Newby Questions About Fittings

[Will A]

Getting back into the game, I feel like I've gotten my swing consistent-ish enough to seek out clubs that actually fit me.  The problem is, I am at a complete loss of how and where to start this journey.  There's a Club Champion close enough to me to not be inconvenient, but the just-released MSG driver survey has me doubting they are worth the money.  I've also got a regional chain nearby that Golf Digest ranked in the top 100, but I'm hesitant about doing everything indoors off of matts (more so with irons).  Then there's the golf coach I've used, but he seems to be brand (TM) specific, so I'm skeptical I'd get fitted for what's truly best for me.  Same with brand fitting days at my course.   And if I can somehow do it outdoors, how do I do a fitting with "real" balls rather than range balls (see ball test) without sending $500 worth of Titlists down range?

But more than anything, I'm cheap.  Just about the only thing I'm willing to buy new are the things that anchor me to the ground (tires, shoes, and mattresses).  I don't mind to pay for the fitting, but given my skill level, I'd much rather seek out a good lightly used clubs from 2-3 years ago than fork over $1500 dollars for new clubs.  (Not to mention the backlog in new clubs.)

I know I'm over-thinking all of this, but with a big commitment of resources (time and money), I'd like to do this right. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

Where you get fit isn’t as important as who the fitter is. In most places the price of a specific portion of a bag is about the same but there may be times where a Club Champion might be more expensive by upwards of $50. 
 

If someone wants to see actual ball flight, hit off grass vice turf or mat or doesn’t like swinging inside then an outdoor fitting is where they should go and do research to see who the best fitter in the area is. If those types of things don’t matter than an indoor place will be fine. As you the comment of doing an outdoor fitting the balls you hit will be provided by the facility or in the case of some titleist Thursday’s prov1s provided by the fitter. Even if just range balls the fitter should have things optimized to a Prov1 in the monitor settings.

If you are going to buy clubs 2-3 years old the fitting may or may not carry over to that set. Example if you get fit to titleist t100-s unless you buy the same shaft in the previous t100-s release you couldn’t save money and go find a set of Ap2 and expect them to produce the same results. 
 

If interested in seeing what works for you or not then the fitting can be as useful tool to help eliminate shafts and/or heads that work or don’t work for you. This could be used to reduce the risk of buying old not being a complete bad fit

[Chris1]

So I am glad you started this thread.  I have been battling with Club Champion or my coach for a couple weeks now.  There is also another local indoor place that I have heard good things about.  I pretty much would like to stick with Ping irons but open to try a few others, shafts and multiple brands to see.  I think one bigger advantage to CC is that they have the S.A.M. for putting and at the very least I think that is pretty cool.  Honestly the only think really holding me back is I hear that CC likes to get into some crazy priced shafts.  I hate to blow $350 on a full bag fitting just to not buy any clubs, lol.  At the same time I feel like my current coach who is a Ping fitter can get the job done and save me the drive and the cost.  

I haven't played for about 4 years and just got back into it last month.  About 4 years about I went to Titleist Thrusdays and got fitted.  The fitter let me hit a few balls with a 7 iron and some tape on a trackman and then told me I can just buy off the rack.  I left feeling like it was a total waste of my time and this time I would like to do it right.  

 

[RickyBobby_PR]

7 hours ago, Chris1 said:

I hate to blow $350 on a full bag fitting just to not buy any clubs, lol.  At the same time I feel like my current coach who is a Ping fitter can get the job done and save me the drive and the cost.  

I haven't played for about 4 years and just got back into it last month.  About 4 years about I went to Titleist Thrusdays and got fitted.  The fitter let me hit a few balls with a 7 iron and some tape on a trackman and then told me I can just buy off the rack.  I left feeling like it was a total waste of my time and this time I would like to do it right.  

1) You can tell the CC fitter your budget and he/she will work with that so you won’t have to get into the upgrade shafts if you don’t want 2) you have no obigatuon to buy from CC you can pay for the fitting get your specs and buy elsewhere whether you do stock or upcharged items 3) it will give you a good idea about what works for you and if there’s something that doesn’t whether club type of shaft.

There’s nothing wrong with your coach doing ping if you are ok with ping clubs.

Not sure what to say about the titleist Thursday but that’s far from the experience anyone I know and my own experience with titleist Thursday’s 

[Chris1]

Yeah the Titleist fitting was a flop for sure. If I recall correctly it I was one of the last ones that day and the guy was just tried I’m sure or just having a bad day.  

[cnosil]

9 hours ago, Chris1 said:

So I am glad you started this thread.  I have been battling with Club Champion or my coach for a couple weeks now.  There is also another local indoor place that I have heard good things about.  I pretty much would like to stick with Ping irons but open to try a few others, shafts and multiple brands to see.  I think one bigger advantage to CC is that they have the S.A.M. for putting and at the very least I think that is pretty cool.  Honestly the only think really holding me back is I hear that CC likes to get into some crazy priced shafts.  I hate to blow $350 on a full bag fitting just to not buy any clubs, lol.  At the same time I feel like my current coach who is a Ping fitter can get the job done and save me the drive and the cost.  

I haven't played for about 4 years and just got back into it last month.  About 4 years about I went to Titleist Thrusdays and got fitted.  The fitter let me hit a few balls with a 7 iron and some tape on a trackman and then told me I can just buy off the rack.  I left feeling like it was a total waste of my time and this time I would like to do it right.  

 

There are lots of posts on the forums about fittings and people’s thoughts on CC, coaches, chain stores, and local dedicated fitters as well as indoor vs outdoor and other considerations.   
 

Puttlab is definitely a cool toy just like launch monitors, but without a competent operator/fitter they don’t make for a better fitting.  The fitters knowledge on how to apply that information is really the key to any fitting.   
 

If you like Ping then get Ping.  A fitter should be able to get you a good fit in pretty much any brand since they all have a pretty wide range of stock shaft options.   Since you coach is smaller he could help you determine specs and possibly try older models;  which would enable you to search the used and closeout market. 

Not knowing your long term commitment level and only being back in the game for a month , I’d go down the coach path. 
 

[GaDawg]

Everyone has opinions, but I don't see the issue with getting fit inside. To me, you are in a controlled environment, no wind, not hot or cold. I have had several fittings over the years and all have been done indoors.

If you are serious about golf, it will be difficult to be successful and cheap at the same time. I can go out and purchase cheap golf clubs, but if they don't fit my swing, my game will show poor results. It all depends on what you want or expect out of your game.

[jrm007]

A fitting is only as good as the fitter.  I went to a big box golf retailer for a fitting.  The fitter tried to put me in senior flex. Likely due to my age and gray hair.  This was after seeing my driver club head speed of 102 mph.  Be careful.  Make sure a fitter is qualified.  And remember, distance isn’t everything.  Look for a shaft which gives you a tight dispersion pattern.

[#handsofstone]

As JRM007 said, be careful.  Many “fitters” aren’t.  It also helps to understand what good fitting parameters look like from launch monitor data.  Make sure your fitter is qualified and using a high quality launch monitor, such as Gcquad or Trackman.   If the fitter charges for the fitting, your charge should go toward the price of the driver or clubs, if you buy from them. Take a look at TXG channel on youtube, you can learn a lot from watching those guys go through a fitting.  

[Rob W.]

I did the exact thing 5 years ago, when both of my kids were done with travel sports. My process took a bit, but I didn't blow $350 either.

First, I went to a golf show where I could swing a lot of new offerings at the  same place in a short amount of time with company reps assisting with some customization.  Amazing how much time I saved because some sets just didn't feel or look right to me.

Second, once I narrowed down a club category (GI/Players distance) and 4 /5 models I liked, I went to the box stores a handful of times and tried different sets with some of the stock shafts.

I finally settled on the Mizuno JPX900 hot metals based on how constantly I hit them.  Remember a fitting is not a normal environment, so you will subconsciously alter your swing just because someone else is watching.

I then went to GolfTec when mizzuno was running a fitting event.  Got fit into a custom shaft and had the clubs bent 1* up, but since there was no obligation to buy, I told them I would take a couple days to think about it.  I dug out the business card of Maple Hill Golf in Michigan whom I talked to at the show, called them and got the custom set with Golf Tec specs for $200 less than Golf tec.  Part of it was no sales tax (good ole days) and part of it was favorable price.  Mizuno drop shipped the clubs a week later.

[higherplane]

Getting a fitting is especially important if you have an "unusual" build or swing speed or swing.  Agree to above that you should get cost applied to the new clubs if applicable. Also agree that you need to go to a fitter with a quality launch monitor that shows dispersion.   My belief is that you may want to consider doing this in pieces both to save money and to learn as you go,  if so start with irons.            

[HDTVMAN]

As a fitter, I would recommend Club Champion, a no to any Big Box Store. BB Stores employ ex-hamburger flippers who have absolutely no experience and learn with 5-minute videos. Their goal is to sell clubs, any clubs, whether the right ones or not. Best bet is to go to a club pro, or assistant pro, as they will point you in the right direction and possibly do the fitting. Many courses have demo days, but you have to sign up with the brand, but there is usually no cost or obligation. Once you're fit by a certified rep you'll have the knowledge to buy the right clubs from any brand. Demo days and the certified reps are the best and most cost-efficient way to go.

[Godawgs]

On 8/26/2021 at 8:38 AM, Will A said:

Getting back into the game, I feel like I've gotten my swing consistent-ish enough to seek out clubs that actually fit me.  The problem is, I am at a complete loss of how and where to start this journey.  There's a Club Champion close enough to me to not be inconvenient, but the just-released MSG driver survey has me doubting they are worth the money.  I've also got a regional chain nearby that Golf Digest ranked in the top 100, but I'm hesitant about doing everything indoors off of matts (more so with irons).  Then there's the golf coach I've used, but he seems to be brand (TM) specific, so I'm skeptical I'd get fitted for what's truly best for me.  Same with brand fitting days at my course.   And if I can somehow do it outdoors, how do I do a fitting with "real" balls rather than range balls (see ball test) without sending $500 worth of Titlists down range?

But more than anything, I'm cheap.  Just about the only thing I'm willing to buy new are the things that anchor me to the ground (tires, shoes, and mattresses).  I don't mind to pay for the fitting, but given my skill level, I'd much rather seek out a good lightly used clubs from 2-3 years ago than fork over $1500 dollars for new clubs.  (Not to mention the backlog in new clubs.)

I know I'm over-thinking all of this, but with a big commitment of resources (time and money), I'd like to do this right. 

I got fit by Club Champion in February and got my clubs in May. Best move I could have made. I was a 15 handicap and now I’m at 8. I love the clubs they fitted me with and couldn’t be happier 

[Dajgolf]

11 minutes ago, HDTVMAN said:

As a fitter, I would recommend Club Champion, a no to any Big Box Store. BB Stores employ ex-hamburger flippers who have absolutely no experience and learn with 5-minute videos. Their goal is to sell clubs, any clubs, whether the right ones or not. Best bet is to go to a club pro, or assistant pro, as they will point you in the right direction and possibly do the fitting. Many courses have demo days, but you have to sign up with the brand, but there is usually no cost or obligation. Once you're fit by a certified rep you'll have the knowledge to buy the right clubs from any brand. Demo days and the certified reps are the best and most cost-efficient way to go.

You are wrong about big box stores, some have very qualified fitters. Just do a little research and you can get a very good fitting. 

[chrisv]

Did Iron fitting at Club Champion in NJ that was XMas present from my kids. Objective was to replace my eight year old Callaway X2 Hot irons + Dynamic Steel shafts with something better suited to my swing, speed and age (67). First, Club Champion iron fitting is only done with 6I, no other lofts are used. So if you are NOT comfortable hitting a 6I, then you need to tell the fitter. The fitting starts with trying different heads. Once you settle on a head, you try different shaft combos. About 1/2 of my fitting time was used on heads and 1/2 on shaft combos. My only concern in retrospect was a head i didn't like might be totally different with a different shaft.

Second, Club Champion is a business. Their real business is to sell golf equipment. Club fitting is a means to that end. Make sure they give the iron/shaft/lie spec you decided upon, because they won't give it to you otherwise. They are also not budget conscious unless you really press them.

About 1/2 way through the fitting, the fitter offered these great hybrid graphite shafts. Felt great, only to find out they were $145/shaft. For seven iron set, these wonderful shafts added $1,000+ to the set. When I asked if there was something comparable for under $50/shaft, they said no. In dealing with a local pro shop, they found something extremely close for under $25/shaft installed.

In the end, I am extremely happy i went for the iron fitting. I have new set of TM P790s with KBS 65 gram shaft. I hit the balls straighter and longer than with my old Callaway X2 Hot irons. Most of all, I'm more confident over the ball with any iron in my hands, which means I'm scoring better.

[Specneeds]

I got fitted many years ago by the first of it’s kind company- they didn’t charge then because they would make money selling custom clubs- long out of business but not before the told me everything about you is standard except swing speed (118 with driver) so get X shafts & buy what you like. 

Ive bought many drivers, fairway woods & wedges in the intervening 25+ years. But am still playing old ping zing 2 irons.  I’m thinking of getting fitted for irons  this winter but expect the same results as if I went out & bought used Mizuno JPX forged with a stiff shaft.

[Joel C]

On 8/26/2021 at 6:38 AM, Will A said:

Getting back into the game, I feel like I've gotten my swing consistent-ish enough to seek out clubs that actually fit me.  The problem is, I am at a complete loss of how and where to start this journey.  There's a Club Champion close enough to me to not be inconvenient, but the just-released MSG driver survey has me doubting they are worth the money.  I've also got a regional chain nearby that Golf Digest ranked in the top 100, but I'm hesitant about doing everything indoors off of matts (more so with irons).  Then there's the golf coach I've used, but he seems to be brand (TM) specific, so I'm skeptical I'd get fitted for what's truly best for me.  Same with brand fitting days at my course.   And if I can somehow do it outdoors, how do I do a fitting with "real" balls rather than range balls (see ball test) without sending $500 worth of Titlists down range?

But more than anything, I'm cheap.  Just about the only thing I'm willing to buy new are the things that anchor me to the ground (tires, shoes, and mattresses).  I don't mind to pay for the fitting, but given my skill level, I'd much rather seek out a good lightly used clubs from 2-3 years ago than fork over $1500 dollars for new clubs.  (Not to mention the backlog in new clubs.)

I know I'm over-thinking all of this, but with a big commitment of resources (time and money), I'd like to do this right. 

Welcome back the greatest game!  Getting fitted for clubs can make a big difference and what people are saying is correct about getting the "right" fitter IMO.  But if I was in your situation and just getting back into it, I would fit yourself.  There are methods to determine lie angle, shaft length, swing speed, etc.  You can then take these numbers and look for a good used set.  Will these be perfectly fit for you, no.  But as you keep playing and improving you will eventually be ready go make the jump for a full fitting.  Again everyone is different and has different budgets.  Do what is comfortable for you.    No need to break the bank if you dont feel you or your game are ready to make that jump. 

 

 

[JSH1177]

1 hour ago, HDTVMAN said:

As a fitter, I would recommend Club Champion, a no to any Big Box Store. BB Stores employ ex-hamburger flippers who have absolutely no experience and learn with 5-minute videos. Their goal is to sell clubs, any clubs, whether the right ones or not. Best bet is to go to a club pro, or assistant pro, as they will point you in the right direction and possibly do the fitting. Many courses have demo days, but you have to sign up with the brand, but there is usually no cost or obligation. Once you're fit by a certified rep you'll have the knowledge to buy the right clubs from any brand. Demo days and the certified reps are the best and most cost-efficient way to go.

NOPE - I would AVOID Club Champion at all costs.  Literally 13 months ago to the date went in paid my $350 (decided to get "serious" about golf) and bought a great set of Titleist TS2 woods, T300 irons, SM8 wedges & Scotty putter for $5k+.  Exotic shafts, purring, I got EVERYTHING.  There were some red flags (fitter made the mistake of charging me for 13 Arccos smart grip SETS instead of 1 but he didn't blink at the then $8k price tag.  When I informed him of the mistake and wrongly went ahead with the purchase.

12 months, 53 rounds, and a dozen lessons later I'm not sure how much of my handicap drop (7.6 strokes) are due to the clubs.  The one thing I do know is that while I was having one of my grips replaced (Arccos sensor died - they replaced under warranty) I mention to the club builder (@ Golf Mart) the issues with my game, holding the green from 100-150 yds per Arccos.  He said to go grab my 8 through 6 irons and he would take a look. 

Measured them the issues were, (1) all of the clubs were 1/2" too long, (2) the swing weights were way too high D7-D9, (3) lofts were off (this probably due to my use), (4) they had fitted me to a low spin head with a low spin shaft (later confirmed with launch monitor).   He wanted me to try the same club with a different shaft and right away I was getting more height and because the swing weight wasn't crazy high I was getting more distance.

I schedule a fitting with him the following week and my "FREE" one and half hour iron fitting with him was much better than the CC. He had me hit a few heads, then a few shafts turns out the stock shaft model worked the best, but I liked the feel of one but the performance of the other.  His solution was to soft step my iron shafts so I could have the best of both worlds; ALL FOR NO ADDITONAL CHARGE.  

Big Box stores may hire ex-hamburger flippers (nothing wrong with that as long as they know golf and the tech) and CC may hire people with more "industry" experience but they're no better.  

I've seen this on may responses, its not the company (Club Champion, Cool Clubs, Dick's Sporting Goods, GolfMart, Etc...) that matters, IT'S THE FITTER.  You can end up like me with a s***** fitter at Club Champion and great fitter at GolfMart.  Talk to the fitter, do they want to know about your game, are they asking you the right questions, do they give you their opinions, is the first thing they do first thing they do grab the $400 driver shaft without going through through the various stock options?  If you're not familiar with golf clubs or the fitting process, watch some you tube videos (TXG, 2nd Swing, etc), they have a lot of great info on fittings.

Finally, sorry this is so long I needed to get this off my chest, I would avoid Club Champion because of their hard sales pitch, "we build the clubs ourselves so its better than the manufactures" bs, and overpricing for exotic shafts and standard shafts.  THEY UPCHARGED ME FOR SHAFTS THAT TITLEIST HAS AN NO UPCHARGE OPTION!  CC Are the greedy bastards!

[That’s Mr. Dirt]

Long story short: went to a well respected fitter, got fitted, spent a boatload of money, play with them for a few years, sought out the fitter for advice on a new series of clubs, he said to try this other brand I did not want to try, I mentioned my old set that had a dial to adjust the face for draw or slice, he said that doesn’t do s*** and it was there for show, I reminded him that I bought that set from him and that was the main selling point.  I bought a new set from someone else.

[Jzcrouse]

I went to club champion and it was pretty good just because of the wide selection of clubs and shafts they have. You can be upfront and say you don't want any custom shafts as they tend to try to sell those more. That way you can get a detailed print out of what they offer you then go buy them off eBay or something. I bought a couple things from club champion just because I wanted the upgraded shaft on a couple clubs but my irons I shopped around for since they were all stock components. But like others have said before it's really about who it is not necessarily where you go. Club champion trains their fitters the same but perhaps it's not consistent throughout the franchises. My guy was good though. 

[BigRV]

Check out Sub 70 Golf for anything you might need. They carry their own line of clubs for all levels of players. Everything from putters up to drivers. They have a fitting page on their site to give you a ballpark of what you need. Sub 70 is located outside Chicago, IL. It was a short drive for me to go and get fit by them in person. You can also have up to 3 irons shipped to you to demo for the price of shipping it that’s more convenient. You can check the reviews here. All very favorable. And their prices are very reasonable seeing that they sell straight to customers, NOT thru stores. 

[Steve Gawron]

As a retired club fitter, I would recommend getting a copy of Ralph Maltby's pamphlet "How Golf Clubs Work", available through Golfworks.com.  Ralph created the PGA courses for club fitting and is recognized as one of the greatest minds in club fitting.  The pamphlet is only 120 pages and can answer about 98% of your questions.  Focus on length, shaft flex, lie angle, and 'feel'.  If you get these right, you should have a set of clubs that will last many years and will out-perform most club sets costing north of $1000.

[Onestoptech]

On 8/26/2021 at 6:38 AM, Will A said:

I don't mind to pay for the fitting, but given my skill level, I'd much rather seek out a good lightly used clubs from 2-3 years ago than fork over $1500 dollars for new clubs.  (Not to mention the backlog in new clubs.)

 

The number one important part is finding a fitter you trust. If club champion in your area is open to public and not appointment only see if you can watch a fitting or two to get an idea of there knowledge. Also look into different courses in area usually one of them with have a brand agnostic fitter with a studio and a range area usually the our door area is hitting back towards the people on the range in these situations or next to the range. They will have a little shed for hitting off both mats and real grass. I've used club champion and liked my fitter I've used there. I then found a guy at reflection bay in Las Vegas who will play a round with you then a few days later will get you on a launch monitor and dial in the suggested gear changes. So ask around at the different courses you play. Someone is b staff will know the best fitter in your area. Most great fitters I've meet will only accept clients referred by other clients. 

As far as buying used clubs go; be very direct and find a few sets your interested online and show those to your fitter he can build something close to it and see if any of them work for you. 

Edited August 28, 2021 by Onestoptech
Added paragraph about used clubs.

[Onestoptech]

On 8/27/2021 at 4:43 AM, Chris1 said:

Yeah the Titleist fitting was a flop for sure. If I recall correctly it I was one of the last ones that day and the guy was just tried I’m sure or just having a bad day.  

I just went through the worst experience with my Titleist wedge fitting. I wanted to really see different turf interaction for my wedges. When I got there I was supposed to be like his 3rd fitting of the day. The guy I felt was having a really bad day or he was intoxicated on something. He left to half his gear at home and the one trackman he had with him he was building drivers for different people and not even paying attention to my ball flight. After like three swings he told me that's good. 

[Chris1]

Yep that sounds like the same guy I had. LOL. I am just going to have my local coach do the fitting, she is giving me the lessons anyway and Ping gave her top 100 fitters a few years back so I guess that is good. 

[LeafBoy]

     Thank you fellow golf nuts and players alike.  I think most of us would want to play with the ideal equipment suited our unique swing.  

We just do not want to go around in circles and ending up in the same place or worse off, right?

Could  anyone shed light on how to determine the  best length of irons?

I feel like the 1/4" or 1/2 " +/- is pretty conservative.

It was recently recommended for me to cut 2 Full inches off my irons. (which are 1/8 + btw)

 I believe my wrist to floor is 32.5" but this can't be the sole determining factor?

Any guidance on other good metrics to compare to arrive at the best answer?

 

thank you,

 

Robbie long arms-