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Recoil v Steelfiber v MMT iron shafts?


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I plan to reshaft my irons with graphite, I’ve never had anything but steel but my joints just can’t take it anymore. I have TT XP95 S300 shafts now (fitted in 2018), so I assume a graphite shaft of about the same weight would be a good starting point if not a good substitute, though regular flex as I’m not getting younger or faster. After a bad $450+ experience with a driver fitting and a totally ridiculous quote for new JPX921F’s with MMT shafts from CC - I’m not going there again anytime soon. I’m leaning toward just going to GG and seeing what the latest Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D recommends, guessing it will be the UST and Aerotech shafts below, but that won’t permit me to try MMT’s. The ones I’m looking at are all similar weights, regular flex and mid launch.
I’m doing this to:

  1. reduce impact in my joints first and foremost,
  2. I certainly don’t want dispersion to increase (at least as good), 
  3. but I don’t care at all about extra distance.
  • UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$45ea

  • Mitsubishi MMT Iron 80 Regular (84g) @$60ea
  • Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$51ea

Any insights into the differences between the three? Again, I realize many will suggest a full blown fitter, but that’s an expensive crapshoot IME unless your swing is reasonably repeatable AND you’ve already narrowed the contenders substantially.

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  • Mizuno CLK 3H 19°, JPX900 Forged 4-GW, S18 56.10, S18 60.06
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I haven’t hit the mmt so can’t compare them to the other two options.

The steelfibers to me feel harsh compared to the recoils. They also tend to play stiff to flex. I know Snedeker plays them in i95 S. I don’t recall if Kuchar or someone else also went with the S flex.

Ive tried the steelfiber in the original apex irons and again in the cf16 and hated them.

The recoils have lots of options with weight and design. The smacwrap versions have even more stability and vibration dampening than the recoils without 

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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The Accra ICWT series is worth adding to the list at least for doing due diligence

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Follow my golf journey to break into the 80s

Current tester for the Titleist TSi Driver

Spring 2020 MGS Tester for the Fujikura Motore X Shaft

Updated 4/27/2021
Driver:titelist-small: TSi 2 - Graphite Design AD-XC 6S
Hybrids:taylormade-small: SIM Max 3H, 4H - Matrix Ozik 85S
Irons:srixon-small: ZX5 5 - PW - Accra 95 icwt S
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CBX 2 54, CBX Full Face 58 - Nippon Modus 105 Wedge
Putter:  :odyssey-small: Two Ball Ten S Tour Lines - 31"
 

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In order of stoutness they will fall pretty much in this order

SteelFiber

Then a whole lot of space

Recoil

Then just a little bit of space

MMT

Regardless of weight, the SteelFiber is going to be the toughest to swing and load,  Recoils as RickyBobby said, have a lot of good options in both weight and profile, such as 680's are much less stout than Recoil 95's.   

MMT's are going to be the less harsh and easiest to launch of the 3s.  For example a MMT90 will be much easier to swing than a SteelFiber 95 even though the MMT is actually 3 grams heavier (98 vs 95 in Stiff) in weight.

 

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:titelist-small: TSi2 Kuro Kage 50g R Flex

:titelist-small: TSi2 16.5 FW with GD AD IZ 6 Shaft

:ping-small:  G410 FW 7 Alta CB R flex 

:ping-small: G410 Hybrid 26 degree Alta CB R Flex

:titelist-small: T100S/T200 Combo 5-7 T100S 8-P T200 TT Black Oynx R Flex

:titelist-small: SM7 54.08 F 58.12 K 

:ping-small: Heppler Tomcast 

:titelist-small: ProV1X Play number 12

 

 

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Steelfiber i95 Stiff has a profile almost identical to DGS; I've always assumed that is the source of its reputation for playing stiff.  I have i125 in a GW and notice a stiffer bottom section, but don't think it plays stiff to flex.  Then again, I'm a DGS player.  <shrug>

Recoil seems to have a softer lower section, and produces a higher flight.  I'm guessing on the characteristics of your current XP95 shaft, but I would think the Recoil a better fit.  Emphasis on "guessing."  😉

No experience/knowledge with the MMT 80.

Have you explored the possibility of the Steelfiber FC 90 instead of the i95?  It's said to have a softer tip and a higher flight than the i-series Steelfibers.

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Driver: TM Original One 11.5* set to 10*, Aldila RIP Alpha 80 X, 43.5"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, Matrix 8m3 X, 42"
2h or 3h:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, Aldila NV105 S
Irons:  3-PW Mizuno MP37, Recoil Proto 125 F4 (reshaft in progress, slowly); 1-PW Vibration Matched Golden Rams, RIP Tour 115 R (reshaft project); 1i & 3-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S
GW: Dynacraft Dual Milled CNC 52*, DGS300; Scratch 8620 DS 53*, Steelfiber 125 S
SW:  Ram TG-898 56*, DGX ss2x; Ram Tom Watson 55*, DGX ss2x; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS; Golden Ram TW276, DGS; Golden Ram TW282, DGS; Ram Troon Grind 56*, DGS
LW:  Maltby Design 60*, 1.05 sole, DGS; Maltby Design 60* 1.05 sole, NV105
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34"
Ball:  Wilson Staff Duo Professional, or TM TP5

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6 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

 

Steelfiber i95 Stiff has a profile almost identical to DGS; I've always assumed that is the source of its reputation for playing stiff.  I have i125 in a GW and notice a stiffer bottom section, but don't think it plays stiff to flex.  Then again, I'm a DGS player.  <shrug>

 

 

I used to be a s300 player forever. To me the steelfibers felt worse. 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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5 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

I used to be a s300 player forever. To me the steelfibers felt worse. 

Which did you have?  The 110 is especially notorious in golf nerddom, as I'm sure you know.  🙂

Driver: TM Original One 11.5* set to 10*, Aldila RIP Alpha 80 X, 43.5"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, Matrix 8m3 X, 42"
2h or 3h:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, Aldila NV105 S
Irons:  3-PW Mizuno MP37, Recoil Proto 125 F4 (reshaft in progress, slowly); 1-PW Vibration Matched Golden Rams, RIP Tour 115 R (reshaft project); 1i & 3-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S
GW: Dynacraft Dual Milled CNC 52*, DGS300; Scratch 8620 DS 53*, Steelfiber 125 S
SW:  Ram TG-898 56*, DGX ss2x; Ram Tom Watson 55*, DGX ss2x; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS; Golden Ram TW276, DGS; Golden Ram TW282, DGS; Ram Troon Grind 56*, DGS
LW:  Maltby Design 60*, 1.05 sole, DGS; Maltby Design 60* 1.05 sole, NV105
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34"
Ball:  Wilson Staff Duo Professional, or TM TP5

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19 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

Which did you have?  The 110 is especially notorious in golf nerddom, as I'm sure you know.  🙂

Only tested the i95s based on the fitters recommendation. 

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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3 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Only tested the i95s based on the fitters recommendation. 

Interesting.  And a little unsettling.

🤔

Driver: TM Original One 11.5* set to 10*, Aldila RIP Alpha 80 X, 43.5"
3w:  Cobra King LTD, Matrix 8m3 X, 42"
2h or 3h:  TaylorMade Stage 2 Tour, Aldila NV105 S
Irons:  3-PW Mizuno MP37, Recoil Proto 125 F4 (reshaft in progress, slowly); 1-PW Vibration Matched Golden Rams, RIP Tour 115 R (reshaft project); 1i & 3-PW Golden Ram TW276, NV105 S
GW: Dynacraft Dual Milled CNC 52*, DGS300; Scratch 8620 DS 53*, Steelfiber 125 S
SW:  Ram TG-898 56*, DGX ss2x; Ram Tom Watson 55*, DGX ss2x; Wilson Staff PMP 58*, DGS; Golden Ram TW276, DGS; Golden Ram TW282, DGS; Ram Troon Grind 56*, DGS
LW:  Maltby Design 60*, 1.05 sole, DGS; Maltby Design 60* 1.05 sole, NV105
Putter:  Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34"
Ball:  Wilson Staff Duo Professional, or TM TP5

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41 minutes ago, NRJyzr said:

Steelfiber i95 Stiff has a profile almost identical to DGS; I've always assumed that is the source of its reputation for playing stiff.  I have i125 in a GW and notice a stiffer bottom section, but don't think it plays stiff to flex.  Then again, I'm a DGS player.  <shrug>

Recoil seems to have a softer lower section, and produces a higher flight.  I'm guessing on the characteristics of your current XP95 shaft, but I would think the Recoil a better fit.  Emphasis on "guessing."  😉

No experience/knowledge with the MMT 80.

Have you explored the possibility of the Steelfiber FC 90 instead of the i95?  It's said to have a softer tip and a higher flight than the i-series Steelfibers.

The shafts I noted are simply based on what Mizuno offers from the factory (and their fitting cart), and because I intend to use the Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D instead of an all out fitting to decide. Sounds like the Recoil is more likely for me, or I can take a flying leap on the MMT.

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  • Evnroll ER5B (replaced ER2)
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1 hour ago, NRJyzr said:

Interesting.  And a little unsettling.

🤔

Some people find them to not be harsh and prefer three over recoils. 

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Just did a session with the Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D and then hit my XP95 S300 7i vs a JPX921F 7i with Recoil 95 F3 (regular flex). My dispersion seemed about the same and if anything I gained a couple yards and a couple hundred RPMs spin. And they felt a touch softer, I am hoping that over the course of a round a touch softer translates to a noticeable reduction in wrist and (left) elbow pain. Tried the Steelfiber i95, they felt harsher and I got a couple yards less. Ordered a set of Recoil 95 shafts for my 4-GW, I'm going to leave my S18 SW and LW in steel as it's very rare I take a full swing with either. I would have ordered MMT's but my irons are 0.355" tips and they can only get MMT's in 0.370" tips thru GolfWorks. Read that MMT's can be special ordered in 0.355" tips but the shop said they couldn't and I decided I wasn't going to argue with them. I'll have new shafts at about 1/3rd to cost of all new irons ($488 vs $1399+tax). Wish me luck, and thanks for all the input!

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  • Mizuno CLK 3H 19°, JPX900 Forged 4-GW, S18 56.10, S18 60.06
  • Evnroll ER5B (replaced ER2)
  • Snell MTB-Black
  • Ping Pioneer - MGI Zip Navigator AT
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33 minutes ago, Middler said:

Just did a session with the Mizuno Shaft Optimizer 3D and then hit my XP95 S300 7i vs a JPX921F 7i with Recoil 95 F3 (regular flex). My dispersion seemed about the same and if anything I gained a couple yards and a couple hundred RPMs spin. And they felt a touch softer, I am hoping that over the course of a round a touch softer translates to a noticeable reduction in wrist and (left) elbow pain. Tried the Steelfiber i95, they felt harsher and I got a couple yards less. Ordered a set of Recoil 95 shafts for my 4-GW, I'm going to leave my S18 SW and LW in steel as it's very rare I take a full swing with either. I would have ordered MMT's but my irons are 0.355" tips and they can only get MMT's in 0.370" tips thru GolfWorks. Read that MMT's can be special ordered in 0.355" tips but the shop said they couldn't and I decided I wasn't going to argue with them. I'll have new shafts at about 1/3rd to cost of all new irons ($488 vs $1399+tax). Wish me luck, and thanks for all the input!

That’s awesome. I can tell you that your body will enjoy the effects of the shafts throughout the round. When I did my fitting with UST I could have gone with the recoil 125s but we decided that going 110 would be beneficial for helping with late round fatigue. The combination of the graphite and the lower weight from the s300 amt would help overall and save the joints at the same time

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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I played the Steelfibers in Regular flex for a couple of years...loved them! Really tight dispersion....the R flex plays really close to stiff.

I play Recoils now, but I miss the Steelfibers


Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

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:cobra-small: King F7+ UST Mamiya Chrome Elements 6F4 Shaft

:cobra-small: King F7 3W UST Mamiya Chrome Elements 7F4 Shaft

:cobra-small: King F7 5W UST Mamiya Chrome Elements 7F4 Shaft

:cobra-small: King F7 4 Hybrid Graphite Designs Tour AD-HY 95 Shaft

:cobra-small: King F7 5 Hybrid Graphite Designs Tour AD-HY 95 Shaft

:cobra-small: King F7 6-PW UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Shafts

:cobra-small: King PuR Wedges 50*,54*,58* UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Shafts

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I was in a similar situation. Had shoulder surgery, turned 47 and my joints couldn't take it anymore. I had played TTS300 or Rifle shafts in my irons since I was 25. I went for a fitting to get new irons and was recommended the Recoils. Great shaft and I loved it. PGA SS recommended a set if Mizuno's that would have cost me $1,200+ and I just didn't want to spend that much.  I bought a set from Sub70 and based on my specs and what PGA SS recommended, they put me in a set with the Aldila NV iron shaft. These shafts are great. Very similar feel to the Recoils. I would add those to your list.

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ping.png.7c5862342023c35b77c4616604806e90.png Driver: 425LST w / KBS TD60 X-Stiff

callaway-golf-vector-logo.png.493ab23d387785f73cfea313e1af01a6.png 3-Wood: Callaway Rogue

596048109_ScreenShot2021-02-28at3_28_30PM.png.6dfa8b67ed327055667700b4ef19afd1.png Sub70 699Pro: 5&6 Irons w/ Aldila NV Graphite Shaft - Stiff - 1/2" short

596048109_ScreenShot2021-02-28at3_28_30PM.png.6dfa8b67ed327055667700b4ef19afd1.png Sub70 639CB: 7-PW w/ Aldila NV Graphite Shaft - Stiff - 1/2" short

596048109_ScreenShot2021-02-28at3_28_30PM.png.6dfa8b67ed327055667700b4ef19afd1.pngHybrid - 939X: with Proforce V2 Stiff

1884238425_Titleistlogo.png.90c97c2fbcb19171e8ef7dc60bee0fc4.pngSM7 50* & 56*

167032231_GELlogo.jpeg.060ddfab800aed4c79ddd5d4ccc47ee0.jpegPutter: OPAL

vicegolf_logo.png.26dae2f1802c046450d6ce62d44baf39.png VICE - Pro Plus

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I don't have much to offer on all three, but I just have to chime in re: MMT. I recently picked up a Ping i500 3i with the MMT 125tx...disclaimer that it has only been 2 range sessions and one round but I am in one of the best honeymoon periods I've ever had with a club.

For reference my driver ss is ~108, not exactly screaming for rebar-type shafts, but with a fast tempo and quick transition; my stock shot is a draw and my misses are a pull hook and an overcooked draw.

The MMT feels more stout than my $ Taper 130 X iron shafts when you waggle it, kind of more like C-tapers, but when you swing it feels much more $ taper than C-taper, which for me is a massive plus. Despite the pleasant feel it performs like a very stout shaft. I was stepping on it and hitting nice tight fades at the range and in the round, and couldn't really turn it over. Seeing this ball flight without making a dedicated effort to change anything in my swing was a total revelation. I think I have my fairway finder off the tee for the foreseeable future, and while I won't be purchasing new irons until the end of this season I am 90% positive that they will be shafted with the MMT 125tx soft stepped once. YMMV

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Driver:  :titelist-small: TSi 3 10* w/ Graphite Design AD IZ 7X 

Fairway: :titelist-small: TSi 2 15* w/ Graphite Design AD IX 7X

Hybrid: :titelist-small: TSi2* 17* w/ Atmos Blue 85x  

Utility: :ping-small: i500 3i (19*) w/ MMT 125tx

Irons: :cobra-small: King Forged CB w/ KBS $ Taper 130

Wedges:  :vokey-small: SM7 54 S, 58 M w/ Modus 125

Putter:  :cameron-small:  California Hollywood 34" Circle H

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As noted above, since my OP I had my irons reshafted with Recoil 95 F3’s, just got them back yesterday so I haven’t even hit them yet. Also as mentioned above, I would have gone with MMT’s but the 0.370” tip wouldn’t fit my 0.355” hosel JPX900F’s. Wish me luck.

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  • Snell MTB-Black
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4 hours ago, Middler said:

As noted above, since my OP I had my irons reshafted with Recoil 95 F3’s, just got them back yesterday so I haven’t even hit them yet. Also as mentioned above, I would have gone with MMT’s but the 0.370” tip wouldn’t fit my 0.355” hosel JPX900F’s. Wish me luck.

Good luck with the Recoils, hope you hit them well.

Just an FYI for others in general, you can easily put 0.370" shafts in a 0.355" hose. On a 0.355" taper tip shaft, it really is only about the final 1/2" that is tapered to 0.355", and then it tapers up to a 0.370". People are always arguing which is better, but you can either taper the last 1/2" of the 0.370" graphite shaft or you can hand ream the hosel to 0.370". I'm not going to argue which one is better, but both are common and doable DIY.

Follow my golf journey to break into the 80s

Current tester for the Titleist TSi Driver

Spring 2020 MGS Tester for the Fujikura Motore X Shaft

Updated 4/27/2021
Driver:titelist-small: TSi 2 - Graphite Design AD-XC 6S
Hybrids:taylormade-small: SIM Max 3H, 4H - Matrix Ozik 85S
Irons:srixon-small: ZX5 5 - PW - Accra 95 icwt S
Wedges: :cleveland-small: CBX 2 54, CBX Full Face 58 - Nippon Modus 105 Wedge
Putter:  :odyssey-small: Two Ball Ten S Tour Lines - 31"
 

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2 hours ago, dlow206 said:

Good luck with the Recoils, hope you hit them well.

Just an FYI for others in general, you can easily put 0.370" shafts in a 0.355" hose. On a 0.355" taper tip shaft, it really is only about the final 1/2" that is tapered to 0.355", and then it tapers up to a 0.370". People are always arguing which is better, but you can either taper the last 1/2" of the 0.370" graphite shaft or you can hand ream the hosel to 0.370". I'm not going to argue which one is better, but both are common and doable DIY.

Some pros and cons re: 0.370” graphite shafts in 0.355” iron hostels. 

 

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  • Mizuno CLK 3H 19°, JPX900 Forged 4-GW, S18 56.10, S18 60.06
  • Evnroll ER5B (replaced ER2)
  • Snell MTB-Black
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On 3/15/2021 at 2:37 PM, Middler said:

The ones I’m looking at are all similar weights, regular flex and mid launch.
I’m doing this to:

  1. reduce impact in my joints first and foremost,
  2. I certainly don’t want dispersion to increase (at least as good), 
  3. but I don’t care at all about extra distance.
  • UST Mamiya Recoil 95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$45ea

  • Mitsubishi MMT Iron 80 Regular (84g) @$60ea
  • Aerotech Steelfiber i95 Graphite Regular (95g) @$51ea

One thing and this is just a suggestion the shaft is a timing device and kind of needs to match the head you want the best... if your set on the Mizuno the shaft optimizer is a good place to start however it’s limited to things Mizuno carries... if you’re looking for dispersion to actually get better there is Accra then everyone else in my opinion... as @dlow206 mentioned the work is not that difficult to perform yourself and the iCWT 2.0 is discrete meaning that each shaft gets a 1/2” shorter to make it easier to fit and build... happy to chat more as well!

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Driver:taylormade-small: SIM 10.5, Graphite Design Tour AD-XC 6X 

Woods:titelist-small: TSi2 16.5, Fujikura Ventus Blue 7X

Hybrid: :ping-small: G410 3&4H, Graphite Design Tour AD-DI 95X 

Irons:titelist-small: T-100 3-PW, Nippon Modus 120 X 

Wedges: :mizuno-small: T20, DG TI S400, 50/56/60

Putter:  :EVNROLL: ER1.2 W/BGT Stability Shaft

Ball:  :titelist-small: ProV1X-Optic Yellow

Bag: :ping-small: Pioneer

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