Marshalls

[pulledabill]

Buddy and his cuz were playing at a local course yesterday when the marshall just happened to be on the #1 tee box. They were playing the tips (6850) and the marshall asked them what their hdcp was.Buddy tries to joke and says whatever club is in my hand. Marshall had no humor and told them they are really busy and should maybe move up a box (6300ish). Buddy said he would not and they both proceeded to smoke their drives from the tips. They were a twosome with 4some in front of them. 

Hole #5 same marshall approached them (they were keeping up just fine and waiting every shot) and told them that they both needed to hit as soon as the group in front of them  hit their shots from the fairway. Buddy said he would not because he is much longer than the  group in front of them and can reach the par 5s in 2. Marshall didnt like that he wasnt willing to change his game to accommodate the packed course.  

This rubs me wrong because all their marshalls (minus 1) are all like this and rule with what is almost an iron fist. Its to the point that when we see a marshall coming we say "who ÷&%$ up this time". Complete turn off to this course but we do play it a ton early season as it drains decently. 

They do a 7/8 minute tee time rotation so maybe thats on them for aiding in creating slow play. 

Buddy plays to a -2 while his cuz plays to a -6 so both certainly capable.

Edited August 3, 2021 by pulledabill

[Shankster]

The problem is the over booking of tee times.  Golf is time consuming as it is.  Add in slow play… it is miserable, I will leave the course if I have to wait at all.

[GolfSpy_APH]

11 minutes ago, Shankster said:

The problem is the over booking of tee times.  Golf is time consuming as it is.  Add in slow play… it is miserable, I will leave the course if I have to wait at all.

Exactly this!

I worked at a course and on most days it was fine with no real long rounds. All the regulars out for basically the first 4 hours then often with the evening rush it would slow down to a crawl on the course. The issue was 8 minute tee times. So for all the members its fine, they play every day and know the course and where their balls land so all good. However when you get newer people or just guys looking for a fun round, searching for balls, enjoying their time and not exactly playing slow, but always having a group right behind it compiles. Sometime nerves kick in and it gets slower. 

When I would Marshal I would basically go to 3 spots on the course. These were spots where either balls often ran out and could get lost or be hidden and on a few blind shots where often players would wait longer then needed because they needed to wait to be sure they didn't hit into the group infront of them. This helped keep things up to pace a little better, but rarely would I ever say get a hurry on because there is nowhere to go!

It wasn't because of the players, but because of the bosses pushing in that extra 2 or 3 tee times to make that extra bit at the expense of slower rounds on busy days. I mean I don't blame them for trying to make some extra money, but when it's that slow all I would prefer to do is stop and call it a day. I can sit, wait and enjoy time outside at home rather then being frustrated with slow play.

[DiscipleofPenick]

23 minutes ago, Shankster said:

The problem is the over booking of tee times.  Golf is time consuming as it is.  Add in slow play… it is miserable, I will leave the course if I have to wait at all.

Agreed. There are a handful of courses around me that do 6 minute times. I never play those factories.

[DiscipleofPenick]

I've never met a marshall worth his salt. Thankfully most courses here don't have them. Story time, so the last 2 times I ran into marshalls...

One, we were 2 couples going out for 9 holes on a Friday evening. It took us a little while to get down #1 but trouble started before we were even done with the hole. We were just getting to the green when the marshall zips past and drops a twosome off on the second tee. Then before we even finish putting out, he gets out of his cart and meets us on the green. Told "you need to speed it up, Big Met has a reputation for fast play." Ok first of all, you just dumped a group in front of us so where would you like us to go? Second, and this is stupid, this is the most jam packed course in CLE. Historically it gets 100k+ rounds a year and only in the golfnow era do they actually offer tee times. They were so busy you just walked up and got in line and operated like that for decades.

The other time we were playing as a two on Saturday morning. We were two because the equally inept starter let the other 2 off 30 min early because they were "here and ready" (wtf guess tee times are pointless). So we're stuck behind a foursome all day and they were generally 2 holes behind. Twice the marshall drove past them to yell at me because I didn't cross the fairway at exactly 90 degrees and needed to follow the rules.

#banmarshalls

Edited August 3, 2021 by DiscipleofPenick

[Siamese Moose]

I'll tell one good marshal story: a course near me has a blind tee shot with a dogleg and OB right as the second hole. If you tell the starter that you've never played there they sometimes meet you on the second tee, point out the line and the trouble, then drive forward and forecaddie. It is a very effective consideration. 

[garyt1957]

11 hours ago, pulledabill said:

Buddy and his cuz were playing at a local course yesterday when the marshall just happened to be on the #1 tee box. They were playing the tips (6850) and the marshall asked them what their hdcp was.Buddy tries to joke and says whatever club is in my hand. Marshall had no humor and told them they are really busy and should maybe move up a box (6300ish). Buddy said he would not and they both proceeded to smoke their drives from the tips. They were a twosome with 4some in front of them. 

Hole #5 same marshall approached them (they were keeping up just fine and waiting every shot) and told them that they both needed to hit as soon as the group in front of them  hit their shots from the fairway. Buddy said he would not because he is much longer than the  group in front of them and can reach the par 5s in 2. Marshall didnt like that he wasnt willing to change his game to accommodate the packed course.  

This rubs me wrong because all their marshalls (minus 1) are all like this and rule with what is almost an iron fist. Its to the point that when we see a marshall coming we say "who ÷&%$ up this time". Complete turn off to this course but we do play it a ton early season as it drains decently. 

They do a 7/8 minute tee time rotation so maybe thats on them for aiding in creating slow play. 

Buddy plays to a -2 while his cuz plays to a -6 so both certainly capable.

In fairness to the marshall, they probably don't get many 2 and 6 handicaps trying to play the tips, it's more likely 15's. So trying to get people to move up isn't that bad an idea. Once he saw them hit he should have left them alone, though.

[DaveP043]

I've read lots and lots of Marshal  stories, and two complaints are common.  First, its the marshal's fault that play is slow, they should do something.  Second, how dare they tell ME to speed up!  Of course there are times when the marshal does things poorly, but I'd ask every one a simple question.  Would you like that job, when you know you have to deal with people like YOU?

[bens197]

As someone who's worked on golf courses for 12 years, there are two kinds of marshals...

1) I'll work here for free golf and do the absolute bare minimum to give the appearance that I am doing my job. 

2) I am insecure, power-hungry and snipe young golfers while trying to flex some power.   

I would be curious to see how many other groups he dug into about how and where they are playing.

[DaveP043]

25 minutes ago, bens197 said:

As someone who's worked on golf courses for 12 years, there are two kinds of marshals...

1) I'll work here for free golf and do the absolute bare minimum to give the appearance that I am doing my job. 

2) I am insecure, power-hungry and snipe young golfers while trying to flex some power.   

I would be curious to see how many other groups he dug into about how and where they are playing.

Are you suggesting that none of them are actually doing a decent job?  I find that really hard to believe, that's not my personal experience.  There's no questions that there ARE those two types, but like almost all stereotypes, they're certainly unfair to a large percentage of marshals.

[Nolan220]

I never really had a problem with marshals .. Usually pretty nice and say hey can you try to pick it up a little bit or the group in front is on the next tee box so your group should be on the green which I understand. The one time which wasn't really a problem the marshal asked us to speed it up because the other group a head of us already teed off the next hole and we should be putting. The problem I explained to the marshall was we were a 4 some and they were a threesome and one of the threesome was the reigning member champ who is at like a 5 .. he agreed and just said make the group behind you isn't waiting, I said yes totally agreed and at that same time myself and marshal looked back at the tee box on the hole I was on and the group behind us was nowhere to be found ... he said thanks and took off to talk to the group behind us... 

[Shapotomous]

My experience is the good ones are far outnumbered by the ones that are doing the bare minimum for free golf.  I am playing lower to mid tier public courses not high end public courses or country clubs so that may be the difference.

[bens197]

29 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

Are you suggesting that none of them are actually doing a decent job?  I find that really hard to believe, that's not my personal experience.  There's no questions that there ARE those two types, but like almost all stereotypes, they're certainly unfair to a large percentage of marshals.

I'm suggesting that they're not very useful.  Slow and deliberate golfers will always be slow and deliberate golfers.  Fast golfers will always be fast golfers.  Nothing will ever change that, not even the most influential of Marshal.  Most courses would be better off allowing golfers to police themselves.

Never in my 34 years of playing have I seen a Marshall truly change the pace of a round.  I could write a book on the stories of members walking into the shop complaining about Mrs. V and Mr. W playing either too fast or too slow.  Every week, same story.  Same goes for college rounds, invitationals and PGA Section events.  

For those who are affecting change, you're a rare breed.

[Chip Strokes]

most courses i play don't have a marshall at all, and since i'm usually a single i'll take my pace of play under my own control and either play through if i can or skip a hole if it comes to it.  

i had a really good encounter with a marshall last weekend though.  the guys in front of us were either new to golf or the types to only play a few times a year.  they were playing the blue tees (one up from the tips) and were all over the planet on every hole.  deep in the fescue, searching forever for balls, hitting 10yd dribblers...the whole lot.

marshall came up to us on 4 and said he was going to ride ahead and say something to them about speeding up.  he came up to us again on 7 and said that he was now going to tell them if they hit one in the fescue to drop a ball and play on.  finally on 11 he drove up to us and informed us that he moved the group ahead of us to the front tees and if we waited on another hole to call the pro shop directly and he'd come handle it.

he did all of that without us complaining once.  it was definitely slow, and we waited on every tee box, but we weren't in a rush so we didn't see a reason to complain.  it was definitely nice to feel like he was looking out for our enjoyment though.

[Hook DeLoft]

4 hours ago, DiscipleofPenick said:

Agreed. There are a handful of courses around me that do 6 minute times. I never play those factories.

6 minutes?!?  Any course that does that should be called the Grinch. I wouldn’t touch it with a ten and a half foot pole. 

[Shankster]

I will say I did have a good interaction with a ranger when I played Hidden River.  They for whatever reason allowed me to book a tee time right in the middle of their club championship…

He started me on 10, checked in on 17, told me to go to 7 when I made the turn, come back and play 1-6 after hitting 9.

 

I waited for about 3 minutes on hole 10 for a group that has just made the turn. after that it was smooth sailing, never saw the club champ guys once.

 

I’ll go there again for certain.

[DiscipleofPenick]

3 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

I've read lots and lots of Marshal  stories, and two complaints are common.  First, its the marshal's fault that play is slow, they should do something.  Second, how dare they tell ME to speed up!  Of course there are times when the marshal does things poorly, but I'd ask every one a simple question.  Would you like that job, when you know you have to deal with people like YOU?

I am a delight, I don't know what you're talking about

[DiscipleofPenick]

1 hour ago, bens197 said:

I'm suggesting that they're not very useful.  Slow and deliberate golfers will always be slow and deliberate golfers.  Fast golfers will always be fast golfers.  Nothing will ever change that, not even the most influential of Marshal.  Most courses would be better off allowing golfers to police themselves.

Never in my 34 years of playing have I seen a Marshall truly change the pace of a round.  I could write a book on the stories of members walking into the shop complaining about Mrs. V and Mr. W playing either too fast or too slow.  Every week, same story.  Same goes for college rounds, invitationals and PGA Section events.  

For those who are affecting change, you're a rare breed.

I've been behind the group that is 4 holes out of position and never seen the marshall actually do anything about it. The cliche story is that they go to the group 3 back from that and tell them to speed up. 

And to your other comment. The power hungry ones don't just snipe at young golfers, they snipe and women & walkers too. My sister was varsity golf all 4 years and there were lots of times I got into with ranger. Even now my one friend's wife with play with us relatively often, and I can feel the attitude change when we roll up to #1.

And if I had a nickel every time I've been told "walking slows the game down"...

[Shapotomous]

7 minutes ago, DiscipleofPenick said:

I am a delight, I don't know what you're talking about

Me too.... I manage to put up with myself every day and haven't had a social clash with any of my multiple personalities!  

[DiscipleofPenick]

47 minutes ago, Hook DeLoft said:

6 minutes?!?  Any course that does that should be called the Grinch. I wouldn’t touch it with a ten and a half foot pole. 

And they don't turn away walk ups either. Take the money and get in line at #1. Played it twice, took over 6 hours both times, never going back. And it's the public course everyone raves about on my side of town. I don't understand it.