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8th Hole - Belmont Golf Course - Richmond, VA
350 Yards

image.png.48505142717ce3742d28c4b97c1fd4b3.png

The triangle is 250 yards long (my average with the driver).  The width is 57 yards.  You can't see it from this image, but there's a small penalty area to the right of the triangle with very high grass around it (likely lost ball and nearly impossible to get out of if you do find it).

My usual driver shot shape is left-to-right, and I can't hit driver over the trees to the left that are closer to the tee.  And sometimes the fade is just a pull, so I need to start a driver far enough right to miss the trees short left.  I usually hit driver if I have 65 yards to use, so I feel like it's a little too narrow here to hit driver.  My 19* hybrid goes about 220 and should still leave me a full PW into the green.  

I've just started playing here again after a recent renovation (the Google Earth images are old), so I've only played this hole a couple of times recently, tried several clubs off the tee, haven't hit any of them well.  I'm thinking that the hybrid is the play, just because those trees short and left won't let me bail out way left away from the penalty area.

What do you guys recommend?

 

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What is your GIR or proximity on approaches from 100 yards versus 130? If you play the hole 10 times with driver how many times do you hit it in the penalty area? 

Play it 10 ways with each club and see which scores better. If the scoring is similar with both tee clubs, then it becomes situational. Right to left wind, probably OK to hit driver. Hitting driver relatively straight and on target on the front 9? Hit driver. 

If 250 is your average, that means you should hit driver 260-270 on good shots. If you start comparing an 80-90 yard wedge vs 130, you should start seeing benefit in that situation. Maybe grip down an inch on driver and try to make an easier swing and see if that helps. 

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I’m with @BMart519on this. For me would depend on how my driver was working that day and I would play it safe. YMMV 

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The triangle is fine, but consider drawing a "triangle" using your normal shot shape for the two long legs.  On the left side it would have to stay right of the first batch of trees, ending up in the left-center of the fairway, maybe further right.  You know your shape, you can do this.  On the right side, the end has to stay left of the Penalty Area.  NOW what's the available width?  40 yards maybe?  45?  That does seem pretty tight to me.  If you can learn to hit the driver straighter or higher, that would open the hole up a good bit, but you have to make decisions on the shots you have right now.  I agree with you, the shorter club is probably the right choice.  And the right choice is not dependent on the length of the hole, to me, its a matter of getting the maximum distance possible while maintaining an acceptable level of risk.

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Assuming that dropping back a club takes the penalty area out of play and you are left with a wedge into the green then dropping back seems like the right play.   Green looks to be decent sized with some room to not just play to the middle.  

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57 yards is a lot of room. That’s just over the width of a football field. Take driver from middle of the tee area aim just just inside the left corner of the triangle and swing away

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Hit your 200 yard club, leaving your 150 club into the green.  There is a hole similar to this that I play, but it’s a forced layup for me.  I hit my 190-200 club, leaving me about 120-140 in depending on hole location.

 

If you are comfy with the 150 club, that’s how I would approach it.  
 

Or 210, 220, give yourself the best 2nd shot into the green that works best for you.  

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If your hitting wedge or less it's probably a good shot off the tee. Keep dropping down until you find something your comfortable with and confident in. Even try splitting the hole in half, hit your 175 club twice. I'm guessing the idea is to just keep the big number off the scorecard?

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If 250 is a good drive, all things considered, and you're likely to be shorter if you miss it just a bit, I'd hit driver. It would appear you have plenty of room for that.

I'm not a huge fan of dropping back, as a mishit hybrid is nothing more than shorter than a mishit driver in most cases. Now, if your mishit hybrid still gives you a wedge into the green, then by all means that's probably an OK play as well.

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more and more i'm finding myself not pulling driver on holes like this.  

i'd play it as 5i (220 club) and either full gap wedge or soft PW from 130.  

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Personally, at the age of 75, I would always hit away from danger and have a simple shot into the green, again avoiding danger surrounding the greens.  At my age, I always play to yardages that are in my comfort zone.  With respect.   

 

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Buy a new driver that you hit 260 🤣. If 220 takes the penalty area out and doesn't bring anything else into play then that is the play. Leaving a wedge to the green even if it is a longer wedge is fine. If 220 doesn't remove the trouble or brings the bunkers into play then you may have to reassess. Is it any wider at 220? From the pic it appears it is the same width and 220 may bring the front of the hazard into play or bunkers? 55-60 yards is borderline for a driver but if there are no wider or better options send it is the right play. 

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Hit driver from the tee.   Aim  down the left inside the tree-line.  I usually tee the ball slightly lower, and move it back about a ball from my normal driver position.  That almost guarantees a low fade that runs, because the ball is teed down, and the club doesn't quite get square before you get to the ball. It also sort of takes the pull out of the equation.   That should put you close enough (150 or less) for your approach.  Since you favor the left-to-right (fade), you can aim your approach off the left bunkers and you have all sorts of room short and to the right before the right bunkers become a problem.    Play your normal shot shape to your advantage.  Your minimum yardage on the approach should be enough to get you  5 yards over either of the front bunkers.  If you draw a line across the backside of both front bunkers... beyond that with a fade off the left bunkers you have all sorts of landing room.   

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Laying up seems to be the right play since you can't hit driver past/over the yardage that the trouble is located at. The hole is short enough that using less than driver should be just fine.

My son-in-law owns a house that borders this course but I've never had the chance to play it. Is it true that there are going to tear it up and make a 12-hole course out of it? I thought I had read that somewhere...

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The answer is to develop a fade you can trust.  Do that and you can tee off with anything giving 200 - aiming to start at the left hand edge fairway and leaving a shot at the green. 

It looks like barring behind a tree, the right hand side of the fairway (and even under the tree) gives a clear shot.  In fact fade- fade is a probably the easiest shot sequence to visualise  unless pin is back left.

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I would pound the crap out of my driver...190 right down the middle. Then a five hybrid to the green. If I don't hit the drive well I would hit 5 wood.

This is identical to the #1 hole at the course I play. All spring we got no roll and it was cool and windy. Usually hit 3 wood for my second...occasionally a 5.

When you get over 75...you really have to enjoy the game for what it is.

 

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Don’t hit driver.  Hit the hybrid and a full PW to center of green.  Hopefully, you can make a birdie, but at least a par and move on. 

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I agree on the 5i piece, or even less if you can slap a 6i out there further. How are you with your long irons? Could you play the whole out 150-160 then a 190-200 club in? I do read the post really is about how to avoid the danger. It's smart to make sure danger isn't hit in to, but are your misses into the junk more because you also can't stop thinking about it? Above someone mentioned trying to play the hole 10 different ways each and see how that works. How is your visualization on the tee? 

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3 hours ago, goaliedad30 said:

One of the factors for me liking the 210-220 option is that it's the first hole. Put the tee shot in play, hit a short iron onto the green, make an easy par and move on.

At least for me, if the first shot of the day puts me in trouble, I feel like I'm chasing the round, versus having a simple, solid start.

1st hole of the day?  Not unless it's a scramble.  It says it's hole #8.

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For @HardcoreLooper, I took a look on Google Earth, and it looks even tighter than you described, maybe 50 yards wide from the small tree on the left to the penalty area right  It makes sense to me to take the Penalty Area and/or potential lost ball on the right out of play, and that means hitting something around 200 yards off the tee.  If you're a little left or right, you could still have trouble reaching the green, but at least you won't be taking penalty strokes.

For @Shankster, laying up to avoid a difficult downhill lie seems perfectly logical to me.  You're also taking the penalty area to the left out of play, it looks like driver could reach that easily.

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Another thing would be to learn how to hit a  draw

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

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46 minutes ago, MarineJoe said:

Lessons

 

27 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Another thing would be to learn how to hit a  draw

All of this is true, but if he's playing that hole this afternoon, what's the right way for HIM to play it with the skills he has now.  

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21 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Another thing would be to learn how to hit a  draw

Funny thing about that is even most pro's today wouldn't change their shot shape for the way a hole lays out.  It happens rarely enough that it is called out by commentators.  Earlier this year JT had to play a draw on a couple tee shots instead of his normal fade and they had a special 5 min segment on it talking about how special it was he hit a low draw to follow the shape of a dogleg and let it run forever for an easy 2nd into a par 5.  I could just see somebody like Trevino listening to that and screaming curses at the TV for thinking it is special to be able to shape the ball either way!    😂

I am noticing a lack of 'studies show you should hit it as far as you can because even in the high rough you are better off closer to the green'  responses.  😄

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8 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

 

All of this is true, but if he's playing that hole this afternoon, what's the right way for HIM to play it with the skills he has now.  

If someone can’t hit a 50+ yard wide fairway with driver that’s a problem and if worried about a penalty area another 15 yards or more they probably need to hit whatever club they can hit straight 100% of the time. Then go schedule some lessons

 

6 minutes ago, Shapotomous said:

Funny thing about that is even most pro's today wouldn't change their shot shape for the way a hole lays out.  It happens rarely enough that it is called out by commentators.  Earlier this year JT had to play a draw on a couple tee shots instead of his normal fade and they had a special 5 min segment on it talking about how special it was he hit a low draw to follow the shape of a dogleg and let it run forever for an easy 2nd into a par 5.  I could just see somebody like Trevino listening to that and screaming curses at the TV for thinking it is special to be able to shape the ball either way!    😂

I am noticing a lack of 'studies show you should hit it as far as you can because even in the high rough you are better off closer to the green'  responses.  😄

True and someone like Zach Johnson won 2 majors and a bunch of other events only playing a draw. 
 

 

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Either 220-230 with a 3W then a 9i

Or 4i for 200 and 7-8i

I prefer mid, short irons to the green instead of wedges.

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23 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

If someone can’t hit a 50+ yard wide fairway with driver that’s a problem and if worried about a penalty area another 15 yards or more they probably need to hit whatever club they can hit straight 100% of the time. Then go schedule some lessons

 

True and someone like Zach Johnson won 2 majors and a bunch of other events only playing a draw. 
 

 

PGA players don’t always hit a 50 are wide fairway.   Most PGA pros only intentionally hit a driver in one direction.  

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   :taylormade-small:TM-180

Testing:   SPGC_logo.jpg

Backups:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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