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Vice Pro Zero


MGoBlue100
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I shot this question directly at Tony, but thought I'd throw it on the table here, too.  Fused vs Cast?  I'm assuming fused is two separate pieces somehow joined together into a single cover?  Must be simpler than casting an entire cover?  Pros & Cons??

 

image.png.698c84b87cbbe568830b454b9c84c610.png

 

 

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"Where'd it go?"  "Right in the Lumberyard..."

126422322_PXGLogo_2.png.74a339363ba3931cc4fc226a253621f8.png Gen 2  0811 XF 10.5*  Graphite Design Tour AD DI-6x 
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Very interesting... And at that price point they could really make a splah

In my bag:

Driver: :cobra-small: Speedzone Xtreme 9.0* Fujikura Motore X F1 6X

Wood: :cobra-small: Speedzone Tour Fujikura Motore X F1 7X

Hybrids: :cobra-small: King Utility 19.5* Diamana Tensei White Pro 90TX

Irons: :srixon-small: Srixon ZX5 4-6 (1 degree weak), ZX7 7-PW Project X 6.5

Wedges: :taylormade-small: Milled Grind 3 50*, 54*, 58* Tour Issue S400

Putter: :seemore-small: Nashville Z1C 34"

 Ball: :bridgestone-small: Tour B X 

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I like their packaging but trying to make the connection between golf and a Mackerel.  Vice most definitely has an "out-of-the-box" approach to golf balls.  Anyone gaming "The Drip"?

53aa1fc0-77a2-4555-b219-fd77b326ac97.5c1cfeb2704bdf8da7be92dbc3fa42d0.png?odnWidth=undefined&odnHeight=undefined&odnBg=ffffff

And, if you happen upon one of these, hang onto it as they are a limited edition and may one day be a collectible. 

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:ping-small: G410 Plus, 9 Degree Driver 

:ping-small: G400 SFT, 16 Degree 3w

:ping-small: G400 SFT, 19 Degree 5w

:srixon-small:  ZX5 Irons 4-AW 

:ping-small: Glide 2.0 56 Degree SW   (removed from double secret probation 😍)

:EVNROLL: ER5v Putter  (Evnroll ER5v Official Review)

 

 

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That Vice Fugu is amazing!  

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Driver:  Ping 425LST 9*  (Aldila Rouge White 130) 

3 Wood: Sub70 Pro (13) (HZRDS Black 60)

3U: Sub70 (19.5) (True Temper Project X U) 

Irons: Sub70 699 Pro (5-Gap) (Dynamic Gold S300)

Wedges: Vokey SM8 54 and 58 (10S)  (Project X)

Putter: Some old green Nike Blade

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5 hours ago, MGoBlue100 said:

I'm assuming fused is two separate pieces somehow joined together into a single cover?

Wonder if it's something similar to what Srixon do with the ZStar series? There's a parting line that becomes visible after a while that is a result of their manufacturing process.

 

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:cobra-small:            Cobra F9 9.5° (Hzrdus Yellow X)

:srixon-small:                     H85 16° and 19° (Hzrdus Black 85 6.0)

:mizuno-small:                    MP20 MMC 4-PW (KBS $ Taper 120S)

:mizuno-small:                    T20 51°, 8° (KBS $ Taper 120S)

:mizuno-small:                    T20 55°, 9° (KBS $ Taper 120S)

:mizuno-small:                    T20 59°, 9° (KBS $ Taper 120S)

:scotty-small:                          Phantom X 5.5 34"

:srixon-small:                     ZStar XV

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I did receive a reply from Tony. He’s not exactly sure what they’re saying with the fused cover. I think he’s investigating. I’ll probably order some of these and the new gen gloves from Vice. 

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"Where'd it go?"  "Right in the Lumberyard..."

126422322_PXGLogo_2.png.74a339363ba3931cc4fc226a253621f8.png Gen 2  0811 XF 10.5*  Graphite Design Tour AD DI-6x 
:bridgestone-small:  Tour B JGR 15*   Fairway UST ProForce V2 7F5 76g X-Flex
:bridgestone-small:  Tour B JGR 19* & 22* Hybrid UST ProForce V2 90g X-Flex
:bridgestone-small:  Tour B JGR HF-2 irons (5i - PW)  KBS Tour 130x

:cleveland-small: CBX Wedges (50, 54, 58)  TT Dynamic Gold 115 Wedge Shaft
MATI  Mamo Putter 33"  Super Stroke Football League 3.0 Slim
:bridgestone-small: Tour B-RX

:918457628_PrecisionPro: Precision Pro Nexus Rangefinder

:PuttOut:FAN!

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I mean, at that price... Yes please. @fixyurdivotknows I'm on the Vice train. I did try that drip ball instead of my normal glowing red fireball, but my eyes had been so scorched looking at the red orb of death that I couldn't see it and played horrid golf. I switched back to the eye of thundera, and was able to see and hit the ball again.

But I'll probably get more drip ones when they come back in stock. I might have to get some zeros just to compare. And I literally thought I had locked in my ball choice earlier today after parsing they the ball test data for hours. Ratfarts! 

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WITB:

Driver:   :taylormade-small: SIM2 Max 12° - Accra TZ6 M4

FW Wood:     th.jpg.d6e2abdaeb04f007fd259c979f389de6.jpg Gen5 0311 7w  Fujikura Motore X F3

Utility:    :cobra-small: King Forged 20.5° Utility - Catalyst X

Irons:   image.png.cbfb2d938ea45d82004d9bdeb23cf643.pngD7 Forged GW-5i - Recoils

Wedges:   :Sub70:  JB 52° , 286 56°

Putter:   :taylormade-small: MySpider X

Cart: image.png.5aa5e9b8c0d6e08a2b12be76a06a07ca.pngOnewheel XR+

Ball: :srixon-small: Z-Star Diamond

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While I am on the Vice train currently I don't know how I'd feel about going back to a 2 piece ball from the 4 piece Pro Plus. The price points are fantastic that they offer and a decent quality from what I can tell this year

:ping-small: G425 LST 10.5 Aldilla Rogue White 70s

:titelist-small: TS3 15.5 3W Fuji Speeder Tour Spec

:titelist-small: 818 H1 19deg Hybrid Fuji Atmos White

:mizuno-small: JPX 921 Hot Metal 4-PW Nippon Modus 120s

:vokey-small: SM8 50,54, and 58deg Dynamic Gold Wedge Flex

:taylormade-small:Spider Tour Putter

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2 hours ago, RollingGreens said:

While I am on the Vice train currently I don't know how I'd feel about going back to a 2 piece ball from the 4 piece Pro Plus. The price points are fantastic that they offer and a decent quality from what I can tell this year

They're advertising it as a 3-piece ball.  It's just that the cover description is something I've not heard of before.

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"Where'd it go?"  "Right in the Lumberyard..."

126422322_PXGLogo_2.png.74a339363ba3931cc4fc226a253621f8.png Gen 2  0811 XF 10.5*  Graphite Design Tour AD DI-6x 
:bridgestone-small:  Tour B JGR 15*   Fairway UST ProForce V2 7F5 76g X-Flex
:bridgestone-small:  Tour B JGR 19* & 22* Hybrid UST ProForce V2 90g X-Flex
:bridgestone-small:  Tour B JGR HF-2 irons (5i - PW)  KBS Tour 130x

:cleveland-small: CBX Wedges (50, 54, 58)  TT Dynamic Gold 115 Wedge Shaft
MATI  Mamo Putter 33"  Super Stroke Football League 3.0 Slim
:bridgestone-small: Tour B-RX

:918457628_PrecisionPro: Precision Pro Nexus Rangefinder

:PuttOut:FAN!

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Went on a split 5 dozen with my homie. I game the Vice Pro but used the lower priced Tour when I was just starting out and even those were great. Hope they eventually bring the color options to the Pro Zero because the neon makes them very difficult to lose.

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  • Driver - :taylormade-small: SIM (10.5°) - Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black (S)
  • 3 Hybrid - :srixon-small: Z H85 (19°) - Project X HZRDUS Black (S)
  • 5 Hybrid - :honma: XP-1 (25°) - Vizard (R)
  • 4I-GW - :mizuno-small: JPX 900 Hot Metal - Nippon NS (R - +0.5)
  • SW - :honma: TW-w4 (56°/12 - Nippon Modus 125)
  • LW - :honma: TW-w4 (60°/8 - Nippon Modus 125)
  • Putter - Kirkland Signature KS-1
  • Ball - :bridgestone-small: Tour B X
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I love the neon red.  It is so easy to see! Haven't tired the lime yet, maybe next round. 

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Driver:  Ping 425LST 9*  (Aldila Rouge White 130) 

3 Wood: Sub70 Pro (13) (HZRDS Black 60)

3U: Sub70 (19.5) (True Temper Project X U) 

Irons: Sub70 699 Pro (5-Gap) (Dynamic Gold S300)

Wedges: Vokey SM8 54 and 58 (10S)  (Project X)

Putter: Some old green Nike Blade

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Too bad these weren’t available a few weeks ago so they could have been added to the ball test.

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On 8/18/2021 at 7:04 PM, Jonny_Crash said:

I love the neon red.  It is so easy to see! Haven't tired the lime yet, maybe next round. 

Interesting. The neon red is too dark for my taste, even harder to see than white. But the neon lime is money.

I've been playing the Pro for few years now, so if I can get similar results for less money, I'm all in!

Couldn't find the Pro Zero on their German website either.

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On 8/18/2021 at 1:38 PM, TBT said:

Too bad these weren’t available a few weeks ago so they could have been added to the ball test.

time to spin up the conspiracy theory machine! what if Vice, following MGS' social feeds, knew exactly when the ball test would be and strategically released it right after, thereby generating sales without the scrutiny and thus, the possibility that the performance is lagging. This would then give them time to make adjustments based on player feedback until the next ball text (2023?)

now where's my tinfoil hat?

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Driver: :cobra-small: RADspeed 9* with Motore X F1 60S
Fun driver: :srixon-small: ZX5 9.5* with 47" Tensei CK White 60S
3-wood: :taylormade-small: SIM 15* with Diamana Limited 75S
5-wood: :cobra-small: RADspeed 18.5* with Motore X F3 60S
2i: :srixon-small: ZX with SteelFiber i95 Stiff

4i-7i :srixon-small: ZX7, 8i-PW Z-Forged, Modus3 Tour 120 S
50*, 54* :cleveland-small: RTX ZipCore Modus3 Tour 115
60* :cleveland-small: RTX Full Face ZipCore DG Spinner S400
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I'm guessing it's a mix of urethane and ionomer. Cheaper and more durable due to the latter. 

Anyone a chemist that knows if those two plastics can bond? 

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:cobra-small: King LTD @ 14.5*, Accra FX100 M3 42.5"
:cobra-small: King LTD @ 17.5*, Accra FX100 M3 40.5"/ :cobra-small: Utility Iron 3 @ 18*UST Mamiya 460ESX F4 39.25"
:cobra-small: Utility Iron 4 @ 21* UST Mamiya 460ESX F4 37"
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On 8/20/2021 at 7:14 AM, Kanoito said:

Interesting. The neon red is too dark for my taste, even harder to see than white. But the neon lime is money.

I've been playing the Pro for few years now, so if I can get similar results for less money, I'm all in!

Couldn't find the Pro Zero on their German website either.

The Pro Zero was sent in an email as an early release. Marketing geniuses, make people give them their email! 

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4 hours ago, Tony Covey MGS said:

In my opinion, Vice does some cool stuff in terms of branding and not being afraid to try some stuff that's a little weird by conventional standards, but...

 

Some of the marketing walks and maybe crosses the line. "Engineered in Germany" is a good place to start. Define "engineering". As I've joked on NPG, if I call my local pizza place and tell them what I want on a pie, did I engineer a pizza or simply order it to spec?

 

That brings me to Fused Urethane and the new dimple design.

 

Consider this highly educated speculation based on the realities of the market. Like other DTC brands, Vice is having trouble maintaining inventory. As we all know by now, golf is super-hot so demand is outpacing supply for everyone. With small-to-mid sized golf companies, those issues are compounded by the realities of the ball market, namely, the big boys get the priority and whether we're talking about Snell and Nassau or Vice and Foremost, the big boy is TaylorMade. That's especially true as Foremost does the core and mantle production for TP5/TP5x. 

 

So what I think is happening is that Vice is struggling to get inventory from its primary supplier and to offset that, it's having a *new* ball with 344-dimples and a Fused Urethane cover made somewhere else. Every indication is that the ball itself is being produced by Feng Tay. They manufacturer RZN balls, the Mizuno RB Tour stuff, and countless stuff you've never heard of.

 

Feng Tay is pretty good, but definitely a step-down from Foremost. Why take a quality hit unless you absolutely have to? Better margins perhaps.

 

The *new* dimple pattern is almost assuredly the same one found on the RZN balls, and - if you feel like trucking trucking to your local Walmart - the Spalding tour balls too. I wouldn't be shocked if the new Vice is similar to the Spalding Tour. 

 

Regarding Fused Urethane - it's highly unlikely that Feng Tay has made a consequential material breakthrough during COVID. Possible, but unlikely -  and you can bet your house that nobody in Germany developed a new urethane process. The very high probability is that "Fused Urethane" is Vice-speak for injection molded TPE. Plus or minus a patent here or there it's the same process currently used by Bridgestone, Callaway and a bunch of others. It's only noteworthy because Foremost is a cast urethane provider so it's a fundamentally different way of putting covers on balls. Cast vs. injection molding from an advantage standpoint is one of those things where it depends on who you ask - and you'll definitely get quite a bit of 'we do it better than the other guys using a similar process', but the guys I know who source from multiple factories tend to favor cast. Probably nothing most golfers would notice or care about one way or the other, but it is what it is.

 

Make of it what you will, but this doesn't look like reinventing a wheel so much as it does finding somebody who already has a wheel to sell you.

 

Great insight Tony.  Completely spells out the game they might be playing. 

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Apex UW 17* and 21 *

5H Callaway BB21

7-PW Callaway Rogue ST Max Elevate 85 shafts

Wedges:  Cleveland CBX zipcore 46*, 50*, CBX 54*, CBX2 58*

Putter: Odyssey Stroke Lab Ten

Ball:  Callaway Chrome Soft X 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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