UPDATE on Apex '21 Experiment

[JohnnyCallaway]

I’ve had a few days with my “Wunder Style” Apex ’21 Irons and I must say, the experiment has paid off in spades. My Callaway box was at my doorstep when I arrived home from Muirfield Village and I took them out right away. First impression? WOWZA. I’ve played three rounds with them so far and these are my takeaways 

1. I’m 8 yards further with each club (On Avg)
2. I typically hit about 10 greens per round and I’ve hit AT LEAST 13 with Apex ’21
3. My gapping got better before I had a large gap between the 4 iron/4 utility/4 hybrid and my 5-wood. Now I don’t. See new numbers below. 
4. My miss hits are of the same quality as my solid shots with my X-Forged CB. 
5. I’m better. My iron game has been an eyesore but with the Apex ’21 done my way, im a good iron player again. 

Let’s get into the numbers, shall we? I had a chance to do a gapping session so I have hard data to back up the performance. Keep in mind that my miss with any iron is center thin and it happens about 30% of the time. 

Old Set: X-Forged CB ’21/Apex MB Combo w/ True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100 (Soft Stepped), Std Length, Std Lie, D3

X-Forged CB (4-7) Apex MB (8-PW)

Loft/Carry Distance

XF 4-iron: 22.5, 210
XF 5-Iron: 26, 195
XF 6-iron: 29, 180
XF 7 Iron: 33, 165
Apex MB 8 Iron: 37, 150
Apex MB 9 Iron: 41, 135
Apex MB PW: 46, 125

New Set: Apex 21 (Wunder Spec) w/ True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100 (Soft Stepped), Std Length, Std Lie, D3

Loft/Carry Distance

Apex 4-iron: 22.5, 220
Apex 5-iron: 25.5, 205
Apex 6-iron: 28.5, 190
Apex 7-iron: 32.5, 175
Apex 8-iron: 36.5, 160
Apex 9-iron: 40.5, 145
Apex PW: 45, 130

Here is how the whole bag gaps out now: 

Carry Distance in normal conditions: 

Driver: 280
3-wood: 255
5-wood: 235
Apex 4-iron: 22.5, 220
Apex 5-iron: 25.5, 205
Apex 6-iron: 28.5, 190
Apex 7-iron: 32.5, 175
Apex 8-iron: 36.5, 160
Apex 9-iron: 40.5, 145
Apex PW: 45, 130
Jaws 50/10S: 115
Jaws 54/8C: 105
PM Grind 60: Who Cares

This new setup helped my gapping tremendously, my entire bag has been a weird puzzle lately but now it all kind of makes sense. The problem was from 4-iron thru 6-iron I just wasn’t getting the ball speed and performance to do anything but guess. It’s hard to play well that way. Not anymore. 

Here is how the whole bag gaps out now: 

Carry Distance in normal conditions: 

Driver: 280
3-wood: 255
5-wood: 235
Apex 4-iron: 22.5, 220
Apex 5-iron: 25.5, 205
Apex 6-iron: 28.5, 190
Apex 7-iron: 32.5, 175
Apex 8-iron: 36.5, 160
Apex 9-iron: 40.5, 145
Apex PW: 45, 130
Jaws 50/10S: 115
Jaws 54/8C: 105
PM Grind 60: Who Cares

The point is, for better players that struggle with the irons or are finding deficiencies in their setups, going into something like this and bending/tweaking the set to match what you need is a no-brainer. 

I’m a gear head to the core and as much as I want to strut around with Raw TCB’s, that path won’t help my golf game. I want to play well far more than I want a bag full of players’ irons. To be honest I truly believe I’ve cracked a code. I offset the extra loft and launch by going into a heavy low spin shaft, I combat the lack of spin by playing a spinny golf ball (CSX) and BOOM. I’m having a blast. Try it. I dare you. You won’t go back I promise you. 

[ForeRightAgain]

Jealous.  Ordered my Apex from Club Champion almost 9 weeks ago.  Supposedly coming in this week.  Hope the do.  I've been champing at the bit waiting to give them a whirl in real life conditions.

[null]

5 minutes ago, ForeRightAgain said:

Jealous.  Ordered my Apex from Club Champion almost 9 weeks ago.  Supposedly coming in this week.  Hope the do.  I've been champing at the bit waiting to give them a whirl in real life conditions.

He works for Callaway - so no surprise he doesn't have to deal with order delays

[trike11]

I have a similar gapping issue that I want to solve. Your distances are extremely close to mine until we get into the 4/5 iron. I am a little shorter to the point where off the deck, my 4 iron doesn't go much further than my 5. I was planning on fixing that hopefully in the next couple of weeks.

Congratulations on the improved play, that's really awesome.

[Audi S-fore]

16 hours ago, JohnnyCallaway said:

I’ve had a few days with my “Wunder Style” Apex ’21 Irons and I must say, the experiment has paid off in spades. My Callaway box was at my doorstep when I arrived home from Muirfield Village and I took them out right away. First impression? WOWZA. I’ve played three rounds with them so far and these are my takeaways 

1. I’m 8 yards further with each club (On Avg)
2. I typically hit about 10 greens per round and I’ve hit AT LEAST 13 with Apex ’21
3. My gapping got better before I had a large gap between the 4 iron/4 utility/4 hybrid and my 5-wood. Now I don’t. See new numbers below. 
4. My miss hits are of the same quality as my solid shots with my X-Forged CB. 
5. I’m better. My iron game has been an eyesore but with the Apex ’21 done my way, im a good iron player again. 

Let’s get into the numbers, shall we? I had a chance to do a gapping session so I have hard data to back up the performance. Keep in mind that my miss with any iron is center thin and it happens about 30% of the time. 

Old Set: X-Forged CB ’21/Apex MB Combo w/ True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100 (Soft Stepped), Std Length, Std Lie, D3

X-Forged CB (4-7) Apex MB (8-PW)

Loft/Carry Distance

XF 4-iron: 22.5, 210
XF 5-Iron: 26, 195
XF 6-iron: 29, 180
XF 7 Iron: 33, 165
Apex MB 8 Iron: 37, 150
Apex MB 9 Iron: 41, 135
Apex MB PW: 46, 125

New Set: Apex 21 (Wunder Spec) w/ True Temper Dynamic Gold Tour Issue X100 (Soft Stepped), Std Length, Std Lie, D3

Loft/Carry Distance

Apex 4-iron: 22.5, 220
Apex 5-iron: 25.5, 205
Apex 6-iron: 28.5, 190
Apex 7-iron: 32.5, 175
Apex 8-iron: 36.5, 160
Apex 9-iron: 40.5, 145
Apex PW: 45, 130

Here is how the whole bag gaps out now: 

Carry Distance in normal conditions: 

Driver: 280
3-wood: 255
5-wood: 235
Apex 4-iron: 22.5, 220
Apex 5-iron: 25.5, 205
Apex 6-iron: 28.5, 190
Apex 7-iron: 32.5, 175
Apex 8-iron: 36.5, 160
Apex 9-iron: 40.5, 145
Apex PW: 45, 130
Jaws 50/10S: 115
Jaws 54/8C: 105
PM Grind 60: Who Cares

This new setup helped my gapping tremendously, my entire bag has been a weird puzzle lately but now it all kind of makes sense. The problem was from 4-iron thru 6-iron I just wasn’t getting the ball speed and performance to do anything but guess. It’s hard to play well that way. Not anymore. 

Here is how the whole bag gaps out now: 

Carry Distance in normal conditions: 

Driver: 280
3-wood: 255
5-wood: 235
Apex 4-iron: 22.5, 220
Apex 5-iron: 25.5, 205
Apex 6-iron: 28.5, 190
Apex 7-iron: 32.5, 175
Apex 8-iron: 36.5, 160
Apex 9-iron: 40.5, 145
Apex PW: 45, 130
Jaws 50/10S: 115
Jaws 54/8C: 105
PM Grind 60: Who Cares

The point is, for better players that struggle with the irons or are finding deficiencies in their setups, going into something like this and bending/tweaking the set to match what you need is a no-brainer. 

I’m a gear head to the core and as much as I want to strut around with Raw TCB’s, that path won’t help my golf game. I want to play well far more than I want a bag full of players’ irons. To be honest I truly believe I’ve cracked a code. I offset the extra loft and launch by going into a heavy low spin shaft, I combat the lack of spin by playing a spinny golf ball (CSX) and BOOM. I’m having a blast. Try it. I dare you. You won’t go back I promise you. 

Great review, totally makes sense. My GIR's are also my weakpoint. I hit about 75-80% FIR, and chip/putt well. GIR's are the key to whether I shoot ~79, or an "easy" 76 as a 4-5 handi.

My current makeup is the CF19 Apex combo set.  Love the CF19 Apex in the long irons because I really want point and shoot type performance for anything over 160y. I like the Apex Pro 19's bc they're basic cavity backs since I play a lot of partial, choke up, and feel shots in the lower irons. Any concerns with feel or consistency with the Apex's for these type of shots? 

 

[Hook DeLoft]

Congrats on the improvements.  Given how close the lofts are, how do you account for the extra distance?  Lower spin?  Higher launch?

[Off The Tow]

Did you have your lofts weakened?  Based on Callaway, Apex 21 standard lofts are below. This could also explain your increase in distance...but I don't know what "Wunder Spec" means either.

4	21
5	23.5
6	26.5
7	30.5
8	34.5
9	38.5
10	43
AW	48

Edited June 9, 2021 by Off The Tow

[cnosil]

26 minutes ago, Off The Tow said:

Did you have your lofts weakened?  Based on Callaway, Apex 21 standard lofts are below. This could also explain your increase in distance...but I don't know what "Wunder Spec" means either.

4	21
5	23.5
6	26.5
7	30.5
8	34.5
9	38.5
10	43
AW	48

Yes he had the lofts weakened by about 1.5* as listed in his post.  The distance is probably related to playing more if a GI type iron vs players iron; he discusses his plan in the original post on this topic: 

 

Winder spec is simply what he is calling the specs for these clubs…attempt at humor. 

[Off The Tow]

4 hours ago, cnosil said:

Yes he had the lofts weakened by about 1.5* as listed in his post.  The distance is probably related to playing more if a GI type iron vs players iron; he discusses his plan in the original post on this topic: 

 

Winder spec is simply what he is calling the specs for these clubs…attempt at humor. 

Ah, I missed that, thanks! Makes a lot more sense now.

[JohnnyCallaway]

On 6/8/2021 at 2:02 PM, Hook DeLoft said:

Congrats on the improvements.  Given how close the lofts are, how do you account for the extra distance?  Lower spin?  Higher launch?

Launch and lower spin for sure

[JohnnyCallaway]

9 hours ago, Off The Tow said:

Did you have your lofts weakened?  Based on Callaway, Apex 21 standard lofts are below. This could also explain your increase in distance...but I don't know what "Wunder Spec" means either.

4	21
5	23.5
6	26.5
7	30.5
8	34.5
9	38.5
10	43
AW	48

All irons are a degree to 2 degrees weak

On 6/8/2021 at 10:58 AM, jlukes said:

He works for Callaway - so no surprise he doesn't have to deal with order delays

Fair lol