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Difference between lag/make putting


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I cant find any answers to this question online

Do you feel there is a different stroke with a long putt vs a short putt?

Do you have a total different setup for long putts vs short putts?

Do you have the same stroke regardless of the length of putt ?

 

 

Edited by Haro
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My goal is to make every putt regardless of length. If I miss I want it to be within a 36” circle of the hole. This circle drops the closer I get to the hole and from 4-5’ I expect to make 75% of them. The make percentage drops the further out I get.

 

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17 minutes ago, Haro said:

Do you feel there is a different stroke with a long putt vs a short putt?

Do you have a total different setup for long putts vs short putts?

Do you have the same stroke regardless of the length of putt ?

I want my set-up and stroke to be the same for every single putt, the only difference is the length/speed of the stroke.  To me, that's the only way to consistently hit my line and speed. 

The one thing that varies is my intended distance past the hole.  For shorter putts, the ones I believe I can make a significant portion of the time, I want to NEVER be short, so my intended leave is maybe 18 to 24" past the hole.  In that way, my longest putts end up 3 to maybe 4 feet past the hole, eminently makeable come-backers.  For longer putts, I don't want 5 or 6-foot come-backers, so my intended end point is right at the hole.  In that way my worst putts, short and long, are both around 3 feet.   I'd say the transition zone between these differing goals is from 10 to about 20 feet.  

For reference you can look at the Strokes Gained putting references.  PGA Tour pros are about 50% make from 8 feet, somewhere around 15% from 20 feet.  For most of us, you'd have to come in a few feet to get those make percentages.

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27 minutes ago, Haro said:

I cant find any answers to this question online

Do you feel there is a different stroke with a long putt vs a short putt?

Do you have a total different setup for long putts vs short putts?

Do you have the same stroke regardless of the length of putt ?

 

 

For me stroke length changes based on distance and I try to maintain the same tempo.  I also have the same setup for any length putt.  
 

in my opinion putting is about personal choices and understanding how those choices impact performance.  There isn’t a single answer; just like the full swing, on how to putt.  

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1 minute ago, Haro said:

what about routine?

Is there a significant change long vs short putts?

Nope. Same routine for reading the green, practice stroke and setup. Only difference is what cnosil pointed about about stoke length

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15 minutes ago, Haro said:

what about routine?

Is there a significant change long vs short putts?

Nope,  I try to be consistent.  There is a discussion thread on heads up putting where some people only do heads up on shot to mid length and then head down for longer putts.  Need to do what works for you.  
 

 

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23 minutes ago, Haro said:

what about routine?

Is there a significant change long vs short putts?

For a while now I've stopped taking a practice stroke for shorter putts.  For longer putts, I'm trying to rehearse a specific feel for distance, I don't care a lot about the specific path for that practice stroke.  For shorter ones, the distance feel is much simpler, so I don't need a rehearsal.  For these short ones, a "wobble" in my practice stroke could introduce a hint of doubt in my mind, so I prefer to omit the practice stroke and just hit the putt confidently.  After 50 years of playing, I bet I've made a half a million putts inside 5 feet, I know how to stroke those.

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... Putting is so personal, so that said I putted the same for short and long putts when playing Bent Greens for 35 years. I have always used a long, fluid pendulum stroke. I found that approach problematic on the Bermuda Greens here in Phoenix as short putts tend to jump off line when gently rolling to the hole, especially into the grain. I tried just making a longer stroke but that didn't compute with my internal hard drive  🤪  so I ended up taking a shorter back stroke and more aggressive forward stroke on short putts inside 2-3 feet. Routine is the same but the stroke is different. 

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I like the analogy that putting is personal. However; there is a difference for most on the long putts that qualify as a lag putt. The distance is the difference. I am not a accurate approach shot golfer so my putt is generally longer than most. Because I have a tendency to hit more lag putts my accuracy is better than when I hit a four footer. However when I hit it or chip it close my stance is more refined and my stroke is fluid and deliberate. So yes, its different, for me.

 

Aaron R

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Dave Pelz recommends on real long putts, to stand taller and use your chipping motion.  

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Three, Albatross'

Three Holes in One

Plus, when I was 5 the first ball I ever hit on a golf course went in the hole, so I have that going for me.

My bag is a mish mash of Srixon drivers, cobra and adams fairways, TA1 irons and Hopkins wedges, plus a Cure putter.  

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The only time I vary is on downhill putts. I tend to set up with my putter with a little forward shaft lean on most putts, but find I have a more delicate touch with the shaft more vertical that works better on downhills. Length of putt has almost no impact on my prep or technique other than a longer stroke with maybe a little more pop to it.

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7 hours ago, Haro said:

I cant find any answers to this question online

Do you feel there is a different stroke with a long putt vs a short putt?

Do you have a total different setup for long putts vs short putts?

Do you have the same stroke regardless of the length of putt ?

 

 

No, same stroke

No, setup is the same.

Yes, same stroke; different force applied.

Same routine.

We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.”

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As always, it depends what works for you.  My address for both likely looks the same to a casual observer, but there are subtle differences.  Since there will be relatively small breaks in most short putts, staying quite square is important to me so I can track a very specific line (more mechanical). I also hit just a tiny bit down on these, which keeps the ball tracking firmly.  On longer putts, since they are rarely going to travel on a straighter line than short putts, are more about speed.  Often several different lines can be taken depending upon green speed, slope of a the particular green your on, etc.  Hence longer putts are more about feel for me, picking a more general line toward the peak of the desired apex and then feeling the speed necessary to use whatever slope/break exists to get to the desired apex point.  I achieve this best when my stance is just a bit open when compared to a short putt.  Different strokes for different folks, keep trying different variations until the results speak for themselves (saving more short par putts, reducing your number of three putts when starting from 20'+ from the hole.          

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On 10/13/2021 at 5:35 PM, Albatrossx3 said:

Dave Pelz recommends on real long putts, to stand taller and use your chipping motion.  

I been thinking about where the “cutoff” between what I consider long vs short and it’s usually 25 feet give or take few feet depending on how fast the green is 

Then I get into what is a “chipping” motion over 25 feet For me it’s using my hips and allowing my lower body and knees to move.  Doesn’t have to much but just a little 

For fine short distance control I feel like most people that it’s shoulder/arms/hands motion. No lower body movement 

 

Edited by Haro
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On 10/13/2021 at 6:11 PM, Jim N said:

The only time I vary is on downhill putts. I tend to set up with my putter with a little forward shaft lean on most putts, but find I have a more delicate touch with the shaft more vertical that works better on downhills. Length of putt has almost no impact on my prep or technique other than a longer stroke with maybe a little more pop to it.

Yea I find that my setup differs on downhills /side slopes I usually have to go behind the hole or low side to read it properly.  Almost all the time I’m looking to roll to curve /look for apex   Almost never straight for me 

shaft lean does help as much as more vertical shaft.  Thanks for the tip 

Edited by Haro
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On 10/13/2021 at 2:55 PM, chisag said:

... Putting is so personal, so that said I putted the same for short and long putts when playing Bent Greens for 35 years. I have always used a long, fluid pendulum stroke. I found that approach problematic on the Bermuda Greens here in Phoenix as short putts tend to jump off line when gently rolling to the hole, especially into the grain. I tried just making a longer stroke but that didn't compute with my internal hard drive  🤪  so I ended up taking a shorter back stroke and more aggressive forward stroke on short putts inside 2-3 feet. Routine is the same but the stroke is different. 

Seems like inside 2.5 feet my eyes are drawn to the hole as I can see the cup in my visual field without moving my head. 
I think “banging” the ball in certainly is confidence builder with a deliberate follow through   When I get longer out say 4-20 feet I feel my stroke reverts back to  more pendulum like and follow isn’t longer than my backstroke. Usually follow through is short than length of back stroke 

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