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Arm Lock Putting Should Be Illegal


LICC

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1 minute ago, Shankster said:

Banned swimsuits… what the actual…

What’s next?  Cyclists cant shave their legs?

banned swimsuits are better than band swimsuits.  have you seen some of those tuba players?

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Just now, Chip Strokes said:

banned swimsuits are better than band swimsuits.  have you seen some of those tuba players?

Oh we are NOT going to go there. You want a war, pal????????!!!!!!?????????1111111?????

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1 minute ago, russtopherb said:

Oh we are NOT going to go there. You want a war, pal????????!!!!!!?????????1111111?????

please no, we finally just got out of one.

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2 minutes ago, Chip Strokes said:

please no, we finally just got out of one.

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1 hour ago, LICC said:

And that is the whole original point of this discussion, that the armlock putter should not be within the rules.

This is going in a circle so no point in continuing.

I think that is the point of the warning.  I wasn’t involved in the conversations or had with the mods, but I don’t think the issue was with you opinion,. It the way you appear to dismiss other opinions as been wrong simply because you don’t agree and find quotes from people (players, ruling bodies, etc) that support you position. We all know there are people on both sides of all topics, but ultimately they are all opinions. The purpose is to help explain why you yourself have that opinion and possibly help others see a different perspective.  My opinion isn’t wrong simply because I don’t agree with you.   I typically don’t respond to your posts and asked you not to quote me in these controversial topics because of this.  

1 hour ago, Shankster said:

Banned swimsuits… what the actual…

What’s next?  Cyclists cant shave their legs?

They banned the use of the physio tape for cyclist in the Olympics when the Dutch team all had Thentapemcown the front of their shins

1 hour ago, Chip Strokes said:

@LICCyou failed to address nearly ALL of the things i brought up. 

a ballplayer can get a bat produced in nearly any way he chooses so as to give himself the best possible chance of producing a good result.  

the same way a golfer can get a putter produced in nearly any way he chooses so as to give himself the best possible chance of producing a good result.

...within the rules. (let's not forget that armlock is still well within the rules)

should it be illegal for a baseball player to get a 36" bat and choke up 3" for more control? 

Id actually liken the little rubber thing that players put on their thumbs to help control the bat more to anchor putting than the actual bat itself.  
https://www.baseballthumbguard.com/

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I think what this thread has taught us is that there are 2% of people who don't agree with the armlock/anchoring split, the other 98% either don't give two sh**s or are fine with the way it is. Following the 2% is exactly how the ruling bodies got in this situation in the first place, when banning anchoring. The amount of energy wasted on the 2% is unbelievable. 

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@cnosil- I didn't quote you. Not sure to what you are referring.

I give my opinion and I provide information to support it. That is not dismissing, it is giving a counter-point. I can't say why some people can't handle reading a counterpoint, but the mods have blamed me and I'm trying to avoid going in circles in these discussions. Even now, all I did was quote an article. That led to me getting attacked by others that my points are not valid, don't apply, etc. ...

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6 minutes ago, LICC said:

@cnosil- I didn't quote you. Not sure to what you are referring.

I give my opinion and I provide information to support it. That is not dismissing, it is giving a counter-point. I can't say why some people can't handle reading a counterpoint, but the mods have blamed me and I'm trying to avoid going in circles in these discussions. Even now, all I did was quote an article. That led to me getting attacked by others that my points are not valid, don't apply, etc. ...

You didn’t quote me this time, but I have asked you not to quote me in the past.  
 

Unfortunately past perceptions will continue even though they might not need too.  It is kind of like this response,  I gave an opinion on how I think people’s perceive your posts and you respond by saying it’s not me it’s everyone else.   
 

Anyway,  Hope you find what you are looking for on the forum.  

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3 hours ago, blackngold_blood said:

Ok last thing then I’m done forever.   The same ball argument for baseball applies only to the ball in golf nothing more. Bats to hit the ball or arms to throw it equate more to the club than anything and bat more so than arm. Not all bats are the same weight or length or even material just like not all clubs are.  

Man it took some catching up to do in this thread

@blackngold_bloodfamous last words my friend (as I quote you, you will respond, see what I did there)

3 hours ago, Chip Strokes said:

i'm aware of what a balk is.  my two seasons in the mets organization taught me a thing or two.  

and submarine and underhand free throws are very valid corollaries.  they're deviations on a "standard" motion that give SOME players an advantage over others.  namely, the players who can't get the job done doing things the conventional way.  

if your issue is the changing of the equipment, then are you ok with the infinite number of baseball bat varieties? flared knob, no knob, choking up, pinky off, axe handle....how about different weights, lengths, weigh to length ratios, barrel to hand ratios, materials?

how about the guys who still play in metal spikes vs. the ones who choose to play in turf shoes?

what about different face masks in football? visors? flak jackets? 

or nba players who wear compression sleeves, wrist bands, or finger sleeves.

if i'm a swimmer and want to wear a speedo, but the guy in the next lane has on the suit that comes to his knees, should i protest?

these are all things that make a much larger MENTAL difference than a PHYSICAL difference, but are well within the rules of their sport.  why should golf be any different in this respect?

The mets?! To quote Stephen A "CMON MAN!", JK I am for the mets, nice line of equipment there

 

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2 hours ago, bens197 said:

It would be neat to see a comparison for Kuchar, Keegan, Bryson and others to see what effect it had on their putting stats.  Is it more of a comfort thing or is there really a tangible difference.  

Frankly, I am not even remotely interested in this debate.  If the governing bodies wanted a change, they would change.

 

... I am with you. I would love to see comparison video's of guys yipping putts and then anchoring against their arm with no yipping. I would love to hear them interviewed and see if they say their nerves got the best of them and the anchoring helped. I keep hearing how anchoring does not give any golfer an "advantage" and I just disagree with that terminology. It isn't a question of an advantage but more of a question of addressing a performance problem with equipment that takes some skill away like bumpers covering the gutters while bowling. 

... Attempting to compare to with anything other than actual equipment that helps elevate a problem just doesn't seem like an apples to apples comparison. A pitcher with a different arm delivery isn't any different than a Jim Furyk, Tommy Gainy, Moe Norman and of course Dechambeau. And Dechambeau uses same length shafts as well as HUGE grips, all very unconventional but does not remove a skill and you could make the argument actually takes more skill. 

...  I don't think an anchored putter gives anyone an "advantage" and most likely it will perform worst for the majority of players. Dave talked about an arbitrary line and it seems to me the rule has done exactly that. ALL of the anchoring is done to stop the smaller nerves in the hands from yipping putts when free swinging so banning anchoring against the chin, chest and belly but allowing anchoring to the forearm is just a head scratcher for me. But like you Benz, the rule is the rule and nothing we say here is gonna influence that. As long as it is the law of the land and the governing bodies are not soliciting opinions for a future rule change this is just a fun discussion (for some) and differing opinions are interesting and all of them are equally valid.  

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47 minutes ago, chisag said:

but allowing anchoring to the forearm is just a head scratcher for me.

I can see the difference between anchoring to an immovable part of the torso and anchoring to a part of the body that moves, the forearm.  There's no question that its an arbitrary division, but any other decision would also be arbitrary.  Similarly, all of the pencil and claw grips are intended to do largely the same thing, to remove the "twitchy" small muscles from the motion.  I don't have a rationale to suggest where the line might be more appropriately drawn, I have no problem if a player uses the armlock in a match against me, and I'm unlikely to try it at this stage in my golfing career.  I'm simply not convinced that a chance should be made.

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10 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

I can see the difference between anchoring to an immovable part of the torso and anchoring to a part of the body that moves, the forearm.  There's no question that its an arbitrary division, but any other decision would also be arbitrary.  Similarly, all of the pencil and claw grips are intended to do largely the same thing, to remove the "twitchy" small muscles from the motion.  I don't have a rationale to suggest where the line might be more appropriately drawn, I have no problem if a player uses the armlock in a match against me, and I'm unlikely to try it at this stage in my golfing career.  I'm simply not convinced that a chance should be made.

 

... Com'on Dave. There is a huge difference between the way you grip a free swinging club and anchoring against any part of the body that does not hinge. Anchoring against the forearm means the lead wrist will not break, which of course is the problem players are trying to overcome. Like you, I would have no problem playing against someone anchoring their putter legally or illegally since I view them as the same and a sign of putting difficulties. Fwiw, you must not have watched bad putters anchoring against anything because many (most?) certainly move their chin, chest or belly when putting. 

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20 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... Com'on Dave. There is a huge difference between the way you grip a free swinging club and anchoring against any part of the body that does not hinge. Anchoring against the forearm means the lead wrist will not break, which of course is the problem players are trying to overcome. Like you, I would have no problem playing against someone anchoring their putter legally or illegally since I view them as the same and a sign of putting difficulties. Fwiw, you must not have watched bad putters anchoring against anything because many (most?) certainly move their chin, chest or belly when putting. 

I didn't say there was no anchoring involved in the armlock method, only that I can see the difference between anchoring to the torso and anchoring to somewhere else on the arm.  There's a rather long continuum of putting grips and methods, from

really traditional putting to

left-hand-low to

pencil grips to

armlock using hands together, pressing the butt end into the forearm to

clasping the butt end against the forearm with the trail hand to

non-anchored long putters to

the now outlawed hand anchored against the chest to

now outlawed belly putters with both hands together down the shaft.

And this doesn't even get into putting stances facing the hole, not anchored under the current definitions.  I do not see a need to go any further in eliminating some or all of those non-traditional putting styles.

 

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28 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

And this doesn't even get into putting stances facing the hole, not anchored under the current definitions.  I do not see a need to go any further in eliminating some or all of those non-traditional putting styles.

 

... Feels a little like being sucked into a Black Hole, as the linebacker that hit me from the blindside when I was wearing a red jersey and not supposed to be touched, let alone hit said in my year book: "It have been fun but fun have to come to a end" so last response. I am not against non traditional. I am against anchoring and then only as an opinion not as a crusade to get it declared illegal. Keep in mind I am the same guy that told the CEO of Wilson Golf when I narrated the video of the Killer Whale Titanium driver introduction that was 275cc's "I just don't think any serious golfer is gonna play a driver head this HUGE. I hope I am wrong but I just don't see it". 🤣

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5 hours ago, Shankster said:

What does that even mean?! Haha 

stupid auto spell correct.  had the tape down the front of there legs

 

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23 minutes ago, cnosil said:

stupid auto spell correct.  had the tape down the front of there legs

 

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/is-the-danish-pursuit-team-faking-injury-at-olympics-to-circumvent-uci-rules/

 

Oh… I don’t even know what to say about that.  Pretty soon they will have a specific hair cut you are required to have.  
 

🤦🏼‍♂️

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5 hours ago, chisag said:

Keep in mind I am the same guy that told the CEO of Wilson Golf when I narrated the video of the Killer Whale Titanium driver introduction that was 275cc's "I just don't think any serious golfer is gonna play a driver head this HUGE.

i told the manager of a wendy’s that square burgers were weird. same same. 

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2 minutes ago, Shankster said:

Oh… I don’t even know what to say about that.  Pretty soon they will have a specific hair cut you are required to have.  
 

🤦🏼‍♂️

they already have haircuts you CAN’T have. so we’re almost there 

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2 minutes ago, Chip Strokes said:

What a world… what a world.

I basically have a cone head.  They’d probably ban me from competing due to the shape….  It would definitely give me an advantage if I had a fresh buzz cut.  Like a bow of a 1994 Scarab… just cuts through the water.

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