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Lie Adjustment and Club Face Marks


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I just returned from a hitting board exercise with my three sets of irons; Burner2 steel, Burner2 graphite, and Ping E55. All of the board marks on the tape show marks at around half way from the heel to the center of the club. The toe is certainly up when addressing the ball. Over the many years of playing my ball marks(abrasions) have always been outside of center; about the same distance from center as the board marks on the tape. 

My question is: Will bending the lie to move the board marks to the center of the club move the ball marks any closer to the center of the face, away from the toe?

 

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5 hours ago, jborchel said:

I just returned from a hitting board exercise with my three sets of irons; Burner2 steel, Burner2 graphite, and Ping E55. All of the board marks on the tape show marks at around half way from the heel to the center of the club. The toe is certainly up when addressing the ball. Over the many years of playing my ball marks(abrasions) have always been outside of center; about the same distance from center as the board marks on the tape. 

My question is: Will bending the lie to move the board marks to the center of the club move the ball marks any closer to the center of the face, away from the toe?

 

Trying to understand what you are saying.  You tested the lie angle of your clubs and found that impact was close to the heel.  You would adjust the lie angle to move the marks to the center.     You are also hitting the ball on the toe?   Adjusting the lie angle probably won't fix where you hit the ball on the face as it is probably a swing issue.   But you won't know until you fix the lie angle. 

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :callaway-small: 54-10S   :cleveland-small: 588  58-12
Putter:  :seemore-small: mFGP2

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180, :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, Bellum Winmore 787

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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1 hour ago, cnosil said:

Trying to understand what you are saying.  You tested the lie angle of your clubs and found that impact was close to the heel.  You would adjust the lie angle to move the marks to the center.     You are also hitting the ball on the toe?   Adjusting the lie angle probably won't fix where you hit the ball on the face as it is probably a swing issue.   But you won't know until you fix the lie angle. 

I have had a very slight outside in swing path forever. The hitting board shows it to be fractional in size. I've always credited the toe-ish(about 50% between the center and the scored face edge) pattern on the club face to swinging on that path. I wonder why you can't hit the ball in the middle of the iron even though you are an outside in swinger. Even though these clubs are supposed to be forgiving I'm sure I'm losing some yardage on my irons.

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1 hour ago, jborchel said:

I have had a very slight outside in swing path forever. The hitting board shows it to be fractional in size. I've always credited the toe-ish(about 50% between the center and the scored face edge) pattern on the club face to swinging on that path. I wonder why you can't hit the ball in the middle of the iron even though you are an outside in swinger. Even though these clubs are supposed to be forgiving I'm sure I'm losing some yardage on my irons.

A lie board doesn't really reflect path; it tells you what part of the sole hits the ground.  your path might not be why you are hitting it on the toe. you can hit the center with an inside out or an outside in swing.    Forgiving doesn't mean that you will get the exact same distance with an off center strike;  it means you won't lose as much distance.    Or maybe I don't know what you mean by a "hitting board."

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :callaway-small: 54-10S   :cleveland-small: 588  58-12
Putter:  :seemore-small: mFGP2

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180, :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, Bellum Winmore 787

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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10 minutes ago, cnosil said:

A lie board doesn't really reflect path; it tells you what part of the sole hits the ground.  your path might not be why you are hitting it on the toe. you can hit the center with an inside out or an outside in swing.    Forgiving doesn't mean that you will get the exact same distance with an off center strike;  it means you won't lose as much distance.    Or maybe I don't know what you mean by a "hitting board."

I think a lie board and a hitting board are the same thing. It’s a plastic board you hit ball off of with tape on the bottom of the club. I’m using electrical tape so the black marks clearly shoe the club path. So if it’s not the path that’s causing the toe hits then it must be the lie. Or is it?

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1 minute ago, jborchel said:

I think a lie board and a hitting board are the same thing. It’s a plastic board you hit ball off of with tape on the bottom of the club. I’m using electrical tape so the black marks clearly shoe the club path. So if it’s not the path that’s causing the toe hits then it must be the lie. Or is it?

wanted to make sure we were talking about the same thing  Toe hits can be cause by raising your hands, moving your hands closer to your body,  weight shifting back, etc.    Neither lie angle or path are a direct cause of hitting the ball off the toe;  they are more related to ball flight.    

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
               :titelist-small: 915H 24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :callaway-small: 54-10S   :cleveland-small: 588  58-12
Putter:  :seemore-small: mFGP2

Backups:  :bobby-grace-1: 6330, :taylormade-small:TM-180, :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, Bellum Winmore 787

 

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, cnosil said:

wanted to make sure we were talking about the same thing  Toe hits can be cause by raising your hands, moving your hands closer to your body,  weight shifting back, etc.    Neither lie angle or path are a direct cause of hitting the ball off the toe;  they are more related to ball flight.    

If that's the case then I probably need a lesson to see if the pro can isolate myself toe hit issue. As I get older I can't afford to give up much more distance.

Edited by jborchel
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If you get the clubs bent a little more flat, you should strike the center of the sole. I also recommend you put tape on the face to see where you are striking the ball to ensure you have the right length. If you are striking the ball near the center of the face but hitting on the sole closer to the hosel then you should get your clubs bent a little flatter. If you are hitting out on the toe, your clubs may be a little short and you should try gripping out to the end of the grip to see if that changes your face contact location.2 It could also be your swing but if you're not unhappy with your swing, I would get the clubs bent. You can always bend them back if you need to.

FYI, it is normal for the toe to look a little up at address since the toe will actually dip down when you're hitting the ball. This is why using tape and lie boards is called a "dynamic" fitting. 

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3 hours ago, Kansas King said:

If you get the clubs bent a little more flat, you should strike the center of the sole. I also recommend you put tape on the face to see where you are striking the ball to ensure you have the right length. If you are striking the ball near the center of the face but hitting on the sole closer to the hosel then you should get your clubs bent a little flatter. If you are hitting out on the toe, your clubs may be a little short and you should try gripping out to the end of the grip to see if that changes your face contact location.2 It could also be your swing but if you're not unhappy with your swing, I would get the clubs bent. You can always bend them back if you need to.

FYI, it is normal for the toe to look a little up at address since the toe will actually dip down when you're hitting the ball. This is why using tape and lie boards is called a "dynamic" fitting. 

I just ordered a bending device so I will go back and forth between the Bender and the board until it is just right. I'm also going to try the concept of magic marking a vertical line on the ball also.

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