand to figure it out.   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I had my set of Mizuno Jpx921 hot metals built last year with the Aerotech steelfiber i80 shafts r flex. And they are the most accurate irons I’ve ever had. Both in distance consistency and dispersion. I tried a few other shafts one of which was the Mitsubishi but I kept going back to the Aerotech. They were the closest feel to steel that I tried while still giving me some vibration dampening for my elbows and hands. I have to also say that after hitting roughly 100+ balls at the range and another 150+ short game shots on average two to three days a week I still feel the effects on my elbows just not quite as bad as when I had my steel shafted clubs. I did pay extra to have them pured, not sure if it made a difference or not, but I figured I was already spending the money to custom fit my clubs so why not spend a little more for that.
If it helps, (7i=170) and I’m a 6hdc. 

Edited by KenBender

:callaway-small:Epic Max LS 9* ACCRA TZ6

:callaway-small:Epic Speed 3w ACCRA FX

:cobra-small:3H ACCRA FX

:mizuno-small: JPX 921 4-pw Aerotech 

:vokey-small:50,55,60 

:cameron-small: Phantom X 11.5 putter

:titelist-small: prov1

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, dlow206 said:

Those were the i95 S parallel tip right (the Private Reserve)? Usually the boardy comment is in regard to the i95 CW. 

I guess so? I don't know the difference honestly I'm a graphite noob! I swear they accentuate the Mizuno butter tho, probably the reduction in vibration. It's kinda addicting.

Driver: :callaway-small: Rogue ST Max LS Tensei AV Blue S

3w/5w: :titelist-small: TSi2 Tensei AV Raw Blue S

4h: :mizuno-small: CLK 22* Hybrid Tensei CK Pro Blue 80HY S

Irons 5-PW: :mizuno-small: 223 Steelfiber PR 95 S

Wedges: :cleveland-small: RTX Zipcore Tour Rack 50, 54, 58 Steelfiber PR 105

Putter: LAB Link.1

Ball: :srixon-small: Z-Star Diamond

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Similar story to many listed above - I went to graphite shafts in irons not expecting to necessarily improve my game, but due to wrist issues. I've been using graphite for over 2 years now (and through 2 sets of irons), and my wrist issues have disappeared!

During my last fitting I tested the 3 shafts listed and a KBS graphite shaft in TM irons. The Recoil 660 was my shaft in my last set of irons, and I loved them, so wanted to try them in the new irons during the fitting.

I did not like the Steelfiber or the KBS at all - for me, I couldn't get a decent launch angle, and both dispersion and distance were poor. There was no feel for me - it always felt like a mishit, even when it was dead center.

The Recoil felt good, ball flight was similar to my old irons with a little added length.

The fitter then put in this wondrous shaft called the MMT that I had not even heard of until then. The feel was incredible - I could tell exactly where I hit on the face and the club just felt smooth throughout the swing with a butter strike. More importantly, my dispersion tightened up considerably and I gained 7-10 yards per club. My ball flight gained a little height as well, so I find that not only do I hit it longer, but I have more stopping power on the greens.

I think the Recoil is the best looking of the four, but for me the MMT was by far the best performing. 

I also ordered my wedges with the same shaft, and I love them!

Edited by lrvalley

WITB: Callaway Epic Max LS, SimTI Rocket 3W, Cobra Speedzone 4W, 3H-5H, Cobra Forged Tec One Length irons, PXG Wedges, Odyssey Stroke Lab Armlock putter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Middler, I’m a PGA professional that has been playing graphite shafts throughout my bag for 30+ years. The graphite on the market now is fantastic, in fact there are many players on tour using graphite because the torsional resistance can be made greater than steel if desired. There’s an optimum blend of flex and torsional resistance. I can tell you from experience I prefer Recoil over Steel Fiber as it has much more feel and better playing characteristics. I know Steel Fiber is popular on Tour, but in my experience the shaft just feels hard and unresponsive. Just my two cents worth.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is interesting reading everyone say steelfibers are stout. 
 

I have been playing the i125cw in x flex and actually find them pretty smooth.. 

 

 

Driver: Callaway Paradym Triple diamond 10.5 Ventus black TR 6x

3 wood ; Callaway Paradym triple diamond 15 degree, Ventus black TR 7x

Apex UW 19 degree, Ventus black TR 8x

Utility Iron: Mizuno Pro Fli Hi 4 utility, Ventus blue HB 90X

Irons: Callaway Apex MB 5-PW, KBS $ taper 130x

Wedges: Callaway Jaws Raw 50, 54, 58, KBS $ taper 130x

Putter: Wilson Staff TM22, hand torched, KBS cutter putter shaft, Super stroke Pistol GT 1.0

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/15/2021 at 3:37 PM, Middler said:

I plan to reshaft my irons with graphite, I’ve never had anything but steel but my joints just can’t take it anymore. I have TT XP95 S300 shafts now (fitted in 2018), so I assume a graphite shaft of about the same weight would be a good starting point if not a good substitute, though regular flex as I’m not getting younger or faster. After a bad $450+ experience with a driver fitting and a totally ridiculous quote for new JPX921F’s with MMT shafts from CC - I’m not going there again anytime soon. I’m leaning toward just going to GG and seeing what the latest Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D recommends, guessing it will be the UST and Aerotech shafts below, but that won’t permit me to try MMT’s. The ones I’m looking at are all similar weights, regular flex and mid launch.
I’m doing this to:

  1. reduce impact in my joints first and foremost,
  2. I certainly don’t want dispersion to increase (at least as good), 
  3. but I don’t care at all about extra distance.
  • UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$45ea

  • Mitsubishi MMT Iron 80 Regular (84g) @$60ea
  • Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$51ea

Any insights into the differences between the three? Again, I realize many will suggest a full blown fitter, but that’s an expensive crapshoot IME unless your swing is reasonably repeatable AND you’ve already narrowed the contenders substantially.

I went with the Recoil Dart, both shafts worked pretty good but I found I could work the ball a little better with the Recoil

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have Steelfiber i80s in R flex in a set of MP-53's, and Recoils (also R flex) in a set of Ping i-90's. The Recoils are a little soft for my liking, nothing horrrible and yes workability is good. If my timing is off I feel less confident with the Recoils though. The Steelfibers on the other hand are wonderous, much less harsh than any steel I've used, always feel like I'm in control. Also workable, or should I say did not diminish the workability of the MP-53s. I was concerned to go to R flex but the control is there. I had the MP-53s bent 1° stong but that's really due to the weak nominal angles vs. "modern" iron numbers.

I only use Winn Dri-Tac Wrap mid-size type grips, they will save your hands if you have issues, which I do. They don't last as long as other grips, I seem to replace the most heavily used ~once per year. But, you can't replace your hands now can you! 

the MMTs look interesting, they would have to be very good to move me off of Steelfibers though.

Edited by footwedge
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/15/2021 at 12:37 PM, Middler said:

I plan to reshaft my irons with graphite, I’ve never had anything but steel but my joints just can’t take it anymore. I have TT XP95 S300 shafts now (fitted in 2018), so I assume a graphite shaft of about the same weight would be a good starting point if not a good substitute, though regular flex as I’m not getting younger or faster. After a bad $450+ experience with a driver fitting and a totally ridiculous quote for new JPX921F’s with MMT shafts from CC - I’m not going there again anytime soon. I’m leaning toward just going to GG and seeing what the latest Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D recommends, guessing it will be the UST and Aerotech shafts below, but that won’t permit me to try MMT’s. The ones I’m looking at are all similar weights, regular flex and mid launch.
I’m doing this to:

  1. reduce impact in my joints first and foremost,
  2. I certainly don’t want dispersion to increase (at least as good), 
  3. but I don’t care at all about extra distance.
  • UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$45ea

  • Mitsubishi MMT Iron 80 Regular (84g) @$60ea
  • Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$51ea

Any insights into the differences between the three? Again, I realize many will suggest a full blown fitter, but that’s an expensive crapshoot IME unless your swing is reasonably repeatable AND you’ve already narrowed the contenders substantially.

I have PXG Gen 2 irons with the Aerotech Steelfiber shafts.  I replaced those recently with the MMT when I upgraded to Gen 5 irons.  I love the MMT shafts and can definitely feel the lighter weight.  Not that I didn't like to Steelfiber shafts and had originally planned to use them on my Gen 5 irons until I tried both side by side.  You won't go wrong with either, but I would recommend the MMT.  I am 66 years old and play to an 8 handicap.

PXG clubs and Ping putter

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I first tried steelfiber 105's in my Apex16.  Just wanted to avoid the stress on my elbow after a tendon tear.  The first thing I noticed was the absence of hand joint fatigue.  I also picked up 10 yards, but attributed that to the clubhead.  I then tried the 95's if rogue Pro's and found them too twisty in 9,pw,gw.  Left everything to the right.  Now I'm back to 105's in the PXG 0211 and love them.  I still have 95-105 swing speed, and these are a perfect transition from steel to graphite.  I need the dampening attributes much more than the kick/distance of graphite.  I don't find them too stiff/firm at all. Easy to control and plenty of feedback on mishits.  I highly recommend you try them in person because they are not for everyone, but I don't think there is a better transition shaft from steel than the steel fiber. 

All of the above are stiff flex.  I did not find them to be too harsh for my quick swing and transition.

 

Edited by Rob W.

ROGUE ST MAX 9* - Mitsubishi TENSEI AV White 65 Graphite stiff

GBB Epic Pro Tour 15* - Matrix Radix HD 7 stiff

Cleveland Mashie 20.5* - Miyazaki 5G Stiff

PXG O211 4-G - Steelfiber I95 Stiff

Callaway Mac Daddy CB 54* & 58* - KBS shafts.

PXG Battle Ready Bat Attack - PXG Multi-Material M16 Putter Shaft plumbers neck 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The OP got the Recoils.  Can't wait to hear his experiences with them.

14 of the following:

Ping G430 Max 10.5 degree

Callaway 2023 Big Bertha 3 wood set to 17 degrees

Cobra F9 Speedback 7/8 wood set at 23.5 degrees

Callaway Epic Max 11 wood

Ping Eye 2 BeCu 2-SW

Mizuno 923 JPX HM HL 6-GW

Hogan sand wedge 56 degree bent to 53

Maltby M Series+ 54 degree

Ping Glide 3.0 Eye2 58 degree

Ping Glide 3.0 60 degree

Evnroll ER2

Ping Sigma 2 Anser

Cheap Top Flite mallet putter from Dick's, currently holding down first place in the bag

TaylorMade Mini Spider

Bridgestone XS

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Quigleyd said:

It is interesting reading everyone say steelfibers are stout. 
 

I have been playing the i125cw in x flex and actually find them pretty smooth.. 

 

 

That's because you are a big hitter

@LeftyMatt89 you can talk to Quigleyd about his Steelfiber experience

Follow my golf journey to break into the 80s

Tester for the Titleist TSi Driver

Spring 2020 MGS Tester for the Fujikura Motore X Shaft

Updated 07/15/2022
Driver:callaway-small: Rogue St Max LS - Autoflex
Fairway Woods:callaway-small: Rogue Max St 3HL and 7 Wood
Irons:mizuno-small: JPX 921 Hot Metal 5 to AW - Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Stiff parallel tip
Wedges:ping-small: Glide 4.0 54 and 58
Putter:  :ping-small: PLD Custom Kushin 4

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/15/2021 at 3:45 PM, RickyBobby_PR said:

I haven’t hit the mmt so can’t compare them to the other two options.

The steelfibers to me feel harsh compared to the recoils. They also tend to play stiff to flex. I know Snedeker plays them in i95 S. I don’t recall if Kuchar or someone else also went with the S flex.

Ive tried the steelfiber in the original apex irons and again in the cf16 and hated them.

The recoils have lots of options with weight and design. The smacwrap versions have even more stability and vibration dampening than the recoils without 

Back when I was doing some of his club work, Matt Kuchar was actually using the SteelFiber i95 shafts in R-flex, hard-stepped one step (or two).  He even experimented with the SteelFiber i80 shafts in his irons.

Just an FYI -- When I was working in the equipment trailers on tour, I did club work for Kuchar, Gary Woodland, Padraig Harrington, and even a bit for Tony Finau, plus a few others who will remain unnamed here.  I also worked with lots of guys on the Senior (now Champions) Tour, as far back as the mid-late 1990s.

Edited by funkyjudge

DR - Callaway Paradym X, Newton Motion 4-Dot

4W - T.E. Exotics C722, Diamana D+ 82-S

HYB - Paradym X 18*, HZRDUS Smoke Red 80S; Sub 70 949X 21*, same shaft

7W (if played) - Callaway Epic Flash, ACCRA Tour X 80S

Irons - Cobra Forged Tec X (5-GW), KBS TGI 75-R

Wedges - Edison 2.0, 53* and 57* (bent to 58*), KBS TGI 100

Putter - Makefield VS custom, 34", 67* lie, 1.75* loft

Ball - Maxfli Tour-X CG (2023) or Vice Pro Plus (OnCore ELIXR or Maxfli Tour S in winter)

Bags - Vessel

Cart - MotoCaddy M7 Remote (without the remote)

Spoiler

driver / off the tee is no longer a weakness for me!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am also playing my last set of steel shafted irons at the moment and have started dabbling but it is still early days in my graphite journey. I have tried out the MMT 125tx in a i500 3i and liked it but found it to be more stout than the X100 that it is designed to perform/feel like; too much for a driving iron for me. I top out at 110mph driver and 95mph 7i with an aggressive transition and play a bit below those numbers on the course FWIW.

It's not in the forum header but I am also currently trying out the KBS PGI 100 in a UDI hard stepped so playing S+; still very early but I think I like it in a 17* driving iron; tip is stiff but it is a bit less stout in the middle, for me it reminded me of AD DI a bit. PGI probably would not be a fit for a full set for me unless they came out with something a bit heavier though.

Look forward to testing the MMT 105tx and 125 Stiff along with Seelfiber and Recoil offerings that are around +-120g weight which proved to be much more important to my results in a fitting than a specific profile or flex - will be curious to see if that holds true for graphite.

Driver:  :titelist-small: TSi 3 10* w/ Graphite Design AD IZ 7X 

Fairway/Hybrid: :titelist-small: TSi 2 15* & 18* w/ Graphite Design AD IZ 7X, AD IZ 95X

Irons: :taylormade-small: P790 4i, P770 5-7i, P7MC 8-P, $ Taper 120

Wedges:  :vokey-small: SM7 52F/54 S, 58 M w/ Modus 125

Putter:  :cameron-small:  California Hollywood 34" Circle H

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Response to EJW:

I agree with your assessment of Recoil. About 2 years ago I replaced a set of 15 year old irons (DGS300 shafts) with new Srixon 785s and Recoil 95 F4 (stiff) shafts and soft-stepped them one club. I do have sensitive joints but was not willing to sacrifice distance. In fact, I gained over ten yards in distance with this setup. I did all the testing and research on my own and couldn't be happier with the results. Everyone should know that stiffness does not equate to distance. A #4 rebar is stiffer than any golf shaft but delivers little ball speed. It's the way a shaft loads and unloads that counts. Sorry if that sounds a little preachy, but EJW's comments are right-on. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/15/2021 at 3:37 PM, Middler said:

I plan to reshaft my irons with graphite, I’ve never had anything but steel but my joints just can’t take it anymore. I have TT XP95 S300 shafts now (fitted in 2018), so I assume a graphite shaft of about the same weight would be a good starting point if not a good substitute, though regular flex as I’m not getting younger or faster. After a bad $450+ experience with a driver fitting and a totally ridiculous quote for new JPX921F’s with MMT shafts from CC - I’m not going there again anytime soon. I’m leaning toward just going to GG and seeing what the latest Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D recommends, guessing it will be the UST and Aerotech shafts below, but that won’t permit me to try MMT’s. The ones I’m looking at are all similar weights, regular flex and mid launch.
I’m doing this to:

  1. reduce impact in my joints first and foremost,
  2. I certainly don’t want dispersion to increase (at least as good), 
  3. but I don’t care at all about extra distance.
  • UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$45ea

  • Mitsubishi MMT Iron 80 Regular (84g) @$60ea
  • Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$51ea

Any insights into the differences between the three? Again, I realize many will suggest a full blown fitter, but that’s an expensive crapshoot IME unless your swing is reasonably repeatable AND you’ve already narrowed the contenders substantially.

Fwiw my two new current sets are Tacoma Forged 201 with Kbs C-Taper lite 105 reg and 2021 T-200 with AMT White reg. Last couple years owned PXG Gen 3 0311 Ps with MMT 80 stiff,PXG 0211 with same MMT 80 stiff. 410 Ping irons with Sieelfiber 95reg. Finally had 2015 Apex with Recoil i95 reg. Right now even at 75 I prefer wieght of steel and don,t have issues. All these shafts felt ok and differences but nothing major. Smoothest is the Recoils and dispersion is a toss up between MMT and Steelfiber. Just a personal comment is I prefer look of Steelfiber probably because of playing steel so many years. Although I have had a knee and two hips replaced I still have gone to gym or use to ran daily over 50 years so there’s no issue swinging sticks although  obviously not at my old 105 mph. Have checked lately but pretty sure driver is still hanging in at 90.

I think going wherever you can hit various shaft options is key.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 8/17/2022 at 4:34 PM, chisag said:

 

... Oh Boy, they most assuredly do not. Lots of research regarding this false claim. When I had my first serious bout of tendonitis I tried all the inserts including Sensicore and while the feel was more dampened the shock to my elbow was not. First time I switched to graphite in my irons (frowned upon at that time) it made all the difference for my tendonitis and have not had an issue until playing my MIM's with Nippon 950GH shafts and the tendonitis came back. Installed Steelfiber 95's and it disappeared again.  

My experience also with graphite vs steel. Also try not hit off mats!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/17/2022 at 2:34 PM, chisag said:

 

... Oh Boy, they most assuredly do not. Lots of research regarding this false claim. When I had my first serious bout of tendonitis I tried all the inserts including Sensicore and while the feel was more dampened the shock to my elbow was not. First time I switched to graphite in my irons (frowned upon at that time) it made all the difference for my tendonitis and have not had an issue until playing my MIM's with Nippon 950GH shafts and the tendonitis came back. Installed Steelfiber 95's and it disappeared again.  

Have you actually tried using a set of irons with vibration absorming inserts your self or are you just repeating what you heard somewhere. Reason I ask is that I have done my own tests and the inserts I'm using do in fact work quite well. So I stand behine what I posted before, they work and they work well. 

All my clubs are custom built with aftermarket shafts that have been spine and FLO aligned for max performance every swing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, IONEPUTT said:

Have you actually tried using a set of irons with vibration absorming inserts your self or are you just repeating what you heard somewhere. Reason I ask is that I have done my own tests and the inserts I'm using do in fact work quite well. So I stand behine what I posted before, they work and they work well. 

 

... 🙄  I never repeat something I heard somewhere unless I state this is something I heard somewhere. If you actually read my post " I tried all the inserts including Sensicore and while the feel was more dampened the shock to my elbow was not." I did not post to change your opinion, which of course is impossible, I posted to warn others that inserts do nothing for elbow tendonitis, they just produce a more dampened feel. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
Irons:       :titleist-small:         '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :taylormade-small: Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli     Maxfli Tour

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... 🙄  I never repeat something I heard somewhere unless I state this is something I heard somewhere. If you actually read my post " I tried all the inserts including Sensicore and while the feel was more dampened the shock to my elbow was not." I did not post to change your opinion, which of course is impossible, I posted to warn others that inserts do nothing for elbow tendonitis, they just produce a more dampened feel. 

 

sorry my error there. You did try them which is good to know. My mistake. But as many others here are prone to post, what works for  you or in this case did NOT work for you doesn't mean it would not work for others. They didn't work for you, but they did work for me so who's to say if they would work for the rest of the golfers out there with elbow issues? 

All my clubs are custom built with aftermarket shafts that have been spine and FLO aligned for max performance every swing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

IMO inserts will never come close to dampening the vibrations your elbows feel. Your hands may feel something completely different, but your elbows are still taking some abuse. Graphite does a much better job of dampening the vibs than inserts. This is coming from someone who has had multiple shots in his elbows for tendenitus but none since switching to graphite in his irons. No argument that inserts feel much better in the hands. But I would argue that your elbows are still taking a beating.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 9/1/2022 at 12:00 PM, therod said:

IMO inserts will never come close to dampening the vibrations your elbows feel. Your hands may feel something completely different, but your elbows are still taking some abuse. Graphite does a much better job of dampening the vibs than inserts. This is coming from someone who has had multiple shots in his elbows for tendenitus but none since switching to graphite in his irons. No argument that inserts feel much better in the hands. But I would argue that your elbows are still taking a beating.

I have a theory on why you can feel the difference in your hands buy not helping with your elbows. When I was looking for a good set of graphite shafts to use to build my wife a set of new irons, I looked at all the graphite shafts listed in my Golfsmith catalog about 18 years ago. I noticed three things about graphite shafts compared to steel. One was the weight, second was the price, and third was the torque rating for the graphite shafts. Most every shaft i found had a torque rating of between 5.0 and 6.5*.  That was for L flex shafts. Steel shafts have a torque of between 1.9* and 2.2*. 2.2* being for the L flex shafts. So the graphite shafts have a much higher torque rating compated to the same flex steel shafts, In the case of L flex it was 2.2* for steel and over 5* for graphite. Since there are hundreds of golfers on half a dozen golf forums that say that low torque shaft just feel too harsh and how they much prefer  higher torque shafts in their clubs, I can't help but wonder is what your elbow is feeling is how the steel shafts do NOT twist as much at impact and that is the reason your elbows hurt when you play steel shafts in your irons. NOT the vibrations so much as the twisting action of the cluhhead at impact being 2 or 3 times as much for steel shaft irons compared to graphite shaft irons.  

You mention that your hands can feel the difference but not your elbows. My own tests have shown that the inserts do reduce the vibrations by a big factor, so I have to think it might be the twisting of the club head that is hurting your elbows and not the vibrations. Does that make sense to anyone other than me? 

All my clubs are custom built with aftermarket shafts that have been spine and FLO aligned for max performance every swing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 9/3/2022 at 10:35 AM, IONEPUTT said:

Most every shaft i found had a torque rating of between 5.0 and 6.5*.  That was for L flex shafts. Steel shafts have a torque of between 1.9* and 2.2*. 2.2* being for the L flex shafts. So the graphite shafts have a much higher torque rating compated to the same flex steel shafts, In the case of L flex it was 2.2* for steel and over 5* for graphite. Since there are hundreds of golfers on half a dozen golf forums that say that low torque shaft just feel too harsh and how they much prefer  higher torque shafts in their clubs, I can't help but wonder is what your elbow is feeling is how the steel shafts do NOT twist as much at impact and that is the reason your elbows hurt when you play steel shafts in your irons. NOT the vibrations so much as the twisting action of the cluhhead at impact being 2 or 3 times as much for steel shaft irons compared to graphite shaft irons.  

You mention that your hands can feel the difference but not your elbows. My own tests have shown that the inserts do reduce the vibrations by a big factor, so I have to think it might be the twisting of the club head that is hurting your elbows and not the vibrations. Does that make sense to anyone other than me? 

 

... First torque ratings are almost irrelevent as every OEM measures them differently. That said current graphite shafts are heavier and have much lower torque ratings, some less than steel. I play Steelfiber i95's with 2.0 - 2.4* of torque. Steelfibers are the most played shaft on the LPGA Tour and played by the top 3 golfers in the world. They are not using L Flex. Steelfiber i110's have 1.5 - 1.9* of torque and i125's have 1.4 to 1.8*

... When I swiped to Aldila Tour graphite iron shafts they had 1.5* of torque and weighed 130gms and were much stronger than the DGS300's and Aldila was trying to match the performance. They had a graph showing the vibrations from steel with inserts and graphite. Steel had the most, steel with inserts still had quite a bit with the peaks reduced and graphite almost flat lined. Their conclusion, which I already knew through experimenting with all the inserts from Sensicore to Pro Soft was that inserts were good at masking vibration but did not reduce it significantly and that is the reason they feel more dampened but still produced way too much vibration to combat tendonitis.

... I have stated this before but after taking several months off and switching to graphite my elbow tendonitis never returned. Until due to a shaft shortage, I played some Nippon 950GH for a couple months and the tendonitis came roaring back after 20 years of no problems. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
Irons:       :titleist-small:         '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :taylormade-small: Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli     Maxfli Tour

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You mentioned some Aldila Tour iron shafts, so I went to the Aldila website to look up the specs on those shafts, but there is no mention of them on the Aldila site. They have Tour shafts but only for woods or hybrids, None for irons . Not sure what this means but they don't seem to be selling them currently, Can you provide some info on those shafts? 

All my clubs are custom built with aftermarket shafts that have been spine and FLO aligned for max performance every swing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, IONEPUTT said:

You mentioned some Aldila Tour iron shafts, so I went to the Aldila website to look up the specs on those shafts, but there is no mention of them on the Aldila site. They have Tour shafts but only for woods or hybrids, None for irons . Not sure what this means but they don't seem to be selling them currently, Can you provide some info on those shafts? 

 

... They stopped making the Tour shafts a good 15 years ago. There was not much demand for a shaft with 1.5* of torque and weighing 130gms that felt like a telephone pole for anyone other than VJ Singh and a few others that played them on tour. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
Irons:       :titleist-small:         '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :taylormade-small: Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli     Maxfli Tour

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...