Mizuno Pro 221/223/225

[RickyBobby_PR]

31 minutes ago, chisag said:

And feel is so very subjective. I don't think it is fair to compare a hollow head players distance iron to a solid forged MB but instead compare feel to other hollow head irons like P790's, T100S or Forged Tec.

Especially when many are equating feel to the sound. And these are all good comparison irons as well as pxg 

[MWGolf23]

5 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... Really not true at all. They are geared toward mid to low index players that either never had a lot of club head speed or those that have lost some speed in their losing battle with Father Time. And feel is so very subjective. I don't think it is fair to compare a hollow head players distance iron to a solid forged MB but instead compare feel to other hollow head irons like P790's, T100S or Forged Tec. I have not hit the 225's yet but played P790's that felt a little dead and T100S that had a very dense feel for a players distance iron. Ymmv of course ...

@chisag My apologies. I said higher handicap and I should have clarified that it is for higher handicap than blade players. Higher handicap has definitely changed in my mindset to be 10-20 in MyGolfSpy's forum as most involved in this forum are no higher than that. A lot of good golfers here. Mizuno I believe often mentions 10+ handicap with some lower handicaps adding them in the long irons for extra help (don't exactly quote me on that). And when the product team is discussing the irons, they typically say higher handicap in reference to the other clubs, while mentioning the handicap range. So not super high handicap for sure. Players Distance. Good players seeking more distance/forgiveness for sure. You are correct in thinking it is not a GI iron with a ton of offset and we are on the same page with who should play this iron. Yes, I agree on the distance piece 100% and mentioned that. My father in fact finally got fitted and gained substantial distance moving from a more traditional loft set to the P790 and his handicap is similar to mine.

The person I was responding to was mentioning the Mizuno feel and that is why he is wanting to get rid of his 225s. The 225s aren't going to feel the best. The Mizuno feel is exclusively about their blades and small cavity forged irons. You are not going to get the coveted Mizuno feel from a hollow body iron or a GI club. It has to be a forged blade or a small cavity club. But yes, 225s could very well feel better than P790s. I too have not compared them against each other.

[Sluggo42]

On 3/11/2022 at 6:17 PM, chisag said:

 

... While I have no doubt Golftec is always trying to add lessons to anything they do, especially a fitting, I don't think they targeted or tricked you. I was just having some fun a little at your expense. And as you said, you liked the guy and were ready for lessons anyway so we are all looking forward to hearing how your lessons go. 

I started a thread in the “lessons” catagory, as today was first lesson…

[chisag]

4 hours ago, MWGolf23 said:

@chisag My apologies. I said higher handicap and I should have clarified that it is for higher handicap than blade players. Higher handicap has definitely changed in my mindset to be 10-20 in MyGolfSpy's forum as most involved in this forum are no higher than that. A lot of good golfers here. Mizuno I believe often mentions 10+ handicap with some lower handicaps adding them in the long irons for extra help (don't exactly quote me on that). And when the product team is discussing the irons, they typically say higher handicap in reference to the other clubs, while mentioning the handicap range. Players Distance. Good players seeking more distance/forgiveness for sure. You are correct in thinking it is not a GI iron with a ton of offset and we are on the same page with who should play this iron. Yes, I agree on the distance piece 100% and mentioned that. My father in fact finally got fitted and gained substantial distance moving from a more traditional loft set to the P790 and his handicap is similar to mine.

The person I was responding to was mentioning the Mizuno feel and that is why he is wanting to get rid of his 225s. The Mizuno feel is exclusively about their blades and small cavity forged irons. You are not going to get the coveted Mizuno feel from a hollow body iron or a GI club. It has to be a forged blade or a small cavity club. But yes, 225s could very well feel better than P790s. I too have not compared them against each other.

 

... No apologies necessary just a friendly disagreement of the original post.   Having played MP33's and written a WRX review for the MP59's several years ago I know what you mean. As a + index the Pro 223's would be my first choice if I were looking to replace my Cobra MIM irons but I love these irons so a set of Pro 225's would be my choice. At 68 I hit my 4 iron a comfortable 190-195 and if I could stretch that to 200-205 my gapping would be a little better so I have ordered a set of the '22 Forged Tecs and hope they beat out my MIM's or even just replace my long irons but I am open to whatever works.

... I am very much a feel player and appreciate a soft dense feel and am spoiled by the MIM's that look so good at address and feel as soft (or softer) then Mizuno's I have played but the feel is a little different and really unique. I can play a club that doesn't feel as dense and soft as I would like but I can't play a club that feels bad, so I am hoping the hollow headed FT's feel good enough if the performance is there.  

[MWGolf23]

9 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... No apologies necessary just a friendly disagreement of the original post.   Having played MP33's and written a WRX review for the MP59's several years ago I know what you mean. As a + index the Pro 223's would be my first choice if I were looking to replace my Cobra MIM irons but I love these irons so a set of Pro 225's would be my choice. At 68 I hit my 4 iron a comfortable 190-195 and if I could stretch that to 200-205 my gapping would be a little better so I have ordered a set of the '22 Forged Tecs and hope they beat out my MIM's or even just replace my long irons but I am open to whatever works.

... I am very much a feel player and appreciate a soft dense feel and am spoiled by the MIM's that look so good at address and feel as soft (or softer) then Mizuno's I have played but the feel is a little different and really unique. I can play a club that doesn't feel as dense and soft as I would like but I can't play a club that feels bad, so I am hoping the hollow headed FT's feel good enough if the performance is there.  

The 2° stronger difference in 225 (30°) 7 iron vs the 223 (32°) 7 iron got me 10 extra yards. 223's could still very well be in play for you if you still want a softer feel. You can easily bend them stronger and get very similar yardage to the 225's if you want.

I'm sure the FT's will treat you well! Hard to go wrong with anything in the market today. The OEM's have done well to keep up with each other across the board. Mostly comes down to looks and feel of each club with very marginal performance gains, if any.

[GolfSpy TCB]

11 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... No apologies necessary just a friendly disagreement of the original post.   Having played MP33's and written a WRX review for the MP59's several years ago I know what you mean. As a + index the Pro 223's would be my first choice if I were looking to replace my Cobra MIM irons but I love these irons so a set of Pro 225's would be my choice. At 68 I hit my 4 iron a comfortable 190-195 and if I could stretch that to 200-205 my gapping would be a little better so I have ordered a set of the '22 Forged Tecs and hope they beat out my MIM's or even just replace my long irons but I am open to whatever works.

... I am very much a feel player and appreciate a soft dense feel and am spoiled by the MIM's that look so good at address and feel as soft (or softer) then Mizuno's I have played but the feel is a little different and really unique. I can play a club that doesn't feel as dense and soft as I would like but I can't play a club that feels bad, so I am hoping the hollow headed FT's feel good enough if the performance is there.  

As usual Chisag, your post sparked my interest.  I may have even inquired about this before to you... My all time favorite sticks were the MP33's.  In fact, I have considered finding a near(est possible) mint set and just go with it.  But what I'm interested in your opinion about is MP33's vs. the MIM's (which you and I traded notes about last summer), and the Pro 223 and 221's if you have had a chance to swing them with intent.  I too prefer "feel" over forgiveness... but my "feel" is significantly less consistent than yours... I know... but I'm working on that part.  You may have already given your thoughts on this, and I just missed it... so feel free to point me to your previous post if you did

[chisag]

2 hours ago, Tiftaaft said:

As usual Chisag, your post sparked my interest.  I may have even inquired about this before to you... My all time favorite sticks were the MP33's.  In fact, I have considered finding a near(est possible) mint set and just go with it.  But what I'm interested in your opinion about is MP33's vs. the MIM's (which you and I traded notes about last summer), and the Pro 223 and 221's if you have had a chance to swing them with intent.  I too prefer "feel" over forgiveness... but my "feel" is significantly less consistent than yours... I know... but I'm working on that part.  You may have already given your thoughts on this, and I just missed it... so feel free to point me to your previous post if you did

 

... I would not say I prefer feel over forgiveness, like most serious players I want both. That said forgiveness is low on my list as I want/need some but not more than a typical Players Iron. Which brings me to the MIM irons that have the best combination of feel, looks at address, performance and forgiveness. Granted I was playing Maxfli HT-100 balata balls back then but Mp33's had that melt into the face kind of Mizuno feel I have not found in many others, although Z101's come to mind. MIM's have a different feel, still dense and soft ... just different and unique. To be honest first few rounds I was not a big fan of the feel but grew to love it. A little low or on the toe and they do not feel as sweet, so kinda like MB's you instantly know when you miss the center but mishits are much less penal. I am not a MB fan because I think a quality Players Iron provide all the performance benefits of a MB with just a little forgiveness that can make all the difference on slightly missed shots and more importantly help on poor swing days. Ymmv of course. 

... I have not hit the Mizuno Pro series yet so I can't comment on their feel yet. 

[GolfSpy TCB]

1 hour ago, chisag said:

I would not say I prefer feel over forgiveness,

Thanks Chisag,  I didn't mean to over generalize your comment (or make incorrect assumptions).  Of course we need some forgiveness... we aren't Iron Byron or Ping Man, or whatever PXG calls their swing machine.  That said... the "melt into the face" feeling I got from a well struck MP-33 is what made me an obsessed golfer for life... maybe I should be mad at Mizuno for showing me what that feels like, so now I am up in the middle of the night running calculations in my head on how I can recapture it.  My gamer irons are awesome irons... but they don't give me that feel... or sound... which I am ashamed to say is also more important to me than it should be.  So even when I happen to make a mistake and catch one pure... and the ball flies high and straight to the target, hits the green - one hops and stops...... there is still a bit of disappointment in the feel and sound... because... it wasn't that MP33 feedback. 

Anyway, great comments as always... thanks for sharing you thoughts with us... I, for one, learn something about golf, or myself, ... or both, every time I read one of your posts.  Tim.

[chisag]

1 hour ago, Tiftaaft said:

the "melt into the face" feeling I got from a well struck MP-33 is what made me an obsessed golfer for life... maybe I should be mad at Mizuno for showing me what that feels like, so now I am up in the middle of the night running calculations in my head on how I can recapture it. 

 

... Oh I get it. I have told this before but I was playing Hogan '99's and the feel was just too crisp for my tastes. So I traded them in for my MP33's and was much happier. I was at the range and a guy next to me was hitting new Hogan '99's and after we both hit a 4 iron to the same green I asked him how he liked his irons. He laughed and said he loved them and had just traded in his MP33's because they felt like "mush" and the Hogans had a much more satisfying crips feel. I told him that was just so ironic as I had just traded in my Hogans because they felt harsh and I loved the melt into the face MP33's. 

... It was very informative for me and I took "feel" into account on all future reviews with comments like "If you prefer a crisp feel you will love these..." 

[GolfSpy TCB]

6 minutes ago, chisag said:

... It was very informative for me and I took "feel" into account on all future reviews with comments like "If you prefer a crisp feel you will love these..." 

Totally agree.  "feel" is subjective to each person, and not only how we perceive it, but what we each like.  Your '99 Hogan story is a great example.  I swear those MP33's actually wrapped around the ball and threw it up into the air.  haha.  When I find a demo set of the 221's and 223's at my local shop, I am looking forward to seeing how they compare to my memory of those 33's.  

[Golfspy_CG2]

Alriight, I can't remember who it was but early in this thread someone commented, that they were happy I ordered these as they would be able to get them in a couple months at the most!   Don't know if it was @bens197 @Middler or maybe @RickyBobby_PR has gotten old enough that F3 shafts are in his wheelhosue now

But here you go boys, it's also listed on WRX, so I'd love to see someone here get them.  

 

 

[RickyBobby_PR]

37 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Alriight, I can't remember who it was but early in this thread someone commented, that they were happy I ordered these as they would be able to get them in a couple months at the most!   Don't know if it was @bens197 @Middler or maybe @RickyBobby_PR has gotten old enough that F3 shafts are in his wheelhosue now

But here you go boys, it's also listed on WRX, so I'd love to see someone here get them.  

 

 

Wouldn’t be the first set of regular stiff shafts not fit for me that I played in irons

[Hook DeLoft]

47 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Alriight, I can't remember who it was but early in this thread someone commented, that they were happy I ordered these as they would be able to get them in a couple months at the most!   Don't know if it was @bens197 @Middler or maybe @RickyBobby_PR has gotten old enough that F3 shafts are in his wheelhosue now

But here you go boys, it's also listed on WRX, so I'd love to see someone here get them.  

 

 

Not the shafts I need. Are you taking requests for your next set?

[Golfspy_CG2]

59 minutes ago, Hook DeLoft said:

Not the shafts I need. Are you taking requests for your next set?

LOL! 
Actually it would be the next to next set. The next set is already ordered. 
 

Wilson D9 Forged  

although I played my T300 again yesterday and that was the deciding factor in listing these.  Just so good!! 

 

 

 

 

[bens197]

4 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Alriight, I can't remember who it was but early in this thread someone commented, that they were happy I ordered these as they would be able to get them in a couple months at the most!   Don't know if it was @bens197 @Middler or maybe @RickyBobby_PR has gotten old enough that F3 shafts are in his wheelhosue now

But here you go boys, it's also listed on WRX, so I'd love to see someone here get them.  

 

 

Today was the 4 week anniversary of ordering mine so while I’m tempted, I’ll wait another what?  6 weeks?  Oh well. 
 

I love the idea of trying those D9’s. Meow. 

[bens197]

Today is 5 weeks since ordering my 223's.  Not mad or bummed rather a measure for those who have recently ordered and are wondering about build / ship times.

[chisag]

1 minute ago, bens197 said:

Today is 5 weeks since ordering my 223's.  Not mad or bummed rather a measure for those who have recently ordered and are wondering about build / ship times.

 

... Should be interesting at least. Thankfully your session isn't in full swing yet. Last winter it took 3 months for one Mizuno wedge to arrive. 

[bens197]

2 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... Should be interesting at least. Thankfully your session isn't in full swing yet. Last winter it took 3 months for one Mizuno wedge to arrive. 

You're exactly right Sam.

I'm keeping a hands-off approach until the end of April.  I figure if I hit 7 weeks I'll reach out.  

Worst case I keep my Hogan's in play for the beginning of the season...hardly a consolation prize...

Best case, they're ready to go once the weather is truly ready.

[MWGolf23]

On 3/23/2022 at 12:51 PM, bens197 said:

Today is 5 weeks since ordering my 223's.  Not mad or bummed rather a measure for those who have recently ordered and are wondering about build / ship times.

Your patience is admirable. Nonetheless, I expect to have mine in time for a better part of the season (late spring/start of summer) 2.5 weeks in after ordering.

Edited March 24, 2022 by MWGolf23
added content

[bens197]

1 hour ago, MWGolf23 said:

Your patience is admirable. Nonetheless, I expect to have mine in time for a better part of the season (late spring/start of summer) 2.5 weeks in after ordering.

It helps when my existing set is just butter...I'm excited...Please share some pics when yours arrive!

[MWGolf23]

18 hours ago, bens197 said:

It helps when my existing set is just butter...I'm excited...Please share some pics when yours arrive!

Will do and you do the same! Yeah I'm not too beat up about it with my MP-18s. I will miss the blade look in my bag. Just looking for the added forgiveness 6-4 and a more correct shaft for me.

Edited March 25, 2022 by MWGolf23

[Sluggo42]

On 3/24/2022 at 12:08 PM, bens197 said:

It helps when my existing set is just butter...I'm excited...Please share some pics when yours arrive!

Butter.. the hogans… yup

im sitting here with $1700 (golf/football bet winnings) burning a hole in my pocket, and I’m jonesing for a new set… but just don’t know which way to go. 

[bens197]

1 hour ago, Sluggo42 said:

Butter.. the hogans… yup

im sitting here with $1700 (golf/football bet winnings) burning a hole in my pocket, and I’m jonesing for a new set… but just don’t know which way to go. 

Drivers-a-plenty on the market. 1700 could go a long way…

[d.lama]

Ordered on 1/15 supposed to be delivered 1/31 - Nope. Call shop, they can't get through to Mizuno turns out a ransomware attack brought them to a standstill. Ok, fine s*** happens.   

Shop finally is able to contact Mizuno on 2/21 and Mizuno says my clubs are set to be in production on 2/29 and I'll have them by 3/1. 

I call shop on 3/1, turns out Mizuno were out of 223 6i heads (they had everything else) and the shop asked them to just build what they had and send them. Mizuno said OK, they will be at your shop on 3/22. I call shop on 3/23 and they are so busy I call them back on 3/24. No Mizuno said, *nah we were never going to build just a partial set, so we didn't do anything at all*. But we have everything now and will build them on 4/1 so you should have them on 4/15 ... F#<K'n hell Mizuno.  

[Sluggo42]

4 hours ago, bens197 said:

Drivers-a-plenty on the market. 1700 could go a long way…

Don’t feel a need for a driver, the mavrik is good…

actually they’re all good- I just got an itch, and I’ve already got more fishing poles than I need!

im kinda likening the 790’s.. maybe a combo with the p770’s… there’s just so many options anymore

[chisag]

23 minutes ago, Sluggo42 said:

I just got an itch, and I’ve already got more fishing poles than I need! im kinda likening the 790’s.. maybe a combo with the p770’s… there’s just so many options anymore

 

... If you can find some cortisone cream (or lavender and coconut essential oils if you are into homeopathic cures) for your itch to last you a little while, be sure and take a look at the Cobra Forged Tecs coming out next month. Having played and loved the P790's I am looking forward to thinner toplines, slightly smaller blade and a little narrower sole in the FT's. I should have a set in hand and preliminary review by the end of April. 

[bens197]

6 hours ago, d.lama said:

Ordered on 1/15 supposed to be delivered 1/31 - Nope. Call shop, they can't get through to Mizuno turns out a ransomware attack brought them to a standstill. Ok, fine s*** happens.   

Shop finally is able to contact Mizuno on 2/21 and Mizuno says my clubs are set to be in production on 2/29 and I'll have them by 3/1. 

I call shop on 3/1, turns out Mizuno were out of 223 6i heads (they had everything else) and the shop asked them to just build what they had and send them. Mizuno said OK, they will be at your shop on 3/22. I call shop on 3/23 and they are so busy I call them back on 3/24. No Mizuno said, *nah we were never going to build just a partial set, so we didn't do anything at all*. But we have everything now and will build them on 4/1 so you should have them on 4/15 ... F#<K'n hell Mizuno.  

The amusing part about the ransomware attack (unbeknownst to me) was that it happened the day before I went for my fitting. 
 

Quite honestly it didn’t matter since it was February. I’d resigned to the idea it would take some time anyways since they were a new release and there’d be some demand.
 

My biggest frustration is what you describe, the moving goalposts. If they’re going to take 8 weeks, just be straight and say 8 weeks.  

[Sluggo42]

12 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... If you can find some cortisone cream (or lavender and coconut essential oils if you are into homeopathic cures) for your itch to last you a little while, be sure and take a look at the Cobra Forged Tecs coming out next month. Having played and loved the P790's I am looking forward to thinner toplines, slightly smaller blade and a little narrower sole in the FT's. I should have a set in hand and preliminary review by the end of April. 

That’s funny, as the top line is about my only dislike of the p790’s. I’ll take a deep dive into the interweb on the FT’s. They’re probably the most unknown to me. Altho, I do use the SZ fairway woods…

thanks for the tip…

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

Just got back from the golf show here in mass. I’ve been trying to be calm and play another year with my 790s…..I swung and was shaft optimized at the show……I don’t know if I can hold out a year for the 225’s…..soooo sooooo smooth

[yungkory]

21 minutes ago, Lacassem said:

Just got back from the golf show here in mass. I’ve been trying to be calm and play another year with my 790s…..I swung and was shaft optimized at the show……I don’t know if I can hold out a year for the 225’s…..soooo sooooo smooth

Doooooooo it